Njaco
The Pop-Tart Whisperer
Edgar is right. Its the Beaufighter.
WW2 Aviation Mythbusters
- Thread starter FLYBOYJ
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then there is Douglas Bader having his tail chewed off by a BF 109, research suggests it might have been blown off by Buck Casson for a blue on blue kill and the pair may have made up the collision story in POW camp
Agreed, it is absolutely impressive. These pilots did an amazing job and served their country with distinction (even though we did not treat them as equals). That says a lot in my opinion.
My problem is that if you care about the true history and point out the fact that they did in fact lose bombers, people get offended. We have even had people come into this forum and accuse people of being racist because they stated the fact that they did lose bombers.
Njaco
The Pop-Tart Whisperer
BoB myth;
Galland did NOT say "I want a squadron of Spitfires."
What he said on 2 September was:
"Ich bitte um die Ausrüstung meines Geschwaders mit Spitfire." ("I should like an outfit of Spitfires for my squadron.")
Galland did NOT say "I want a squadron of Spitfires."
What he said on 2 September was:
"Ich bitte um die Ausrüstung meines Geschwaders mit Spitfire." ("I should like an outfit of Spitfires for my squadron.")
Shortround6
Major General
P-40 was designed to be a ground strafer in 1938.
The USAAC ruined the P-39.
The USAAC ruined the P-39.
always wondered if he meant it or was just trying to get a reaction out of his boss ???
pbfoot
1st Lieutenant
I wonder if it would be possible to "solve" one myth at a time everynody seems to be tossing a whole bunch out there and they are all good
I always though it was just Galland's way of talking back. Goering had just chewed some butt, and had actually suggested that too many bombers were getting shot down because of cowardice of the Luftwaffe fighter pilots. So i'm sure there were some very pissed men listening, Galland among them.
I wonder if Galland was ever asked about the Spitfire request in any of his post war interviews ?
Edgar Brooks
Senior Airman
It was said that Bader never spoke to Casson, while they shared the camp, and the "collision" story depends on how you feel about Bader's character. He was either so arrogant, that he refused to admit to being shot down, or he was so thoughtful that he didn't want Casson to be known, for the rest of his life, as "the man who shot down Bader." You pay your money, and you take your choice; "Bader's Last Flight," by Andy Saunders is worth a read, and there's a 2006 TV programme "Who Downed Douglas Bader?" around, somewhere.
- Thread starter
- #50
FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
It was in the Pacific13 September 1940 was before WWII started?
GrauGeist
Generalfeldmarschall zur Luftschiff Abteilung
I recall talking to a family friend who actually flew a Corsair in the Pacific (VMF-212), and he explained the guys called it "Whisteling Death" because of the noise of the air passing over the oil coolers when the plane was in a high-speed pass or especially a dive...
And that's "Whisteling" and not "Whispering Death", there was nothing "Whispering" about a Corsair unless it was parked on a ramp somewhere...lmao
And that's "Whisteling" and not "Whispering Death", there was nothing "Whispering" about a Corsair unless it was parked on a ramp somewhere...lmao
The Beaufighter got called "whispering death" for the sleeve valve cylinders. Corsair was "whistling death" for the oil cooler intakes. Easy to confuse the two.
I've seen Galland talking about Göring. He absolutely hated the man, he thought he should've been retired from service in favour of his political career back in 1938, he said so once. He didn't believe it responsible to try doing both at once but Göring wasn't even doing that, when he wasn't blowing his own trumpet in Prussia, he was stoned and having party attendees picked up by gestapo buddies for slights. You know the satirical stalag 13 style quip "send him to the russian front," Göring actually did that to Wilcke over an argument.
Pretty argumentative combining various heresay in such a statement I realise, it should be taken at face value of little genuine worth.
I've seen Galland talking about Göring. He absolutely hated the man, he thought he should've been retired from service in favour of his political career back in 1938, he said so once. He didn't believe it responsible to try doing both at once but Göring wasn't even doing that, when he wasn't blowing his own trumpet in Prussia, he was stoned and having party attendees picked up by gestapo buddies for slights. You know the satirical stalag 13 style quip "send him to the russian front," Göring actually did that to Wilcke over an argument.
Pretty argumentative combining various heresay in such a statement I realise, it should be taken at face value of little genuine worth.
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fastmongrel
1st Sergeant
The Luftwaffe started bombing London (and lost the Battle of Britain) because the RAF bombed Berlin.
got the book, saw the tv program but thanks
I think this was a reaction to the requirement that the fighters close escort in formation the bombers. In these circumstances any advantage in speed, acceleration, corkscrew climb or tactics the Bf 109 had developed was lost and only turning radious would seem citical.
It was disasterous tactic that cost the Me 110 but also the Me 109 dearly. I believe the USAAF made the same mistake for a time.
The Me 110 in particular had poor acceleration and could not get to a suitable speed in time.
I thought the rumour is that the japanese used these terms? I'd rather think that any japanese soldier using such defeatest demoralising language would be up for a little bit of discipline.
Now that I find even more incredulous. I can't possibly immagine some sergeant pilot strapping himself into his 'whispering death' to give the nips some curry. If anything it was going to be called a "Beau". Limguistically it just doesn't sound english at all. It sounds like someone trying to feign an oriental style.
I wasn't really whispering either, perhaps a little quieter using youtube video. The turbochargerd aricraft were likely the quietest of aircraft.
Edgar Brooks
Senior Airman
The word is "incredible," which means "unbelievable," which means that you are incredulous, but not all pilots were sergeants; there were some officers who'd had university and public school education, and flowery language would have been second nature to them. If you're wondering how I know, I live within 25 miles of Oxford, and have heard, back in the 1950s, their posh, superior, accents.
You'll find it on page 90 of "Beaufighter at War," published in 1976, written by, and about, pilots of the Beaufighter. I can recommend research; you can find out a lot of truths that way.
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It certainly is impressive, is it a statistically exceptional for similar missions flown in similar circumstances in the same region (the MTO I think mainly?) by other groups? I haven't the resources or the inclination to do the analysis. IQ tests were extensively used in the selection process so if anything we can argue that IQ tests predictive values is at work yet again.
The problem here is that some people wish to demonstrate or mythologise some superhuman performance that will underline some social point. It just showed these men were willing and capable of loyally carrying out their duty. One can't realistically expect more given the complex circumstances. Notable is a suprising casualty rate these men paid.
