can anyone identify this round?

[GrauGeist]

I have seen a FA weapon go wild in the hands of the inexperienced mainly because if you're holding something and it catches you off guard, your first reaction is to tighten your grip to control it. As the grip tightens, so too, does the finger on the trigger (part of the fist reflex) which compounds the problem for the first second or so of delayed reaction time.

First thing that should be impressed on any person, is to always keep the finger clear of the trigger until you are prepared to discharge that weapon. No exceptions. Ever.

 

[mikewint]

Yes, Yes, and Yes again Dave. Don't forget muzzle awareness too.
We first sit down together at the table with a gun (my GSG 1911 .22LR). I offer the gun to them and if they reach out for it they get a STOP. And we go through the whole eject clip and open/lock back slide. Later outside I demo how the gun can still fire with the clip out. With revolvers we'll look at and handle revolvers like the Python whose cylinder opens to my Colt SSA which is impossible to be observably safe. Even 1st and half-**** are not really safe if a bullet is present so a prime lesson in muzzle awareness.
However none of this applies as he was not teaching but going for a "Gee Whiz Golly" experience.

 

[nuuumannn]

Intelligence and stupidity live side-by-side without ever interacting.

Children should not be given firearms!!! Loaded or unloaded!!!

In gun world, giving an Uzi to a child makes perfect sense - LA Times

I'm sorry, but the rest of the world simply shrugs its shoulders and says, "only in America" when this sort of thing happens; it is all about gun culture and you can argue till the cows come home about your rights, but the simple fact is, this sort of thing should not happen at all. The fact that people are debating whether the safety was on or that the trigger shouldn't be touched is silliness. Children should not be allowed to go near firearms. Full stop.

Sick as it may be, gun violence is as American as baseball - LA Times

"The United States is the only advanced, industrialized country with this problem. In less-developed regions there are countries where gun violence is rampant – places like Somalia and the Central African Republic, but those are anarchic places where no effective governmental authority exists. In America, we have a government that some people believe is too big and overbearing, yet when it comes to guns, we might as well have no government at all."

 

[GrauGeist]

In all honesty, we've lost the social control that used to keep people educated in regards to firearm safety and responsibility.

As it stands, far more Americans are killed each year, in non-medical related deaths due to automobile accidents, yet you don't see the media hacking about that problem. Another thing to take into consideration, is the population of the United States is far larger than most other developed countries out there, and taking those statistics into consideration, the U.S. has a far lower incidence of gun-related deaths than quite a few European nations. Handling a firearm requires education, common sense and a good deal of responsibility. Unfortunately, you see more people driving along the road, texting on their cellphones or driving drunk and this amounts to a far greater amount of negligence than mishandling a firearm.

More People have died in London this year by knife attack than all the school shootings in the U.S. during the same period of time. Of course, you don't hear about that because "gun phobia" sells in the media and knife attacks don't.

And I am sorry you read the L.A. times...when I lived down in Southern California, they were always good for stirring up trouble with their "spin" on things...I see they are still at it. If they were to actually put something in print that was balanced and used factual information, I would pass out from absolute shock...

 

[nuuumannn]

More People have died in London this year by knife attack than all the school shootings in the U.S. during the same period of time. Of course, you don't hear about that because "gun phobia" sells in the media and knife attacks don't.

You know Dave, you are right. But that doesn't justify what happens on an all too frequent basis in the USA at all. If this sort of thing is going to stop, it requires a huge sea change in culture in your country, you know it as well as I do. I'm not saying get rid 'a guns, that's not gonna happen, heck, I live in an environment where almost everyone I know owns a firearm, but stricter control on exposure to firearms is required in your country before the number of firearm related deaths in the hands of the general public starts going down. It's as simple as that, LA Times articles or not.

Stereotypes come about from repetitive behaviour. This is how the world views the USA, whether you guys like it or not.

