What of the Me 410?

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

I am sure there were more kills by Me-410s now whether they were famous or not is debatable.

 

[Erich]

ZG 26 and 76 histories need to be written, the problem is most of the veterans of the two Geschwaders were KIA in the war. 7-7-44 there was a contingent of Me 410's that attacked 8th and 15th AF but were slaughtered, claiming maybe 7 kills total through the very heated aerial engagement. This date JG 300 and JG 3 SturmFw's shot down nearly 55 US heavies

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Hmm good source of info as allways Erich.

 

[carpenoctem1689]

The Me-410's were, like all Zerstorers, vulnerable to single enging allied escort fighters. Shouldnt say single engined, since the P-38 posed just as big a threat as the P-51 and the P-47. The -410 would have been good against unescorted bombers, blowing apart the formations with large rockets, and sending in waves diving and climbing, diving and climbing, mixed with head on attacks and horizontal diving would have torn B-17s and B-24s to shreds. Fortunatly for the allies, the escorts were around most of the time to tear into the -410's, strictly limiting the amount of kills they could acheive.

 

[Erich]

the 8th AF Jugs and the 354th fg Stangs were the Zerstörer killers in winter of 43 till March of 44 when the 410 was being phased out slowly and moved to the lower Reich.

I have a friend Del harris of the 8th AF 353rd fg who flew a Jug and he tells of many missions jumping the Bf 110G-2's and the Me 410's as they que'd up for a quick rocket attack by staffel. Both German craft were slow and highly unmanueverable, Del's Jug buddies easily got within the ranks of the twins and blew them apart.

Literally the only time for success would be along the great miles of bomber streams and hopeful no US escorts were in the area, a most rare occassion where victories by the twins were duly noted in November-December 43 and into January 44 when they fell off abruptly, and were then sporadic. One of the most successful missions operated by ZG 26 and 76 was October 14, 43 with 23 kills.

ZG 26 alone on December 11, 43 had 8 kills
ZG 26 alone on December 22, 43 had 14 kills

January 11, 44 a huge aerial battle, 19 B-17's claimed by ZG 26 and 76, not to cover any of the twins in the NJG's that flew this day mission.

March 6, 44 II./ZG 26 alone claims 10 B-17's in their Me 410's.

April 11, 44 II./ZG 26 claims 10 B-17's and III./ZG 26 claims 9 B-17's.

May 29, 44 ZG 26 claims 15 B-24's

Against the US 15th AF on July 2, 44 -- ZG 76 claims 13 B-17's

♫

 

[carpenoctem1689]

Good information. The mustang and P-47 would rip apart an Me-410 or Bf-110. they were slower, much less manvouverable, sitting ducks for the Later P-51'a and P-47s. One thing about the P-51B though with only four 12.7mm machine guns, it might have some trouble bringing down one of the big aircraft, would require more hits than the D and later models. Obviously the P-47 never had this problem, sporting double the armament of the P-51B.

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

It just depends on where you hit on the aircraft.

 

[CharlesBronson]

Another sucessfull Me-410 pilot.

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Nice pic there.

 

[carpenoctem1689]

That was a nice pic. Damn i love that BK.5 cannon, just so...damn cool. Looks like the killer it is, and must have sounded pretty wicked when Fros opened up with that thing on those B-17s.
Does anyone have footage of the effects of a BK5 on an aircraft?

 

[Gnomey]

I have this but is just a pic of the weapon itself...

 

[KraziKanuK]

Has this link to a 410 site been posted?

http://detailsite.tripod.com/410/410framespage.htm

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Cool link.

 

[Erich]

I see my good friend Bernd Willmer copied and pasted the Me 410 manual almost in entirety which I own........dang wish I had the scanner and digi cam since I could post the MG 151/20 2cm fittings and ammo feeds

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Mail it to me Erich...... I cant promise that you would get it back though.....

Just kidding with you Erich.

 

[CharlesBronson]

Pictures of the 13 mm defensive barbettes system...simple isnt ?

The handweel and gunsight in the rear gunner cockpit.

 

[Udet]

Great photos Charles...

As you might recall the allies also claim that besides having made a crappy plane 100% uncapable of dealing with single engined enemy fighters, the remote controlled barbette system for the MG 131s proved "failures".

 

[CharlesBronson]

Well.. the B-17 had 12 defensive Mgs and still get shoot down, so the effectiveness of defensives MGs are always relative. The Me-210/410 system was complicated to manufacture and insume a lot of copper for his electric motors, but wasnt particulary bad.

 

[Udet]

Charlie, i agree, but my point was not in the direction of suggesting the Me 410 could not be brought down if attacked from the rear entering the area of fire of the defensive MG 131s...rather what i meant is i have read opinions that say the remote controlled barbettes proved a failure, referring to the idea of a system that simply did not work, that was useless...unless proven otherwise sounds like allied crap to me of course.

You know allied rear gunners are "fearsome shooters" while German rear gunners either "do not hit a thing" or "use inadequate weapons".

 

[CharlesBronson]

You know allied rear gunners are "fearsome shooters" while German rear gunners either "do not hit a thing" or "use inadequate weapons".

Here is an P-38 ace who might not agree, James M. Morris

On 7 July 1944 he was about to down an Me-410 when the German plane turned the tables and shot him down. He parachuted safely from his aircraft, was subsequently captured by the enemy and spent the remainder of the war as a POW.

His highest scoring day came while he was flying P-38 serial# 42-67871 Squadron code: LC-G, however his normal mount was P-38 serial# 42-67717 Squadron code: LC-E which he named "My Dad / Til We Meet Again

Capt. James M. "Slick" Morris