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Thanks. You're absolutely right. The lack of cooperation counted for both sides. The Germans didn't perform so well either. Actually a few of the Defiants might have been shot down by Stuka's as the bombers were really dogfighting the Defiant. A few surviving pilots mention being chased by Stuka's, but it's vey difficult to find out who shot down who.Hi Marcel. Always nice to read your contributions.
When you mentionned in another thread, the clash between Defiants and Stuka over where your house is now, I gathered the Defiantes were slaughtered by Stuka. Glad to see that did not happen but the Defiants performance is less than glittering.
It seems to me that there was also something lacking in cooperation between the Defiants and the Spits. If there was any.
You don't need ammunition to practise aircraft identification.
That worked during WWI. Not sure what went wrong during 1940 as Germany and the Netherlands got along well.
That might have something to do with it.Maybe because Germany invaded?
Actually there is some clues of Stuka's dogfighting in the crew's reports, although I agree that the bf109's probably shot down most if not all of the Defiants. I translated this back from the Dutch translation, so appologies for any mistakes I made:As for the Stukas dogfighting with the Daffys; an urban myth, I'm afraid.
P/O Thomas pilot of Blue2:When we were atacked by a Ju-87 that followed us at about 50 yards, I told Skelton (pilot sic.) to bank. I didn't get an answer. Then we got another Ju-87 on our tail .... Our aircraft spiralled downwards while the second Ju-87 kept on following us.
At that time, the Ju-87 that was following us was shot down.
Yeah, maybe my definition of a Dogfight is not totally correct.Being chased or following and dogfighting are two different things. There's no doubt the Ju 87s got onto their tails (if I was a Ju 87 pilot and I saw my comrades being shot at I'd want to do what I could to get back at the attackers), but I doubt they were dogfighting. According to the loss records for the aircraft involved, they were shot down or damaged by the Bf 109s.
They are translations by the writer Jan Jolie, I just translated them back. He got them from the Public Record Office in London.Interesting information, Marcel. From where did you acquire the combat reports if they were in Dutch?
Not sure what the single-seat version would have added to the 2 already excellent fighters Spitfire and Hurricane.It's a pity the inquiry that followed this, didn't result in:
- Defiants being restricted to beyond Me 109 range, even in the BoB dispite further disasters they were still used on 'patrol' in 11 Group! Better to act as sweepers perhaps to finish off the damaged aircraft returning from a raid.
- convert Squadrons to night-fighters, even before radar - with the extra pair eyes available to scan the sky, they would help,
- and an earlier (than the P.94) single-seat prototype - shouldn't take long to fare over the turret aperature, add guns to the wings, and a new control stick - to fire them. Seems possible to have dual version production line, until the s/s (Defoe) takes over, with the Mk ll version with the Merlin XX.
Not sure what the single-seat version would have added to the 2 already excellent fighters Spitfire and Hurricane.