FOUND!!! USS Lexington (CV-2)

Peter Gunn · Mar 8, 2018

From my readings, it was Shinano that took four torpedoes and flooded, sinking at dawn the next day after a night attack by Archerfish in which the captain set the torpedoes to run shallow hoping to get flooding high in the hull of the ship to capsize her.

Taiho was torpedoed and suffered the same fate as Lady Lex when an inexperienced damage control officer turned on the ventilation system to clear the ship of avgas fumes and blew the ship up.

Bad-Karma · Mar 8, 2018

buffnut453 said:
No. Over 200 personnel went down with the Lexington.

XBe02Drvr said:
Sometimes in the inferno you have to save the living and let the dead rest. First thing you learn in Shipboard Firefighting in boot camp.
They send 6 of you with a 1 1/2" hose into a forward compartment aboard USS Neversail over a pool of diesel fuel, close the hatch, and touch it off. If one or more of you goes down, the "survivors" evacuate, the fire is quenched by remote control, and instructors retrieve the "victims". Otherwise you use the hose to sweep the fire into a corner and kill it.
I was there not too long after the Oriskany and Forrestal disasters and the Navy was seriously hard core about damage control. Your shipmates are depending on you.
Cheers,
Wes

Thank you both, and thank you Wes for that insight into your training. Sometimes it's hard to remove the hindsight and lessons we have learned when discussing ww2. I can't imagine the difficult decisions and uncertainty they faced.

vikingBerserker · Mar 8, 2018

The Shinano had a very inexperienced crew in damage control, it really spoke well of the ship it stayed afloat as long as it did.

Barrett · Mar 8, 2018

LOTS of discussion amongst navalists, of course. Two friends who worked with Ballard have intriguing comments. Nobody's seen a large USN ship so thoroughly broken up, a real surprise. One theory is implosion because Lex sank with many compartments intact. As for the Fox-5 Wildcat, John Lundstrom's da man, check his First Team Vol. I. F-5 was sometimes flown by Lt Noel Gayler (normally F-13), and the victory markings (plus one bomb) seem to reflect that record.

tomo pauk · Mar 8, 2018

Barrett said:
LOTS of discussion amongst navalists, of course.
<snip>

Mr. Tillman - what is your take on 'leagalities' with regard to the current ownership of the A/C laying down on the bottom of the sea? How likely is that USN will allow anyone to salvage the A/C without saying 'hold your horses, it is our A/C you have' after the operation is done?
(all while disregarding, for the moment, the technical challenges for the salvage operation itself)

BiffF15 · Mar 8, 2018

tomo pauk said:
Mr. Tillman - what is your take on 'leagalities' with regard to the current ownership of the A/C laying down on the bottom of the sea? How likely is that USN will allow anyone to salvage the A/C without saying 'hold your horses, it is our A/C you have' after the operation is done?
(all while disregarding, for the moment, the technical challenges for the salvage operation itself)

From what i've read the USN does not play well with others regards salvaged aircraft.

Cheers
Biff

XBe02Drvr · Mar 8, 2018

BiffF15 said:
From what i've read the USN does not play well with others regards salvaged aircraft.

Cheers
Biff

"We bought it, we paid for it, and it's OURS til hell freezes over! If you want to recover it for us, feel free, but understand it's our property and you are liable for any damage occurring in the process."
Ayup, doesn't sound like good kindergarten ettiquete to me.
Cheers,
Wes

XBe02Drvr · Mar 8, 2018

Bad-Karma said:
Thank you both, and thank you Wes for that insight into your training. Sometimes it's hard to remove the hindsight and lessons we have learned when discussing ww2. I can't imagine the difficult decisions and uncertainty they faced.

Let's hear it for high velocity fog, light water, foam, and purple K powder, all firefighting staples of my time in the Nav that had their roots in WWII.
Cheers,
Wes

ArmouredSprue · Mar 8, 2018

This is amazing indeed

BiffF15 · Mar 8, 2018

XBe02Drvr said:
"We bought it, we paid for it, and it's OURS til hell freezes over! If you want to recover it for us, feel free, but understand it's our property and you are liable for any damage occurring in the process."
Ayup, doesn't sound like good kindergarten ettiquete to me.
Cheers,
Wes

Actually the taxpayers laid down the cash...

Cheers,
Biff

buffnut453 · Mar 8, 2018

BiffF15 said:
Actually the taxpayers laid down the cash...

Cheers,
Biff

Great. So can I have my quarter rivet as back-pay?

vikingBerserker · Mar 8, 2018

Dibs on 1/4 of rivet # 54,677!!!

buffnut453 · Mar 8, 2018

Awww, I wanted that one!!!!

Shortround6 · Mar 8, 2018

XBe02Drvr said:
Let's hear it for high velocity fog, light water, foam, and purple K powder, all firefighting staples of my time in the Nav that had their roots in WWII.
Cheers,
Wes

Many of which were mis-applied for years in land based structural fire fighting
Most timber frame (or even brick) structures being much less air tight than steel ships.

Peter Gunn · Mar 9, 2018

buffnut453 said:
Awww, I wanted that one!!!!

BOYS!!! No bickering! I'm from the government and I'm here to help.

First we'll need to form a committee to study the effects of removing 1/4 rivet # 54,677 and the possible impact it will have on rivets # 54,676 and 54,678 with a sub committee to study the effects on the other 3/4 of rivet 54,677. We'll also have to elect someone to chair a panel to study how rivets 55,668, 55,669 and 66,275 might be impacted along with panel # 7435.

And that's just for starters...

buffnut453 · Mar 9, 2018

Peter Gunn said:
BOYS!!! No bickering! I'm from the government and I'm here to help.

First we'll need to form a committee to study the effects of removing 1/4 rivet # 54,677 and the possible impact it will have on rivets # 54,676 and 54,678 with a sub committee to study the effects on the other 3/4 of rivet 54,677. We'll also have to elect someone to chair a panel to study how rivets 55,668, 55,669 and 66,275 might be impacted along with panel # 7435.

And that's just for starters...

I've decided I'm against the arbitrary selection of rivets. All rivets should be treated the same. Equal rights for metal fasteners!!!

XBe02Drvr · Mar 9, 2018

buffnut453 said:
I've decided I'm against the arbitrary selection of rivets. All rivets should be treated the same. Equal rights for metal fasteners!!!

Hey don't leave out fabric surfaces, guys! So well preserved after all these years, they deserve equal consideration. End discrimination!

Peter Gunn · Mar 9, 2018

XBe02Drvr said:
Hey don't leave out fabric surfaces, guys! So well preserved after all these years, they deserve equal consideration. End discrimination!

Wes, now you're talking about a full scale Senate investigation headed by a special counsel appointed by the President as to why fabric surfaces have been excluded from the discussion.

vikingBerserker · Mar 9, 2018

#FabricsLivesMater

XBe02Drvr · Mar 9, 2018

Yes, we seem to have a gender bias regarding the superiority of hard over soft. Equal opportunity for all! Breach the plexiglass ceiling!

FOUND!!! USS Lexington (CV-2)

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