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Correction, he wasn't the only one, Bob van der Stock was for instance a dutch squadron commander.However, he wouldn't have been made the only foreign squadron commander within the RAF if he was a compulsive liar.
It's virtually a given that WWII pilots actually shot down fewer a/c than they were credited with, because almost all air arms in general did at all times. As has been discussed, there are example of German units in certain periods with almost 100% accurate claims, but it wasn't the rule even for the Luftwaffe, and in some units and periods they were very far from it in fact, and the typical range for all WWII air arms was 25-50% (or higher or lower, I'm *roughly* generalizing).On another note, the last thread on this forum about Pierre Clostermann descended into something of a free-for-all, French-bashing fest. Is this where the "negative vibes" come from? I also find it interesting that aces of the US/Uk/Ger are for some reason above scrutiny. For the record, other forums I've visited have mentioned that only very recently, some historians have called into question the "kills" claimed by Molders, Galland, and Marseilles. Should we look less upon them if it turns out they inflated their claims? I don't think so.
Whatever Pierre Closterman's number of confirmed kills, his book is one of the most poetic records in all of air combat. I wept along with Closterman when he landed his Hawker Tempest, Le Grand Charles, for the final time and "laid him down on the grass, like a cut flower."
And I shared his grief when one of his comrades died in his arms, after Closterman had hauled what was left of him out of the burning wreckage of a Tempest which had cartwheeeled during a wheels-up crashlanding attempt; and later felt Pierre's own anxiety when he had to attempt a wheels-up landing of his own the very next day.
I found my first copy of "The Big Show" abandoned in a desk at school in my 8th grade math class, and was entranced by it, and read re-read it until it had to be taped together, a not uncommon fate for many of my military history sci-fi books in those days.
Later in college, my best friend was perusing my bookshelves and saw its garish red yellow cover with Closterman's Tempest celebrating a victory over a burning FW-190, and he said, "Hey! I read that book years ago in Jr. High. I remember losing it in Mr. Gadd's math class." So I ended up getting him a new Bantam War Books edition to replace it, and another one for me to re-read to spare the old beat-up edition I'd read to pieces.
Skywalker
clostermann
(28 February 1921–22 March 2006)
"Dear Neil I was a little annoyed by Adam Holden's letter, which you published in SAM Vol 22/3 May 2000. On principle I never usually answer letters of this sort, but in view of my Tempest friends from No 3 Squadron, I feel I owe them an answer. First the Falklands War. . I never wrote to an Argentinean newspaper, but sent a letter to a group of Argentinean pilots who were pupils of my son, (then an Armée de l'Air Mirage pilot), at the Mirage Academy in Dijon. I knew them and they even came to my house when they were on leave. When I read the insults printed in the UK tabloid newspaper, the 'SUN', (greasers, tango dancers etc.), I wanted to tell these 'underdogs' that some people admired their courage. It is an admitted fact today by all - (including the US Air Force and the RAF) - that "the courage of your enemy honours you", and it should not be forgotten. Also, being an MP, with political responsibilities I am entitled to my opinions. They had nothing to do with my long-standing friendship and love for the RAF.
Secondly, I was never married to an 'Argentinean beauty'. I have been married for 53 years to a French girl.
As to my claims, they never changed. They were painted on my Tempest, (see accompanying photo), (The photograph that Pierre sent with his letter, with him in the cockpit of 'Le Grand CharIes'~, NV724, JF.E of 3 Sqn., circa July 1945, showing the twenty-three black crosses representing his accredited confirmed 'kills', and the nine white outline only crosses for 'probables' and 'ground kills'.) and are substantiated by the following citations and letters. My two DFC citations, by Air Marshal Slessor and AOC 83 Group Sir Harry Broadhurst, are enough for me.
"DFC 26/8/44 This officer has displayed outstanding courage and devotion to duty throughout his operational career in the course of which he has destroyed at least 11 enemy aircraft and damaged other military objectives". "Bar 28/5/45 since being awarded the DFC this officer has participated in 70 new operational missions during which he has destroyed a further 12 enemy aircraft. Throughout, Lieutenant Clostermann has displayed outstanding courage and ability, and has proved to be a source of inspiration to all". 23 black crosses and 23 confirmed by my DFC citations. I never personally asked for anything else.
