Mosquitoes and Cookies

Discussion in 'Aviation' started by pampa14, Aug 9, 2015.

  1. pampa14

    pampa14 Active Member

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    Hi everyone.

    The need has promoted an unlikely combination during WW2, a small plane and a heavyweight bomb. We are talking of dH Mosquito and blockbuster bombs used by the Royal Air Force. The link below provides an interesting collection of photos, some of which I had never seen before, this unusual combination. It is worth visiting and I hope you enjoy.


    Aviação em Floripa: Mosquitos e as bombas de 4.000 libras


    Best Regards.
     
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  2. fastmongrel

    fastmongrel Well-Known Member

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    Interesting that the third picture of a Mossie with 2 stage Merlins has the bomb aimers flat vision panel blanked out by a censor. I wonder what bomb sight they were using in the high altitude Mossies with 2 stage Merlins I believe the standard Bomber Command MkXIV (or Sperry T1) sight didnt work too well above 25,000ft and 250mph. What were the drop heights and speeds.
     
  3. GregP

    GregP Well-Known Member

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    #3 GregP, Aug 9, 2015
    Last edited: Aug 9, 2015
    First, nice pics. Thanks.

    The bomber version of the Mosquito routinely carried 4,000 pounds of bombs. So I'm not too sure what is so unusual about carrying one 4,000 pound bomb?

    If it fits and can be attached to a bomb release(s), the Mossie would carry it easily. So would any bombed taht could haul 4,000 pounds of bombs ... if it fit in the bomb bay.
     
  4. fastmongrel

    fastmongrel Well-Known Member

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    What version routinely carried 4,000 pounds of bombs before the bulged bomb bay came into service. As far as I can tell the heaviest bomb load routinely carried was 4 x 500 pounders.
     
  5. parsifal

    parsifal Well-Known Member

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    Great aircraft. Thanks for posting the images
     
  6. fubar57

    fubar57 Well-Known Member

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    The first bomber version of the Mosquito to carry 4000lbs. was a B Mk IV , with the bombay conversions starting in '43


    Geo
     
  7. pbehn

    pbehn Well-Known Member

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    I noticed that I just wondered what sort of super duper high tech bomb sight was needed to drop a cookie. Most were nuisance raids to blow roofs off and depress or keep awake the population.
     
  8. pbehn

    pbehn Well-Known Member

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    #8 pbehn, Aug 9, 2015
    Last edited: Aug 9, 2015
    The bombay conversions only served in India?

    Takes coat in hand, walks in a determined fashion towards the door.
     
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  9. fastmongrel

    fastmongrel Well-Known Member

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    Still need some sort of computing sight at high altitudes to allow for wind and speed or you aim for Reichstag in Berlin and hit the Havel and kill some fish.
     
  10. fastmongrel

    fastmongrel Well-Known Member

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    Were the Bombay conversions a mixed success
     
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  11. fubar57

    fubar57 Well-Known Member

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    Dang frikken spel chek.



    Leo
     
  12. GregP

    GregP Well-Known Member

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    The Mosquito in all it's bomber versions could haul 4,000 pounds if you could get it into the bomb bay. Getting it there was your problem. I meant the 4,000 pound cookie might be remarkable in itself, but the Mosquito hauling really isn't.
     
  13. Gnomey

    Gnomey World Travelling Doctor
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    Good stuff!
     
  14. wuzak

    wuzak Well-Known Member

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    Yes, the Mosquito regularly hauled 4,000lb bomb loads from 1944. This was almost always with the single 4,000lb HC "cookie". The other occasions where they hauled 4,000lb of bombs was when they carried a single 4,000lb MC general purpose bomb.


    Fitting was the problem.

    The 4,000lb bombs required the bulged bomb bay.

    If the RAF used a 2,000lb MC/GP bomb (which they didn't) only one would fit in the bomb bay.

    Two 1,000lb MC bombs (or the similar 1,000lb TI target indicators) could be carried in the modified bomb bay.

    The 1,000lb MC bomb was larger in diameter than the earlier 1,000lb GP bomb. The latter was trialled in a B.IV with standard bomb bay - one 1,000lb GP in the front, and a pair of 500lb MC bombs at the rear. Even that required modification of the door stiffeners to give clearance.

    A trial installation was made of a modified Wellington bomb beam to a Mosquito with a bulged bomb bay. This would have enabled the fitting of 8 x 500lb bombs, except that with such a load the CoG would have been outside the aircraft's limits. It would have carried 8 x 250lb comfortably, and possibly 4 x 500lb and 4 x 250lb.

    And then there was the Avro bomb carrier that was supposed to be able to carry 6 x 500lb bombs in the Mosquito. I have yet to find confirmation of its existence.

    Anyway, more on the Mosquito's bomb bay arrangements:
    http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/av...6-bomb-carrier-mosquito-41416.html?highlight=
     
  15. wuzak

    wuzak Well-Known Member

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    The Maximum bomb load for a B.XVI was 5,000lbs - 1 x 4,000lb + 2 x 500lb (on wing stations).

    Without the bulged bomb bay the maximum was 3,000lb, except earlier bombers without the wing stations (introduced with the strengthened wing when the FB.VI was being developed).
     
  16. wuzak

    wuzak Well-Known Member

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  17. Shortround6

    Shortround6 Well-Known Member

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    The Mosquito bomb bay was "originally designed" to hold four 250lb GP bombs (10.2in dia) with one pair behind the other pair. The 500lb GP bomb was only about 2.7 in larger in diameter (12.9in dia) but was about 14 in longer overall. Fitting four 500lb GP bombs in the Mosquito required shortening the bomb tails by about 15 inches. 1000lb GP bombs were 16.15in diameter and 1000lb MC bombs were 17.75 in diameter not to mention longer.

    The 4000lb HC bomb was 30 in in diameter and 110 in long.
     
  18. stona

    stona Well-Known Member

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    The Mk XIV bomb sight was standard on Mosquitos at the time being discussed. It was first trialled on MK286 in early 1942.

    I'm not sure whether earlier versions used the Mk IX or ABS sight, but whatever they used, in trials they were claiming a 400 yard radial error from 26,000 ft which they hoped to reduce to as little as 150 yards with the introduction of the Mk XIV.

    Cheers

    Steve
     
  19. stona

    stona Well-Known Member

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    Initially 500lb bombs with telescopic fins were developed. The fins automatically extended when the bomb was dropped. Later the designer (CT Wilkins) developed a tail with shorter vanes and test drops were carried out from W4057 which showed that the ballistics of the bomb were not impaired by the shorter fins. This did not initially go down very well at the A.A.E.E. but eventually the shorter finned 500 lb bomb was adopted as standard.

    It wasn't until April 1943 that the idea of carrying a 4000 lb bomb was discussed. A relatively simple system was designed, the bomb being hung from a single hook on a bridge of two spruce beams fixed to the front and rear wing spars. The bulged bomb bay doors and small fairing aft are the other visible features. By October 1943 testing was complete and the initial decision to convert all Mk.IVs and Mk IXs in service taken. All Mk IXs and Mk XVIs in production would also be 4000 lb capable, the modifications being introduced on the production lines from the end of October. This never happened as stability problems became an issue. The first two modified aircraft didn't reach 692 Squadron until February 1944.

    Cheers

    Steve
     
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  20. pbehn

    pbehn Well-Known Member

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    #20 pbehn, Aug 10, 2015
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2015
    I was wondering if it was a policy to mask all mosquito front transparencies to disguise the fact that many bombs were dropped by guidance other than the bomb sight, like oboe for example.
     
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