 

[GrauGeist]

I have to say that the American society as a whole pisses me off. Seriously.

We used to be respectful, industrious, hard working people. Somewhere along the way, we lost ourselves. Now kids think it's funny to randomly knock out elderly women. They think they can spill hot coffee in their laps and expect 14 million dollars. And the list goes on and on...

I know we're not the only country on earth that's having a serious social meltdown, but it's really amplified here because we have so many people...and I guarentee you if we didn't have a large share of firearms, it would most certainly be something else (hammers, screwdrivers, pencils, etc etc). Honestly, I was really surprised to see just how many people have been killed in England by edged weapons to the point where they are considering a ban on anything with a point. Seriously, banning kitchen knives and anything with a point??

WTF is wrong with the world nowdays and where the heck did we go wrong?

 

[fubar57]

We're no longer allowed to discipline our children properly, Dave. A firm but parental slap on my a$$ taught me right from wrong and never turned me into a deviate. Now, you look at your child wrong, social services is all over you. I was one of the last to paddle my kids collective keesters and while they are not perfect, they are more respectful than a majority of their friends.

Geo

 

[Siddley]

We're no longer allowed to discipline our children properly, Dave. A firm but parental slap on my a$$ taught me right from wrong and never turned me into a deviate. Now, you look at your child wrong, social services is all over you. I was one of the last to paddle my kids collective keesters and while they are not perfect, they are more respectful than a majority of their friends.

Geo

My wife worked in education for 15 years in the UK, before we emigrated, and she would agree with you entirely. It's not so much a lack of corporal punishment, it's much more than that - there is a generation of kids who no-one has ever said 'No' to and who think they are entitled to anything they want.

 

[mikewint]

Dave the clapping you hear is from me. Once again you hit the nail squarely on the head. We could not agree more.
Nuuumannn, I disagree. My children, like myself, were introduced to guns at a very early age because they were IN the house and because my parents knew, as I did, that The Forbidden Fruit is the sweetist. The lessons were repeated over and over and I knew very early on that my Dad's guns were very dangerous and not to be touched unless he was around. My wife who grew up in Missouri actually had classes in grade school on gun and hunting safety. Morons get guns and cars and airplanes and speedboats and... Do stupid chit. Because humans can't stop texting and/or look behind the SUV we have cars that do it for them and stop themselves. The idiots who can't drive in a straight line will soon have cars that drive themselves.
NOTHING can be made fool-proof because fools are so clever

 

[at6]

I miss the America where we had discipline, respect, moral values, and the Ten commandments as our guideline. Starting with sixties[my generation], the wrong people took over our educational institutions. Young people became indoctrinated in philosophical garbage that passed for enlightenment. Succeeding generations have been fed even worse garbage to the point that college freshmen need remedial courses just to read at what might be best described as a third grade level. I've seen illiterates with high school diplomas believing that they should be admitted to colleges. Only the best and the brightest deserve to be enrolled in higher education. If I did something wrong as a child, there were very clear and painful consequences. Do no wrong, feel no pain.

 

[Njaco]

Not to be religious but my father always said that the USA's troubles started with Vatican II and Madalyn Murray O'Hair. Everything since has been downhill.

..... heck, I live in an environment where almost everyone I know owns a firearm, but stricter control on exposure to firearms is required in your country before the number of firearm related deaths in the hands of the general public .....

With the number of things that want to kill you in Aussie land, you're born with a S&W in your hand!!! Its a common baby shower gift!!!!

 

[Lucky13]

Not to get into politics (2nd Amendment) and all that stuff, but wasn't this incorporated in your Bill of Rights on December 15, 1791 and it being somewhat was, partially, based on English Bill of Rights of 1689? ......plus, when this was being done, those gentlemen putting this on to paper, had the nagging thought, in the back of their heads, that the Red Coats would return?

It wasn't that long after the Revolutionary War....

