Groundhog Thread Part Deux - P-39 Fantasy and Fetish - The Never Ending Story (Mods take no responsibility for head against wall injuries sustained)

[XBe02Drvr]

Dont the blades fold back when the elastic band has run out of power?

Only in Wakefield County, elsewhere they stay extended.

 

[special ed]

Birch Matthews in his book, Cobra, covers the XP-39E. Three were contracted, two for flight and one structure test. The first, 41-19501 and the second 41-19502. To build the XP-39E, major portions of the wing and fuselage changed. Wingspan and root chord increased. A new center section allowed the new thicker airfoil to include two .50s in each wing, giving six .50s and the ever present 37mm. The fuselage was LENGTHENED 1.75 feet to accommodate THE LONGER Allison V-1710-E9 (-47) BECAUSE OF THE OVERALL LENGTH WITH THE AUX STAGE SUPERCHARGER. The normal gross weight came in just under 9000 pounds making it the heaviest Airacobra ever built. The first acft was used for handling qualifications with the temporary engine and crashed during spin tests after 15 hours. The second acft had the -47 engine and was used only for performance tests. A replacement third aircraft was ordered and built, 42-71464, with no armor, armament and basic radio. Although the second acft reached 393 mph, the USAAF saw no further need for the E model. All this reading is going to make me the new P-39 expert although my favorite is the P-38. I had forgotten how much data on the P-39 and variations, as well as the P-63, Matthews has collected. He actually begins the Bell story in 1934, the very beginning of the company . Our resident P-39 Expert should make this his textbook and study for a degree.

 

[fubar57]

Those are just silly words, not to be taken seriously as Birch Matthews isn't a P-39 Expert

 

[GrauGeist]

How can Birch Matthews be taken seriously if he doesn't have the word "expert" in his name?

 

[buffnut453]

How can Birch Matthews be taken seriously if he doesn't have the word "expert" in his name?

But you can make Etsbirt from some of the letters....which sounds kindda close.

 

[SaparotRob]

Birch Matthews in his book, Cobra, covers the XP-39E. Three were contracted, two for flight and one structure test. The first, 41-19501 and the second 41-19501. To build the XP-39E, major portions of the wing and fuselage changed. Wingspan and root chord increased. A new center section allowed the new thicker airfoil to include two .50s in each wing, giving six .50s and the ever present 37mm. The fuselage was LENGTHENED 1.75 feet to accommodate THE LONGER Allison V-1710-E9 (-47) BECAUSE OF THE OVERALL LENGTH WITH THE AUX STAGE SUPERCHARGER. The normal gross weight came in just under 9000 pounds making it the heaviest Airacobra ever built. The first acft was used for handling qualifications with the temporary engine and crashed during spin tests after 15 hours. The second acft had the -47 engine and was used only for performance tests. A replacement third aircraft was ordered and built, 42-71464, with no armor, armament and basic radio. Although the second acft reached 393 mph, the USAAF saw no further need for the E model. All this reading is going to make me the new P-39 expert although my favorite is the P-38. I had forgotten how much data on the P-39 and variations, as well as the P-63, Matthews has collected. He actually begins the Bell story in 1934, the very beginning of the company . Our resident P-39 Expert should make this his textbook and study for a degree.

So Bell Aircraft, with their plans and their actual planes that they built, lengthened the fuselage, in their factory, to get that power plant in. The wings were different so in essence Bell, the manufacturer of P-39's, had to to come up with a different airplane ? Didn't they know that the the new engine would fit without the fuse modification?

 

[fubar57]

They only created the illusion of a longer fuselage. It was the same length.....pay attention pulleeeze

 

[SaparotRob]

Sorry. I'm kinda' out of my depth here.

 

[fubar57]

I think all of us, save one, is out of our depth here

 

[GregP]

This thread is dedicated to all those inventive people who tried to do the impossible and succeeded. It is also dedicated to those cravers, who have the heart of crine in life. Because never before would pursuit of genius, of inventive type, with the crib of sworn-in nine. In life itself, men are said to laugh, or he has his foot in the crine sign. But in hearts anew we know, that praise of quorites is the important. Fingers of the hand are signed, in 1914.

 

[Glider]

I think all of us, save one, is out of our depth here

Personally I see the opposite. He dived in and then found that he was out of his depth

 

[fubar57]

I stand corrected

 

[buffnut453]

This thread is dedicated to all those inventive people who tried to do the impossible and succeeded. It is also dedicated to those cravers, who have the heart of crine in life. Because never before would pursuit of genius, of inventive type, with the crib of sworn-in nine. In life itself, men are said to laugh, or he has his foot in the crine sign. But in hearts anew we know, that praise of quorites is the important. Fingers of the hand are signed, in 1914.

