P-51 D interior cockpit green code ?
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Airframes
Benevolens Magister
I think I've got the correct FS number(s) somewhere Gary. Bear with me a day or two, and I'll try to find them in the pile of junk that passes for my 'reserve reference sources!
Terry.
Terry.
- Thread starter
- #3
Airframes
Benevolens Magister
Hi Gary. I found a 'reserve refernce source' stack next to my desk - forgot I'd used it not long ago!
Right, the P51D/K cockpit colour is specified as 'Interior Green, ANA611'. I thought I had a FS number, but I only have the 'old' system number. You'll be able to get a match to a FS number via one of the modelling paint references for 'Interior Green'. The seat was painted Olive Drab 41, and the scuttle over the instrument panel was, originally, specified as Dull Dark Green, which matched Medium Green 42. This part was later painted in a continuation of the Olive Drab 41 of the anti-glare area of the upper cowling. The plywood floor was clear-laquered plywood, but very often painted in the Interior Green, as was the central well for the control column. All 'bolt on' fittings were semi-matt black, but the pedestal for the throttle group and trim switches was the 'Interior Green'. The interior mounting port for the flare pistol, and it's spring-loaded cover, was natural dull metal, probably with a slight 'goldish' tint. I'll attach a couple of B&W pics that might be of use in a separate post. Hope this has helped.
Terry.
Right, the P51D/K cockpit colour is specified as 'Interior Green, ANA611'. I thought I had a FS number, but I only have the 'old' system number. You'll be able to get a match to a FS number via one of the modelling paint references for 'Interior Green'. The seat was painted Olive Drab 41, and the scuttle over the instrument panel was, originally, specified as Dull Dark Green, which matched Medium Green 42. This part was later painted in a continuation of the Olive Drab 41 of the anti-glare area of the upper cowling. The plywood floor was clear-laquered plywood, but very often painted in the Interior Green, as was the central well for the control column. All 'bolt on' fittings were semi-matt black, but the pedestal for the throttle group and trim switches was the 'Interior Green'. The interior mounting port for the flare pistol, and it's spring-loaded cover, was natural dull metal, probably with a slight 'goldish' tint. I'll attach a couple of B&W pics that might be of use in a separate post. Hope this has helped.
Terry.
Good info Terry.In addition to your post:
The P-51D had their cockpit painted with FS34151 what is ANA611 Interior Green or .But you should remember that the primer was applied firstly.These primers were two FS33481 Zinc Chromate Primer type1 yellow and FS34258 Zinc Chromate Primer type2 Tint.
The P-51D had their cockpit painted with FS34151 what is ANA611 Interior Green or .But you should remember that the primer was applied firstly.These primers were two FS33481 Zinc Chromate Primer type1 yellow and FS34258 Zinc Chromate Primer type2 Tint.
Airframes
Benevolens Magister
Thanks for that Wojtek, I forgot about the primers!
Gary, the 'yellow' zinc Chromate primer was the one used for areas subject to exposure, such as the inside of the engine bay, the tail wheel well, the gun-bay doors and walls, (ammo trays were Interior Green) and the front of the main spar in the main undercarriage bay. This is the one with the sickly yellow, just-a-hint-of-green colour. The second primer was used overall inside, on 'bare areas, and under the cockpit finishing colour of ANA611, which Wojtek has kindly produced the Federal Standard number for. Note, contrary to popular belief, among modellers at least, the inside of the wheel bays, and the inside of the undercarriage doors, were NOT painted. These were coated in a clear protective laquer, with the colour showing as glazed bare aluminium. The main U/C legs were treated with a coating containing powdered aluminium, which gave the appearance of a very light greyish-silver. The wheel yokes themselves were a dull, greyish bare metal. The enclosed pics might be of use. Note that the front half of the undercarriage lever, on the lower port pedestal, was painted red.
Cheers,
Terry.
Gary, the 'yellow' zinc Chromate primer was the one used for areas subject to exposure, such as the inside of the engine bay, the tail wheel well, the gun-bay doors and walls, (ammo trays were Interior Green) and the front of the main spar in the main undercarriage bay. This is the one with the sickly yellow, just-a-hint-of-green colour. The second primer was used overall inside, on 'bare areas, and under the cockpit finishing colour of ANA611, which Wojtek has kindly produced the Federal Standard number for. Note, contrary to popular belief, among modellers at least, the inside of the wheel bays, and the inside of the undercarriage doors, were NOT painted. These were coated in a clear protective laquer, with the colour showing as glazed bare aluminium. The main U/C legs were treated with a coating containing powdered aluminium, which gave the appearance of a very light greyish-silver. The wheel yokes themselves were a dull, greyish bare metal. The enclosed pics might be of use. Note that the front half of the undercarriage lever, on the lower port pedestal, was painted red.
