vikingBerserker
Lieutenant General
Some people can rationalize anything, regardless of reality.
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Very well said Gary. I actually wrote to the mayor of Nagasaki over the anti-American slant in some of his speeches made about the subject and he was un-yielding in his feelings that the Japanese were totally victimized by US brutality. When presented with facts about the behavior of the Japanese military during WW2, his response was "we tend to remember history in the manner that suits our individual needs."
"we tend to remember history in the manner that suits our individual needs." QUOTE]
That's not quite accurate.
A historian with an creedence doesn't use selective memory. They can not. It is part of their job description to be accurate on such matters.
But, as noted by Proton, a politician will play to his base. All politics is local, and the politician in question was going for the lowest common denominator.
PS- Good job writing him Flyboy. Shows that people are paying attention.
"we tend to remember history in the manner that suits our individual needs." QUOTE]
That's not quite accurate.
A historian with an creedence doesn't use selective memory. They can not. It is part of their job description to be accurate on such matters.
But, as noted by Proton, a politician will play to his base. All politics is local, and the politician in question was going for the lowest common denominator.
PS- Good job writing him Flyboy. Shows that people are paying attention.
Thanks Tim - BTW just for the record, several years later this mayor was murdered by a mobster.
Thanks Tim - BTW just for the record, several years later this mayor was murdered by a mobster.
Sounds like he was from Jersey. 8)
You know, oddly enough, if we hadn't caused the last Tokugawa Shogun to lose face publicly by forcing open Japanese ports, the Meiji Restoration might never have happened and the Japanese Empire might never have modernized. WWII might have found Japan still an isolationist backwater controlled by samurai with swords.
The story is the childlike recollections of a real person...how do you expect a child to see things?
FYI, the author of the Manga , Keiji Nakazawa, that this cartoon is based on was extremely critical of the militarization of Japan. Here is a quote from an interview:
"NAKAZAWA: Well, I spent a lot of time thinking about why it happened. And if you think it through, the answer clearly lies with the militarists and the imperial system. And as a young kid, of course, I'd heard my father criticizing them too."
This was his response to a question about WHY THE BOMB WAS DROPPED...
What bothers me is that people watch a little 5 minute clip of a full length movie and they think they know the whole story...I think its dangerous thinking to lump all people into "fixed" categorizes (or nationality's). Some people watch a little Japanese film clip and they immediately assume its expressing anti-American feelings...The world is a complicated place and experiences are never black and white. From the point of view of a little kid the bombing must have seemed a scary and horrible experience, but the author makes it clear who is to blame.
America may have wielded the hammer that struck the blow but the die was cast by Japan's own military complex...
There was a small, wealthy, maniacal element in Japanese society who had extreme nationalist and imperialist agendas and who seized the opportunity to create a fascist government and a ruthless and sadistic military. The Japanese weren't forced to become Imperial Japan any more than the French and British forced the German people to accept the Nazis. The power vacuum created by losses those countries suffered allowed people like Nazis, Fascists and Imperialists to come to power, but the people bear some responsibility for allowing it to happen and supporting it.This is the view most frequently given by the more conservative branches of Japanese society. They claim that Japan just wanted t be left alone and that the American's + international pressures caused Japan to militarize quickly. After Admiral Perry showed up with his guns and forced japan to open her ports, Japan felt very vulnerable was afraid that they would end up like China (pulled apart by international concerns). Most conservatives feet that this was the bedrock that actually led to the "showdown" between Japan the USA...
There was a small, wealthy, maniacal element in Japanese society who had extreme nationalist and imperialist agendas and who seized the opportunity to create a fascist government and a ruthless and sadistic military. The Japanese weren't forced to become Imperial Japan any more than the French and British forced the German people to accept the Nazis. The power vacuum created by losses those countries suffered allowed people like Nazis, Fascists and Imperialists to come to power, but the people bear some responsibility for allowing it to happen and supporting it.
All that happened in the 1850s. I think by the 1930s things changed just a little....Well, your right of course...no one was making the Japanese people adapt a militarized government (did they really have a choice?). But I would say that the American government supplied the excuse and the context to push the agenda. Think about it for a minute...The United States only cared about its own agenda when they delivered their ultimatum to japan..."Open your ports to us or we will return with more guns and bigger boats". Any Government that was faced with this ultimatum would ultimately choose to strengthen their own military...The message of international diplomacy that was being delivered to Japan at this time was "might makes right".
There is a difference between strengthening ones military (the way we did when extorted by Barbary Coast Pirates under Thomas Jefferson) and putting rape and genocide on the agenda as standard operating procedure. I'd fully support them consolidating their power and building a Navy etc. It's when they decide to start conquering all of Asia and committing unspeakable atrocities that I draw the line.Well, your right of course...no one was making the Japanese people adapt a militarized government (did they really have a choice?). But I would say that the American government supplied the excuse and the context to push the agenda. Think about it for a minute...The United States only cared about its own agenda when they delivered their ultimatum to japan..."Open your ports to us or we will return with more guns and bigger boats". Any Government that was faced with this ultimatum would ultimately choose to strengthen their own military...The message of international diplomacy that was being delivered to Japan at this time was "might makes right".
All that happened in the 1850s. I think by the 1930s things changed just a little....
..... the behavior of the Japanese military during WW2,
True Flyboy. By the 1930's, I think that people's rights became more of an issue for the western world than they did during the 19th century. I mean, Japan was kinda like a 19th Century power in the 20th Century world, trying to catch up with the rest of the world (least politically).
Anybody who wants to read about this kind of thinking should check out Winston Groom's 1942. It was a great book, couldn't put it down.
America pretty much lost its appetite for war and such after WW1... it wasn't so much a concern for human rights (or equal rights) as it was a distaste for warfare and the things that happen during "all out war". Just look at the things that where happening and accepted in the USA (lynchings and burnings) in the 1930's.
Japan never participated in WW1, and they never experienced the horror (and logistics) of "all out trench warfare)...
That was far from being accepted. It was an issue that permeated throughout the south for the most part, and while it was a despicable part of America's past, it wasn't even close to the scale of the slaughter on the European battlefields....Just look at the things that where happening and accepted in the USA (lynchings and burnings) in the 1930's.
Joe already commented on the WWI part, and I might add that warfare between the nations of the Orient have been historically brutal, and in many cases, moreso than European wars.Japan never participated in WW1, and they never experienced the horror (and logistics) of "all out trench warfare)...
That was far from being accepted. It was an issue that permeated throughout the south for the most part, and while it was a despicable part of America's past, it wasn't even close to the scale of the slaughter on the European battlefields.
Joe already commented on the WWI part, and I might add that warfare between the nations of the Orient have been historically brutal, and in many cases, moreso than European wars.