Hasegawa 1/48 Bf 109K-4

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In addition to the hard edged appearance of the wave markings themselves, another indication that masks may have been used for the fuselage are the photos of Red(or Blue) 7.



The relatively soft demarcation between the lighter and darker camo colors (a) leading into the harder edge "valley" of the wavy pattern (b) would be very difficult to accomplish by spraying only. But it would be a common outcome if masks were used to form the wave pattern and the painters handsprayed the two camo colors over the mask. This could also explain why the wave shapes of certain 331xxx aircraft camo look the same even though the junction between the two camo colors varies.

W.Nr 331461


Blue 16


Just a personal theory...
 
As a theory I can offer no better explanation. Do we know exactly how German aircraft were typically painted? There is not a lot of information I could find. What kind and type of masks did they use? Were they primarily painted in the field or at time of manufacture?
 
Robert, there was a factory application of all camo colours but these were often modified in the field, especially toward the end of the war to offer added protection from low flying aircraft. While I would defer to experts on the matter, and I'm certainly not one, I would agree that the vertical stab and rudder of the late model 109s that came from certain factories did receive a masked camo pattern. This would have been simple to do with a standard template that was easily portable. However, I have difficulty thinking that the larger assemblies like fuselage would have undergone a time-consuming masking process late in the war where speedy production was of utmost importance. Again, I could be proven wrong by others who know better.

I think the examples posted by John definitely show a very tight demarcation but I still feel that this was probably achieved by a careful spraying close to the surface. The effect was certainly well achieved with the described masking for this scale.
 
It's all conjecture on my part. I'm thinking that using some sort of masks actually sped up the painting process and that's why you start to see it more during the later war years. What I'm obsessing on right now is why the small section of nose behind the spinner of Blue 16 is so light? Hard to tell but it looks lighter than either the RLM 76 undersides or the assumed RLM 75 on top. Some references mention K-4 schemes using RLM 77, which is a light grey.

 
Great work here John!

My two cents on the hard camo (and it is just my opinion as an artist):
It looks to me as if the darker patches on those K-4 tail assemblies were brush painted (possibly over a presprayed background colour), hence the very sharp edging. This assembly isn't large and the camouflage patches would be easy enough to brush paint, and much quicker than setting up, painting, and cleaning an airbrush.
The fuselage is obviously a much larger job (and components were often produced in seperate locations by that stage anyway), so spraying is the obvious solution there. That the edging appears very hard on some machines, I would agree with Andy that it is *probably* just very tight spraywork, brush probably held close and sprayed upwards.
Masks would be a logical solution for markings and call signs, so I would agree with you they were probably used to a certain extent, just not sure if that would extend to camouflage aswell.

Again, just my opinion...
 
This is what so interesting/frustrating/fun about Luftwaffe aircraft... some things we'll just never know. Evan, I would agree with your conclusion as being very plausible after looking at the tail spot pictures individually but would alter that conclusion after evaluating the pictures together. It's obvious to me that the spots on different aircraft are not simply similar in size and shape but share traits of being identical, thus leading to my conclusion that some sort of pre-fabricated pattern was used. Anywhoo... it was fun looking at Marc-André Haldimann's astounding collection of wartime 109 photos on Facebook in detective mode.

Speaking of tail spots... I tackled Blue 16's tail spots just now. After masking off the tail and painting it Dark Green (RLM 83), I used small pieces of Blu Tack to replicate the spots.


I sprayed over the tail with RLM 75. This came out fairly well except there where the Blu Tack lifted paint in the middle of the spots... how to fix these???


Removing additional masks revealed more lifted tape. Again, a very tough fix. I'm really worried about the masks on bottom of the horizontal stabs lifting huge spots of paint when I remove them.


So... I did it over. This time I used RLM 81. The tail assembly of Blue 16 is missing in the photo so there is no authoritative answer but some references state that the tail was likely RLM 81 over RLM 83 based on other similarly colored Batch 331xxx aircraft.


Some more lifted paint but since they are away from any borders, they'll be easy to fix. And miraculously the stabilizer masks came off really clean.


The wavy pattern on the bottom edge of the rudder was cut from masking tape. I experimented with a couple of possible techniques for this including brush painting and Micro Mask but settled on drawing the wavy pattern on piece of Tamiya tape and cutting with a pair of small scissors.


On we go...
 
Great work John! However the Germans did it, you've captured the look very well.