Cheers,
Terry.
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Colin1
Senior Master Sergeant
The green seemed to be applied to the crew-occupied areas whilst the yellow was applied everywhere else eg engine nacelle interiors, gun bays, access panels. I don't recall reading that another green was used on top of the zinc chromate.
ANA 611 interior green wasn't a primer.Of course there is always a possiblilty that in cockpit area the primer wasn't used and the Interior Green was applied on bare metal.But generally all metal parts were painted with Zinc Chromate Primer in order to get a preservation of these parts.So it is possible that the Interior Green was painted on the primer as well.
Airframes
Benevolens Magister
Just to clarify, the 'second' primer, as I called it, was Zinc Chromate Green, and, as Wojtek also suggested, would be applied to those other areas not covered by the 'yellow' primer.
The interior colours of OTHER U.S. aircraft varied dependant on manufacturer and, in many cases, the factory that produced them. For instance, a commonly used colour was 'Bonze Green', seen, for example, inside some B25's, which was darker then ANA611 'Interior Green', and a bit similar to the second, Green Zinc Chromate in shade. There were, of course, other internal finishes, some of which, for example on late-model B17's, was laquered bare metal.
The interior colours of OTHER U.S. aircraft varied dependant on manufacturer and, in many cases, the factory that produced them. For instance, a commonly used colour was 'Bonze Green', seen, for example, inside some B25's, which was darker then ANA611 'Interior Green', and a bit similar to the second, Green Zinc Chromate in shade. There were, of course, other internal finishes, some of which, for example on late-model B17's, was laquered bare metal.
The same situation was with the wooden and metal floors for P-51s.- Thread starter
- #12
seesul
Senior Master Sergeant
Gary, on which project are you working now? Just curious...think I missed something...
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- #14
seesul
Senior Master Sergeant
Aha! So good luck my friend, looking forward to your thread!
The specification for Yellow-Green, used in aircraft interiors was given as:
Zinc Chromate (Yellow) Primer: 1 Gallon
Toluene Substitute: 1 Gallon.
Black Enamel or Paste 1 Gallon.
Originally 4oz of Aluminium Powder was also included.
! gallon of 'black' would appear to be extremely excessive and it is believed to be a typo or mistake for a tenth of a gallon, a more reasonable quantity.
There were two reasons for turning 'yellow' chromate 'green'. One was that zinc chromate is sensitive to UV light and the Carbon Black helped to reduce the photolytic reactions the UV induced. (Perhaps the Aluminium Powder was included for the same reason.) The second was that green was thought to cause less eyestrain than the bright yellow of the raw pigment. In fact the USAAF issued a directive during WW II forbidding the use of Yellow Chromate in crew areas. In September 1943 the yellow/black mix was replaced by ANA611 which designated black tinted Zinc Chromate primer as Interior Green.
For a more detailed explanation of the various interior colours used on US aircraft see
Camouflage Markings: Interior Colours of US Aircraft, 1941-45 (Part I)
Zinc Chromate (Yellow) Primer: 1 Gallon
Toluene Substitute: 1 Gallon.
Black Enamel or Paste 1 Gallon.
Originally 4oz of Aluminium Powder was also included.
! gallon of 'black' would appear to be extremely excessive and it is believed to be a typo or mistake for a tenth of a gallon, a more reasonable quantity.
There were two reasons for turning 'yellow' chromate 'green'. One was that zinc chromate is sensitive to UV light and the Carbon Black helped to reduce the photolytic reactions the UV induced. (Perhaps the Aluminium Powder was included for the same reason.) The second was that green was thought to cause less eyestrain than the bright yellow of the raw pigment. In fact the USAAF issued a directive during WW II forbidding the use of Yellow Chromate in crew areas. In September 1943 the yellow/black mix was replaced by ANA611 which designated black tinted Zinc Chromate primer as Interior Green.
For a more detailed explanation of the various interior colours used on US aircraft see
Camouflage Markings: Interior Colours of US Aircraft, 1941-45 (Part I)
SoD Stitch
Banned
I was going to recommend the IPMS Stockholm site, but you beat me to it; in my years of internet camoflage and coloring research, I have found the IPMS Stockholm site to be the best overall reference for WWII. You should also check out the other two "articles" in this series (below):
Camouflage Markings: Interior Colours of US Aircraft, 1941-45 (Part II)
Camouflage Markings: Interior Colours of US Aircraft, 1941-45 (Part III)
- Thread starter
- #18
Airframes
Benevolens Magister
Glad to be of help Gary. Looking forward to your build thread.
Terry.
Terry.
