Shortround6
Major General
Thank you, another myth goes down in flames 
favourite korean war aircraft
- Thread starter space dodo
- Start date
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Yes, these are all Vietnam-era aircraft, not Korean War . . .
Some 50 Canadair Mk 2s were accepted by the USAF as F-86E-CAN-6s I don't know if any made it to Korea.
And, of course, the almost identical Mk 4 was the RAF's first operational swept wing fighter, at a time when the Venom was the hottest home-produced production jet.
Harry Thyng, CO of the 4th FIW Nov. '51 - Oct '52 - Another two-war Ace.
John Glenn got his three MiGs in 10 days in July 1953, the last one possibly being the last MiG kill of the war.
Peter Gunn
Master Sergeant
Examining the loss rates for the Mustang v. Corsair (i.e. almost exactly the same) I doubt the Thunderbolt would have come off any better in reality.
-My comment about USAF politics ("politics") is primarily based on reports of the relationship between LTG Elwood "Pete" Quesada and the USAF purveyors of strategic bombing at the expense of tactical aircraft and tactical missions. Quesada's relationship with GEN Hoyt Vandenberg during and after WW2 was, from what I've read, particularly contentious. In 1948 Quesada was commander of the Tactical Air Command (TAC) when Vandenberg, as USAF Chief of Staff, pretty much gutted TAC.
-I'm Army so I could be wrong.
FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
Well despite this situation, the document I posted seems to show in 1952 there were several ANG units flying F-47Ns being replaced by P-51Hs. Whether this was part of this tiff, one would never know but there seems to be no documented evidence that the F-47 was snuffed from Korea because of politics. It almost seems like the F-47 was going away regardless.
FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
There was an article written by Rowland, Michael D. In "Airpower History" magazine in Sept. 2003 about this. Mr. Rowland stated the following:
"Why didn't the Air Force use the F-47 in Korea? There are several reasons, including budget limitations and shortages of spare parts, a nearly complete focus by the Air Force on strategic nuclear bombing in the post-World War II years, and the transition to jet-powered aircraft."
He also wrote the following:
"Why didn't the Air Force use the F-47 in Korea? There are several reasons, including budget limitations and shortages of spare parts, a nearly complete focus by the Air Force on strategic nuclear bombing in the post-World War II years, and the transition to jet-powered aircraft."
He also wrote the following:
The F-51's liquid-cooled engine, coolant lines, and radiator were extremely vulnerable to enemy fire. Edgar Schmued, chief designer of the F-51, explained that using the Mustang for ground attack was "absolutely hopeless, because a .30-caliber bullet can rip a hole in the radiator and you fly two more minutes before your engine freezes up." Not surprisingly, more Eighth Air Force Mustangs were lost during strafing attacks than in air combat in World War II. The Mustang suffered the highest combat losses of any Air Force warplane during the Korean War, with 172 F-51s shot down by enemy ground fire. A total of 164 Mustang pilots were either killed or declared missing during ground-attack operations. For World War II Thunderbolt pilots who flew the F-51 in Korea, the F-47 was definitely the better plane for ground attack. The F-51 was derisively nicknamed "Spam Can" and left many pilots in Korea wishing they were flying the Thunderbolt instead. Colonel Bill Myers, who flew Thunderbolts in World War II, admits that every time he took off on a mission in Korea in his Mustang, he would pray, "Please, God, make this a Thunderbolt."
and...
Years of lean budgets and the neglect of tactical air power meant that by 1950 there were simply not enough Thunderbolts and associated spare parts left to support long-term combat operations. During World War II, 15,683 Thunderbolts were produced–more than any other American fighter. Of this total, an estimated one third were destroyed in combat, a third were scrapped after the war, and the remaining third went into storage, served with the Air National Guard, or were sold to foreign governments. Late-model F-47Ds and F-47Ns remained in service with a few active-duty Air Force units until the late 1940s, and the Air National Guard did not retire its last Thunderbolts until 1955. When the Korean War began, there were 1,167 F-47s on hand, but most of these were in storage–only 265 Thunderbolts were active in ANG units and they were all considered second-line aircraft. Additionally, the rapid demobilization after World War II affected the supply system and the availability of spares for the Thunderbolts throughout the post-war years. For instance, the 23rd Fighter Group stationed on Guam in 1947 had pilots who had not accumulated the required night time flying hours because their Jugs lacked functioning flight instruments. The group's historian noted "the installation of these instruments is contemplated in the near future, depending of course, upon Tech Supply." Historian Kenneth P. Werrell was told the F-47 was not used in Korea primarily because of the lack of spare parts.
