Best World War II Aircraft?

[Wespe]

50 hour (if you were lucky) engines, and airframes with dissimilar metal construction, (if you even know what that is) little or no corrosion control process during construction and no I really wouldn't want to have flown on in its WW2 combat form. BTW I have flown jets and know what it takes to maintain and operate them. Can you say the same?
Wrong again pal, if you read my earlier post you would find I have nothing but admiration for German WW2 aircraft which I know were superior to many allied birds.
Read my post again pal, there was a lot more than that which was needed to make it a safe reliable combat machine - it was too little too late. For a noob here I suggest you read several threads on get your facts straight about what some of the membership have said earlier in this thread, let a lone our backgrounds in aviation....

Wow, I really don't know what to say,
Quote:Wrong again pal, if you read my earlier post you would find I have nothing but admiration for German WW2 aircraft which I know were superior to many allied birds.
Which German crap plane was superior to allied planes?
The Germans didn't have a single plane that contributed to winning the war, only loosing.
The Me-262 fell apart, the Ta-152 not even really in Service,The D's just barley touching a P-51 and didn't win the war, the Bf-109s ??? or do you reflect in allied birds, more the Russians and English?

Tell me more, please

 

[FLYBOYJ]

Wow, I really don't know what to say,
Quote:Wrong again pal, if you read my earlier post you would find I have nothing but admiration for German WW2 aircraft which I know were superior to many allied birds.

Just to humor you - FW 190D (My oppinion the best fighter of the war, Bf 109K series and the Ta 152...

Which German crap plane was superior to allied planes?

Read above and they weren't crap...

The Germans didn't have a single plane that contributed to winning the war, only loosing.

Well Germany lost, you want to rewrite history?

The Me-262 fell apart, the Ta-152 not even really in Service,The D's just barley touching a P-51 and didn't win the war, the Bf-109s ??? or do you reflect in allied birds, more the Russians and English?

Tell me more, please

All the above - even with the FW 190D, Me 262 and late model Me 109s with the best pilots flying them, it was all too little too late and that's not my opinion. I could go into another dissertation why the Luftwaffe lost but I thin its quite evident...

 

[Wespe]

Glad to see that u finally agree that the 47 did infact influence the 130...

Heeeyyy,

did I say that I agree ? I said I do not know much about Transportplanes, so if you guys consider the adapting of a cockpit layout and a cargo door as influential to any modern transport a/c, well then I feel free to let you have your own opinion to that.

Wespe

 

[FLYBOYJ]

if you guys consider the adapting of a cockpit layout and a cargo door as influential to any modern transport a/c, well then I feel free to let you have your own opinion to that.

Wespe

It's a little bit beyond opinion, about 70 year's worth...

 

[Wespe]

Just to humor you - FW 190D (My oppinion the best fighter of the war, Bf 109K series and the Ta 152...


Read above and they weren't crap...

Well Germany lost, you want to rewrite history?


All the above - even with the FW 190D, Me 262 and late model Me 109s with the best pilots flying them, it was all too little too late and that's not my opinion. I could go into another dissertation why the Luftwaffe lost but I thin its quite evident...

Tanks

I knew that you Americans can be so generous if you want to.

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

I stated that the Me-262 is to me the greatest aircraft of WWII, because it marked a new era in aeronautics and future layouts of modern air forces, therefore it moved the props into history.

No actually when you stated "Come on Guys it was just a transport" and basically implied that it could not have had the impact that it did on the whole war and could not have possibly been the best aircraft used in WW2 you started this...

Now if you wish to end it, prove us wrong.

I stated that in comparable mission spectrum the Me-262 could do the same as any prop but at 200km plus.

No in this thread you stated the Me-262 was the best aircraft and that it was the most versatile and you said this in another forum as well. Go back and read you own posts.

 

[FLYBOYJ]

Tanks

I knew that you Americans can be so generous if you want to.

And blunt -

But in all seriousness, I think aircraft like the Fw 190D were far superior to anything the US had available in late 1944 - The Luftwaffe had 3 things to do - stop an invading army, stop a bombardment from the air, and deal with escorting fighters. As good as their aircraft were they couldn't do all three...

 

[Wespe]

It's a little bit beyond opinion, about 70 year's worth...

Hey great pictures,

so what is the difference between a Ju 90 cockpit and that of the C-130 ?
I am sure you have a picture, if you don't mind please post it.

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

You don't get it do you? "the most influential in the role it played in WWII" did I ever state that the C-47 did NOT PLAY AN INFLUENTIAL ROLE IN LOGISTICS????

And what did Logistics contribute to? Winning the war. No one is claiming the Me-262 was not a good aircraft. But it was not the best. If it is then please post some facts. We are still waiting...

Since the Me-262 did go into action in March 45,

Actually you might want to check your dates. The Me-262 flew its first operational sorties against the allies with Kommando Nowotny in August 1944. Nowotny was even shot down in November 1944.

And because the US won, everything that contributed to WWII must off course be American or in the worst case British, otherwise how could they have won? And the best tank in WWII was the Sherman, because it influenced the Abrahms (they both have a cannon) and It contributed to winning the war.
If every future discussion comes down to contribution (winning) towards the WWII, than what do you want to discuss about ?

The Ta 152 better than .......
Answer NO because it didn't contribute
The 109 better than .....
Answer NO because it didn't contribute
MK 108 better than ...........
Answer NO because it didn't contribute
Did the Germans have anything at all?
Answer NO because it didn't contribute


Anything else?

Now you are just being silly. I dont know what to say to this either anymore. No one here has said that the Germans did not make great aircraft. They had some of the best aircraft of the war and in some cases the best aircraft in my opinion.