 

[at6]

The Red coats did return in 1812 and it took two years to defeat them so that the matter was settled once and for all. Also the Second amendment was added not only for national defense, but to make certain that there could be no establishment of a repressive government over the people.

 

[at6]

Not to be religious but my father always said that the USA's troubles started with Vatican II and Madalyn Murray O'Hair. Everything since has been downhill.



With the number of things that want to kill you in Aussie land, you're born with a S&W in your hand!!! Its a common baby shower gift!!!!

The S&W plus a can of insecticide. The land down under has the Funnel web spider and who knows how many other little nasties crawling around.

 

[mikewint]

Jan, it is indeed written into the Constitution and is the Second Amendment behind Freedom of Religeon (IN MY OPINION an indication of how vital the Founders, States, and People felt this right was/is). The problem is, that in a day where things were written, copied, and re-written there exist many different versions all differing in capitalization and punctuation. There are even differences between the drafted and ratified versions.
As adopted by Congress: A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.
As presented to the States, ratified by them, and accepted by Thomas Jefferson (Sec of State): A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.
Those words have been disected and interpreted in many different ways. Most debate is over the three phrases: "well regulated militia"; "the right of the People"; and "keep and bear arms". These phrases have been debated over and over and various Supreme Courts have ruled on their meaning. The problem is that no one Supreme Court ruling can bind another Court. So one Court can rule that "People" means an individual right and 10years later a second court can rule it means a "collective" right.
The English Bill of Rights dating back to 1689 codified the long held "right of self-defence". It removed the King's (James II) right to disarm his subjects as individuals. The US Supreme Court refered to this passage in a 2008 case involving the interpretation of "People"
IN MY OPINION the Framers of the Constitution were very much concerned with the power of their new government to become as tyranical as the British King had been. As spoken by Mather Byles: "Which is better - to be ruled by one tyrant three thousand miles away or by three thousand tyrants one mile away?"
As written by Alexander Hamilton: If circumstances should at any time oblige the government to form an army of any magnitude, that army can never be formidable to the liberties of the people while there is a large body of citizens, little, if at all, inferior to them in discipline and the use of arms, who stand ready to defend their own rights and those of their fellow-citizens."

 

[Siddley]

Being able to own the means to protect yourself from unwarranted aggression is a basic human right, or at least it should be.

More than a 100 million people were killed by their own governments in the 20th century, totalitarian governments who took special care to disarm their victims first.

 

[mikewint]

The most foolish mistake we could possibly make would be to allow the subject races to possess arms. History shows that all conquerors who have allowed their subject races to carry arms have prepared their own downfall by so doing. Indeed, I would go so far as to say that the supply of arms to the underdogs is a sine qua non for the overthrow of any sovereignty. So let's not have any native militia or native police.
-A. Hitler

 

[at6]

The most foolish mistake we could possibly make would be to allow the subject races to possess arms. History shows that all conquerors who have allowed their subject races to carry arms have prepared their own downfall by so doing. Indeed, I would go so far as to say that the supply of arms to the underdogs is a sine qua non for the overthrow of any sovereignty. So let's not have any native militia or native police.
-A. Hitler

The very reason that gun control is so dear to certain groups of people . They suggest giving up firearms because the state will protect you. If we foolishly follow that line, who the h6LL is going to protect you from the state?

 

[Marcel]

I think I'd better install my sense of humour...the only other forum I use regularly is very uptight and joking is " verboten !!! "

I hadn't realised it was affecting me, but obviously it has

Of course joking is forbidden. I'm always dead serious and I guess the others are to. I especially thought the colour for a model someone was building has been researched quite well. Even after years people try some suggestions to shed some light on the speed of dark. And we're still wondering if cc is a bloke or a girl. Couldn't get more serious than that.

 

[Njaco]

Here ya go Siddley. This should start ya off on the right foot!

http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/off-topic-misc-/forums-20-funniest-threads-16791.html?highlight=