Full article
sobchak.wordpress.com
and...
Years of lean budgets and the neglect of tactical air power meant that by 1950 there were simply not enough Thunderbolts and associated spare parts left to support long-term combat operations. During World War II, 15,683 Thunderbolts were produced–more than any other American fighter. Of this total, an estimated one third were destroyed in combat, a third were scrapped after the war, and the remaining third went into storage, served with the Air National Guard, or were sold to foreign governments. Late-model F-47Ds and F-47Ns remained in service with a few active-duty Air Force units until the late 1940s, and the Air National Guard did not retire its last Thunderbolts until 1955. When the Korean War began, there were 1,167 F-47s on hand, but most of these were in storage–only 265 Thunderbolts were active in ANG units and they were all considered second-line aircraft. Additionally, the rapid demobilization after World War II affected the supply system and the availability of spares for the Thunderbolts throughout the post-war years. For instance, the 23rd Fighter Group stationed on Guam in 1947 had pilots who had not accumulated the required night time flying hours because their Jugs lacked functioning flight instruments. The group's historian noted "the installation of these instruments is contemplated in the near future, depending of course, upon Tech Supply." Historian Kenneth P. Werrell was told the F-47 was not used in Korea primarily because of the lack of spare parts.
Full article
[Article] Why the U.S. Air Force did not use the F-47 Thunderbolt in the Korean War
Gia’, perche’ il possente e robusto Thunderbolt della Republic non prese parte alla Guerra di Corea nel ruolo di caccia da appoggio tattico? E perche’ l’USAF preferi’ …
sobchak.wordpress.com
Thumpalumpacus
Major
This is the explanation I've read regarding the T-Bolt's absence from Korea, but I have no idea if it's true or simply a "just-so" story.
Aww, the Sabre Dog has a charm of its own
The F-86 sure is a looker, from any angle.
but I'm more of a utilitarian kinda guy, so the likes of the AD or A/B-26 floats my boat. The latter was everywhere after Korea. I also have a soft spot for the Po-2, one of the most unlikely warbirds. In saying all that, the Sea Fury oozes charisma.
SaparotRob
Unter Gemeine Geschwader Murmeltier XIII
I never said it didn't have any charm. It's just not my favorite.
Peter Gunn
Master Sergeant
You're right about her being a looker from any angle, much like her predecessor the Mustang.
Regarding the Sabre Dog, I read a story years back where a group based either in Texas or Louisiana deployed to Maine for exercises and while there, worked out a deal for a huge batch of live Maine lobsters. I forget what they traded for them but when they tried to figure out how to get them back somebody (crew chief most likely) came up with a plan to roll them into foil or perhaps waxed paper and ice and slide them all into the empty rocket tubes of one of the Sabres.
Apparently most of them made it just fine and a batch went to the home town ground crews to A). reward them for helping get the lobsters out and B). keep them quiet.
The story was in the old Sabre Jet Classics magazine which is now closed down.
Regarding the Sabre Dog, I read a story years back where a group based either in Texas or Louisiana deployed to Maine for exercises and while there, worked out a deal for a huge batch of live Maine lobsters. I forget what they traded for them but when they tried to figure out how to get them back somebody (crew chief most likely) came up with a plan to roll them into foil or perhaps waxed paper and ice and slide them all into the empty rocket tubes of one of the Sabres.
Apparently most of them made it just fine and a batch went to the home town ground crews to A). reward them for helping get the lobsters out and B). keep them quiet.
The story was in the old Sabre Jet Classics magazine which is now closed down.
swampyankee
Chief Master Sergeant
- 3,987
- Jun 25, 2013
The best day fighter in the Korean War was certainly the F-86, but I'm fond of the F9F Panther. Dicing it up with MiG-15s would, though, be low on my list of priorities
And is aptly named. It was a dog of a Sabre. One of my instructors in mech school was a retired career AF fighter pilot, who survived a tour in dog Sabres, in between three tours in "real" Sabres. "Overweight and underpowered PoS, full of fancy electronics that didn't work most of the time" was how he but it.Aww, the Sabre Dog has a charm of its own
When he discovered his CO was about to recommend him for a tour as a dog Sabre instructor, he volunteered for a tour as FO on C124s. Anything to get out of the dog.
FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
There was an F9 pilot who shot down three or four MiGs over Soviet territory in one mission. All hushed up until recently. He made it back to the carrier with holes all over his aircraft
Never let anyone cross your nose for free…
