In 1942: top 3 Allied fighters

[tomo pauk]

Same drill as in similar threads: what would be the top 3 land-based fighters available for Allies? Only the service machines qualify - no prototypes and one offs. Naval fighters can compete, but the ability to be used board the CV does not yield them any points. As always, the best blend of raw performance, firepower, handling, range/radius and protection is looked for.

Please, no flag waving. Hopefully your nominees would incorporate at least two countries of origin

 

[Shortround6]

US is in trouble

they have the P-38 and the ....................
No P-51s in US service squadrons by the end of 1942 (A-36s are being delivered but in service?)
The P-47 equips two Fighter groups but they are still in the US training.
F6F is not in Service. (only 10 delivered by the end of Dec)
F4U units are in training, 1st is declared operational in Jan 1943.

That leaves the P-38, P-39, the Allison and Merlin P-40s and the F4F.

 

[Vincenzo]

Again Spit is one of three

 

[Vincenzo]

and again a my list like '41 list it's with a different requirement (SE combat), but all in this list are sure in topic
Buffalo, F2A-3 and export variants 339C, D and E
Hawk, P-36A and export variants 75A-7 and Mohawk IV
CW-21B
Lancer
I-16 Type 18 and following (in China probably also older)
Wildcat/Martlet, 3, 3A, 4, I, II, III
La-5
LaGG-3
MiG-3
Yak-9
P-40K (and older) and export Tomahawk and Kittyhawk
Yak-1B
Yak-7B
Mustang
Typhoon
Spitfire IX (and older)
Hurricane II
Yak-1
Yak-7
P-39D&F (and older)

not in my list but was in the field the P-38F, the G was in production but i don't think operational need a check

 

[wuzak]

The Spitfire IX - definitely.
The Spitfire XII - did this get into service in 1942. I think maybe it was 1943, not sure. First productionmachines delivered in October 1942, though?
The Mustang I/IA (II?) - would be up there as well.
And the P-38 was probably also in the top 3.

Is the Tiffy sufficiently sorted in 1942 to be considered for the top 3?

 

[tomo pauk]

Don't need too much range? Spitfire IX
Need plenty of range? P-38
After those two, there is the Mustang I (or IA because 4 cannons?; plenty of fuel, but neither has drop tanks; II is in production from March 1943), La-5, or maybe LaGG-3-37 for some Soviet-style firepower (short range; neither has drop tanks?). Anyhow, those listed will come short from the leading two in important categories.

A wildcard: Mosquito FB as a day fighter?

 

[drgondog]

1

 

[Shortround6]

A wildcard: Mosquito FB as a day fighter?

Nope, it wasn't built to handle the high "g" turns. Not to say they didn't on occasion out turn an enemy aircraft.

 

[pbehn]

FW 190 and Bf 109G-1 and 2 have to be considered

Who are your allies, not saying they weren't great AC?

 

[pbehn]

Nope, it wasn't built to handle the high "g" turns. Not to say they didn't on occasion out turn an enemy aircraft.

I cant see any data for the mossie in G turns, it could carry a big load but is there anything about max G loads in turns for the fighter versions?

 

[drgondog]

it was a Brain fart Pbehn

 

[CORSNING]

The Spitfire IX - definitely.
The Spitfire XII - did this get into service in 1942. I think maybe it was 1943, not sure. First productionmachines delivered in October 1942, though?
The Mustang I/IA (II?) - would be up there as well.
And the P-38 was probably also in the top 3.

Is the Tiffy sufficiently sorted in 1942 to be considered for the top 3?

Wuzak,
I'm not quite sure when the Spitfire XII was delivered to the RAF, but it first became operational with 41 91 Squadrons on 3 April 1943.

I am having the same problem figuring out if the P-39M which was delivered to the USAAF in November 1942 can be used or not. When you consider that VVS and Luftwaffe fighters were used very quickly after being delivered...? This model of Airacobra had a higher top speed up to 15,000 ft. and could outclimb the Merlin 61 +15 lbs. Spitfire IX up to about 7,500 ft. The margin was very small and the altitude limited, but still...then we remove the 4 x 0.3 in wing guns like the Russians did and see what happens.

Jeff.

 

[Vincenzo]

AFAIK P-39M start the production in november '42

 

[CORSNING]

Hi Vencenzo,
In America's Hundred Thousand, Dean states that the first P-39Ms were delivered in November 1942. It could very well be both, that production and deliveries began in this month...? I have not come across the production starting date of the M model Airacobra (yet).

Jeff

 

[Vincenzo]

my source is Baugher page and would be wrong again, however commonly fist delivery go not at combat unit so is very doubtfull that M was operational in '42

 

[CORSNING]

I am incline to agree and will not use the P-39M unless someone has information stating it was operationally ready in 1942.

 

[CORSNING]

I looked over Vincenzo's list in post #4 and would chose the Whirlwind over the Buffalo, Hawk 75, CW-21, Lancer, I-16, MiG-3, Hurricane and Wildcat. Maybe more. The LaG-5/La-5 in 1942 was manufactured from discarded LaGG-3 airframes. The contemporary LaGG-3 was actually a well liked aircraft that could outperform the La-5.
I am still researching the rest but there is two aircraft that seem to stand out above the others at this time. The Spitfire Mk.IX with the Merlin 61 at +15 lbs. boost and the P-38G-1 of the 14th FG in North Africa. The third one is going to be tough because I can't keep the tails from falling off the Typhoons. Even though the Mustang Ia is the undisputed speed demon below 15,500 ft. it just can't get the lead out when it comes to climbing and it doesn't roll worth a hoot unless it has its speed way up.

, Jeff

 

[Vincenzo]

for the accident report list the first P-38G lost in north Africa was on 23rd march '43
the first overseas lost is on 13th november '42 in England (and was not from a combat unit)
the first overseas lost in a combat unit (96thFS/82ndFG) was on 16th december '42 ever in England

i checked also for the 39M
first overseas ... Canada 14th FRS 30/12/42
first overseas not Canada unit NA, 18/02/43 England

 

[CORSNING]

Great information Vincenzo. Thank you, Jeff

 

[Vincenzo]

You are welcome
Data by George of All About Warfare II
La-5 (n° 37212383) max power not "forced" max speed SL 509 km/h, max speed a 6.2 km 586 km/h, time to 5 km 6.1'
forced SL 545 km/h, 569 km/h at 3.2 km, time to 5 km 5.4'
LaGG-3 34th block (august '42 n° 31213445) SL 501 km/h, 560 km/h at 3.78 km, time to 5 km 7.3'