Zyzygie’s Mumbles and Rambles

Zyzygie · May 3, 2020

Zyzygie said:
It might well have gone to 37,000 but that's the figures I've got from CFE testing after the war.

With a max level speed of about 530 mph it should have been in reasonable condition:

View attachment 579517
View attachment 579896
Note allowance for throttling back to 16,000 rpm on incipient surging.

The Meteor climb rate is limited by surge at altitudes above 15,000 ft.

There's not enough data points in the Me 262 graph to be sure, but it looks likely that there is also a decline starting at around 10,000 ft.

That would fit in with what is known about the JUMO compressor's tendency to surge.

However even if we were to extrapolate a straight line all the way to 30,000 ft for the Me 262, the Meteor would still come out well on top.

Zyzygie · May 5, 2020

Graeme said:
Getting back to the Meteor and that report that Bada kindly uploaded, you read this...
How then did the Mk.III become operational?

View attachment 579288

From EVALUATION OF THE ME 262 by TECHNICAL INTELLIGENCE

FLIGHT CHARACTERISTICS

Handling and control at various speeds
The handling characteristics were poor at all speeds above 350mph. The airplane would not make a very satisfactory gun platform because of a tendency to hunt directionally, which resulted in snaking at speeds above 400 mph IAS...

bada · May 5, 2020

Damned, is this still going???

Yeah it was a bad gun platform...
so tell me : (actually i don't know if i'll read the answer as it will be some third source quoted for the nine time and unworthy of spending my time )

1-how many German grease monkeys with the sufficient knowledge about the plane/engines were keeping this plane flying? Maybe the allied GreaseMonkeys simply didn't had the knowledge to make one flyiable like the germans would have? don't you think?
2- it was such a bad plane that it has like, what, how many, confirmed aerial victories again?....hmm, i wonder, cant remember anymore...the number is blurred by the meteor's score
Yeah it 's a silly argument, i know, just like this whole thread is.

Stop your Crusade. The meteor3 sucked. Final.

Ps: i forgot, have fun (don't know the source, it was saved on the hdd in 2006, i think it origin even from this board)

Zyzygie · May 5, 2020

bada said:
Damned, is this still going???

Yeah it was a bad gun platform...
so tell me : (actually i don't know if i'll read the answer as it will be some third source quoted for the nine time and unworthy of spending my time )

1-how many German grease monkeys with the sufficient knowledge about the plane/engines were keeping this plane flying? Maybe the allied GreaseMonkeys simply didn't had the knowledge to make one flyiable like the germans would have? don't you think?
2- it was such a bad plane that it has like, what, how many, confirmed aerial victories again?....hmm, i wonder, cant remember anymore...the number is blurred by the meteor's score
Yeah it 's a silly argument, i know, just like this whole thread is.

Stop your Crusade. The meteor3 sucked. Final.

Ps: i forgot, have fun (don't know the source, it was saved on the hdd in 2006, i think it origin even from this board)
View attachment 580216

Maybe if Germany hadn't thrown in the towel so quickly, and if more than 20-30 Me 262s had managed to get into the air on any particular day, there would have been a reasonable chance of some combat...

It was the Meteors hunting for the Me 262s, not the other way around.

swampyankee · May 5, 2020

Zyzygie said:
Maybe if Germany hadn't thrown in the towel so quickly, and if more than 20-30 Me 262s had managed to get into the air on any particular day, there would have been a reasonable chance of some combat...

It was the Meteors hunting for the Me 262s, not the other way around.

Germany was pretty thoroughly beaten; they didn't so much throw in the towel as have it pulled from around its figurative waist, followed by having it snapped against the now-naked rump.

Zyzygie · May 5, 2020

But the Me 262 was certainly a formidable bomber destroyer in the hands of an expert...

nuuumannn · May 5, 2020

swampyankee said:
Germany was pretty thoroughly beaten; they didn't so much throw in the towel as have it pulled from around its figurative waist, followed by having it snapped against the now-naked rump.

Guy's sniffing the what-if stuff too hard, keeps repeating the same thing over and over again... "if the Germans had X number of Me 262, the Allies would'a lost" yada yada. He's delirious.

Zyzygie · May 6, 2020

nuuumannn said:
Guy's sniffing the what-if stuff too hard, keeps repeating the same thing over and over again... "if the Germans had X number of Me 262, the Allies would'a lost" yada yada. He's delirious.

I certainly wasn't meaning to denigrate the German people. They fought bravely.

The leaders were the big problem.

nuuumannn · May 6, 2020

Zyzygie said:
certainly wasn't meaning to denigrate the German people. They fought bravely.

Yeah, we know. Whether or not the German military fought bravely has nothing to do with what you are repeatedly claiming.

GrauGeist · May 6, 2020

Zyzygie said:
Maybe if Germany hadn't thrown in the towel so quickly, and if more than 20-30 Me 262s had managed to get into the air on any particular day, there would have been a reasonable chance of some combat...

It was the Meteors hunting for the Me 262s, not the other way around.

As has been explained ad nauseam, the Luftwaffe did not have the fuel, rubber, spare parts or pilots in the final days, to keep their fighters (any, but Me262 included) in the air.
And when Luftwaffe fighters got airborne, there were hundreds of Allied fighters roaming the countryside scouring the earth of anything that walked or crawled.

In regards to the Meteors hunting Me262s, bullshit, they were forbidden to pass over enemy lines, so it never happened.
The closest that a jet-on-jet encounter ever happened, was when Ar234s bombed 616 sqd's airbase, nearly destroying their Meteors on the ground.

Now for reality: *IF* the Meteors jad encountered the Me262, there HAS to be several factors to take into consideration.
First of all, the Meteor and the Me262 were closely matched.
Secondly, the circumstances are a what-if, BUT he pilots of the Me262 are experienced in attacking bombers, challenging escorts and tactical flight, the Meteor pilots were experienced in intercepting V-1 cruise missiles and ground attack.
So it literally comes down to pilot versus pilot in the end.

Zyzygie · May 6, 2020

OK... I'll buy that.

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