R Leonard
Staff Sergeant
This is, more correctly, an FM-2, not an F4F. Note exhaust location and the taller tail found only with the FM-2.
Grumman F4F Wildcat
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BlackSheep
Banned
- 443
- May 31, 2018
That passenger cubby reminds me of some Skyraider info, I recently found and was going to add to the Skyraider thread still active.
Before the 4-seat cockpit AD—5 was built, 35 AD-1Q and and an unspecified number of AD-3Ns were built. The AD-1Qs carried an ECM operator in the fuselage while the AD-3N carried 2 techs, an ECM operator and a radar operator for night attack and radar bombing. Talk about
claustrophobic, I don't even want to think about the rumored 8-passenger model. And, I used to think flying radio operator in an Avenger sounded dicey……
SaparotRob
Unter Gemeine Geschwader Murmeltier XIII
I looked in Wiki about an ambulance version but couldn't find it. I thought there was one.
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Snautzer01
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1939 XF4F-3 during test flight
WW2 Picture Photo 1939 XF4F-3 during test flight 0048 | eBay
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BlackSheep
Banned
- 443
- May 31, 2018
Wasn't it also the cargo version with built in hoist?
1939 XF4F-3 during test flight
View attachment 698777
WW2 Picture Photo 1939 XF4F-3 during test flight 0048 | eBay
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Nice shots!
BlackSheep
Banned
- 443
- May 31, 2018
Great find!
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- #170
Snautzer01
Honourably banned
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With a Wildcat. Bet you you see it here first. Airplane Towing Service for Disabled Planes
Original WW II US Navy Press Photo Airplane Towing Service for Disabled Planes | eBay
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"Yo, HEAVE ho!"With a Wildcat. Bet you you see it here first. Airplane Towing Service for Disabled Planes
View attachment 703556
View attachment 703557
Original WW II US Navy Press Photo Airplane Towing Service for Disabled Planes | eBay
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SaparotRob
Unter Gemeine Geschwader Murmeltier XIII
Bet you're right!With a Wildcat. Bet you you see it here first. Airplane Towing Service for Disabled Planes
View attachment 703556
View attachment 703557
Original WW II US Navy Press Photo Airplane Towing Service for Disabled Planes | eBay
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Terrific little fighter, still combat effective to the last days of WWII.
The last kills by the Fleet Air Arm in the ETO were scored by Wildcats escorting an anti shipping strike off Norway in March 1945, 8 Wildcats were bounced by 8 Bf09G's, resulting in 4 Bf109's shot down.
Alas, nearly every surviving Wildcat was pushed over the side of carriers in the weeks after VJ Day.
The last kills by the Fleet Air Arm in the ETO were scored by Wildcats escorting an anti shipping strike off Norway in March 1945, 8 Wildcats were bounced by 8 Bf09G's, resulting in 4 Bf109's shot down.
Alas, nearly every surviving Wildcat was pushed over the side of carriers in the weeks after VJ Day.
BlackSheep
Banned
- 443
- May 31, 2018
Truly sad and awe-inspiring to think that Wildcats and other planes were considered junk not worth transporting at war's end. Imagine how many times in the early months of the war that some officer was bemoaning the lack of availability of fighters and a few years later, he is watching deck personnel pushing them overboard.
While, vaguely on the subject of junk, I found out another war-related fact of some interest. I'm sure, most of us have heard how the old wrecks have been disappearing, for reasons unknown, until large amounts of ship parts started making appearances at salvage yards. For example, these grave robbers were getting $5k per brass ship screw while interfering with the last resting places for so many heroes.
So, what I didn't know was that the steel being stolen and sold can command a premium because it isn't contaminated by radionuclides and thus able to be used in sensitive builds, such as Geiger counters and spacecraft sensors. With modern techniques and changes in nuclear testing, the demand isn't what it once was, but, it is still contributing to the desecration of these war graves.
Edit: Forgot to mention the reason the steel in not contaminated by radionuclides is due to it's being manufactured before the Atomic bombs and subsequent nuclear tests.
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What you going to do with second rate fighters, suitable for CVEs only, in the world's greatest navy, overstocked with carriers, no enemies in sight, and awash with F6Fs and F4Us? Especially with every homebound hull needed to repatriate overseas personnel and haul IMPORTANT equipment stateside. Most CVEs and some CVLs had one way tickets to the scrap yard, and the rest were headed for mothballs. "Fans are history; blowtorches are the future."
BlackSheep
Banned
- 443
- May 31, 2018
Thus the reason I said "awe inspiring" to think that a country could climb so far in a 4-5 year period that it would accumulate such a surplus of equipment. As for "what (are?) you going to do….", I know a lot of people that would love to get their hands on a second rate fighter suitable for CVEs only..
Sometimes, I like to display a bit of emotion in my comments, rather than taking "the Spock only logic" approach.
Live Long and Prosper!Today, yes, even I would love to get my hands on an FM2; but 1945-46, not so much. "WWII and it's machinery are so yesterday. We want to look forward, not back." Most all of the adults of my childhood regarded the war as a recent nightmare that changed them in ways they weren't happy with. Some of them had unsettling reactions to surprises and sudden sounds ten and fifteen years later. Sure, there were a few adrenalin addicts out there with the skills and the wherewithal to operate a surplus fighter, but F6Fs, F4Us, P51s, P47s, and the like could be had for a song, so who wants a tired, war weary FM2?
BlackSheep
Banned
- 443
- May 31, 2018
I believe you miss the entire reason for my post in your need to make your point of the condition of the equipment in question. It isn't about owning cutting edge equipment, flying to the edge of space, or getting my adrenalin junkie rocks off, it's just a love of history, a desire to learn of and from it, coupled with a deep respect for the lives lost on all sides of the conflict. So, while I acknowledge some, but certainly not all of what you are attempting to say, I will also state that just because my writing comes from a deeper place than an accountant's ledger, it doesn't necessarily mean I don't know the difference between what is obsolete, practical, and necessary. Sometimes, especially on this forum, I assume the readers know that something like a Wildcat was only around to fill a niche role and attempt to contribute something a bit more meaningful than reading off the contents of a spreadsheet.
As for war weary FM-2s, I will concede your point, after all, when 8 FM-2s met 8 Me-109 G6s in March of 1945, the Wildcats only managed to down 3 without taking a loss of their own. If they'd been in Hellcats or Corsairs, none of the 109s would have survived. (Yes, many factors were in play but the bottom line is the guys in the Wildcats won that day.)
Spoken like a true scholar, several generations removed from the true reality of WWII. I get your point. But for the adults I grew up surrounded by, it hasn't history, it was current events, and it remained so for the rest of their lives. "History is everything that happened before you became aware of the world around you; everything in your lifetime is current events, and hard for most folks to put in 'the history box'."
