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I don't know and don't care about what has been said by those who were not even born back then.I have read about the "sanitizing" of the Wehrmacht after the war. It was a politically expedient. The Wehrmacht was also ordered to, and did, carry out large scale atrocities.
Not a "source", but worth considering as an option:
In movie "Fury", the US forces kill SS POWs. I know it's a movie, but we actually have real time examples... Dachau massacre, done by US troops, victims were SS troops, recently transferred to area.
Have in mind, what we know, is what allowed to be shared on public...I know that some incidents happened. I reject the notion that these were "routine" occurrences.
It is happening still as we can see here. I worked all over Northern Europe and some places in the south, no place I worked was there no evidence of German atrocities, a big surprise for me was in Greece, which I hadnt heard about, but you get told about there on the road signs.I have read about the "sanitizing" of the Wehrmacht after the war. It was a politically expedient. The Wehrmacht was also ordered to, and did, carry out large scale atrocities.
Can you read german?Americans executing prisoners was hardly "routine". If you have a source for that claim, please present it.
I have read about the "sanitizing" of the Wehrmacht after the war. It was a politically expedient. The Wehrmacht was also ordered to, and did, carry out large scale atrocities.
I actually had an in depth conversation on this topic with a military historian (an American). He explained that the military history of USA was born in the "Indian Wars" which were genocidal, hence No military culture of POW was ingrained in training. Remember that a 40 year old senior officer in WW2 would have attended Academy in say 1925, and it became illegal to kill Indians around 1908 in USA.Not a "source", but worth considering as an option:
In movie "Fury", the US forces kill SS POWs. I know it's a movie, but we actually have real time examples... Dachau massacre, done by US troops, victims were SS troops, recently transferred to area.
Did he tell you when other countries started taking prisoners in large numbers, high value prisoners were taken, the officers were usually wealthy and could be held for a ransom, the others on a Napoleonic battlefield that didnt escape were killed, prior to that they frequently werent prisoners taken, but slaves. Now, about all these places taken by the German army where all was peace and love, can you tell me the name of them please, just one will do, as a start. I note that you have very quickly confused the treatment of soldiers in battle with the treatment of civilians after the battles finished.I actually had an in depth conversation on this topic with a military historian (an American). He explained that the military history of USA was born in the "Indian Wars" which were genocidal, hence No military culture of POW was ingrained in training. Remember that a 40 year old senior officer in WW2 would have attended Academy in say 1925, and it became illegal to kill Indians around 1908 in USA.
I have personally spoken with veterans who executed Japanese and German prisoners. In both cases they explained it was inconvenient/ impractical to hold them for logistical purposes, so they shot them. Both explained that as young soldiers they didn't mind as they hated the enemy but as years went by they began to see their victims as humans. If you really want to dig in, find a historian that digs into regimental diaries and statistics. You might notice that towards the end of WW2 USA collected and did not kill vast numbers of enemy but not very many in the first months after landing. BTW notice I prefaced my earlier comments on "based on direct interview". But, there is some shame in the military culture. An example of this manifesting can be seen in the movie "saving private Ryan", where the movie goes to lengths to show why they should have murdered a hapless German soldier who they show kindness to but instead goes back and joins the SS (see they should have murdered him). On a lighter note I remember a story from. Dutch man who took several Japanese prisoners at a remote observation point. He had no way to bring them to his side and they couldn't walk well as they were thin and sick. He had them burn their rifles and ammo, gave them malaria pills, and told them to burn all their radios and most of their clothing and all their boots. He said in a few days people would bring food but only if they would formally surrender to him. He told them they would go home where they were needed to rebuild, to fight on would in fact be cowardly. They all did, and indeed waited for later arrest.
You have only interviewed Americans, not ones from opposit side, it simply means, you haven't heard half of story.I actually had an in depth conversation on this topic with a military historian (an American). He explained that the military history of USA was born in the "Indian Wars" which were genocidal, hence No military culture of POW was ingrained in training. Remember that a 40 year old senior officer in WW2 would have attended Academy in say 1925, and it became illegal to kill Indians around 1908 in USA.
