"All of Vlad's forces and all of Vlad's men, are out to put Humpty together again." (2 Viewers)

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GrauGeist said:
Last I heard, the Ukraine Army's strength (as of July of this year) was at 700,000.
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Me too, 700,000.

Zelenskyy: 700,000 soldiers are defending Ukraine today - Support Ukraine Army

IRYNA BALACHUK - SATURDAY, 21 MAY 2022, 11:12 AM President Volodymyr Zelenskyy said that today Ukraine is being defended in the war by 700,000 military personnel. Source: Zelenskyy in an interview for Ukrainian journalists Quote from the president: ...
army.com.ua

With Russia having lost >60k troops, my thinking is Ukraine has moved to number three.
 
Thoughts on the M60 to Ukraine?

Idea: Why Not Send Old U.S. M60 Tanks to Ukraine?

There are many who are calling for the U.S. to send tank to help Ukraine fight Russia. One possible model is the old M60 tank.
www.19fortyfive.com

American Tanks For Ukraine Are 'Absolutely On The Table'

There is already speculation about the possibility of U.S.-made M1 Abrams tanks heading to Ukraine, but there are other potential options.
www.thedrive.com

So, what changes now?

U.S. Law On Lend-Lease For Ukraine Comes Into Force

On Saturday, October 1, the law of the United States of America on lend-lease for Ukraine entered into force. Chairman of the Verkhovna Rada Rusla
menafn.com
 
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Shouldn't be bad against T-72s. I don't know if the ammo loadout takes ERA into consideration. Crew matters, too.

Me, I bet they could put 'em to good use.
 
Thumpalumpacus said:
Shouldn't be bad against T-72s. I don't know if the ammo loadout takes ERA into consideration. Crew matters, too.

Me, I bet they could put 'em to good use.
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Agreed, if they're in good refurbished condition. I don't see any other option for AFU tanks if the Germans won't send Leopard 2s and the US says Ukraine can't manage the Abrams gas turbine and advanced systems without significant (and half a year's delay causing) training and establishment of a long support/maintenance train.

If no Leos and no Abrams, and presumably no LeClercs, Arietes and Challengers, it's got to be the M60 or more T-72s scounged up from across Europe and maybe Asia and Africa. The M60 has the same ammo used by the M1128 Mobile Gun System, so it might be good against ERA. But with thousands of MANPATS in AFU service, is antitank the main role for Ukraine's MBTs?
 
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The comment above about supply-chain issues is pretty apt, though. We can compare capabilities 'til the cows come home, but keeping the thing operational is another thing altogether. Perhaps after the war we can do the M-1 thing, and until then complicating the supply-chain might not be beneficial, thereby bypassing the -60 altogether.

wlewisiii is a former tanker. I'd love to get his perspective on this.
 
Hmmm….. there's always some outliers that the US could negotiate. South Korean tanks to Ukraine via Poland?

Poland to buy hundreds of South Korean tanks, howitzers after sending arms to Ukraine | CNN

Poland is buying almost 1,000 tanks, more than 600 pieces of artillery and dozens of fighter jets from South Korea, in part to replace equipment donated to Ukraine to help Kyiv fight the Russian invasion, the Polish Ministry of Defense told CNN on Tuesday.
www.cnn.com

The K2 looks impressive. Same ammo as the Leopard 2 and Abrams, so easier ammunition supply.


GrauGeist said:
With the M60, like any other Western tank, there'll need to be transitional training for crews and maintenance personnel.
Add to that, ample ammunition, since western calibers differ from Soviet/Russian (eastern bloc) tanks.
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True. Anything will need training and support, but apparently the Abrams is on the more demanding side. If it's not Leopards and not Abrams….. IDK.
 
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Thumpalumpacus said:
The comment above about supply-chain issues is pretty apt, though.
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The issues definitely aren't insurmountable. NATO has an entire multinational unit dedicated solely to ensuring Ukraine has what it needs.

I appreciate there a real logistical hurdles yet to overcome, but with Ukraine having a fully committed and stocked NATO right on its western border, providing all the weapons, munitions, communications kit, etc. it can, all free of charge, has any combatant nation ever had a better supply chain? It's like running a hot dog stand and the top backer is your uncle Oscar Mayer.
 

The issue becomes supply for the many systems donated.
 
When the dust settles, Ukraine will be a well equipped military and I suspect that they will receive the M1A1 (or M1A2).

For now, though, we need to get them equipment that they are familiar and experienced with, so that there is nothing to slow their momentum.

The one large benefit of keeping Ukraine supplied with Eastern armor, is that Russia is providing them with huge amounts of ammunition and parts.
 
Isn't he the same guy who received his call up papers and then said that he was too important to be called up. That ethnic minorities and others should go first.

On a different note. Russia keeps talking up the potential use of nuclear weapons and understandably the west led by the USA have promised a response which would be devastating.

No one is talking about what would happen if Russia used the one weapon it has used in the past without any comeback from the west, and that is Chemical Weapons. No doubt there would be a response, but I would be surprised if the smaller countries in the west or those less 'active' in the support of Ukraine such as France, fully took part
 
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