fubar57
General
Silver it is
**** DONE: GB-39 1:48 CR. 42 Falco - Battle for France to Battle of Britain
- Thread starter Crimea_River
- Start date
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Donivanp
Major
Nice work and I do hope it all works out as planed. I've tried my had a biplanes a few times and I need more practice to get them right. I need to finish my Swordfish from a few years back. Looks great Andy.
- Thread starter
- #123
Crimea_River
Marshal
Thanks Don and Geo.
- Thread starter
- #124
Crimea_River
Marshal
For the record and info for those interested, I posted the query about grey vs aluminum undersides at Britmodeller and got the following response:
You are touching a subject that has caused a lot of discussion in the Italian modelling community.. the 3-colour scheme is generally known to have had grey undersides but there is clear evidence that the CR-42s at least initially carried aluminum painted undersides. The reports you mention are part of this body of evidence but there are others.
Some are convinced that Fiat continued using aluminum undersides for longer than they were supposed to do and not only on the CR.42 as the BR.20s seem to have had the same aluminum undersides. Others will deny that aluminum undersides were ever used on the Falco.
Back to proper hard information, it is a fact that aluminum paints from two companies are included in a list of approved paints dated March 1940. A later table (second half of 1940) states that land based camouflaged types must have grey undersides... however in the same document it is stated that seaplanes must have overall grey surfaces and we know that no seaplane had overall light grey surfaces while they generally had aluminum surfaces. It is possible that this relates to the common use of the term "grigio alluminio" (aluminum grey) for the aluminum paint previously used.
The last bit of info is not too clear however there are clearer bits of info: a note sent to SIAI in February 1940 mentions the use of aluminum paint for use on the undersides of military types. Then in Sheet nr. 22/31624 issued by the direction of aircraft production, dated April 1941, it was stated that matt aluminum was to be prohibited from use on exterior surfaces, meaning that it was still in use even if grey was supposed to have replaced this.
Regarding the tables in the Stormo website, they are not official tables but are the result of the hard work of a number of researchers who started publishing their results in the mid '70s. They are extremely useful but all these schemes are classified for ease of interpretation by the modellers, there never was a scheme known as C1 in the '40s. Most information on the use of aluminum after the start of the war was unearthed in more recent years.
Based on the evidence above and discussions with other modellers who studied the matter more than I did, I believe that aluminum undersides were used for longer than previously thought. For a BoB CR.42 I would most likely go with this colour rather than grey.
Decision is final. I'm going with aluminum undersides.
You are touching a subject that has caused a lot of discussion in the Italian modelling community.. the 3-colour scheme is generally known to have had grey undersides but there is clear evidence that the CR-42s at least initially carried aluminum painted undersides. The reports you mention are part of this body of evidence but there are others.
Some are convinced that Fiat continued using aluminum undersides for longer than they were supposed to do and not only on the CR.42 as the BR.20s seem to have had the same aluminum undersides. Others will deny that aluminum undersides were ever used on the Falco.
Back to proper hard information, it is a fact that aluminum paints from two companies are included in a list of approved paints dated March 1940. A later table (second half of 1940) states that land based camouflaged types must have grey undersides... however in the same document it is stated that seaplanes must have overall grey surfaces and we know that no seaplane had overall light grey surfaces while they generally had aluminum surfaces. It is possible that this relates to the common use of the term "grigio alluminio" (aluminum grey) for the aluminum paint previously used.
The last bit of info is not too clear however there are clearer bits of info: a note sent to SIAI in February 1940 mentions the use of aluminum paint for use on the undersides of military types. Then in Sheet nr. 22/31624 issued by the direction of aircraft production, dated April 1941, it was stated that matt aluminum was to be prohibited from use on exterior surfaces, meaning that it was still in use even if grey was supposed to have replaced this.
Regarding the tables in the Stormo website, they are not official tables but are the result of the hard work of a number of researchers who started publishing their results in the mid '70s. They are extremely useful but all these schemes are classified for ease of interpretation by the modellers, there never was a scheme known as C1 in the '40s. Most information on the use of aluminum after the start of the war was unearthed in more recent years.
Based on the evidence above and discussions with other modellers who studied the matter more than I did, I believe that aluminum undersides were used for longer than previously thought. For a BoB CR.42 I would most likely go with this colour rather than grey.
