Best Bomber of ww2

[plan_D]

How can you honestly say that the Tu-95, a turbo-prop 1960s Soviet bomber, descended from the B-29. Just because the Soviets copied the B-29 and made the Tu-4 Bull, it doesn't resemble the B-29 in ANYWAY! It's like saying the B-52 is a descendent of the Handley Page bombers of World War 1, after all they're both heavy bombers....

 

[GermansRGeniuses]

Ya know, they're actually Turboshafts...


What's a turboshaft, you ask?


Basically, it's a jet engine that has a turbine at the end, behind the air compressor baldes; the hot air from the jet turns the turbine, which in turn turns a shaft connected to a propellor... (In the Bear's case, a pair of contra-rotating props for each engine)



Random fact: each Nk-12 Turboshaft on Tu-95s, Tu-114s, Tu-126s, and An-22s is rated at FIFTEEN THOUSAND HORSE POWER!!!

 

[DaveB.inVa]

Well.... I gave the reasons. First off the Bear first flew in 1952, not in the 60's. The cockpit layout is very similar, with throttles on the left hand of the pilot and on the right hand of the copilot with a center aisle stand between them. The fuselages are the same diameter and if you can find a picture of the glass nosed bomber version, take a look at the greenhouse design and compare it to the B-29. You would be crazy to think that the Bear did not take many design features from the Tu-4. The Soviets would be crazy themselves not to develop and utilize certain design features present in the Tu-4. The Soviets didn't call the interned B-29's a gift from God for nothing! I have also read statements from Tupolev engineers that they used design features from the Tu-4. In fact Tu-95 design began shortly after full Tu-4 production began.

Sure you can compare a HP O400 to a B-52 and say theyre both heavy bombers and you can say the B-29 and the Bear are heavy bombers. But you can not deny that the Bear is similar to the B-29/Tu-4.

Answer this, do you think the Bear would have the design that it does (or even existed!) had the three B-29's not landed in the USSR??

 

[plan_D]

First of all, the Bear is still considered a 60s bomber because that's when it started probing British airspace. The RR Nene engine was designed in 1941, I hear no one ever calling it a 1940s Jet engine...

Second of all, the Bear looks NOTHING like a B-29. The control situation and same diameter is not a reason to call it a descendant...but then, let's just say all heavy bombers derived from the bombers before them.

B-29...

Tu-95..

I see your point if I hadn't been told any different I'd mix these two up...

They probably would have achieved something a long those lines. Seeing as the B-29 gave them no knowledge on TURBO-SHAFT (Thank you, GrG and no, I didn't ask ) or swept-back wings...

 

[DaveB.inVa]

Fine, whatever and go drink some beer. Who cares if its considered a 60's bomber because thats when it "probed" British airspace. Should I call the He111 a 40's bomber because it didnt "probe" British airspace until the BoB? ... and I suppose a B-17 should be considered a 40's bomber because it didn't "probe" German airspace until the early 40's. Nice rule, I'll have to remember the great "probe" rule!

Your decended from your grandmother and I hope to goodness you dont look exactly like her... although you do have some traits or genes.

My point is that the Soviet engineers said they used design features from the Tu-4 to develop the Tu-95. Whatever the heck that means to you, fine. You can go argue with them, after all they were the guys who said they used the Tu-4 to develop the Tu-95. I was just repeating what they said... you know... because I figure they might have some insight on the subject. Next time I need to know something about an aircraft, or anything, I'm coming to you. Forget the SOB that designed the thing, I'm coming to you!

 

[DaveB.inVa]

Sorry to seem harsh with that last post. Please accept my apologies!

 

[plan_D]

A little problem with the probing of British airspace comment there. You do know that's what it was called, right? And that's what the RAF Fighter squadrons had to scramble to get up to everyday in the 60s and 70s, either a Bear or Bison...

And the He-111 was in use before the BoB in the Spanish Civil War. More people than not call the plane its decade from its first active service decade, you wouldn't call the F-22 a '90s fighter even though it first flew in the 90s. Something a lot more simple for anyone to grasp on that idea is the EE Lightning, designed in 1947 finally in operational service in 1960. '40s Fighter or '60s fighter?

I never said that the Tu-95 didn't use design features from the Tu-4. If you want to use them as a reason to call it a descendant, then fine. The F-117 originally used A-10 under-carriage, is it a descendant of the A-10?

And finally, I've been drinking beer all day. If you want me to carry on then I can't let you down. 8)

No need to apologise, we ALL get frustrated at times...and I don't know, I might share some visible characteristics with my grandmother...or maybe not...

 

[DaveB.inVa]

Yeah I know its called probing. I was just poking some fun at the word probe. The He-111 is another one of my favorite aircraft and was the first thing that popped into my mind that served before the BoB.

Y'all English are pretty cool. They'res a place in Virginia a couple hours drive away from here that still has a lot of English influence in their culture. They speak with a completly different accent than most Americans, I've always heard it was called Cockney and it was explained that the area after being settled didn't get much influence from the rest of the world. The area was fairly isolated but thats changing and dont hear the accent as much as you used to.

 

[plan_D]

I'd poke fun at the word probe too...I was just hoping you weren't thinking like me...

Oh...GOD...you have cockneys there too....I feel for you.

 

[the lancaster kicks ass]

wow american cockneys................

 

[Gemhorse]

The whole story of this debacle of captured B-29's to Tupelov's, which I may add just didn't cost the US Canada, but also kept the UK busy, was found in 1971 July, August, September October issues of Air Enthusiast, and although alot of hard-earned US technology went 'East', at the end of the Day, the US still holds the cards, from B-52 to Stealth's, although those new Sukhoi's could be a worry......

 

[the lancaster kicks ass]

to be honest the USSR's in such a mess i don't think they'd be able to support a large scale war...............

 

[cheddar cheese]

Well its a big country, it'd take a while to wipe em all out...

 

[the lancaster kicks ass]

not with america's nuclear arsenal, but russia also has enough military power to wipe out america so it's a bit pointless................

 

[cheddar cheese]

Not really, then we can invade America and enjoy their cheap petrol prices...

 

[the lancaster kicks ass]

if the chineese didn't get there first...............

 

[wmaxt]

One nice thing about the breakup of the USSR is that a large number of their nukes are being dismanteled. The company I worked for has been doing this for 6 or 7 years. Not enough but a start!

 

[plan_D]

I take it none of you heard the news recently? Putin announced that Russia is building Nuclear Weapons 3 times the power of anything built before, with a 6 ton Nuclear Warhead. That's big, very-very big. I have no idea what they equals to in TNT terms.

Also, the Russian government is resorting to Soviet style rule again. They have 'legally' re-made oil companies of Russia state controlled, once again.

 

[evangilder]

Not really, then we can invade America and enjoy their cheap petrol prices...

Umm, I think you Brits tried that before...

They are cheaper than yours, but they have climber dramatically, especially here in California where it is considerably higher than the national average.

 

[plan_D]

Cheaper, your fuel prices are nowhere near as high as ours. Ours are 70% tax, if I remember correctly. Since when did we try and invade America? Except in 1812, when America tried to take Canada and we kicked them out - while fighting Napoleon in Europe - and then trotted all the way down to New Orleans.