Carrier operations.....

trackend · Jun 9, 2007

I agree Adler I have a shot of HMS Fencer on her beam ends and the flight deck is about the same angle as the USS San Jancinto the caption reads 22 degree roll, in the night a 40 degree roll was recorded. Too much for me by about 30 degrees

Mike64 · Jun 10, 2007

All -

regarding straight deck vs angled deck - I have to admit axial was a bigger risk, but today, nite ops are the real thrill!

A "Fresnel Lens" has been used in lighthouses for at least decades, I think. It is simply slotted so that it shines in certain verticle arcs, for easier identification and directional illumination.

Mike C
USN / Ret
Fleet A-4 / A-6

R Leonard · Jun 10, 2007

The first Fresnel lens was installed in a French lighthouse in 1822. By the mid 1850's all existing US lighthouses had been converted to Fresnel lenses.

R

pbfoot · Jun 10, 2007

Lucky13 said:
....
1956 USS Coral Sea CVA-43 - In port at Norfolk Naval Shipyard. The new "super carrier" the USS Forrestal CV-59 is tied up on the next pier over. Note the size difference between the Midway Class and Forrestal .

Showed these pics to a couple of RCNAS guys and they asked "where was the crane" apparently if you went past the net the crane was there to impede you

Mike64 · Jun 10, 2007

Regarding Carrier names -

All US commissioned warships (USS) are technically named by the Secretary of the Navy. He obvious;ly considers public inputs, deference to Congress, Navy recommendations, etc. BUT - by public law, written by Congess a long time ago, it IS SecNav's choice.

GEORGE H.W.BUSH (CVN77) has been christened (i.e. launched/floating, formally named, being fitted out). She will be placed "In Commission, in Service" and become USS GEORGE H. W. BUSH (CVN77) in Nov 2008.

I don't like the Prez name stuff either, except for USS DWIGHT D. EISENHOWER (CVN69). I think he was a great President in a difficult time, and a lot of things he did were remarkable in relation to the cold war. He was a quiet, decent man, and not a publicity hound, and I think he has never got the credit he deserves.

Incidentally, when a commissioned warship is "retired", or decommissioned, she is no longer referred to as USS "something" - it technically becomes EX "something", in Navy terms. USS JOHN F. KENNEDY (CV67) was recently decommissioned, now is officially EX-JOHN F. KENNEDY (CV67), "Not in Commission, In Reserve" - in other words, she is "mothballed". Eventually, like EX-SARATOGA (CV60), they are "stricken" and become "Not In Commission, In Excess", awaiting the cutter's torch or other use such as a possible museum.

Mike64 · Jun 10, 2007

OOPS! 1 small correction:

CVN77 will be GEORGE H W BUSH (CVN77), no periods after initials

Lucky13 · Jun 11, 2007

Cheers for the explanation Mike64....

Mike64 · Jun 11, 2007

syscom3 said:
Bon Homme Richard = Bonnie Dick.

Good example, but my favorite was USS HANCOCK (CV-19).

We called her the "Hand Job" in the Vietnam era.

Lucky13 · Jun 11, 2007

Gentlemen..... I'm trying to figure out which fighters etc. that USS Yorktown had in her air groups before the war. Any ideas? Did she have the Boeing F4B's, Curtiss BF2C's for example?

R Leonard · Jun 11, 2007

Fighters Complements USS YORKTOWN CV-5

JUNE 1937
VF-7B: 6 F2F-1

JUNE 1938
VF-5: 19 F2F-1, 1 O3U-3

JUNE 1939
VF-5; 18 F3F-3, 1 F2F-1, 1 SU-3

JUNE 1940
VF-5: 22 F3F-3, 1 SBC-3

JUNE 1941
VF-42: 18 F4F-3

Rich

Lucky13 · Jun 11, 2007

Thanks a lot Rich!

Mike64 · Jun 11, 2007

Matt308 said:
Douglas Fir deck planking on the Yorktown?!!? Crap that wood is SOFT! You can dent it with your fingernail.

My sources say deck planking on ESSEX / TICO Classes was teak, at least after SCB-27C conversions; later, removed and plated over, covered with good old NON-SKID epoxy and aggragate materials.

Mike64 · Jun 11, 2007

Lucky13 said:
Glad to be of service lads... A question though. What happens to the pilot in cases like these? It was obviously NOT is fault, right? Could he had done something else? Will he have to face a, not a courtmarcial(?) maybe, but something similar?

Lucky -

Aircrew, or anyone else does not get Court Martialed for a TRUE accident; there would be an Accident Investigation Board, and administrative action taken as required. However, one exception would be some idiot like Tom Cruise performing unauthorized maneuvers and crashing or damaging something - they would likely get Court Martialed, dismissed from the Navy on an "Administrative Discharge", and their wings would be melted down for bus tokens!

IF the pilot of the AJ was at fault because he landed fast / heavy, he may be assigned a desk job, or formally removed from flight status for good. However, I think the LSO would have got some real heat too, for letting him land fast, if that were the case.

