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I sure haven't heard of British prisoners being massacred anytime before Dunkirk, at all! A lot of prisoners were taken, but they were treated well by the Germans, an order straight from the top.
why do we always branch off into the sphere guys and not stay with the topic ?
its reluctance Bill that I even mention the what if as even possible and it was and is about Göttingen. It still does not seem plausible to me except for just a disaster as a turn and LW ground control getting the heavy SturmFw units and high cover of 109's into position. As one IV.Sturm/JG 3 ace mentioned after war, he could not believe that NO US Mustang escort was seen, as he and his gruppe took first shots and shot down 18 B-24's in their first pass tried to get into position for a second rear pass as Mustangs came onto them and his gruppen banked over and got the hell out of that mess.......
September 28th is also another terrible day like Sept. 11 and 12th and October 6th. I mention these unknown dates as they were in smallness LW victories with the suddeness of their attacks, thank GOD for Allied escort to disperse them.
guess I could also go off on a tangent and talk about some rude missions in July/August 44 as well ~
I gotta go with Kursk.
Battle was anywhere from 10 days to a month and a half, (German view, Operation Citadel 10 days, Russian view, battle lasted till Charkow/Kharkov fell).
At least 2500 Soviet planes, 3000+ if you count units kept in reserve or on less active fronts
A little over 2000 German planes.
Each side flying as many as 4500 sorties in a day.
Kursk is heralded as a tank vs tank battle, but some of the most important sectors were won by air vs tank. It was the proving ground for the Soviet tactical air/ground cooperation concept, which eventually took them all the way to Berlin.
BoB was important too, but Kursk surpasses it (and probably all others) in scale.
In my opinion Kursk was the greatest air battle of WWII, for numbers of aircraft involved, number of sorties flown, and importance as the pivotal battle on the Eastern Front.
Bill:
yes the 445th bg may have been ordered towards Göttingen, but I better leave that thought alone,
the September 11 and 12th raids were brutal
October 6, and 7th
November 2nd
November 26th everyone lost, and the 27th was ugly as well
January 14, 1945
of course I could go back and pull files for July/August of 44 as they were also pretty sad
how about January 11, 1944 with 60 bombers shot down
May 28 and 29th, 1944 with over 30 bombers lost each day
right-O Bill on the earlier dates I posted a select 1-3 Bomb Groups picked out and ripped to pieces
I know there is a book in print possibly by Hikkoki pubs over the Jan. 11 44 mission.
have been in touch since 1999 with a Dutch researcher who has found many B-17 parts and of course studied the event as much fell over his homeland, we ascertained that several Bf 110G-2's with Br 21cm rocket launchers hit the lead B-17's of the lead bombers thus upsetting the whole route and time-table of the US attack.
The day time ZG twin engines claimed 18 B-17's and 3 NJG's claimed some 12 B-17's during this day engagement when flying the day op. LW claims were for 91 bombers on the date.