Geoffrey Sinclair
Staff Sergeant
- 914
- Sep 30, 2021
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The vented blast myth.
Here are some excerpts from the damage report for the Enterprise when it was struck by a kamakazie on May 14, 19445
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The famous photo of a portion of the elevator 400 feet in the air.
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Note the flight deck was bulged upwards by 3 and and half feet
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Full report is here: USS Enterprise CV6 War History 1941 - 1945
From the Wasp lost in action report
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Elevator blown up and over. Side venting doesn't seemed to have helped.
The statement that
" the shock was fed down through the armoured box into the hull causing structural damage like bent shafts, twisted keels and other not good outcomes.
The other thing was a fire in the hanger - it didn't vent and temperatures reached such high levels, yet again, twisted hull" is not true . Bent shafts were caused by underwater explosion from near misses. What specific references to you have for twisted hulls from hanger fires?
As to your statement that the US didn't want armored flight decks here is an excerpt from the USS Franklin damage report
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Report is here: USS Franklin CV-13 War Damage Report No. 56
Actually the USN was 'stupid" enough to follow the RN. Every USN fleet carrier after the Essex class was fitted with an armored flight deck. It was a decision based on experience with the survivability of RN carriers. Note that the strength deck was still at the hanger level on the Midway class, the armored flight deck was pure superstructure .
It also important to note that the USN carriers were struck with smaller bombs (500lb) than the RN were hit with in the Med. The destructive power of a 1000 lb bomb was more than twice that of a 500 lb. NO carrier suffered any where near the number of bomb hits the Illustrious took on January 1, 1941 and lived to tell the tale.
As to the closed hanger the USN spent a lot of money post war turning their Essex class carriers into Illustrious look alikes.
Note sides are plated and the bow enclosed.Aircraft Carrier Intrepid | Exhibitions | Intrepid Museum
Launched in 1943, the aircraft carrier USS Intrepid fought in World War II, surviving five kamikaze attacks and one torpedo strike. Visit the museum today.www.intrepidmuseum.org
Another thing to note is the appalling casualty rate on US carriers which was far far greater than on RN ships. I have the stats somewhere and will dig them up.
Indeed. But if if they persisted, I wonder if a single seat fighter variant would have looked like a single-seat, narrow-bodied Balliol.The Skua was a dead end in development terms - might as well investigate a new airframe altogether.
Yeah some kid made a song about that.It does look better.
I like big tails and that I can't deny.
I like big tails and that I can't deny.
And I thought the Firebrand had a disproportionately tall tail.
OOOH, OOOH, I know!! Put 20 pounds of crap into a 5 pound sack, per government specification?Dunno how Blackburn got that so wrong. Horrendously over engineered aeroplane. Brown, resident FAA test pilot du jour had little nice to say about flying it.
OOOH, OOOH, I know!! Put 20 pounds of crap into a 5 pound sack, per government specification?
I did not state than the Essex class was rebuilt with an armored flight deck. They were rebuilt with closed hanger sides and enclosed bows like the Illustrious.The rebuilt Essex class were fitted with a 1.5" steel flight deck, not because they 'wanted to mimic' the Illustrious design, it was simply needed as a strength deck to operate the much heavier jets.
The Midway design was a disastrous dead end, terrible ships with an awful and vicious roll thanks to being so top heavy with the pointless heavy armoured deck.
No US carrier after the Midway dead end used an armoured flight deck. They all use steel strength decks of 1.5"-2", a simple design requirement due to their huge size.
I wouldn't blame the government for the Firebrand. Blackburn simply wasn't the A team when it came to designing aircraft. They were given a reset and came up with the Firecrest which was actually in many ways worse than the Firebrand.OOOH, OOOH, I know!! Put 20 pounds of crap into a 5 pound sack, per government specification?
It's amazing that nine years after the Firecrest debacle, Blackburn somehow arrived at one of the superlative postwar low level strike aircraft with the Buccaneer. First flying in 1958, the Buccaneer was still flying combat missions over thirty years later.Blackburn simply wasn't the A team when it came to designing aircraft.
I believe Peter had left Westland before the Wyvern was designedHow does Petter's Westland Wyvern compare to Blackburn's Firebrand and Firecrest?
If his Whirlwind, Canberra, Gnat and Lightning are any indication I'd like to think, if temporarily seconded to Blackburn, Petter could have made a better Skua. Though he sounds like a terrible person to work with.
He was still on the Westland payroll, but went awol. But I see now that the Wyvern was a Mensford-led design. I always thought the Wyvern didn't share the clean lines of Petter's Whirlwind and Canberra.I believe Peter had left Westland before the Wyvern was designed
Maybe, maybe not.So, do we think Petter seconded to Blackburn in 1936 can help the Skua?
It would have been interesting to see what Petter would accomplish if given strict parameters; single Merlin engine, grass strip capable, etc.Maybe, maybe not.
Petter did a lot things right. He also did a lot things w..........let's say, not so good, in retrospect.
For the Whirlwind the air intakes to carbs may not have been so hot.
On the Whirlwind prototype the exhaust pipes were certainly streamlined, but running the hot exhausts through pipes (inner and outer) through the fuel tanks and out the back of the wing (and reducing the exhaust thrust) wasn't the best idea by any stretch of the imagination.
Not sure who's idea the Excelsior engine controls were. Made running the controls easy, keeping them adjusted for even a few hours was a problem.
Using the landing flaps as part of the cooling flap to the radiators was certainly innovative and saved parts, cost, and weight.
It also meant you couldn't taxi the plane without overheating the engines unless the landing flaps were down.
Part of the problem he had working with others was that he disliked criticisms of the less that stellar ideas.
Whirlwind had to get special permission to use higher air pressure tires than the RAF used on every other plane to avoid putting ruts in the grass airfields.
Easy to make your plane more streamline if you don't follow the same rules as the other designers ( he got to use smaller rear nacelles to house the smaller landing gear.)
And there was only so much Petter could do if he was forced to use the Perseus engine.
One History says that after the prototype flew a Mercury engine production planes flew with the Perseus because all (most?) of the Mercury production was allocated to Blenheim production. Don't know if that is true. The Wellington and Hampden were probably sucking up the Pegasus engines though?
Part of the problem with the Skua was that ran late. 21 months from flight of prototype to first squadron. IN 1934 when work began they were expecting delivery to start in 1937.
Only 12 were delivered in 1938.
Petter was also busy designing and sorting out the Lysander.