Unfortunately blue tack is not as 'stainless' as they say, as anyone who's stuck a picture on a wall with it will know...it can also remove paint from plastered walls. Glad you could fix up the tail spots anyway, the fuselage should be easier to fix.
 
That is a complicated camouflage design (my respect to the Germans for the designs of most camouflage of his entire air force in WWII, my favorites). You have done outstanding work, and the way to resolve the adverse details, make clear your commitment and dedication to get ahead.

I have suffered these detachments of painting; And among other reasons, could be (in my experience)
- the blue tak or tape, have a greater adhesion.
- The paint did not have enough time to dry.
- a previous coat of primer, allows a better adhesion of the paint.
Learning from the advice, tips and formidable works of several of you, allow us to continue evolving in our abilities.

Is there another reason you identified in what happened to your painting, John?
It will always be important to learn from your experience.

I send my best regards, my friend.
Luis Carlos
 
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It is very hard to say how Luftwaffe aircraft were painted, the factory schemes were carefully proportioned and generally sprayed. Field modifications are well known, and many, many aircraft late in the war were re-sprayed following repair.
The only Bf 109 to retain its original wartime paint is the one at the AWM, which started life as a G-6. It was re-sprayed at a repair facility, I would suggest, by a relatively unskilled painter with a very loose demarcation.



I think that some smaller sub-assemblies were sprayed using a mask late in the war. this is a sensible expedient when using unskilled labour. Masks were widely used in the British aircraft industry for the same reason. I don't think there is much evidence that major components were sprayed this way at the main German manufacturing plants....but you can never be sure.

Cheers

Steve
 
Paint lifting continues to be an issue. It's definitely made worse by the thinned paints I'm spraying. In order to preserve the fine rivets, I chose not to primer the model before painting and that probably has an effect. It also depends on how carefully I remove the masking. Thanks for the comments about the camo pattern theories. I'm not a Luftwaffe experten by any means but I like to capture what I see and sometimes I see things from a different perspective than the established view and I hope that is ok.

After the factory camo per the Batch 331xxx was applied, there was trepidation on my part to start on the obvious field modifications that were performed on Blue 16. It's like purposefully messing up a nice painting. But it has to be done. I started by spraying a darker green along the bottom edge of the rear fuselage. I used Dark Grey ala RLM 66 to simulate the numeral being blacked out and also painted the canopy and windshield frames this color I filled in the front half of the fuselage with RLM 83 mottling. The green fuselage band was added with the now expected paint lifting.



Using an old Montex mask set that I had for a G-10 build, I painted the side crosses. I chose to use masks here so I could match the dark green of the crosses to the fuselage. I've also added some grey mottling.



So here's a pulled back view of where I'm at.



Taking a break here to consider my next step. Still thinking about the light grey on the nose... might mask off the engine cowling and treat the nose per the profile of Yellow 1 that I posted earlier.
 
Crimea_River said:
Looks very good John. It's possible you have some oily deposit on the model surfaces that is causing the lifting. Primer or a light sanding would have likely helped but I'm sure you know that.
Click to expand...

Exactly... I'm thinking maybe fingerprints in that particular area? Hopefully I'm past that now but it's good to keep in mind for future builds.

I've been continuing with the crosses using Montex masks. Although I don't like their canopy masks, I give the marking masks that Montex makes a thumbs up. They are a thicker plastic to make them easier to handle (they're not flopping all over the place), keep their shape even after multiple uses and they are translucent so they are easy to place. The upper wing crosses were pretty easy.


The bottom wing crosses took a bit more time. Not that they were particularly difficult but I only had a single mask for this as I must've used one on another build and thrown it away after using it. Since it is a two-part mask, the overall cross outline is masked first and painted black. The inner cross is then placed with the first mask still in place and the white is sprayed. One mask meant I had to do one marking at a time. They came out very nice though.


Before putting on a gloss for the rest of the decals, I decided to a first round of weathering using highly thinned brown and black on panel lines. I kept it subtle as it is always possible to add more but very difficult to remove.



The bottom has more of this weathering due to the light color.


The gloss coat goes on now. I've used Alclad Aqua Gloss thinned with 91% iso alcohol. I really like this stuff... it's nice and strong and dries really fast. It is touch dry within minutes.





I'll do the decals and a panel wash next. Perhaps do a light salt weathering on the topside. I chosen to keep the engine cowling as is for now but I could easily have a change of heart and repaint it.
 
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