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Soren
as I have wrote, if you are in a trench, behind a big boulder or otherwise well protected, a 75mm shell, at least WWII type, detonating 10-15 away from you didn't kill you. That's why armies bother to dig in.
I take it you have never thrown a grenade in your life ?
Ah yes I have, both training and live fire exercises.
That's complete bollocks Parsifal. Ordinary buildings are about the worst place to seek cover against artillery. If artillery strikes a building with people in it, those people are almost surely going to die.
Not necessarily. In caen the usual place the Infantry to hide in is in the buildings cellars. in Berlin, the LDVs defending, as well as regulars used the buildings of berlin to hide in quite successfully. There is no gurantee in any situation, but a building provides far better cover than no building.
What do you see as a "typical building". If the building is double brick, or masonary, it is going to be quite resistant to artillery fire, lesser standards of construction will of course provide less cover
Now AFTER the building has been turned to rubble, it will provide good cover for infantry, but not while it is still standing.
Agreed, but the issue is whether Infantry within a building before it is demolished will survive. It depends on the size of the building, the type of construction, the explosive capability of the round and whereabouts in the building the Infantry is when the round hits. But generally speaking, buildings provide pretty good cover against artillery attack
Basically, it takes energy to demolish a building, the more energy to demolish the cover and get to the target, the less energy is left to hurt the targets. If the theory is that flying shrapnel is going to do the damge, the theory still holds true. There are more obstacles within a building, like internal walls an the like, to stop, or at leat slow down the flying debris inside the building
That's just completely wrong parsifal. Inside a building is one of the worst places to be under an artillery attack. Why ? Because it takes very little to make the whole building come crashing down upon you. A normal two storey home can quite easily be turned into rubble by a single 105mm artillery shell, with nearly everyone inside perishing.
Hello Juha,
IIRC Soren never mentioned shooting at a trench, but shooting at infantry or building with a 75mm HE cartridge.
Any soldier around 5-15m would have been a goner. Nobody would put a trench round a big boulder, if hit fragmentation would be enormous. A tank would not shoot into a trench, for this one uses mortars and artillery and hand grenades.
And a SC50 dropped in front of a trench 10-20m would have certainly ripped some peoples eardrums, if not to include dead soldiers since during a battle even the guys in a trench certainly can't duck all the way.
Regards
Kruska
but to simply resort to table thumping and abuse doesnt help your case at all.
With regard to Blast effects of artillery, I found this site, which i think is interesting but simple at the same time. It suggests that an artillery piece of 75 mm calibre (with a 14lb explosive head) will crearte a typical crater of about 1 metre wide, and 0.5 metres deep. That is consistent with what might be expected. If that asessment is correct, I doubt very much that a single hit by a 75 mm shell is going to destroy a building of reasonable size or construction (eg, a factory or shopping complex, bank or the like. It would do consideable damage toi say a 200 square metre home of single brick construction. It would, in my opinion, be quite devastating to a lightly constructed timber building. I would not consider a log cabin made from heavy timber to be in this category
General information of artillery weapons and shells
And where exactly have we resorted to table thumping and abuse ???
Kruska has not done that but nearly every post of yours is abusive and non-factual in nature.
Soren, I dont think you are in any position to question the experience of the ex-servicemen on this forum. you have been repaeatedly asked to present your credentials on others threads, and have refused, resorting to some lame excuse about not wanting to remember your past.
For the record, I have witnessed the power of artillery and blast effects, up to 5" (128mm) calibre. The site I have presented is something I found at short notice that is simple, in keeping with the general nature of this discussion, and a reaonably accurate estimate of the effect of artillery.
And thus far it is way ahead of anything you have presented, which is zip.
Hello parsifal,
Gentlemen, let's take it easy okay, please
Sometimes one has to see things in order to get a better picture. Right now I can't, but I will scan in a picture tomorrow of my friends AFV Marder 20mm cannon firing a incendiary high explosion shell at a target in a distance of 600m, and you will see what I mean. (Just try to remember it is a single shot at a 2 storey building.
Regards
Kruska