Admiral Beez
Major
Indeed. And he sets a dangerous precedent for Russia to adhere to. China grabbing some land and holding a sham referendum, for example.
"All of Vlad's forces and all of Vlad's men, are out to put Humpty together again." (4 Viewers)
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RogerdeLluria
Staff Sergeant
- 1,325
- Jul 5, 2015
It seems next Russian weapons Lend lease package is on track at Lyman.
- Thread starter
- #11,563
Beau (of the Fifth Column) always describes international affairs as "that eternal poker game where everyone's cheating, there's no room for morality or sentiment, no right or wrong, and the only measure of success is power".
buffnut453
Captain
Hadn't seen it mentioned but Russia attacked a humanitarian convoy near Zaporizhzhia this morning killing at least 30 people and wounding another 88 (images from the BBC).
The fall of Lyman can't come soon enough...and I truly hope there are many hundreds, if not thousands, of Russian soldiers caught in the trap.
The fall of Lyman can't come soon enough...and I truly hope there are many hundreds, if not thousands, of Russian soldiers caught in the trap.
buffnut453
Captain
More from the BBC:
Every day, convoys of people arrive in a supermarket car park in Zaporizhzhia city, escorted in by police vehicles.
They've made the hazardous trip out of Russian-occupied territory in southern Ukraine, finally reaching the relative safety of this regional capital still firmly under Ukrainian control.
And yet this is one of four Ukrainian regions that Russia is formally annexing, after a five-day exercise it called a referendum and Ukraine and the West condemned as a sham.
Among those handing their papers to police is Anton Osenev, who says the Russians tried to mobilise him twice to fight against his own country, around his home city of Melitopol.
"We weren't home for the first attempt," he says. "On the second occasion they stayed at our house for some time".
Every day, convoys of people arrive in a supermarket car park in Zaporizhzhia city, escorted in by police vehicles.
They've made the hazardous trip out of Russian-occupied territory in southern Ukraine, finally reaching the relative safety of this regional capital still firmly under Ukrainian control.
And yet this is one of four Ukrainian regions that Russia is formally annexing, after a five-day exercise it called a referendum and Ukraine and the West condemned as a sham.
Among those handing their papers to police is Anton Osenev, who says the Russians tried to mobilise him twice to fight against his own country, around his home city of Melitopol.
"We weren't home for the first attempt," he says. "On the second occasion they stayed at our house for some time".
buffnut453
Captain
And more...Peskov doesn't know where the borders of Russian-annexed Zaporizhzhia and Kherson are located:
In Moscow, a Kremlin official was today unable to answer a question about the exact borders of Kherson and Zaporizhzhia - two of the four Ukrainian regions that Russia intends to annex later.
Referring to the annexation of Crimea eight years ago, Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov told reporters: "The Donetsk and Luhansk People's Republics are recognised by Russia within 2014 borders."
Asked about the territories of Kherson and Zaporizhzhia - the latter of which is not under complete Russian control - Peskov seemed less certain.
"I need to clarify this, I can't answer this question right now," the AFP news agency quotes him as saying.
The multiple annexations are due to be formalised at 13:00 BST at a so-called signing ceremony.
In Moscow, a Kremlin official was today unable to answer a question about the exact borders of Kherson and Zaporizhzhia - two of the four Ukrainian regions that Russia intends to annex later.
Referring to the annexation of Crimea eight years ago, Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov told reporters: "The Donetsk and Luhansk People's Republics are recognised by Russia within 2014 borders."
Asked about the territories of Kherson and Zaporizhzhia - the latter of which is not under complete Russian control - Peskov seemed less certain.
"I need to clarify this, I can't answer this question right now," the AFP news agency quotes him as saying.
The multiple annexations are due to be formalised at 13:00 BST at a so-called signing ceremony.
GrauGeist
Generalfeldmarschall zur Luftschiff Abteilung
My Uncle lost several buddies in the Pacific during Typhoon Cobra, a few were lost when their Destroyers were sunk and one was swept overboard just as he was about to enter the bridge of my Uncle's destroyer (my Uncle was a signalman).
Most of the 700+ guys survived intense combat, only to be taken by mother nature during that storm.
I wouldn't say Russia but rather a dictator and a proper leader. remember this war isn't meant to be against the Russian people but rather the thugs supporting/enabling Putin.
The US is also saying similar - basically if you have dual nationality (where one of those nationalities is Russian), get out or risk being
At least 23 people killed in Russian missile strike in Ukraine, says regional governor
A convoy of civilian vehicles on the outskirts of Zaporizhzhia in southern Ukraine was hit in a Russian missile strike, the regional governor says.
www.abc.net.au
'There are four new regions of Russia': Vladimir Putin announces annexation of Ukrainian territory
President Vladimir Putin says four occupied areas of Ukraine will be amalgamated into Russia following a series of local referendums Kyiv and the West have denounced as illegitimate.
www.abc.net.au
Isn't there a rule about membership can't be granted to those nations involved in an existing dispute/conflict?
Ukraine applies for NATO membership, rules out Putin talks
President Volodymyr Zelenskiy announced a surprise bid for fast-track membership of the NATO military alliance on Friday and ruled out talks with President Vladimir Putin, striking back at Moscow after it said it had annexed four Ukrainian regions.www.reuters.com
Well, Vlad, it looks like your fears have come to life.
- Thread starter
- #11,574
I agree, but the attraction to, and the enabling of, a strongman like Putin by the Russian people is an artifact of a millennium of survival under autocratic rule, with all the behaviors, traditions, and attitudes that entails, notably the devaluation of human life other than their tribal circle. They've never had the opportunity to develop liberal democratic reflexes, traditions, and behaviors. Confidence in these things comes with education and experience, which they've never had. They have the leadership they deserve and prefer.
'You've got to question his state of mind': What moves does Putin have left?
Vladimir Putin has regularly warned the West of the dangers of getting stuck in foreign conflicts. So why does he appear to be ignoring his own advice and wading deeper and deeper into his ruinous war with Ukraine?
www.abc.net.au
Thumpalumpacus
Major
Yes, there is. But the request for fast-track could be taken up once this war is over ... whenever that may be.
Thumpalumpacus
Major
I'm not sure they prefer it, and I don't think they deserve it, but they've certainly been trained for it over the centuries.
- Thread starter
- #11,578
Certainly they've been trained for it, so deeply that when they had a fleeting chance to grasp for something better, they couldn't overcome their ingrained habits and embark on the scary and complex path to a modern democracy. Their history is of leadership by personality, not by rule of law, with its (sometimes misplaced) faith in the integrity of those elected to uphold that law and the rights it supports. Scary thought if your experience is of corruption, oppression, and vodka.
SaparotRob
Unter Gemeine Geschwader Murmeltier XIII
I think it's President Zelenskyy thumbing his nose at Vladolph. Putler was ranting about NATO expansion. Earlier in the war, Ukraine not applying to NATO and Ukrainian neutrality were among the talking points (I think). "Well screw you, putler. No more Mr. Nice guy, I'm applying to NATO. "
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Thumpalumpacus
Major
The bitch about democracy is that it requires active participation in order to succeed. The Russians as a nation don't seem to have that; it's been beaten out of them by various tsars, party secretaries, and this latest, er, president.
In one sense it's like infantry, they've been trained to stay low and hug the earth -- so finding the lieutenant who stands up and says "follow me!" is kind of hard after all this time. Such initiative has been drummed out of many of them. That's not to say all; their dissidents are and through history have been brave, forthright, clever.
