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FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
The only " jet experiments" before the P-80 was the P-59 - is that what you're referring to?
firejack007
Recruit
- 1
- May 18, 2012
A squadron of P-80's were sent to Italy to hunt and shoot down AR-234 jets that were giving the Germans knowledge of everything that went on. If a P-80 had shot one down and knowledge of P-80s in the war, you can bet the Germans would've sent at least a squadron of 262's. Then you would've had your first jet to jet dogfights.
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O3viiJ4g5G8
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O3viiJ4g5G8
FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
.
Huh? Where did you hear this? Sorry but that is wrong. Only 2 P-80's were sent to Italy, and it had nothing to do with the Ar 234.
parsifal
Colonel
There were only four AR 234s transferred to Utaly, and by the time the P-80s had deployed these aircrafdt were grounded. To be fair there were plans to upgrade the flight to squadron status at the very end of the war, and whilst they were flying the AR 234s did provide valuable recon in the Ancona area
delcyros
Tech Sergeant
P80A flighttestdata from USAAF trials conducted 1946 and 1947. I excluded trial data for specially prepared high speed aircraft with shallow canopy and clipped wings, which would not be employed in operational fighters. Specially treated surface trial testdata are included and represent the fastest A/C in these trials. Turbine thrust output seems to have been differed significantly between individual engines.
The mean curve in black is representative for an average P-80A, the thinner curves represent poor or very good performing airplanes.
Below attached the Me-262a average speed curve, representative for A/C produced 1944.
These testdata are the mean curve of a rather scattered cloud of points from a total of 125 serially produced Me-262a1 acceptance speed tests. The corresponding curve shows somehow comparable A/C with regard to average top speed. The P-80 holds a slight advantage at Sea Level while the -262A holds an advantage in medium and high altitude. The differences in speed are not as large as differences between individual A/C, thus no conclusive statement can be drawn which A/C is faster.
enjoi.
The mean curve in black is representative for an average P-80A, the thinner curves represent poor or very good performing airplanes.
Below attached the Me-262a average speed curve, representative for A/C produced 1944.
These testdata are the mean curve of a rather scattered cloud of points from a total of 125 serially produced Me-262a1 acceptance speed tests. The corresponding curve shows somehow comparable A/C with regard to average top speed. The P-80 holds a slight advantage at Sea Level while the -262A holds an advantage in medium and high altitude. The differences in speed are not as large as differences between individual A/C, thus no conclusive statement can be drawn which A/C is faster.
enjoi.
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sturmbock44
Banned
Im an American but it seems clear to me Germany outclassed the allies in pilots regardless of how many inexperience German pilots where flying at wars end. Why did the allies come no where near the amount of aces and fall horribly short in the tallys of our highest aces? Also if we had such great designers of our own why was Germany first to use and deploy so many different types of weapons and technology? As far as aircraft go and rocket design go i think their is a reason why the allies rushed to rip off designs and take designers out of Germany. Funny these are "evil" people but you will gladly take them and make them citizens of your country lol! Im an American and i can say i think we faced the cream of the crop when i comes to Germany in WWII it took the best of the world 5 or so years depending on where you come from to beat them into submission. I really doubt any one of the allies could have faced Germany 1 on 1 technologically or just in terms of all out war. Seems to be a huge amount of smart people on this board. Had the Ho 229 made it into beyond just test flights how do you think it would have compared against other luftwaffe jets and allied jets? The P1101 would have been the real contender if you ask me , being that Americans and soviets both leaned heavy on this design for thier post war AC. Like we are supposed to believe the AK 47 isnt a rip off of the STG 44... 
FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
American pilots flew a limited amount of missions and were rotated home. LW pilots flew until they were killed and were also flying in "combat rich enviornments." Examine some of the missions and paces of the top LW and US aces - some of them on both sides shot down aircraft at the same rates.
It didn't seem to help much did it?!?!?
I was going to respond to the rest of your "rants' but I'm going to honest with you - this is the first "Totally Ignorant" post on this site for 2013. I'm giving you some advice and I'm going to tell you once - you better start to back up your BS with DOCUMENTED facts and stop putting up ignorant rants on this site or your time around here is going to be VERY short!!!As far as aircraft go and rocket design go i think their is a reason why the allies rushed to rip off designs and take designers out of Germany. Funny these are "evil" people but you will gladly take them and make them citizens of your country lol! Im an American and i can say i think we faced the cream of the crop when i comes to Germany in WWII it took the best of the world 5 or so years depending on where you come from to beat them into submission. I really doubt any one of the allies could have faced Germany 1 on 1 technologically or just in terms of all out war. Seems to be a huge amount of smart people on this board. Had the Ho 229 made it into beyond just test flights how do you think it would have compared against other luftwaffe jets and allied jets? The P1101 would have been the real contender if you ask me , being that Americans and soviets both leaned heavy on this design for thier post war AC. Like we are supposed to believe the AK 47 isnt a rip off of the STG 44...
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Njaco
The Pop-Tart Whisperer
England did for about 2 years and had them at a standstill.
after about 1943, pilot-wise, this statement is not true.
To the victors go the spoils.
