Midway - The Curse of Emptiness/Anatomy of a Failure....
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FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
"army men" at 9:15. At that point I've determined this review was one step above 3 day fecal matter.
michael rauls
Tech Sergeant
- 1,679
- Jul 15, 2016
I think " misses the point" is the phrase that best discribes this review.
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Lucky13
Forum Mascot
Not a flick that I plan watching....far too Hollywood! 
fubar57
General
Never heard of this movie but then I haven't gone to a theatre since 1981, "For Your Eyes Only"
Barrett
Senior Airman
The current movie has serious flaws, nearly all avoidable.
But
It is VASTLY better than the 1976 atrocity with Heston, Fonda, Holbrook etc.
I was fortunate to know four of the people depicted in the new film: Dick Best, his daughter, his back-seater, and Jimmy Doolittle. Of those, Dick is the best (!) portrayed although Emmerich owes him a posthumous mea-culpa for the absurd stunt early in the film, an intentional dead-stick trap aboard Enterprise. Chief Radioman Jim Murray was the senior chief of VB-6, far-far from the edgy newbie in the film. (Barbara: kinda odd, seeing someone you knew and admired depicted as a child.) The thespian who plays General Jimmy is too tall with too much hair but is immensely better than the profane prettyboy alecbaldwin in the egregious "Pearl Harbor" (which was only partly saved by the dogfight and Kate Beckinsale.)
But
It is VASTLY better than the 1976 atrocity with Heston, Fonda, Holbrook etc.
I was fortunate to know four of the people depicted in the new film: Dick Best, his daughter, his back-seater, and Jimmy Doolittle. Of those, Dick is the best (!) portrayed although Emmerich owes him a posthumous mea-culpa for the absurd stunt early in the film, an intentional dead-stick trap aboard Enterprise. Chief Radioman Jim Murray was the senior chief of VB-6, far-far from the edgy newbie in the film. (Barbara: kinda odd, seeing someone you knew and admired depicted as a child.) The thespian who plays General Jimmy is too tall with too much hair but is immensely better than the profane prettyboy alecbaldwin in the egregious "Pearl Harbor" (which was only partly saved by the dogfight and Kate Beckinsale.)
Was "Red" Best the son of Dick Best? If so,I missed his command of VF-31 by one skipper. (I arrived when Cash had it and was there through Burch.)
(I did have the pleasure of NJP with J. Flatley III.)
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I was going to skip viewing Midway (2019) after watching the atrocious trailers, but after reading Barrett OK it as someone who actually has done a lot on USN I thought to give it a go.
The movie is centered on the code breakers and Dick Best's SBD carrier group, historically its as accurate as my basic knowledge and respectful as a memory to those involved. I can say it was definately worth seeing, there is alot of great scenes of carrier operations and some good air combat, seeing carriers Enterprise, Akagi etc filling the big cinema screen is awesome! Most of the air combat scenes are actually good. The fleet must be computer generated but it looks real and not like some quick and dirty 3D job.
Unfortunately the first action starts with the Pearl harbour attack and its laughable with Kates dropping torpedos from 100yd height at ships 100yd away. The Doolittle raid and Marshall Is/Rabaul composite raid are well done. The Coral Sea battle is mostly skipped over but thats OK as the film does try to cover too much, the gripes start in the Midway battle scenes with swarms of planes (and massed fleets sailing a few hundred yards apart) and amazing 70% lethal Japanese AAA, but its still fun, i imagine 14 year old kids love those battle scenes. If they ever made a directors cut with the 3D generated battle scenes more faithful to reality it would be as good a general release movie you could make IMHO.
The movie is centered on the code breakers and Dick Best's SBD carrier group, historically its as accurate as my basic knowledge and respectful as a memory to those involved. I can say it was definately worth seeing, there is alot of great scenes of carrier operations and some good air combat, seeing carriers Enterprise, Akagi etc filling the big cinema screen is awesome! Most of the air combat scenes are actually good. The fleet must be computer generated but it looks real and not like some quick and dirty 3D job.
