Cool thanks. Hey are you recieving new post alerts. I have not recieved any, but people are posting to what I have posted.
P-61 vs. He-219
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Erich
the old Sage
no I am not, just trying to stay on the net without getting booted off..........weird day
Yeah I am not longer getting new post alerts in my email and it is getting real slow again.
Erich
the old Sage
same here.......
It has died on me twice now, and I am still not recieving alerts.
Interesting stuff Erich, of the listed I would go for the HE-219 and would agree with your comment Alder about the JU-88.
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- #27
book1182
Airman
I would got with the HE-219. We know more about it's use as a night fighter than the P-61. I think the P-61 proved useful in the night intruder role since it was so large but I think the He-219 proved itself as a bomber destory.
lesofprimus
Brigadier General
There was, but it seems there were not enough units to put together anything operational...
KraziKanuK
Banned
- 792
- Jan 26, 2005
lesofprimus said:
There was ONE prototype unit constructed, the V10/M10. The French completed a 2cd a/c post war (M17). This a/c differed from the M10 which was to adapted from the trainer a/c with a small canopy, like the small canopy as on the Beaufighter, closer to the pilot.
There was several 2-seaters built as trainers.
Erich
the old Sage
in fact the only nf was one built of supplemental parts in a hanger. Also there were NO operational Do 335 units, Several took off on pre-maiden flights as test beds circling the airfields and then at wars end the craft were set haphazordly amongst the other a/c typlfying an operational staffel with several two seaters sitting lonely as aerail photos present themselves. A very strange and oversized craft it would of served inconsequential in the coming months had it been operational
the lancaster kicks ass
Major General
- 19,937
- Dec 20, 2003
i think she's a fascinating plane though, i would've loved to have seen her see allot of service and development..........
Kryten
Senior Airman
I seem to recall reading how the 219's were not regarded well by the Nachtjager who preffered the JU88?
davebender
1st Lieutenant
I suspect the Jumo 222 powered He-219B was intended to be the main production version. When that engine program was cancelled it wrecked the He-219s chances to mature into a world class night fighter aircraft.
AdlerIstGelandet,
I don't think the He 219 reached anywhere its potential as it was underpowered and never supported politically by Milch. Milch's pet project was the Ta 154, a fast aircraft but simply too late.
1 The only engine ever used was the DB603A of 1750hp or the high altitude optimised DB603AA.
2 The DB603G of 1900hp was never produced (apparently because it used C3 fuel) though some may have been used in prototypes.
3 The 1800hp DB603E which still used B4 but combined the low altitude power of the DB603A with the high altitude power of the DB603AA may have been delivered in small numbers.
4 The DB603L, a C3 two stage supercharger version was surely never used, the DB603LA, the B4 version only seems to have made it into the Ta 152C and one Do 335 prototype.
The powerfull 2250hp DB603EM which used C3 and MW50 was abandoned due to the use of C3.
Basically with the 1750hp DB603A engine it was too slow to catch a Mosquito and to underpowered to upgrade with the kind of defensive armament needed for daylight opperations.
I don't think the He 219 reached anywhere its potential as it was underpowered and never supported politically by Milch. Milch's pet project was the Ta 154, a fast aircraft but simply too late.
1 The only engine ever used was the DB603A of 1750hp or the high altitude optimised DB603AA.
2 The DB603G of 1900hp was never produced (apparently because it used C3 fuel) though some may have been used in prototypes.
3 The 1800hp DB603E which still used B4 but combined the low altitude power of the DB603A with the high altitude power of the DB603AA may have been delivered in small numbers.
4 The DB603L, a C3 two stage supercharger version was surely never used, the DB603LA, the B4 version only seems to have made it into the Ta 152C and one Do 335 prototype.
The powerfull 2250hp DB603EM which used C3 and MW50 was abandoned due to the use of C3.
Basically with the 1750hp DB603A engine it was too slow to catch a Mosquito and to underpowered to upgrade with the kind of defensive armament needed for daylight opperations.
wuzak
Captain
The thing that struck me about the He219 was that it was larger than a Mosquito, and heavier empty than the Mossie's max takeoff weight. And with engines only a small amount more powerful was expected to catch the Mossie.
The 1944 production He 219 A-2 used the DB 603AA engine, Heinkel planned a lightened A-6 with reduced armament and armor removed to hunt down Mosquitos but this version was dropped (probably because of the Me 262 units set up for this task).
The DB 603E was to be used in the He 219 A-7 of which 200+ were to be produced from 12/44 on.
The He 219 may have been disliked by some crew as it had no defensive armament and had to rely on speed to avoid been shot down.
The DB 603E was to be used in the He 219 A-7 of which 200+ were to be produced from 12/44 on.
The He 219 may have been disliked by some crew as it had no defensive armament and had to rely on speed to avoid been shot down.
It would seem that the He 219 preceded the P-61 into combat by almost 1 year (early 43 as opposed to early 44) so a direct comparison is not fair. The He 219A-0 A-2 night fighter variants seem to have been faster than the 366mph P-61 but its hard to get definitive data as to what speeds were with radar and gun packs. The DB603E engined He 219A-7 was, in theory faster and had the German economy not been so exhausted versions with better engines likely could have entered production in 1944 (eg DB603E, DB603EM or LA). I have the impression that the decision to make German engines multifuel to accomodate C3 fuel shorages delayed these powerfull engines.
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Shortround6
Major General
The Timing is closer to 7-8 months. The Germans often used prototype or pre production aircraft in combat trails or operations/testing. First use of the HE 219 was in June of 43. The Americans shipped the first squadron of P-61s ( by ship) to Europe in Feb of 1944 after completing training. The 348th night fighter squadron, the first to receive P-61s was a training unit and stayed in the US so the unit that deployed to Europe in Feb was the 2nd squadron to receive P-61s.
Sagittario64
Airman 1st Class
in what manner of comparison is this? the he.219 vs the p-61 in combat? or which performed its role better? in both cases, imho, the two are equally matched if properly flown.