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Matt308
Glock Perfection
...not again.
sturmbock44
Banned
WOW I guess if you consider that an ignorant rant you must be pretty easily bothered. Also why are you furthering it like this with your opinion about me? I was just responding to a few things i had seen in 20 pages of other people talking about "who won the war" , Ar 234s , rockets, Designers of aircraft , many others where saying who they thought had better designers. Oh god not again another forum with people who will start make something into argument , because they dont like it, state their opinion make fun of someone who didnt attack any member of this forum and hope the other people get banned. You Killed this thread for me ! and im sorry if to the forum(not flygirl) if what i said was so bad im sure the admin. will ban me at your request. Freaking stupid how someone cant say an opinion unless its POPULAR cause of control freaks! Now i see how others get banned because people start a fight and any attempt to speak back is called childish fighting. See ya later everyone thats easy going open minded and generally decent .
Even Njaco an Admin just wrote what he thought and that was the end of it . like it should be.
why cant other people give an opinion without others getting all personal and acting like nerds!
Even Njaco an Admin just wrote what he thought and that was the end of it . like it should be.
why cant other people give an opinion without others getting all personal and acting like nerds!
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Njaco
The Pop-Tart Whisperer
Well, I don't know what to say....
Anyone can have an opinion. Its the name calling and sarcasm that will get a vacation from here.
Anyone can have an opinion. Its the name calling and sarcasm that will get a vacation from here.
sturmbock44
Banned
Sarcasm is reason to ban? wow i never new that. And will have to keep it in mind unlike somepeople. Well i really dont feel free to say anything which sucks because im not the one being arrogant. take a look at what was said to me and what i actually said.Especially what you have posted before in your careers on this site. take a "what if poll" about something that never happened and control it. resonse to NJACO cuz you tried to be somewhat civil in your response. Is your right about the pilot quality in 43 and on. I was sticking to number of planes built. being that so many people are ruining good forums because they are looking to show how arrogant they can be, i wont participate in anything but models i guess. Im seriously disgusted with you as moderator. Sucking the fun out of being a member here , a lot of people stay out of a thread when people like you are looking to " " everything they say, grammar , call them stupid, and then any response will result in a banning? Wow is all i can say to all of this.
The only response you made a good point on was US flyers could stop after so many missions.
Ok can anyone with real facts back up what he was trying to say so astutely ? When did an American and or British pilot have the option to stop flying combat? couldnt they volunteer to keep flying if they wish? (in theory they could of flied to they died or finished the war? )
Being that your only one person here and want trouble ill just ignore you.Anyone else who responds to what i said with " " trying to burn me or tries to keep this going as a fight, calls me stupid i hope administrators will see who the real problem is with running good forum .
If any helpful non arrogant people want to respond , my main question was, if not too off topic was how the Ho 229 compared to the 262 and shooting star? And about Allied flyers could they in theory flew as many missions as a Luftwaffe pilot not? Thanks this kinda is off topic but i hope not too bad based on everything thats been said in 20 pages of comments.
The only response you made a good point on was US flyers could stop after so many missions.
Ok can anyone with real facts back up what he was trying to say so astutely ? When did an American and or British pilot have the option to stop flying combat? couldnt they volunteer to keep flying if they wish? (in theory they could of flied to they died or finished the war? )
Being that your only one person here and want trouble ill just ignore you.Anyone else who responds to what i said with " " trying to burn me or tries to keep this going as a fight, calls me stupid i hope administrators will see who the real problem is with running good forum .
If any helpful non arrogant people want to respond , my main question was, if not too off topic was how the Ho 229 compared to the 262 and shooting star? And about Allied flyers could they in theory flew as many missions as a Luftwaffe pilot not? Thanks this kinda is off topic but i hope not too bad based on everything thats been said in 20 pages of comments.
FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
1. you posted moronic dribble that had nothing to do with an otherwise good thread.
2. It's one thing to have an opinion, it's another to post WRONG and ignorant rants.
3. You should know better.
4. Now you can take a vacation into cyberspace!
Oh yes - enjoy your new avatar!
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Matt308
Glock Perfection
Yes... again.
FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
Well I just caught up to this one - you should have quit while you were ahead, I was only going to give you 2 weeks on the beach. Now you're gone for good! BTW, I would have answered your question at the end of your post but your blantant stupidity rose to the occasion!
Enjoy the bunker
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Matt308
Glock Perfection
Well...
Njaco
The Pop-Tart Whisperer
yeah...well.....we can do what we want in our sandbox.
Otherwise......
I haven't voted in this poll because it would be pure emotion and nothing based in any facts. I know a bit about the Me 262, its strengths and weaknesses but as for the P-80, not so much. It wouldn't be a fair vote on my behalf.
Otherwise......
I haven't voted in this poll because it would be pure emotion and nothing based in any facts. I know a bit about the Me 262, its strengths and weaknesses but as for the P-80, not so much. It wouldn't be a fair vote on my behalf.
I've noticed a bit of a trend; the 'Luftwaffe Uber Alles' guys are the ones who seem to come out with the most amount of drivel and end up getting censured more often than any other 'group'. Is this actually the case, or is this because on the threads that I frequent there are more of them?
Hard to say which is better out of the P-80 or Me 262. What is the question; which was the best or which is our favourite? With its swept wings and axial flow engines, the Me 262 had advances a plenty, but was unreliable. One thing of interest is that the P-80 did what the 262 could on only one engine, it was more conventional in layout and appearance, but this did not detract from its potential.
Hard to say which is better out of the P-80 or Me 262. What is the question; which was the best or which is our favourite? With its swept wings and axial flow engines, the Me 262 had advances a plenty, but was unreliable. One thing of interest is that the P-80 did what the 262 could on only one engine, it was more conventional in layout and appearance, but this did not detract from its potential.
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