Me-262

[Erich]

actually 3rd staffel would be in the I. gruppe. there was no IV./JG 7 anyway. but besdie the point. the third staffel in a IVth gruppe would be 12th staffel.

does this help ? maybe not..........

 

[plan_D]

Yes, I was simply using the numbers of an example. So 3rd Staffel~1st Gruppe~7th Jagdgeschwader would be 3.I/JG 7?

And also JG is obviously fighter wing, and NJG is night fighter wing. What would be the letters for bomber and ground attack wings?

 

[Erich]

bomber = Kampfgeschwader or KG

ground attack = Schlachtgeschwader or SG

remember though when you say 3./JG 7 it should read 3rd staffel Jagdgeschwader 7 , not 7th Fighter wing. It sounds fine in English but is not proper in the German

 

[plan_D]

I've got it now. Danke Schon.

 

[GermansRGeniuses]

The A-2 was junk and this is one of the reasons KG 51 and 54 went over to the fighter designation (J) for Jäger.

That is not entirely true. As a ground attack aircraft, it was great. The problem was that it was last-ditch (Even more-so than the A-1) and it didn't have too big of an effect because there was no way it couald have. Gas was scarce and they were surrounded and being closed in on at an ever increasing pace.

 

[Erich]

the A-2 was not considered a ground attack a/c but a bomber. the a/c was not good as it was too fast and the pilots had much trouble homing in their payload onto the targets. One reason the two units went over to tacakling the bombers first and secondary bomber missions.

 

[plan_D]

Me-262A-2a were put into Kampfgeschwaders...bomber units, right? See, I'm getting it...

 

[Erich]

correct and then the inventory of the A-1a when the KG 51 and 54 became (J) Jäger units.........

 

[Stuka-99]

I'm still convinced that if Me-262 could have won the war for the Axis.
Although there is one mayor factor in this discussion that I think nearly everone has missed...
The japanese could have used it in there fight against america in the east.
Using Aircraft carriers to bomb the U.S.A. Mainland wich would have caused trouble for moral in America.Of course after wining the battle of Midway what do you think?

 

[Lightning Guy]

Japan was very late getting the Me-262 and I doubt they had a workable aircraft carrier left by that time. Numerous Japanese carriers were esentially sunk in their berths and the Shinano was sunk by a submarine while they were moving it to be fitted out. I don't think it is realistic to say the Japanese could have used the 262 to inflict any appreciable damage to the US.

 

[Stuka-99]

So you're telling me that if the japs had won the battle of Midway the allieswould have still won the war???

 

[the lancaster kicks ass]

yes i think they would, they could out-produse the japs and had home advantage..............

 

[Lightning Guy]

I've posted this link before but apparently Stuka hasn't seen it. The short of it is that even if American lost Midway, it wouldn't have made much difference. If America had lost all three carriers involved in Midway, she would have been able to catch Japan in total numbers of fleet carriers by Sept. '43 and in 9 more months have a 2-1 advantage. Take a look and see just how far American industrial power outstripped Japan.

http://www.combinedfleet.com/economic.htm

 

[plan_D]

It's quite simple really, America out-produced everyone. Although these are from 1936 you can see how much America was ahead in motorised veichle production (Which gives the base for an impressive economy):

America 77.2%
Britain 7.8%
Germany 4.8%
France 3.5%
Canada 3.4%
Italy 0.9%
Others 2.4%

That's the percentage of motorised veichles built by them, in the world. Now, Japan isn't even in the top 6, so it could have never reached Americas production capability. Interestingly though, Russia isn't in the top six. I wonder where all their economy, designs, worker skill and tools came from? Britain, France, America and Germany perhaps?

 

[the lancaster kicks ass]

but remeber that list is done by production of cars, and i would imagine, but i don't know for sure, that russia didn't really care much for cars??

 

[plan_D]

Motor veichles, it incorporates anything with an internal combustion engine. That's tanks as well. And for a good economy you needed a good transport system, and the most efficient ran on the internal combustion engine with good roads. That's why Hitler ordered the construction of the Auto-Bahns you hear so much about today, 700km worth to be precise.

 

[the lancaster kicks ass]

at the time though didn't germany depend more on her huge rail network??

 

[Lightning Guy]

The cars percentages serves as an example of the industrial capacity of a nation. When you consider that the American automobile industry started churning out planes and tanks during the war, you get an idea of the economic and industrial advantages they enjoyed.

 

[plan_D]

No Germany relied on her road network, Hitler and the German generals realised that a rail network is limited. And no effective economy could run a rail network alone.

 

[Erich]

this is all OT gentlemen ! please get back on topic ok ?