Unfortunately the first action starts with the Pearl harbour attack and its laughable with Kates dropping torpedos from 100yd height at ships 100yd away. The Doolittle raid and Marshall Is/Rabaul composite raid are well done. The Coral Sea battle is mostly skipped over but thats OK as the film does try to cover too much, the gripes start in the Midway battle scenes with swarms of planes (and massed fleets sailing a few hundred yards apart) and amazing 70% lethal Japanese AAA, but its still fun, i imagine 14 year old kids love those battle scenes. If they ever made a directors cut with the 3D generated battle scenes more faithful to reality it would be as good a general release movie you could make IMHO.
oldcrowcv63
Tech Sergeant
Watched Midway (2019). I expected to be disappointed and was but then I'm too anal about details to be a good film critic.
The actual battle has so many extraordinary stories that it's somewhat difficult to choose which to high light. If one is forced to select just one or two participant's eyes through which to experience the battle it is certainly Dick Best and perhaps one of Nimitz, Layton or Rochefort for the critical intel component. Nimitz (Fonda) and Rochefort (Holbrook) were prominent in the original 1976 Sensurround epic fiasco with its ridiculous fictional subplot. So, focusing on RAdm Layton (who wrote the illuminating And I Was There) was appropriate. On the other hand, the necessity of casting the Yorktown in a supporting role when it and the performance of its airwing were also significant contributors to the victory was disappointing albeit necessary considering the attempt to put the Best story center stage. Some homage to the Yorktown is about the only redeeming aspect of the 1976 film.
My teeth grated at seeing dozens of B-26's bombing from medium altitude. I guess the motivation was to cut CGI costs by casting the B-26 as a stand-in for the B-17s that were in such numbers and bombing from high altitude. Seeing Dauntless Gunners destroy dozens of A6Ms was absurd as was the number of SBDs destroyed during their attacks by AAA and fighters. While the Hiryu was aggressively defended by a dozen or more Zeros, they were caught out of position by SBDs attacking from up-Sun and off the anticipated threat axis and only able to shoot down three Dauntlesses.
For somewhat more aviation-related accurate depictions of that stage of the war and the Midway battle, I recommend two recent films: Against the Sun and Dauntless. The former film is an account of the fight for survival by an Enterprise ditched TBD crew lost, January 1941, The latter is a hypothetical depiction of a similar case with a factual Dauntless crew shot down during the Midway morning attack on June 4. If you want to see something about the VP contribution to he Midway battle see Dauntless.
The actual battle has so many extraordinary stories that it's somewhat difficult to choose which to high light. If one is forced to select just one or two participant's eyes through which to experience the battle it is certainly Dick Best and perhaps one of Nimitz, Layton or Rochefort for the critical intel component. Nimitz (Fonda) and Rochefort (Holbrook) were prominent in the original 1976 Sensurround epic fiasco with its ridiculous fictional subplot. So, focusing on RAdm Layton (who wrote the illuminating And I Was There) was appropriate. On the other hand, the necessity of casting the Yorktown in a supporting role when it and the performance of its airwing were also significant contributors to the victory was disappointing albeit necessary considering the attempt to put the Best story center stage. Some homage to the Yorktown is about the only redeeming aspect of the 1976 film.
My teeth grated at seeing dozens of B-26's bombing from medium altitude. I guess the motivation was to cut CGI costs by casting the B-26 as a stand-in for the B-17s that were in such numbers and bombing from high altitude. Seeing Dauntless Gunners destroy dozens of A6Ms was absurd as was the number of SBDs destroyed during their attacks by AAA and fighters. While the Hiryu was aggressively defended by a dozen or more Zeros, they were caught out of position by SBDs attacking from up-Sun and off the anticipated threat axis and only able to shoot down three Dauntlesses.
For somewhat more aviation-related accurate depictions of that stage of the war and the Midway battle, I recommend two recent films: Against the Sun and Dauntless. The former film is an account of the fight for survival by an Enterprise ditched TBD crew lost, January 1941, The latter is a hypothetical depiction of a similar case with a factual Dauntless crew shot down during the Midway morning attack on June 4. If you want to see something about the VP contribution to he Midway battle see Dauntless.
I watched it last weekend.
I did not like it. Too hollywood for me. I am a stickler for accuracy, especially with aircraft. I put this movie in the same category as Pearl Harbor. Thankfully I only rented it. It will not end up in my collection.
