cheddar cheese
Major General
Nice diagrams though! 8)
P-39 D Aircobra vs. Me-109
- Thread starter lesofprimus
- Start date
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dinos7
Airman
some people might not agree with me put i believe the me109 wins
evangilder
"Shooter"
I agree. The aircobra was not a match for a 109.
- Thread starter
- #85
lesofprimus
Brigadier General
But then again, there were many Soviet Aces that flew the P-39.... These were not the superstars of the Russian Airforce either....
Yea there were a couple elite VVS guys flying them, but on the whole, they were still poorly trained and no match for the German Aces they flew against...
I feel that in certain combat situations, the Aircobra was on equal terms, or close to them, with the -109....
Pilot skill alone only counts for part of the kill... The platform on which u score the kill also counts...
That being said, I dont think the P-39 was anywhere near a match for the Bf-109...
Yea there were a couple elite VVS guys flying them, but on the whole, they were still poorly trained and no match for the German Aces they flew against...
I feel that in certain combat situations, the Aircobra was on equal terms, or close to them, with the -109....
Pilot skill alone only counts for part of the kill... The platform on which u score the kill also counts...
That being said, I dont think the P-39 was anywhere near a match for the Bf-109...
wmaxt
Staff Sergeant
The air war in the East was primarily below 15,000ft where the P-39 was best and the Bf-109 wasn't at its peak. The P-39 was also one of the fastest fighters down low for most of the war, and still an effective racer for years after the war. It may not have been one sided at all.
wmaxt
wmaxt
I will bring up the issue of soviet pilots deliberatedly overclaiming.
Not that they lusted about the idea of becoming communist super heroes; it was also a matter of personal safety to them.
I have met several experts seriously doubting the claims of Kozhedub, Rechkalov and at least of one dozen more of soviet aces. Pokryshkyn is not included in such club though.
Upon landing after a combat mission, soviet pilots were frequently greeted by a committee of soviet bureaucrats which weren´t less aggressive than the guys flying Bf-109s and Fw190s. It was a process of acute harrassment: "how many fascist snakes did you kill?", "where is your contribution to the motherland?".
By answering "I did not shoot down any" they risked being called cowards and why not traitors letting the nation down.
Not that they lusted about the idea of becoming communist super heroes; it was also a matter of personal safety to them.
I have met several experts seriously doubting the claims of Kozhedub, Rechkalov and at least of one dozen more of soviet aces. Pokryshkyn is not included in such club though.
Upon landing after a combat mission, soviet pilots were frequently greeted by a committee of soviet bureaucrats which weren´t less aggressive than the guys flying Bf-109s and Fw190s. It was a process of acute harrassment: "how many fascist snakes did you kill?", "where is your contribution to the motherland?".
By answering "I did not shoot down any" they risked being called cowards and why not traitors letting the nation down.
- Thread starter
- #88
lesofprimus
Brigadier General
Seeing how many Soviet airbases were within a few miles of the German lines, I seriously doubt there were many "soviet bureaucrats" around...
I have read a great deal on Kozhedub, and have talked to several people that knew him, as well as one fellow who flew with him.... They all discount the "padding" of kills that Kozhedub claimed... He was a respectable man of high moral standards and conviction...
Call him a liar to his face like u just did, and he'd shove a handful of broken glass up ur ass......
Fact is, even US airmen overclaimed... The Germans did, as well as the Japanese and Italians and the Finns and the British....
I have read a great deal on Kozhedub, and have talked to several people that knew him, as well as one fellow who flew with him.... They all discount the "padding" of kills that Kozhedub claimed... He was a respectable man of high moral standards and conviction...
Call him a liar to his face like u just did, and he'd shove a handful of broken glass up ur ass......
Fact is, even US airmen overclaimed... The Germans did, as well as the Japanese and Italians and the Finns and the British....
- Thread starter
- #90
lesofprimus
Brigadier General
Go tell it to someone who gives a rats ass........ Ur always slamming the Soviets....
I have met several experts......... Yea experts in whose eyes??? Yours????
Ha!
Ive been around the Fighter Ace community since I was a small child, and forgotten more about this WWII Ace crap than ull ever know......
But debating with u is like masturbating..... Hardly any pleasure at all...
I have met several experts......... Yea experts in whose eyes??? Yours????
Ha!
Ive been around the Fighter Ace community since I was a small child, and forgotten more about this WWII Ace crap than ull ever know......
But debating with u is like masturbating..... Hardly any pleasure at all...
the lancaster kicks ass
Major General
- 19,937
- Dec 20, 2003
i really wouldn't advise fighting with les, he knows his stuff, i'd only enter into an argument with him if it was about the lanc, it which case i would crush him.........
CharlesBronson
Senior Master Sergeant
Soviet cobras:
P-39L-1 "White 13"
100 GIAP verano1943
P-39Q"White 119" 196 IAP
1944
Bell P-400 with 20mm gun ex-British in white camo. winter 1942/43
P-39N "Krasnoyarskiy Komsomolets" 21 GIAP
Pilot leutenat Sobolev mid 1943
profiles from:
http://vvs.hobbyvista.com/
P-39L-1 "White 13"
100 GIAP verano1943
P-39Q"White 119" 196 IAP
1944
Bell P-400 with 20mm gun ex-British in white camo. winter 1942/43
P-39N "Krasnoyarskiy Komsomolets" 21 GIAP
Pilot leutenat Sobolev mid 1943
profiles from:
http://vvs.hobbyvista.com/
FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
Nice Charlie, I like white 79!
CharlesBronson
Senior Master Sergeant
Here is some more:
By the way:
Hmmm..humm....I mean P-39L-1 White 13 100 GIAP Summer 1943...the bilingual thing.... you know
.
P-39D-2 "White 39"
ca. Oct. 1942
Airacobra I ( Bell P-400) "Withe 34" 19 IAP ca. Dec. 1942
Airacobra I (P-400)
19 GIAP pilot Pavel Kutakhov
Sept. 1942
P-39N "White 50"
16 GIAP pilot Konstantin Sukhov
ca. 1945
P39Q-15 "White 67" ,72 GIAP, summer 1944
By the way:
Hmmm..humm....I mean P-39L-1 White 13 100 GIAP Summer 1943...the bilingual thing.... you know
.P-39D-2 "White 39"
ca. Oct. 1942
Airacobra I ( Bell P-400) "Withe 34" 19 IAP ca. Dec. 1942
Airacobra I (P-400)
19 GIAP pilot Pavel Kutakhov
Sept. 1942
P-39N "White 50"
16 GIAP pilot Konstantin Sukhov
ca. 1945
P39Q-15 "White 67" ,72 GIAP, summer 1944
Nice profiles.
trackend
Chief Master Sergeant
I agree that the 109 is a much better aircraft.
The Aircobra looks really great.
I have talked to one of the engineers at Duxford who looks after one, he said it's a nightmare especially the drive train.(not very reliable and in constant need of work) . It must be one of the wierdest sounding planes around sort of a whining whistle.
The Aircobra looks really great.
I have talked to one of the engineers at Duxford who looks after one, he said it's a nightmare especially the drive train.(not very reliable and in constant need of work) . It must be one of the wierdest sounding planes around sort of a whining whistle.
I have never been a fan of the P-39. Never liked the fact that I would be sitting on a drive shaft.
cheddar cheese
Major General
Nice profiles, I've always loved the P-39...a plane id love to fly...
the lancaster kicks ass
Major General
- 19,937
- Dec 20, 2003
a profile doesn't show how good a plane is though
FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
the lancaster kicks ass said:a profile doesn't show how good a plane is though
Unless you're flying a PC Sim!
