eBay: Messerschmitt Bf109

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Snautzer01 said:
Notice camera Günther Rall

View attachment 756825

Click to expand...
General Rall with me in 1996, and having his last start in a real Bf 109 G with me.

Eng

rall1_2974.jpg
rall2_2975.jpg
 
cammerjeff said:
Zippy, I agree with what you are saying, but I would think that a heavier A/C would be more stable on the Jacks than a Lighter A/C.

And looking closer at the picture in post #2790 the rear fuselage of the 109 is secured to the stand by cables, the cables near the wings seem to be secured to the jack pads, or the tp of the jacks? They do not seem to be securing the A/C down to the jacks. But it is hard to be sure exactly what the cables are attached to.

And I agree most aviation safety improvements are written in blood, but as an ex aviation maintenance tech the picture just sent a shiver up my spine. I have never even considered fulling jacking up any A/C outside, with or without the engine running! But I also am aware that when the shooting starts what is normal restrictions during times of peace are no longer in place.

Looking at the picture a 3rd time I suspect that the crew has either replaced or at least worked on the hydraulic system on the Right MLG, or is troubleshooting an issue with that side. The 4 crew in the back seem to be much more focused on the gear retraction than the 3 crew members in the foreground.

Whatever is actually going on it is a very interesting picture to my eyes!
Click to expand...
Totally agree. It gives me the creeps too.
 
cammerjeff said:
Zippy, I agree with what you are saying, but I would think that a heavier A/C would be more stable on the Jacks than a Lighter A/C.

And looking closer at the picture in post #2790 the rear fuselage of the 109 is secured to the stand by cables, the cables near the wings seem to be secured to the jack pads, or the tp of the jacks? They do not seem to be securing the A/C down to the jacks. But it is hard to be sure exactly what the cables are attached to.

And I agree most aviation safety improvements are written in blood, but as an ex aviation maintenance tech the picture just sent a shiver up my spine. I have never even considered fulling jacking up any A/C outside, with or without the engine running! But I also am aware that when the shooting starts what is normal restrictions during times of peace are no longer in place.

Looking at the picture a 3rd time I suspect that the crew has either replaced or at least worked on the hydraulic system on the Right MLG, or is troubleshooting an issue with that side. The 4 crew in the back seem to be much more focused on the gear retraction than the 3 crew members in the foreground.

Whatever is actually going on it is a very interesting picture to my eyes!
Click to expand...
Yes, We did the retractions on the Bf 109G Black-Six with a hydraulic rig. We could do it with a rig electric motor driven pump with controllable flow for normal test retractions. However, for set-up of the door fit, we used the rig manual lever operated pump for careful work. Apart from adjusting the door fit, the leg position on the up-locks has to be set and both things require careful work.
Like many or most taildraggers, the 109 jacking points are behind the mainwheels and the tail needs holding-down as it lifts with jacking at the jacking points. Getting the tailwheel in the air and then holding it down and getting the mainwheels in the air requires some skill and the correct kit to do it properly. Also, the 109 jacking points on the spar-carry through bottom face are very shallow, circular depressions about 30mm dia and only 5mm deep, so it needs very good tie-downs to do this with the engine hyd pump!
This early Jumo 210 powered 109 looks to be well secured, with fore and aft restraint to ground tie-downs. However, there are photos of this being done in N.Africa with just guys sitting on the tail, jacking beam under the main points and the engine running!
Cheers

Eng
 
Engineman said:
Yes, We did the retractions on the Bf 109G Black-Six with a hydraulic rig. We could do it with a rig electric motor driven pump with controllable flow for normal test retractions. However, for set-up of the door fit, we used the rig manual lever operated pump for careful work. Apart from adjusting the door fit, the leg position on the up-locks has to be set and both things require careful work.
Like many or most taildraggers, the 109 jacking points are behind the mainwheels and the tail needs holding-down as it lifts with jacking at the jacking points. Getting the tailwheel in the air and then holding it down and getting the mainwheels in the air requires some skill and the correct kit to do it properly. Also, the 109 jacking points on the spar-carry through bottom face are very shallow, circular depressions about 30mm dia and only 5mm deep, so it needs very good tie-downs to do this with the engine hyd pump!
This early Jumo 210 powered 109 looks to be well secured, with fore and aft restraint to ground tie-downs. However, there are photos of this being done in N.Africa with just guys sitting on the tail, jacking beam under the main points and the engine running!
Cheers

Eng
Click to expand...
Love these little insights. Thanks.
 
