The Greatest Fighter Pilot of WWII... Finalized....

[Bullockracing]

This is another of those "Greatest (insert whatever here)" polls, without clearly defined criteria for evaluation... Hmmmm... Aces are only made by scoring kills, so you either have to count total kills, or kill ratio based on kills per sortie. Hartmann gets the overall win - anyone got an idea on kill ratio - I know the two highest ratio German aces (and it ain't Hartman) - have to post up later...

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

If you are going to go off of scores then you have to go by who has the highest tally and in that case Hartmann is the greatest and in that case he is the best.

However you have to look at more than just kills and that is why based of books and reading I am with Les on this and in my opinoin and to me the best is Heinz Baer.

 

[Hunter368]

Baer, forsure. You can't look at total kills (too many easy kills to be had in Russia early in the war), you can't look at kills to sorties ratio either (the highest in the LW was some guy, I don't have my books at hand right now for his name, who had something like 75 sorties and close to that in kills. But all that proves was he was hot for a month or two). You want a guy who has fought vs all the allies and done well, fought on all or most fronts and done well.....That is Baer.

You want a guy who started and ended the war, he did that also. Here is his stats that I quickly just grabbed of the net.

He fought on the : Western Front, Eastern Front, Mediterranean

ASSIGNED COMBAT AIRCRAFT:
Messerschmitt Bf 109E/F/G
Focke-Wulf Fw 190A-7/A-8
Messerschmitt Me 262A-1a

AWARDS:
Ritterkreuz des Eisernen Kreuzes mit Eichenlaub und Schwertern
(Knights Cross of the Iron Cross with Oak Leaves and Swords)

VICTORIES:
220 Aerial Destroyed
59 Western Front
96 Eastern Front
65 Mediterranean Front

1000+ Combat Sorties

So he shot down 124 western planes and 96 Russian planes. (including 16 kills in a jet)

He was a warrior of the top level by anyone's standards and IMHO (and many others) he was the best of the best from WW2 (either Axis or Allied).

 

[Gnomey]

Agreed Hunter, that is why he got my vote as well.

 

[lesofprimus]

And he accomplished all of that while being Goering's least favorite pilot as well... Only reason he never got the Diamonds...

 

[Bullockracing]

And he accomplished all of that while being Goering's least favorite pilot as well... Only reason he never got the Diamonds...

Should've got a medal for that alone... Maybe an Allied one...

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

 

[Erich]

should of worn a special RK and not awarded by "Fatty" yep Bär was hot

 

[Heinz]

Johnson for me.

 

[Lucky13]

What is the kill ratio for these gentlemen?

 

[lesofprimus]

Tough to call that up lucky....

 

[Soren]

I'm going with Hartmann - he kept shooting down a/c till the end and mastered his aircraft to the fullest. He never lost a wingman either... All this while most fighting against superior numbers of enemy a/c.

He's the best if you ask me...

Marseille is a very close second.

 

[Lucky13]

Engaged the enemy 800 times, shot down 352, lost no wingman, shot down 6 enemies at three different occations.... Erich Hartmann

 

[Erich]

I still say forget some of these guys with easy kills, and look towards the night fighter chaps, probably overall the German and even the RAF were the best in the war flying at night closed in with bombers, the Mossies diving down and trying to escort RAF heavies and still trying to get behind/below German nfs to pop them.

The guys on the Ost front I have to hand it to them with heavy Bf 110G's and then later the Ju 88G-1 and G-6 against far slower ( in most cases if you do not count the B-25 ) and inferior Soviet types, flying extremely low and getting thumped by the ever present Soviet flak, flaps down and short bursts so you wouldn't collide with your prey ....... a totally unknown and crazy part of the war

 

[timshatz]

I still say forget some of these guys with easy kills

Agreed. Superior Aircraft, Superior Tactics, Experienced Airmen. Even the Russians admitted that their pilots had a phobia of sorts (not all, certainly not the Guards Regiments) that was previlent.

Somebody made a really good point earlier in this thread about the sortie/kill ratio. There was a German pilot who had something like a 1 to 1 ratio. Very close. I believe he was knocked down after shooting down 70 Russians. Collieded with a Lagg or something like that.

Now that is really impressive.

 

[Lucky13]

I did, just earlier. Would be interesting to know I have to say. Hartmann flew 1400 odd missions and engaged the enemy 800 times in those 1400+ flights...
Wonder what the top 20 would look like in kill ratios?

 

[Dragontech64]

I am surprised by a missing name here, Francis Gabreski, jug pilot, multiple ace in WW2 and jet ace in the Korean War, not many aces that did it in 2 wars.

 

[lesofprimus]

Korea has no bearing on this Poll, and Gabreski was on a previous Poll and got zero votes....

There were just too many who were considered better than he...

 

[Lucky13]

I think only 7 American pilots managed to become Aces in two wars, I could remember wrong though....

 

[Dragontech64]

Korea has no bearing on this Poll, and Gabreski was on a previous Poll and got zero votes....

There were just too many who were considered better than he...

SOry, I didn't know about the earlier poll, just started in here recently, and haven't seen everything. As for my statement on his Korean war record, that was included to show his skill. But, if he's already been voted down in prior polls, who am I to argue?