I have personally spoken with veterans who executed Japanese and German prisoners. In both cases they explained it was inconvenient/ impractical to hold them for logistical purposes, so they shot them. Both explained that as young soldiers they didn't mind as they hated the enemy but as years went by they began to see their victims as humans. If you really want to dig in, find a historian that digs into regimental diaries and statistics. You might notice that towards the end of WW2 USA collected and did not kill vast numbers of enemy but not very many in the first months after landing. BTW notice I prefaced my earlier comments on "based on direct interview". But, there is some shame in the military culture. An example of this manifesting can be seen in the movie "saving private Ryan", where the movie goes to lengths to show why they should have murdered a hapless German soldier who they show kindness to but instead goes back and joins the SS (see they should have murdered him). On a lighter note I remember a story from. Dutch man who took several Japanese prisoners at a remote observation point. He had no way to bring them to his side and they couldn't walk well as they were thin and sick. He had them burn their rifles and ammo, gave them malaria pills, and told them to burn all their radios and most of their clothing and all their boots. He said in a few days people would bring food but only if they would formally surrender to him. He told them they would go home where they were needed to rebuild, to fight on would in fact be cowardly. They all did, and indeed waited for later arrest.
This reminds me of a school lesson The story goes tbe English had lost a battle against the French. The French released them but amputated the two fingers needed to draw a bow. The "V" For victory sign was born.Did he tell you when other countries started taking prisoners in large numbers, high value prisoners were taken, the officers were usually wealthy and could be held for a ransom, the others on a Napoleonic battlefield that didnt escape were killed, prior to that they frequently werent prisoners taken, but slaves. Now, about all these places taken by the German army where all was peace and love, can you tell me the name of them please, just one will do, as a start. I note that you have very quickly confused the treatment of soldiers in battle with the treatment of civilians after the battles finished.
The story is that the French at Agincourt told the English that they would cut off their fingers when they (the French) won. When the English won they chased the French waving the fingers they still had, opposite way round to the "v" for victory sign, which in UK is the way to say "f you" like the middle finger in most parts of the world. There is no evidence for this to be true at all.This reminds me of a school lesson The story goes tbe English had lost a battle against the French. The French released them but amputated the two fingers needed to draw a bow. The "V" For victory sign was born.
It was after school, when I got around more, I learned that there really are not so many good "countries" but rather good men who make good and human choices despite personal risk.
Americans executing prisoners was hardly "routine". If you have a source for that claim, please present it.
Have in mind, what we know, is what allowed to be shared on public...
I give another example... One German pilot decided not to shoot down a severely damaged American bomber... The story was said to be not published... Even after war was over...
Now, just think how many similar events could possibly happened? And what portion, we are aware of?
Can you read german?
What a historian might do is start with the regulations- the rules of war flowed into the training. Then look over actual training programs to see how much time was devoted. Then look for refresher in field training (such as modern time UK "green card" ), then study the record for prosecution and count charges and convictions. This has probably all been done. My "sources" are long dead. I am aware that individual reports are not the whole picture, and can be wrong. Example was a Canadian vet who upon seeing original purple wood 8mm German ammo explained to me how when he was in Europe in 1945 they learned that Germany had ran out of metal bullets so we're using wood bullets. He remembered his briefing on it. I didn't have the heart to tell him he was lied to. But I have very vivid memories of old soldiers shaking in tears, and certainly what he told me was his truth, and was deeply disturbing to him (and I).I have never heard of the routine execution of prisoners by US forces but dad was present when a US cook walked in on a group of airmen and medics trying to talk to a Japanese airman who they had captured. The cook shot him dead with the comment that that was the only way he would get to kill a Jap. The MPs took the cook away but dad did not know what happened after that.
One indisputable fact is that the USAAF and RAAF machine gunned and bombed Japanese sailors in lift rafts etc. Look for the full, not edited, documentary Battle of the Bismark Sea for evidence. From memory that got nominated for an Academy Award.