Flight Sims are they really as real as actually flying?

DerAdlerIstGelandet · Nov 1, 2005

syscom3 said:
No, thermals and winds and turbulance. All easily modeled. A well understood phenomena.

No it is not. Are you feeling the wind forces and fighting them back with the stick. An aircraft just does not simply cut through the wind. It is pushed off course and thrown up and down. You feel that and fight against it with the stick. When you are flying you PC sim are you actually feeling that? No. So how is that modeled and accurate, it is not. Atleast with a full motion sim you feel that. You however do not with your Microsoft flight sim. Dont take me wrong flight sims are fun and I dont think they are terrible. I am just saying you are not flying a plane.

FLYBOYJ · Nov 1, 2005

DerAdlerIstGelandet said:
syscom3 said:

No, thermals and winds and turbulance. All easily modeled. A well understood phenomena.

Click to expand...

No it is not. Are you feeling the wind forces and fighting them back with the stick. An aircraft just does not simply cut through the wind. It is pushed off course and thrown up and down. You feel that and fight against it with the stick. When you are flying you PC sim are you actually feeling that? No. So how is that modeled and accurate, it is not. Atleast with a full motion sim you feel that. You however do not with your Microsoft flight sim. Dont take me wrong flight sims are fun and I dont think they are terrible. I am just saying you are not flying a plane.

Especially when you have continual mountain wave co-mingled with thermals. In the full motion "big Buck" sims, the crosswind feel on the yoke or rudders, no matter what is put in by the sim operator, feels artifical when compared to the real thing.

DerAdlerIstGelandet · Nov 4, 2005

Yes it does. I have no where near as much actual stick time as you (actually yoke time since I have never actually flown a helicopter I just crew them) but I can tell you the same thing.

wmaxt · Nov 4, 2005

FLYBOYJ said:
DerAdlerIstGelandet said:

syscom3 said:

No, thermals and winds and turbulance. All easily modeled. A well understood phenomena.

Click to expand...

No it is not. Are you feeling the wind forces and fighting them back with the stick. An aircraft just does not simply cut through the wind. It is pushed off course and thrown up and down. You feel that and fight against it with the stick. When you are flying you PC sim are you actually feeling that? No. So how is that modeled and accurate, it is not. Atleast with a full motion sim you feel that. You however do not with your Microsoft flight sim. Dont take me wrong flight sims are fun and I dont think they are terrible. I am just saying you are not flying a plane.

Click to expand...

Especially when you have continual mountain wave co-mingled with thermals. In the full motion "big Buck" sims, the crosswind feel on the yoke or rudders, no matter what is put in by the sim operator, feels artifical when compared to the real thing.

Sims will never be able to duplicate a thermal or wind shear jogging an aircraft several hundred feet or a tip vortice flipping you over without warning - I'm sure you'd hit the ceiling first.

wmaxt

syscom3 · Nov 4, 2005

Its just a mathmatical equation. Nothing sophisticated to program for.

FLYBOYJ · Nov 4, 2005

syscom3 said:
Its just a mathmatical equation. Nothing sophisticated to program for.

A mathematical equation for continual mountain wave would be infinite because they are never ending, always changing and never the same - with that, attempt to plug that into a full motion sim with pistons and actuators and you'll never have even close to the real thing. The feel will always be "artificial."

You continue to believe what you want, there are those of us who been in both places.

syscom3 · Nov 4, 2005

Sounds like a random event that can be programed with no problem. Of course the simulation for this unique wave can only be simulated once, but subsequent waves can be generated for different velocities, accelrations, etc. They (in the end) all fall within clearly defined parameters.

If a person has enough money, the mechanical simulation of turbulence can be simulated too.

FLYBOYJ · Nov 4, 2005

syscom3 said:
Sounds like a random event that can be programed with no problem. Of course the simulation for this unique wave can only be simulated once, but subsequent waves can be generated for different velocities, accelrations, etc. They (in the end) all fall within clearly defined parameters.

If a person has enough money, the mechanical simulation of turbulence can be simulated too.

Sure, so could random sunspots on the sun

I could tell you in the most advanced sim, these imputs feel artifical - but not only my opinion....

syscom3 · Nov 4, 2005

Sunspots could interrupt communications. It could be modeled in if desired.

FLYBOYJ · Nov 4, 2005

syscom3 said:
Sunspots could interrupt communications. It could be modeled in if desired.

You must be an ailen

syscom3 · Nov 4, 2005

Sunspot activity has long been known to be an indicator of solar activity.

The more the solar activity, the higher the probablity of comm outages/interference.

FLYBOYJ · Nov 4, 2005

Glider · Nov 4, 2005

If its any help I have never found a simulation that comes remotely close to flying a glider. If there is any form of flight that is more natural or instinctive then I haven't found it.
Its a number of things such as the effect of the wind, trying to find the right spot if you are lucky enough to find lift, feeling the effect on the glider of the various forces when centreing on a thermal, using sound to gauge your speed or identifying a source of lift from the ground or a forming cloud for lift. Plus of course the feeling of gravity or negative G.
No simulator comes close.

syscom3 · Nov 4, 2005

You just havent been flying a top of the line simulator.

lesofprimus · Nov 4, 2005

No simulator comes close.

I chewed on some leafy substance in Guatemala back in 1994 that came prrreeetttyy damn close....

FLYBOYJ · Nov 4, 2005

syscom3 said:
You just havent been flying a top of the line simulator.

Does a 1.2 million dollar CAE B737-500 full movement count?

lesofprimus · Nov 4, 2005

Uummmmm.....

Yep.

syscom3 · Nov 4, 2005

I was thinking of something more substantial.

FLYBOYJ · Nov 4, 2005

syscom3 said:
I was thinking of something more substantial.

Like what?!? the Shuttle Sim your your spaceship

Glider · Nov 5, 2005

Syscom, Have you ever flown at the controls of a plane?

Flight Sims are they really as real as actually flying?

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