Another chance might be that the arresting gear engine was set wrong (it DOES happen -), or had some type of mechanical failure so the cross deck pendant did not pay out properly.

In those cases, there may be some minor written reprimands, etc, but the mishap board report would recommend that various units such as the Naval Air Systems Command look into changing designs or procedures to make sure it doesn't happen again.

If the pilot didn't do anything wrong, he and his crew might even get Letters of Commendation for just carrying out proper procedures and surviving the event!

Mike64 · Jun 11, 2007

Lucky13 said:
Cheers fellas! Does anyone of you know how many of the Essex class carriers that is still waiting for their destiny, or are they all scrapped by now?

Lucky -

Three ESSEX / TICO Class ships remain as museums, all others have been "Stricken" and were sold for scrap. A couple are in varying states of scrapping because it takes a long time, and EPA laws keep making it harder.

One, EX-ORISKANY, was recently sunk, on purpose, to make a coral reef for divers. The Navy would like to continue on with this if it builds in popularity with the public.

The sinking was also beneficial, because engineers were able to compare their estimates to reality when the ship sunk, and it turns out that where they choose to install the explosives, how large they were, and their sequencing all were a great "lab experiment". The fact that she went down in 30 min is misleading - the explosive pattern and sizes were very specific, on purpose, and of course there was no one aboard to carry out good old Navy damage control procedures.

As for the three museums - groups can request a stricken warship to make into a museum - it is decided by the Secretary of the Navy if one is going to be "donated". However, Congressional Law also says that the group must prove that they have the intent and financial means to maintain the ship in a "dignified state" - no letting it turn into a disgraceful rust bucket.

Decommissioned ships are typically maintained at the Navy Inactive Ship Maintenance Facility (NISMF) in Philadelphia befor disposal. A few are scattered alsewhere, especially nuke subs.

DerAdlerIstGelandet · Jun 11, 2007

Lucky13 said:
Glad to be of service lads... A question though. What happens to the pilot in cases like these? It was obviously NOT is fault, right? Could he had done something else? Will he have to face a, not a courtmarcial(?) maybe, but something similar?

As Mike64 stated up there you would not be punished for a "true" accident. More than likely rewarded if you were able to bring the bird down good eneogh for everyone to survive.

When I was crewing helos in the Army and a "true" accident would happen it there was accident board to investigate and find out what happened. All crew members would have to "piss and bleed" to make sure there was no alcohol or drugs in our system and then as soon as the board was completed and everything was found to have been a "real" accident everyone was returned to flight status as soon as possible.

Lucky13 · Jun 11, 2007

Thanks a bunch for the info lads, much appreciated! Another question...those "hats" or what they're called that you see on some of the deck crews in pre- and WWII photos , were they coloured matching their duties as deck captains, ordnancemen etc....

FLYBOYJ · Jun 11, 2007

Lucky13 said:
Thanks a bunch for the info lads, much appreciated! Another question...those "hats" or what they're called that you see on some of the deck crews in pre- and WWII photos , were they coloured matching their duties as deck captains, ordnancemen etc....

Here ya go....

Colors On The Flight Deck

maxs75 · Jun 11, 2007

Lucky13 said:
Gentlemen..... I'm trying to figure out which fighters etc. that USS Yorktown had in her air groups before the war. Any ideas? Did she have the Boeing F4B's, Curtiss BF2C's for example?

Lucky13,
try Index

HTH

Rich,
the USN official chronology reports that:

May 31, 1941, Sat.

TG 1 (Rear Admiral Arthur B. Cook), comprising Yorktown (CV-5) (VF 41, VS 41, VS 42, and VT 5), heavy cruiser Vincennes (CA-44), and destroyers Sampson (DD-394) and Gwin (DD-433), departs Bermuda for 4,550-mile neutrality patrol that will conclude at Hampton Roads, Virginia, on 12 June.

Do You have different info about VF-42?

Max

Lucky13 · Jun 11, 2007

FLYBOYJ said:
Here ya go....

Colors On The Flight Deck

Damn it! The website seem to be down, I can't get to it anyhoo....

Cheers fellas!

Oh! btw....which would you say was the first really successful USN carrier plane? That goes for the FAA and IJN as well....

FLYBOYJ · Jun 11, 2007

Lucky13 said:
Damn it! The website seem to be down, I can't get to it anyhoo....

Cheers fellas!

Oh! btw....which would you say was the first really successful USN carrier plane? That goes for the FAA and IJN as well....

Here ya go....

Carrier operations.....

Chief Master Sergeant

Airman

Staff Sergeant

1st Lieutenant

Airman

Airman

Forum Mascot

Airman

Forum Mascot

Staff Sergeant

Forum Mascot

Airman

Airman

Airman

Private Chemtrail Disperser

Forum Mascot

"THE GREAT GAZOO"

Airman 1st Class

Forum Mascot

"THE GREAT GAZOO"

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