We are talking about overall best aircraft here. Aircraft that accomplished them most.

You are just letting pride get in the way. I too am born and raised in Germany but I give credit to where it is due when it comes to WW2 aviation.

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Heeeyyy,

did I say that I agree ? I said I do not know much about Transportplanes, so if you guys consider the adapting of a cockpit layout and a cargo door as influential to any modern transport a/c, well then I feel free to let you have your own opinion to that.

Wespe

What is your background in aviation, if you dont mind me asking you? Some of us here FBJ and myself including are liscensed and have experience in building and working on aircraft.

 

[FLYBOYJ]

Hey great pictures,

so what is the difference between a Ju 90 cockpit and that of the C-130 ?
I am sure you have a picture, if you don't mind please post it.

Actually I cant find the Ju 90, there's a C-130 below.

Into the war, all combatants started configuring cockpits like the DC-3. 2 man flight crew, radios behind the throttles or in the overheard, elevator trim wheel to the right of the pilot's seat and environmental controls in the over head as well. I've flown B737 full motion sims at United Air Lines training center and the set up is still similar as the DC-3/ C-47.

The C-130 cockpit is an older moder, I believe a G.

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Lets go ahead and make this simple. Here is a question for you Wespe.

Not including what an aircraft influenced after the war. What aircraft do you consider using hard facts was the best aircraft of WW2 based on what it did in WW2. You have to account for performance, ease of maintenance and contribution to the war effort on any given side. Who cares about the winner of the war and even more so what country made the aircraft.

 

[Wespe]

No actually when you stated "Come on Guys it was just a transport" and basically implied that it could not have had the impact that it did on the whole war and could not have possibly been the best aircraft used in WW2 you started this...

Now if you wish to end it, prove us wrong.

Okay, the best plane in the world is a B 29 because it carried a lot from here to there, dropped the A bomb and caused Japan to surrender. And it is the forefather off all modern Bombers.
Proof me wrong

No in this thread you stated the Me-262 was the best aircraft and that it was the most versatile and you said this in another forum as well. Go back and read you own posts.

Okay, the Me-262 was crap and acctually could not do anything a prop plane in a similar mission and configuration could do especially not faster.
And the P80 would have kicked its ass because all modern jets derive from the P80.
proof me wrong

 

[lesofprimus]

Ur wise @ss attitude is gonna get u in trouble pal... Watch ur mouth...

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Okay, the Me-262 was crap and acctually could not do anything a prop plane in a similar mission and configuration could do especially not faster.
And the P80 would have kicked its ass because all modern jets derive from the P80.
proof me wrong

Now you are just being silly and making stupid comments. Stop changing the topic of the discussion.

No one has said the Me-262 was a piece of crap. It was a great fighter. It was plauged with problems with its engines and the metals used to make the aircraft were not wisely chosen (they did not have much of a choice though because of lack of raw materials near the end of the war). You do know what using disimiliar metals does correct?

The Me-262 was an innovative aircraft and was the best jet fighter to see service in the war.

However now you bring the P-80 into the picture. We dont know how the P-80 would have been in retrospect to the Me-262 because it did not see combat service. So why bring it up?. Since you did I personally think the Me-262 was a better design. The thing the P-80 had going for it was it had better engines that were more robust.

I also dont think the P-80 is what all modern jets were derived from. It did have one other thing that was better than the Me-262 though. That was its engine was in the fuselage which is more aerodynamic and how 90 percent of all jet fighter aircraft today are.

If you really want my opinion was influenced the most modern jets and that would the Messerschmitt P.1101 and the Focke Wulf Ta-183. They did not fly or see service in WW2 but they were tested by the allies afterwards and used as the basis for several fighters after the war.

Do me a favor though Wespe, stop acting like a child here and debate this like an adult.

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Also you stated the Ju-90 had a cargo ramp. Where is this cargo ramp? I have not seen one yet. The Ju-90 was a tail dragger so where is it s ramp. If you are talking about a ramp that comes out the side, so what, the C-47 had the same as well. However the Ju-90 did not have a ramp that comes out the back.

Please correct me if I am missunderstanding you.

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Aha I have found the ramp on the Ju-90 you are talking about. Only one prototype was built with the ramp in late 1939 and it was cancelled.

 

[FLYBOYJ]

Okay, the Me-262 was crap and acctually could not do anything a prop plane in a similar mission and configuration could do especially not faster.
And the P80 would have kicked its ass because all modern jets derive from the P80.
proof me wrong

The P-80 in its original form was a half notch up on the 262 for reliability and maintainability, if you were lucky. As we know one killed Dick Bong, Lockheed chief test pilot Milo Burcham and almost killed Tony Levier. It wasn't until the "C" was introduced where a reliable (and here's that word again) safe fighter was being produced.

 

[Burador]

Wrong again pal, if you read my earlier post you would find I have nothing but admiration for German WW2 aircraft which I know were superior to many allied birds.

These are your exact words about this German fighter: "NO - although innovative, as a safe reliable combat aircraft it was crap." All that was said about the 262 was its performance superiority over all Allied aircraft in combat, nothing about safety and reliability. With its performance it is indeed a superior fighter to any other in that war. And that is not crap. Also, my contention that Allied propaganda was constantly at play is correct.

Read my post again pal, there was a lot more than that which was needed to make it a safe reliable combat machine - it was too little too late. For a noob here I suggest you read several threads on get your facts straight about what some of the membership have said earlier in this thread, let a lone our backgrounds in aviation....

I don't have to, there are 36 pages in this thread and I don't want to go through your runarounds. Who do you think you are?

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

I don't have to, there are 36 pages in this thread and I don't want to go through your runarounds. Who do you think you are?

He is a moderator in this forum. Who do you think you are?