Gladiators of World War II : Waffen SS

[Amsel]

The activities of 2nd SS are not unusual or atypical of SS activities, in fact they represented the most "successful" implementation of standard SS policy. To try and pass it off as some sort of "one off" or something unusual is grotesque and offensive to the thousands of dead allied, Soviet French and other allied/occupied countries that suffered at the hands of SS attrocities. PLease do not try and pass that off as some sort of unusual behaviour. It was not.

I have to disagree. Most claims of WSS brutality have been unproven and according to some Jewish organizations, the Allgemine SS's crimes are often mistakenly passed onto the WSS.

 

[parsifal]

I have to disagree. Most claims of WSS brutality have been unproven and according to some Jewish organizations, the Allgemine SS's crimes are often mistakenly passed onto the WSS.

They are mostly unproven, because in many cases there were no survivors to their brutality. Thats why its sufficient to prove the illegality of the orders to establish evidence of the brutality.

Sorry, but the SS were not soldiers in my book. They were barbariansm because the evidence of misbehaviour is overwhelming.

Oh, and by the way, Jewish organizations of any repute do not differentiate between the two SS groups.

 

[Amsel]

You don't have to apologize for feeling that way. It is perfectly natural to do so. I on the other hand have no problem with talking about the SS as it is perfectly legal to do so in my country and I find WWII a quite interesting subject. You could not talk about many of the famous engagements without mentioning the WSS.

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Sorry, but the SS were not soldiers in my book. They were barbariansm because the evidence of misbehaviour is overwhelming.

I do not think that you can throw all into one pot. I agree that most atrocities were committed by the SS, however if you yourself did not partake in the crimes then that does not make you a barbarian.

I have 2 family members who served in the Waffen SS (which units, I am not sure. The one who is still alive, I will have to ask), as far as I know they themselves never took part in any crimes. They are not barbarians to me, and to call them that is very unfair in my opinion.

 

[mkloby]

Oh, and by the way, Jewish organizations of any repute do not differentiate between the two SS groups.

That is a broad statement to make for such groups, don't you think? Have you had many close relationships with Jewish folks?

 

[imalko]

To my knowlege Waffen SS were established as fighting units (as their name suggest) of the "larger SS". Correct me if I'm wrong but Allgemeine SS was including all branches of this complex organisation and these were Waffen SS, Totenkopfverbande, Geheime Statspolizei (Gestapo), Reichsiherheitshauptampt (RSHA), SD (Sicherheitsdienst) etc. As someone said all from university profesors to concentration camp guards.

I wouldn't place Waffen SS to the same basket as lets say Totenkopfverbande. The Waffen SS were elite fighting units and they fought well participating in almost every major battle in later part of the war. I'm sure that crimes were comitted by some units or members of the Waffen SS since even within Waffen SS itself there were great differences between some units (for example Das Reich or LSAH on the one side and Skenderbeg or Handzar divisions on the other). However, this doesn't change the fact that these formations were primarily envisioned, formed and deployed in battle as fighting units.

 

[imalko]

Was watching the movie "English patient" the other day and there was one scene when William Deffoe's character is being interrogated by high ranking SS officer. He is threatened that his fingers will be cut off if he doesn't cooperate. Few Wehrmacht soldiers present make remarks about Geneva convention but do not dare to oppose the SS officer, so Deffoe's character looses few of his fingers in the process. Entire scene takes place in North Africa in 1942 or 1943.

My question is the fallowing - were there any members of the Waffen SS or any other branch of SS in any form or number historically involved in North African campaign or was this just some artistic liberty made by the filmmakers? I myself have never heard or read about any SS involvement in North Africa.

 

[B-17engineer]

Sorry, but the SS were not soldiers in my book. They were barbariansm because the evidence of misbehaviour is overwhelming.

I don't think it's fair to call ALL of them barbarians, or even any barbarians for that matter. The SS distinguished themselves in combat, in a few incidents they became notorious for there atrocities. Plus, the majority of members in the Waffen SS were soldiers NOT criminals. Were there criminals? Yes.

I just don't think that is a fair generalization.

 

[jamierd]

as far as i have been able in a short look at my small colection of SS books there is no mention of any SStroops having served in North Africa the closest i can see were Leibstandarte and Das Reich who were insrumental in the succes of the whirlwind Balkan campaign