Engineman said:
Yes, We did the retractions on the Bf 109G Black-Six with a hydraulic rig. We could do it with a rig electric motor driven pump with controllable flow for normal test retractions. However, for set-up of the door fit, we used the rig manual lever operated pump for careful work. Apart from adjusting the door fit, the leg position on the up-locks has to be set and both things require careful work.
Like many or most taildraggers, the 109 jacking points are behind the mainwheels and the tail needs holding-down as it lifts with jacking at the jacking points. Getting the tailwheel in the air and then holding it down and getting the mainwheels in the air requires some skill and the correct kit to do it properly. Also, the 109 jacking points on the spar-carry through bottom face are very shallow, circular depressions about 30mm dia and only 5mm deep, so it needs very good tie-downs to do this with the engine hyd pump!
This early Jumo 210 powered 109 looks to be well secured, with fore and aft restraint to ground tie-downs. However, there are photos of this being done in N.Africa with just guys sitting on the tail, jacking beam under the main points and the engine running!
Cheers

Eng
Click to expand...
Engineman thanks for the info on jacking a Bf 109! The only tail dragger's I ever Jacked and swung the gear on were several Beach 18's. The Bf109 procedure sounds similar to what has to be done with a tricycle geared jet with rear mounted engines such as DC-9's and B-727's. They actually require 3 jacks in the normal position, and a 4th jack under the tail to keep them from tipping back onto their tails during the procedure.

Always nice to learn something on this board!
 
cammerjeff said:
Engineman thanks for the info on jacking a Bf 109! The only tail dragger's I ever Jacked and swung the gear on were several Beach 18's. The Bf109 procedure sounds similar to what has to be done with a tricycle geared jet with rear mounted engines such as DC-9's and B-727's. They actually require 3 jacks in the normal position, and a 4th jack under the tail to keep them from tipping back onto their tails during the procedure.

Always nice to learn something on this board!
Click to expand...
Hi cammerjeff,
Yes, biggest I have done myself was Comet (Nimrod). That was still impressive with the full system rig that had same output as the aircraft, we had to do the usual timed retracts after gear changes etc. Still shook the aircraft but didn't need tying down.
With the 109 we had to do a level flying position fuel gauge calibration by measured filling from empty. That was a bit tricky because the tail was very high and we wanted it on the beam so that wheels were not in the equation. As you lift it that high the CofG goes forward of the wheel contact points and it really wants to tip on its nose. Then, with 700 lb of fuel in the tank, you need to lower the stands at the back and get it all on the ground again. Not straightforward, lots of scope to get it badly wrong! Of course, the German manual does not cover the detail.

Cheers

Eng
 
Snautzer01 said:
E Engineman

View attachment 757010

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Foto,Me 109,Winter Tarnung,Kennung,Maling,MG,Pilot,Jäger,Zahl,Motor,Flugzeug,RAR | eBay

Verkauft wird ein 100% originales Foto.
www.ebay.de
Click to expand...

Hi Snautzer,
An interesting and cold pic of a 109F, it is up on jacks, tied down and supported at the rear lifting tube. Guess it is having gun alignment, with the seat pan out on the wing and the prop positioned clear of the MG 17's line of sight. Fortunately, we didn't have to accurately boresight our guns in the freezing cold!!

Cheers

Eng
 
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Snautzer01 said:
JG51 Mölders

View attachment 757178


www.ebay.de

Foto,Me 109,JG 51 Mölders,Kennung,Maling,Flugzeug,Pilot,Jäger,Orden,Mg Gurt,RAR | eBay

Verkauft wird ein 100% originales Foto. 100 % original.
www.ebay.de
Click to expand...
Hi Snautzer,
This is interesting, they do not have the main jacks or lifting beam in under the forward fuselage, but the tail is lifted maybe 2 feet on the tripods at the rear. There looks to be a bomb or similar hanging there on ropes as a weight to stop the aircraft tipping on its nose! Aircraft looks to be an F3/4 and the underwing panel O/B of the undercarriage bay is removed and leaning on the left wheel door.

Eng
 
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