Best Dogfighter Poll Revisited...

[FLYBOYJ]

I see......

 

[FLYBOYJ]

So is Ponderosa Avaition in Az?

 

[Plane Freak]

Spit XIV, no contest...

i agree

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

And you got banned, so who cares....

 

[ju87]

i said the me 109.

ju87

 

[Vraciu]

Later versions of those planes were better - Ta 152, P-47M/N, P-51H, F6F-5 and F4U-4.

 

[BIG BIRD]

I have a book from osprey called aicraft of the aces legends of world war two. the last chapter is called master falcon. It talks about the kawasaki ki100. In it a force of 24 ki100's interceptid 200 p-51s. In the end the japs shoot down 11 p-51s and only lost 3 planes in return. The story is told from the perspective of a japenise pilot and claims that it was easy for them to shoot the mustangs down. I belive the mustang had a 60 mph speed advantige over the ki100. I think that is proof that the ki100 is one of if not the best dogfighter of world war two.
Here is a link for the ki100 Kawasaki Ki-100 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Burmese Bandit]

the dora....

Hey! I'm with the majority on this one!

Of course, I am assuming that it has the Mk 103 and the MG 151 combination.

 

[lesofprimus]

103???

 

[kool kitty89]

The Fw 190D-9's armament was 2x cowl upper mounted MG 131's plus 2x wing root mounted MG 151/20's.

The D-9 had no engine mounted gun (I don't think there was even a proposed verion with the MK 103) and it lacked the outer wing cannons. (which was a possible mounting for MK 108's)

THe D-12/13 had engine guns, though neither had the MK 103. (D-12 MK 108, D-13 MG 151/20)

The only place any Fw 190 mounted the MK 103 was in underwing pods, and then only on the Anton.

 

[Burmese Bandit]

I seemed to have read that a Mk 103 WAS tested on at least one D-9 in the engine block mounting position...are you positive that not a single Dora was so built? Or, perhaps, am I confusing that single Dora with a test Ta !52?

 

[kool kitty89]

There was a proposed version of the Bf 109K with an MK 103 engine gun, and of course the Do 335.

There was also a version of the Ta 152C with the MK 103.

 

[Burmese Bandit]

DANG I think you're right, and I've mixed up my Dora with my Tank!
Oh well, even with a 151 in the engine bloc and two more in the wing roots, the Dora's still got what it takes!

 

[Soundbreaker Welch?]

Looks like the Dora has beaten the competition.

It's a "Butcher Bird" after all. Probably one of the most scary birds the Allies ever had to face, except for the Me 262.

It's too bad the Allies didn't get their own jet out in time.

 

[Duke Soddy]

The Dora was a beast to deal with between 15-20000 ft, but above that it was a pig, very sluggish at the controls. Hense the reason Kurt Tank considered the Dora and iterim fighter aircraft while he implimented his masterpiece the Ta-152.

The only way you could possible consider the P-51 a better dogfighter than any other advanced fighter at the end of the war is if you took in range as a variable. It would get you there, but in a fight the 47 was more capable of over coming the enemy using angles as well as speed . The 51 had to use more pure energy tactics, and was even slower than the Jug, and the Jug could turn inside the 51, it just couldn't go as far as the Mustang.

 

[Locke]

I'd have to give the Dora my vote ^_^

 

[drewwizard]

The TA-152 didn't make the list!!! Given that I voted for the Thunderbolt. The high roll rate allows it to stay out of trouble in a dog fight, and as soon as you exit and dive away the thunderbolt has you. The big engine, paddle props, and supercharger makes it work well at the high altitudes. Robert Johnson proved he could best spitfires in mock combats using the superior roll rate to advantage. Eight 50's give good armament for fighter vs fighter and deflection shooting. If you read the book thunderbolt, you realize that it's the Allied's high altitude dog fighter. (as big and clumsy as it looks).

I thought about the N1K, but it didn't have good altitude performance. Those automatic flaps (similar to the leading edge flaps on the ME-109) allowed very tight turning. This will start an argument, but when the leading edge flaps were working, the ME-109 will out turn a Spitfire at lower speeds.

 

[Glider]

At those altitudes the Spit is the best all rounder. It had agility, climb and speed.

 

[pbehn]

The TA-152 didn't make the list!!! Given that I voted for the Thunderbolt. The high roll rate allows it to stay out of trouble in a dog fight, and as soon as you exit and dive away the thunderbolt has you. The big engine, paddle props, and supercharger makes it work well at the high altitudes. Robert Johnson proved he could best spitfires in mock combats using the superior roll rate to advantage. Eight 50's give good armament for fighter vs fighter and deflection shooting. If you read the book thunderbolt, you realize that it's the Allied's high altitude dog fighter. (as big and clumsy as it looks).

I thought about the N1K, but it didn't have good altitude performance. Those automatic flaps (similar to the leading edge flaps on the ME-109) allowed very tight turning. This will start an argument, but when the leading edge flaps were working, the ME-109 will out turn a Spitfire at lower speeds.

Your post compares both the P 47 and Bf 109 to the Spitfire in certain conditions. to me that makes the Spitfire the best.

 

[swampyankee]

the dora....

Hey! I'm with the majority on this one!

Of course, I am assuming that it has the Mk 103 and the MG 151 combination.

On this day, there is no majority; the plurality is held by the Spitfire at 27%.
Any of these aircraft could have defeated any of their contemporaries if the pilots were using tactics appropriate to their aircraft or started with and were able to hold a tactical advantage.

After all, AD Skyraider pilots shot down MiG-15s, and it wasn't because the Spad was a particularly great fighter aircraft -- it wasn't -- but because the MiG drivers fought to the AD's strengths.