Have you been at the sherry again, Greg? Or was it the medicinal brandy this time?

 

[P-39 Expert]

Birch Matthews in his book, Cobra, covers the XP-39E. Three were contracted, two for flight and one structure test. The first, 41-19501 and the second 41-19502. To build the XP-39E, major portions of the wing and fuselage changed. Wingspan and root chord increased. A new center section allowed the new thicker airfoil to include two .50s in each wing, giving six .50s and the ever present 37mm. The fuselage was LENGTHENED 1.75 feet to accommodate THE LONGER Allison V-1710-E9 (-47) BECAUSE OF THE OVERALL LENGTH WITH THE AUX STAGE SUPERCHARGER. The normal gross weight came in just under 9000 pounds making it the heaviest Airacobra ever built. The first acft was used for handling qualifications with the temporary engine and crashed during spin tests after 15 hours. The second acft had the -47 engine and was used only for performance tests. A replacement third aircraft was ordered and built, 42-71464, with no armor, armament and basic radio. Although the second acft reached 393 mph, the USAAF saw no further need for the E model. All this reading is going to make me the new P-39 expert although my favorite is the P-38. I had forgotten how much data on the P-39 and variations, as well as the P-63, Matthews has collected. He actually begins the Bell story in 1934, the very beginning of the company . Our resident P-39 Expert should make this his textbook and study for a degree.

I've had that book for years, so long that the back is already out of it. It was a logical assumption that the fuselage was lengthened for the aux stage, but actually the engine section where the aux stage is located is the same size on both the P-39 and P-39E. The aft fuselage behind the bulkhead at the end of the engine section was lengthened.

 

[pbehn]

I've had that book for years, so long that the back is already out of it. It was a logical assumption that the fuselage was lengthened for the aux stage, but actually the engine section where the aux stage is located is the same size on both the P-39 and P-39E. The aft fuselage behind the bulkhead at the end of the engine section was lengthened.

Why did they lengthen the fuselage? It seems a very silly thing to do when the Aux supercharger fitted in the P-39.

 

[Thumpalumpacus]

View attachment 635432

See? Even on land, they had to weigh down the nose due to CoG!

 

[pbehn]

Not being an expert on the subject I am a little confused. The list of engine variants for the Allison V-1710 says that the -47 variant was an "E" model, those with the aux supercharger were F variants. Was the plane that crashed after 15 hrs flight testing fitted with the Aux supercharger?

 

[GregP]

That was the dedication from the old movie "Gizmo." Not the critter Gizmo, but the old collection of early film clips of inventions.

If you haven't seen it, it's worth the look back at things they tried to invent since movie film came out. There are definitely some crazy things going on in that movie!

Gizmo! (1977) - IMDb

 

[Greg Boeser]

Actually, the universe is at odds with itself re: P-39 actually being flown by 31st FG in combat. The 8th AF VC detail Victory credits have 2 P-39 victories on 19 August, 1942. Frank Olynyk (whom I trust most of historians) has Spit V and Roger Freeman has Spitfire assigned to 31st upon arrival in Britain. JG 26 Hermichen stated Aircobra for August 19th - amidst another victory claim for a Spitfire in the same area around Dieppe.

I relied on 8th AF and JG 26 as primary source but have no dog in this hunt as I have never been certain. My logic is that 350th FG conclusively were assigned P-400 that RAF did not want. ALL my sources agree that, and that it was briefly assigned to 8th AF. My father's last USAF job was Dpty COS - Missiles Div, ADC to M.Gen Sandy McCorkle - former CO of 31st. McCorkle was NOT with 31st in England, joined in 1943 as CO. That said, he 'remembered' that 1st flew Aircobra's in England before conversion to Spits.

If so, where did they go - the 350th FG?

Maybe MG McCorkle was remembering flying the P-39 in Alaska with the 54th FG. The 54th deployed in June 1942 and was withdrawn in December. McCorkle was the deputy commander and commander during this time. The unit participated in a total of nine offensive missions between 14 September and 9 October, claiming ten Japanese float planes for the loss of one. The P-39 was found to lack the range for the distances involved in the theater, and the landing gear proved not sturdy enough for the rough forward airfields in theater. The unit returned to the States where it was converted to an RTU.

 

[FLYBOYJ]

It was a logical assumption that the fuselage was lengthened for the aux stage

Why don't you just end with that and give it a rest.