There were I suppose two problems; ONE, I have been in so many Squadrons; Nos 341, 602, 486, 274, 56, and 3, that the forms 540 and 541 'Logs of Claims' were quite spread out. TWO, the French Air Force - as well as the US 8th Fighter Command, considered aircraft 'probables' and destroyed 'on the ground' as victories. This may explain some of the ridiculously inflated claims we found in the press, about me and many American pilots. Not my fault. I tried to rectify often, but to no avail! Finally, the statement about the the DSO. I am a Chevalier of the Legion d'Honneur, which, as a French national, takes precedence over my DFC, and therefore is worn 'in front' of it. It is red with a blue tinge - as is the DSO.
Pierre Clostermann
Montesquiei des Albères
France"
I talked to many Vets in my time... So has Erich and Bill and Neil and Chris and Chris and David and...................................
Galland was a great guy, always smilin... My Grandfather really liked him....
clostermann
(28 February 1921–22 March 2006)
"Dear Neil I was a little annoyed by Adam Holden's letter, which you published in SAM Vol 22/3 May 2000. On principle I never usually answer letters of this sort, but in view of my Tempest friends from No 3 Squadron, I feel I owe them an answer. First the Falklands War. . I never wrote to an Argentinean newspaper, but sent a letter to a group of Argentinean pilots who were pupils of my son, (then an Armée de l'Air Mirage pilot), at the Mirage Academy in Dijon. I knew them and they even came to my house when they were on leave. When I read the insults printed in the UK tabloid newspaper, the 'SUN', (greasers, tango dancers etc.), I wanted to tell these 'underdogs' that some people admired their courage. It is an admitted fact today by all - (including the US Air Force and the RAF) - that "the courage of your enemy honours you", and it should not be forgotten. Also, being an MP, with political responsibilities I am entitled to my opinions. They had nothing to do with my long-standing friendship and love for the RAF.
Secondly, I was never married to an 'Argentinean beauty'. I have been married for 53 years to a French girl.
As to my claims, they never changed. They were painted on my Tempest, (see accompanying photo), (The photograph that Pierre sent with his letter, with him in the cockpit of 'Le Grand CharIes'~, NV724, JF.E of 3 Sqn., circa July 1945, showing the twenty-three black crosses representing his accredited confirmed 'kills', and the nine white outline only crosses for 'probables' and 'ground kills'.) and are substantiated by the following citations and letters. My two DFC citations, by Air Marshal Slessor and AOC 83 Group Sir Harry Broadhurst, are enough for me.
"DFC 26/8/44 This officer has displayed outstanding courage and devotion to duty throughout his operational career in the course of which he has destroyed at least 11 enemy aircraft and damaged other military objectives". "Bar 28/5/45 since being awarded the DFC this officer has participated in 70 new operational missions during which he has destroyed a further 12 enemy aircraft. Throughout, Lieutenant Clostermann has displayed outstanding courage and ability, and has proved to be a source of inspiration to all". 23 black crosses and 23 confirmed by my DFC citations. I never personally asked for anything else.
There were I suppose two problems; ONE, I have been in so many Squadrons; Nos 341, 602, 486, 274, 56, and 3, that the forms 540 and 541 'Logs of Claims' were quite spread out. TWO, the French Air Force - as well as the US 8th Fighter Command, considered aircraft 'probables' and destroyed 'on the ground' as victories. This may explain some of the ridiculously inflated claims we found in the press, about me and many American pilots. Not my fault. I tried to rectify often, but to no avail! Finally, the statement about the the DSO. I am a Chevalier of the Legion d'Honneur, which, as a French national, takes precedence over my DFC, and therefore is worn 'in front' of it. It is red with a blue tinge - as is the DSO.
Pierre Clostermann
Montesquiei des Albères
France"
However, he lies...
I remember talking to Adolf Galland as a kid, and seein him snort when asked about Clostermann... If his fellow Ace/Experten, including my Grandfather, have a less than favorable opinion of him, thats good enough for me...
Of course, if Clostermann were German or American, I suppose his record would then be beyond reproach. What a crock....
Galland was a typical fighter pilot, as Rall and Olds, etc. twinkle in the eyes, loved the ladies, great sense of humor, supremely confident.. it is a rare community.
Yeager and Olds and Sublett and about 20 othe American Fighter Aces went to Russia in the late 90's to meet with a bunch of WWII and Korean War aces - said the same thing about their Russian counterparts.
Precisely! This is what I presonally believe to be the case. All of these pilots are arrogant and braggarts to a certain degree, and it wouldn't surprise me one bit if they were all liars to a certain extent, in fact I'm convinced it is the case. Yet P. Clostermann somehow becomes everyone's puching bag. It doesn't make any sense at all.