I did not like it. Too hollywood for me. I am a stickler for accuracy, especially with aircraft. I put this movie in the same category as Pearl Harbor. Thankfully I only rented it. It will not end up in my collection.
SaparotRob
Unter Gemeine Geschwader Murmeltier XIII
Hey guys. Is it okay to take a screenshot of a thread?
That 1976 atrocity brought my stepfather and I closer together. We had nothing in common. Then that movie was shown on tv. He asked me if it really happened. I told him what really happened was much more impressive. I told him to read "Miracle at Midway", the best book on it I had read. Well, years later he more than returned the favor. He bought me "Shattered Sword". He might not be an aviation buff but he sure likes SBD's!
That 1976 atrocity brought my stepfather and I closer together. We had nothing in common. Then that movie was shown on tv. He asked me if it really happened. I told him what really happened was much more impressive. I told him to read "Miracle at Midway", the best book on it I had read. Well, years later he more than returned the favor. He bought me "Shattered Sword". He might not be an aviation buff but he sure likes SBD's!
oldcrowcv63
Tech Sergeant
It's unfortunate that accounts publicized immediately after ithe battle identified the USAAF B-17s as the vehicle by which the IJN carriers had been destroyed. One popular and reasonably well done 1944 film promoted the TBDs as the agent of destruction (Wing and a Prayer). It won an academy award for screenplay. The amount of misinformation about any battle may be typical when strong egos are involved and this one was no different.
Harold1071
Airman
- 45
- Apr 17, 2020
You are so right on target. I didn't realize that many A6M2 fighters could be shot down so easily. I will check out your recommendations.
oldcrowcv63
Tech Sergeant
The complete film: Wing and a Prayer is on You tube:
Is interesting to see a 1944 Hollywood depiction of the censored story of the Midway Battle. No doubt folks nearer my generation (born in the forties) will have seen it, but it might be a revelation for younger generation who may have missed it. Lot's of inaccuracy due to necessary war time substitutions and simplifications in aircraft and ship board life. One has to forgive substituting TBFs for TBD's and F6Fs for F4Fs which turn up as ersatz A6Ms. There is a salting of SBDs but the dive bombers are mainly SB2Cs. The cast is rather stellar group of A-list actors for the time, but probably mostly unknown to modern viewers, include: Dana Andrews as the Torpedo squadron 5's squadron commander, Don Ameche (Cocoon, 1985) as the Air Boss, Charles Bickford, the CV's Captain. Sir Cedric Hardwick as something like CNO. Harry Morgan (Mash) as a TBF pilot. A very young Richard Jaeckel (Dirty Dozen) as a TBF gunner. 1950's TV Racket Squad's Reed Hadley. A B-list notable Richard Crane (1950-era TV's Rocky Jones, Space Ranger, also on you tube) and frequent & recognizable TV actor David Willock.
Is interesting to see a 1944 Hollywood depiction of the censored story of the Midway Battle. No doubt folks nearer my generation (born in the forties) will have seen it, but it might be a revelation for younger generation who may have missed it. Lot's of inaccuracy due to necessary war time substitutions and simplifications in aircraft and ship board life. One has to forgive substituting TBFs for TBD's and F6Fs for F4Fs which turn up as ersatz A6Ms. There is a salting of SBDs but the dive bombers are mainly SB2Cs. The cast is rather stellar group of A-list actors for the time, but probably mostly unknown to modern viewers, include: Dana Andrews as the Torpedo squadron 5's squadron commander, Don Ameche (Cocoon, 1985) as the Air Boss, Charles Bickford, the CV's Captain. Sir Cedric Hardwick as something like CNO. Harry Morgan (Mash) as a TBF pilot. A very young Richard Jaeckel (Dirty Dozen) as a TBF gunner. 1950's TV Racket Squad's Reed Hadley. A B-list notable Richard Crane (1950-era TV's Rocky Jones, Space Ranger, also on you tube) and frequent & recognizable TV actor David Willock.
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SaparotRob
Unter Gemeine Geschwader Murmeltier XIII
I'm looking forward to seeing Wing and a Prayer. I accepted long ago films used whatever footage was available. Thanks for the post.
And I gotta check out Rocky Jones, Space Ranger!!
And I gotta check out Rocky Jones, Space Ranger!!
