Conslaw
Senior Airman
Right you are.
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Right you are.HMS Glorious. HMS Eagle was sunk by a submarine.
No. The Wildcat and Hellcat had the armament, magazine capacity, armour, self sealing fuel tanks and radio communications needed to get the job done.The weaknesses of the Zero would have been on any other fighter.
My bad.No. The Wildcat and Hellcat had the armament, magazine capacity, armour, self sealing fuel tanks and radio communications needed to get the job done.
Beyond the radio, the biggest problem with the Zero at Midway is there wasn't enough of them. Each carrier only had 17-18 as a standard complement. That's not enough to escort a strike and have a standing combat air patrol, with a relief refueling and rearming. That's especially not enough if, because you won't have radar warning of an attack, you have to have fighters out covering multiple directions of attack, preferably at multiple altitudes.Can I get an Amen if the Wildcats had self sealing tanks at Midway?
Only the US Marine's VMF-221 stationed on Midway had the F4F-3. The carriers all had the F4F-4.Can I get an Amen if the Wildcats had self sealing tanks at Midway?
The spec to Mitsubishi should have demanded narrow folding wings, just outbound of the cannons.Beyond the radio, the biggest problem with the Zero at Midway is there wasn't enough of them. Each carrier only had 17-18 as a standard complement. That's not enough to escort a strike and have a standing combat air patrol, with a relief refueling and rearming. That's especially not enough if, because you won't have radar warning of an attack, you have to have fighters out covering multiple directions of attack, preferably at multiple altitudes.
Any other country, any other plane, we would accept that pre-war experten were not the best judge of "90 day wonders" ability and that more rounds during the brief moment they lined up the target were required. Galland argued much the same to Molders that average Bf.109 pilot needed the 20mm cannons in wings in addition to MG & Cannons in fuselage even if they didn't - the increase in firepower was worth the loss of maneuverability. Grumman added a circuit breaker for each pair of 50s, so experts like Thach could disable a pair if he wanted and actually extend the firing time beyond the F4F-3, although, with reduced firepower.I think the F4F-4 had a reduced firing time due to reduced loadout per gun.
I do agree that the USN fighters were better equipped for the job.
Lucky chap as it turns out.D'Oyly-Hughes had his original Air Boss sent back to UK to stand trail at court marshal for disobeying orders in face of enemy.
Courageous as well, but not on her captain's head.
True. This remind me of my earlier thread Better luck for the RN carrier force 1939-1941What I know of that, which is not much, indicates to me that that was operational rather than derelict. Courageous turned into the wind to launch, setting up the U-boat's shot, and that it was shy two escorts due to another ship in trouble.
If what I know is incomplete, and it probably is, I certainly welcome correction.
I think times are a bit longer for both as the early M2s didn't fire quite 800 rpm, and belt drag further slowed the -3 version when it was pulling the last of the belt out of the magazine.An F4F-4 had about 18 seconds of firing time if firing all guns together.
An F4F-3 had about 32 seconds of firing time for 4 guns.
The Zero used at Midway had about 7 seconds of firing time for the 20mm cannon and over 30 seconds for the cowl mounted 7.7mm machine guns.
Would keeping Ryūjō with fleet and adding 18 additional Zeros have made a difference? I know her std compliment was 12 Zeros and 18 Kates but I'm assuming that could be reversed.Beyond the radio, the biggest problem with the Zero at Midway is there wasn't enough of them. Each carrier only had 17-18 as a standard complement. That's not enough to escort a strike and have a standing combat air patrol, with a relief refueling and rearming. That's especially not enough if, because you won't have radar warning of an attack, you have to have fighters out covering multiple directions of attack, preferably at multiple altitudes.
The IJN's first mistake was letting Kido Butai range ahead of the fleet.A lot of things went wrong. But more importantly the IJN put themselves in a position for things to go wrong.
A few highlights.
No Shokaku or Zuikaku.
Within range of attack from Midway.
No knowledge of where the carriers were.
No land based aircraft helping out.
No radar or fighter control.
The problem with the ratio of bombers to fighters on a carrier is an issue. Zeroes are nice but it's the bombers doing the do. USN got round this as Hellcats could launch with a bombload so it could double as a bomber. So more Hellcats.
There was no big book of carrier warfare so mistakes were made. This was still the only second time carrier battles were done so it was a learning curve.
The guy who shoots first, wins first. So the issue is the Americans got there attack in first. Had the Japanese got thier full strike in first and knew where all 3 carriers were then this would be a thread critical of the USN.
The faster fire rate was adopted/approved in 1940. Existing guns could be modified with a parts kit. Even if the adoption/approval was in Dec 1940 they had about 1 1/2 years to modify the guns on the F4F-3s. This didn't solve the belt pull problem though which also changed on various aircraft depending on exact lay out of the ammo boxes. Belt pull was changed at some point but even that didn't solve everything (P-51B & Cs). Since the ammo was most often held in layers instead of one long flat box pull shouldn't have changed that much on an F4F.I think times are a bit longer for both as the early M2s didn't fire quite 800 rpm, and belt drag further slowed the -3 version when it was pulling the last of the belt out of the magazine.
But if one turned off the breaker for the outer guns, F4F-4 got 18 seconds for 4 guns, then turn breaker back on and you get 18 more on the outer pair - better than Zero after it had expended its cannon rounds.