B17

[jhor9]

have any of your gunners shot down a fighter?

My crew got credit for shooting down 6 enemy fighters

 

[jhor9]

found this one for the B25, Is this a general book what all bomber pilots have to learn or was for each type off bomber ( like the B17) a different book ?

I really don't remember, but it looks right. while in the U.S. Overseas during combat operations it did not hold true

 

[jhor9]

Jules looks like you have many questions coming your way .......... excellent !

thank you for answering mine on ID markings and another if I may. I am familiar with Austria but the ops on Wiener Neustadt was defended more heavily by flak or single/twin engine fighters. . ? I imagine your bomb group faced Bf 110G-2's from II./ZG 1 during your war time career of 1943 to late winter of 44 . .

Erich

If I remember correctly there were several targets in the area, I think mostly aircraft production. My tour from 7/43 to 2/44, (before Ploesti) the area was the most heaviest defended target we went to, very heavy flak and many fighters. I was told that during my Nov 43 flight we were attacked by over 80 fighters. Incidentally my ball gunner got credit for 2 fighters that day.

 

[gis-nl]

I really don't remember, but it looks right. while in the U.S. Overseas during combat operations it did not hold true

Tnx for your reply.
It's the same with your driving license, during combat in the big city it do not hold true either

 

[jhor9]

WINGS of FREEDOM ( B-17, B-24, B-25) Burbank, Ca. April 28- May 2 Friday- Tuesday
Bob Hope Airport Flight reservations 800-568-8924 (Flights are $425 for the 17s and 24s, but $325 and $400 for the 25s. (Tax Deductible Donations) $10 walk through adult


$425? Hmmm That's about what they paid me for flying them for 2 months.

 

[evangilder]

I will be out there on Saturday to take my son to see these historic birds. I wish I could afford the flight, but I understand it takes a lot of money to keep these planes flying. I will try and get some good shots, but the crowds will probably be pretty heavy.

Wow, 425 for 2 months! And I know that flying them into unfriendly skies was probably not the funnest job either.

 

[syscom3]

WINGS of FREEDOM ( B-17, B-24, B-25) Burbank, Ca. April 28- May 2 Friday- Tuesday
Bob Hope Airport Flight reservations 800-568-8924 (Flights are $425 for the 17s and 24s, but $325 and $400 for the 25s. (Tax Deductible Donations) $10 walk through adult


$425? Hmmm That's about what they paid me for flying them for 2 months.

JHOR, in 1994, I paid for a one hour ride in the Collings Foundation B17G. What a heck of a ride!

We flew along the beaches of south Los Angeles county and along Orange County beaches.

The weather sucked though. I had the morning flight and there was thick overcast. Fortunatly the ceiling was high enough for us to fly. It probably added to the authenticity of the flight though, like we were flying in crappy European weather.

 

[loomaluftwaffe]

crappy European weather isn't so crappy in the Pacific though

 

[Erich]

Jules thank you for the quick response again .... . .

a question similiar to the one I asked and not sure if you can give a definate or not you being in the forward part of the B-17 and very busy with other things, but do you remember where most of the Lufwaffe attacks came from (direction) ? front, sides, etc ?

 

[syscom3]

JHOR, when in your training, at what point where some cadets selected for the pilot position and the others for the co-pilot position? What did the AAF decide on who made the commander?

Once you got to Europe and assigned to your bomb squadron, was it normal for all new pilots and co-pilots to fly with veteran's as to gain experience?

 

[Hot Space]

A daft qustion m8? Would you have swapped the B-17 for a Lancaster? Some U.S serviceman joined the RCAF or RAF when the war 1st started and said that they wouldn't swapped the 'Lanc' for anything - including a B-17.

 

[jhor9]

Erich

The only time that I saw a fighter was when I checked out my co pilot, he flew in the left seat. The other times I was too busy keeping the plane in tight formation. although I could hear the crew on interphone calling out direction of attacking fighters

 

[Erich]

Jules thank you again for the reply . . .

Erich

 

[jhor9]

JHOR, when in your training, at what point where some cadets selected for the pilot position and the others for the co-pilot position? What did the AAF decide on who made the commander?

Once you got to Europe and assigned to your bomb squadron, was it normal for all new pilots and co-pilots to fly with veteran's as to gain experience?

Since my 3rd phase of training was in twin engine planes I knew that I wouldn't be assigned to fighters. The bosses tried to meet your requests I asked for A20 (I believe it was called the Havoc)however they said that they needed 4 engine pilots ASAP , so after getting my wings I was assigned to B17 transition school.

 

[jhor9]

JHOR, when in your training, at what point where some cadets selected for the pilot position and the others for the co-pilot position? What did the AAF decide on who made the commander?

Once you got to Europe and assigned to your bomb squadron, was it normal for all new pilots and co-pilots to fly with veteran's as to gain experience?

The procedure in my group was that an incoming 1st pilot would fly as copilot with a checked out copilot. The incoming copilot would fly with a veteran pilot. After several missions I got my complete crew back again. About half way through my tour I checked out my co pilot in the left seat . I then had new copilots in the right seat. I hope that I made sense.

Other groups might have had other procedures.

 

[syscom3]

Yes Jules, this is really interesting.

Heres my next question. Had you ever flown in a plane before your enlistment? What was your first flight as a cadet like?

 

[jhor9]

LMFAO Joe..... That was great....

Welcome Jules....

My questions revolve around the Fw-190A-8's and their increased 30mm armament.... Were u guys ever briefed and/or warned about this kites attack profile and destructive power, or was it just another FW???

It seems that some pilots were briefed and some werent...

I don't recall being briefed on particulars of fighters other then the ME262. Our briefing just told us how many fighters we might expect to encounter.

 

[jhor9]

Yes Jules, this is really interesting.

Heres my next question. Had you ever flown in a plane before your enlistment? What was your first flight as a cadet like?

In 1941 I won a flight scholarship that enabled me to get 35 hours in a Piper Cub, once I had that under my belt it was the AAF for me. I enlisted the day after Pearl Harbor. I recall the exhilaration that overcame me when I made my first solo in the Piper Cub after several hours.
As a cadet flying the Stearman bi wing, it was old hat, My instructor had me solo after 3 hours

 

[FLYBOYJ]

I don't remember but I'm quite sure that at graduation when I got my wings, our class was split up and we were sent to various bases for training in different operational aircraft
During my time in 1942, washouts were sent to nav and bombardier schools,
Later all cadets had to take what was called stanine (?) tests which determined what schools they would be sent to. The latter part of 1944 after a stint as pilot instructor I requested nav school, I had to take the stanine tests , same as cadets, but since I was a student officer I asked for nav school only, i eventually earned nav wings and was dual rated,

Great stuff jhor!!!

I had an uncle who washed out, he was sent to bombadier's school. He told me for a spell that bombaiders made a little more than pilots - do you remember if that was true?

found this one for the B25, Is this a general book what all bomber pilots have to learn or was for each type off bomber ( like the B17) a different book ?

This instrument approach procedure isn't written for a specific plane but is flown based on time and airspeed - it's very similar ti instrument approach procedures today...

 

[jhor9]

Jhor, was that standard practice for the B17 training pilots to have three student pilots under his "wings".

What were the first few training flights like? Go up to altitude and take turns flying around? Did you actually get to stall the plane to get practice in recovery techniques?

Sorry I didn't answer you sooner. I believe that we had 3 trainees to an instructor. Yes, we did practice stalls. We had much practice landings and takeoffs. When landing we had to cut power on the downwind leg and hit a 10 foot circle on the runway, after practice we did it regularly