Decision is final. I'm going with aluminum undersides.
fubar57
General
Aluminize that sucker
Donivanp
Major
That said a lot without saying much, I agree Aluminum is the color if that is what you want. Most countries color charts were never a foolproof way. Colors were applied in the field as needed and not always out of the right can of paint.
- Thread starter
- #128
Crimea_River
Marshal
Thanks Don. No field application on these CR42's as far as I know. I think all with the 3 colour scheme are factory finishes.
Actually did this 3 days ago but didn't download the pics til now. The engine was installed, allowing me to add the long fairing for the intake. I added some detail here which is hard to see so I doctored the pic to darken the highlights. Two cowl straps and fasteners were added using stretched sprue and aluminum tape, respectively. All is under a coat of primer at this point. I'm not completely satisfied with the latches and may redo them.
With the engine on, this allowed me to add the undercarriage as the struts tie into the intake fairing. It took quite a while to get these assemblies straight and parallel but as soon as I was happy, I gave the joints a shot of CA to lock them in. The horizontal stabs were also added but I had to thin these a little as there would have been a step at the joint with the fuselage.
I've once again been busy with other things and have not touched the model since Friday. The joints between the gear legs and the wings need a bit of work before I can risk squirting a silver finish in this area and I expect there will be a lot of fiddly surface prep before I get painting.
Thanks for watching.
Actually did this 3 days ago but didn't download the pics til now. The engine was installed, allowing me to add the long fairing for the intake. I added some detail here which is hard to see so I doctored the pic to darken the highlights. Two cowl straps and fasteners were added using stretched sprue and aluminum tape, respectively. All is under a coat of primer at this point. I'm not completely satisfied with the latches and may redo them.
With the engine on, this allowed me to add the undercarriage as the struts tie into the intake fairing. It took quite a while to get these assemblies straight and parallel but as soon as I was happy, I gave the joints a shot of CA to lock them in. The horizontal stabs were also added but I had to thin these a little as there would have been a step at the joint with the fuselage.
I've once again been busy with other things and have not touched the model since Friday. The joints between the gear legs and the wings need a bit of work before I can risk squirting a silver finish in this area and I expect there will be a lot of fiddly surface prep before I get painting.
Thanks for watching.
Donivanp
Major
Looking pretty nice. Lot of work going in there.
Sweet Andy.
fubar57
General
Beauty
- Thread starter
- #133
Crimea_River
Marshal
Thanks guys. Still doing my bathroom reno so that's interfering with my bench time. Tonight it's working on my 1:1 Mosquito.
- Thread starter
- #134
Crimea_River
Marshal
A little bench time tonight so an update is in order.
Aileron and rudder actuators installed. For the cranks, I used the kit parts but I lopped off the thick actuator cables, thinned the parts, then replaced the cables with stretched sprue which are truer to scale. The details for the openings in the fabric came with the Eduard PE set.
The windscreen was dipped in Future and allowed to cure for a few days before I secured it with CA tonight. Also masked it and the cockpit opening in preparation for paint.
The underside has another coat of primer to reveal any blemishes. The silver finish will be unforgiving so I will be a bit more meticulous in cleaning things up. Note how Italeri provided flattened tires - a nice touch.
Thanks again for checking in and for your support.
Aileron and rudder actuators installed. For the cranks, I used the kit parts but I lopped off the thick actuator cables, thinned the parts, then replaced the cables with stretched sprue which are truer to scale. The details for the openings in the fabric came with the Eduard PE set.
The windscreen was dipped in Future and allowed to cure for a few days before I secured it with CA tonight. Also masked it and the cockpit opening in preparation for paint.
The underside has another coat of primer to reveal any blemishes. The silver finish will be unforgiving so I will be a bit more meticulous in cleaning things up. Note how Italeri provided flattened tires - a nice touch.
Thanks again for checking in and for your support.
parsifal
Colonel
Ive read getting those struts at the right angle is difficult. Did you have any issues Andy, coz they looks perfect to me.
- Thread starter
- #138
Crimea_River
Marshal
Thanks guys. Michael I won't know for sure if I have any issues until I try to mate the upper wing to the rest of the model. I need 6 hands to dry fit it but with two it seems reasonable.
N4521U
Colonel
Really nice detail
Like it...!
