Oh yeah know that feeling, just finished my Hunter and that had nearly 100 decals !
Phantom FG.1 and FGR.2 Differences
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Airframes
Benevolens Magister
Heck! That's only a few of the more obvious stencils !
On that sheet I mentioned, which I now remember was from 'Maintrack Models', the stencils alone, not counting such things as the 'Rescue' arrows, ejection seat triangles, or stencils for weapons pylons, etc etc, covered a sheet probably twice that size !
If I ever do get another British Phantom kit, I will not be using all the stencils I have on the remaining sheet, and that's for sure - it took forever just to do one wing !!
On that sheet I mentioned, which I now remember was from 'Maintrack Models', the stencils alone, not counting such things as the 'Rescue' arrows, ejection seat triangles, or stencils for weapons pylons, etc etc, covered a sheet probably twice that size !
If I ever do get another British Phantom kit, I will not be using all the stencils I have on the remaining sheet, and that's for sure - it took forever just to do one wing !!
Yeah be lucky if I use 25% of them, just enough to look like I put a few on !
- Thread starter
- #24
Catch22
Major
I think a lot of them probably got obliterated as well, but I also have never been up close to the real thing either.
Airframes
Benevolens Magister
On the real aircraft, they're sprayed on, obviously through a stencil, in a thin black or white covering, which is not as prominent as the printed decals for kits. Therefore, they don't stand out as much as the kit decals. There are some on the real aircraft which are either decals or more densely painted, which do show up more, such as the wording around rescue or emergency points etc., and some pylon markings.
It would be better if the black decals were printed in a dark grey, and the white in a light grey - they's not show as much, and would look more realistic.
It would be better if the black decals were printed in a dark grey, and the white in a light grey - they's not show as much, and would look more realistic.
fubar57
General
Cory, if you would like, PM your email and I'll fire off everything I can find on both versions, just in case you change your mind at a later date.
Geo
Geo
fubar57
General
That's all I could find Cory. I do have books with cockpit and other detail photos but most of that can probably be found on the net. I don't know the difference between the two versions but here is the FGR.2 cockpit....RAF F-4 FGR.2 Walk Around
Geo
Geo
- Thread starter
- #28
Catch22
Major
Thanks Geo, the book you sent me was great, and that link is fantastic too as I lacked photos for the cockpit.
Crimea_River
Marshal
Cory, I checked out two of the 4 stores today. Just one 1/48 scale Phantom - a Revell F-4C/D for 35 bucks. I plan to swing by the one in High River on my way back from Nanton Saturday but I think their stock was largely lost in the flood.
- Thread starter
- #30
Catch22
Major
Thanks for looking Andy, I appreciate it. Probably better off not adding to the stash! 
A good chunk of their figure stock was mine at one point I'd imagine! We donated a ton of 1:35 scale troops and I think a number of armor kits as well that we knew we'd never build.
A good chunk of their figure stock was mine at one point I'd imagine! We donated a ton of 1:35 scale troops and I think a number of armor kits as well that we knew we'd never build.
Crimea_River
Marshal
So is it the Hasegawa kit you're after?
- Thread starter
- #32
Catch22
Major
Yes, or the Revell reboxing of it.
Crimea_River
Marshal
So the one I pictured is not the re-box? How would I know?
- Thread starter
- #34
Catch22
Major
Oh, sorry Andy, I have no idea if that particular one is a rebox, but I'm looking specifically for a British Phantom, FG.1 or FGR.2. The nose cone is different, and it has different engines (though I doubt you'll be able to tell from the box). It will just say FG.1 or FGR.2 on it.
Airframes
Benevolens Magister
The Revell re-boxing shows an overall grey FGR2 in 56 Sqn markings, with a shark mouth from memory, with the aircraft moving from left to right. I'll try to find a pic.
In the late 1970's, Revell also released a 'RAF Phantom' kit, but this was just a standard F4-D kit, with parts for the jet nozzles and some RAF specific bits, plus decals. Apart from being nothing like a FG1 or FGR2, it was an early, rather basic kit. The box art was a photo of the model, in green/grey camouflage, from 3/4 underside, the aircraft 'in a climb' moving from right to left. Avoid this kit !
In the late 1970's, Revell also released a 'RAF Phantom' kit, but this was just a standard F4-D kit, with parts for the jet nozzles and some RAF specific bits, plus decals. Apart from being nothing like a FG1 or FGR2, it was an early, rather basic kit. The box art was a photo of the model, in green/grey camouflage, from 3/4 underside, the aircraft 'in a climb' moving from right to left. Avoid this kit !
- Thread starter
- #36
Catch22
Major
This it Terry?
Airframes
Benevolens Magister
That's the one Cory. On e-bay, they normally go for around £25 to £30, compared to £50 to £60 for the Hasegawa boxings. From memory, the original retail price was £20, and I'm hoping Revell re-release it soon.
Just a brief description of further differences between the FG1/FG2 and other Phantoms, additional to the small details already mentioned.
The RR Spey engines were bigger and deeper than the J-79s normally used, which meant that the entire aft fuselage was wider, with wider intakes. The rear section of the underside had a pronounced droop towards the rear, with the jet nozzles being very much larger in diameter, and an entirely different shape to those various styles seen on the J-79.
There were auxiliary intake doors on the top and bottom of the fuselage, very prominent, navigation and position lights were different, the radome shape was slightly different, lacking the 'bullet' beneath as on the 'C' etc, landing gear main wheels were larger and an entirely different pattern, and the fuel dump was different. The MB ejector seats were also the standard British type, with full harnesses, as opposed to the US torso harness type.
Smaller details abound and, of course, internally, including the cockpits, everything was completely different. Various additions were made, including periscopes for the 'back seater', but these were specific to certain aircraft within certain squadrons.
The 'British' Phantoms (part built in the UK) also had glide slope antenna on either side of the fin, and a different shape to the the small nose intakes, as well as the extra-extensible nose leg on the FG.1 with extra torque link. At roughly mid service point, the RWR/ECM pod was added to the top of the fin.
The in flight refuelling was done via a probe which folded into the fuselage on the starboard side, unlike the receptacle on the top of the fuselage on other versions.
Correct designations within the 'Phantom family' are F4-K, built for the Royal Navy as the FG1, which also had the slotted tail planes, for extra control at low angles of attack, and the F4-M, built for the RAF as the FGR2, which was equipped for the Fighter, Ground attack and Recce role.
Put a model of a FG1/FGR2 alongside say, a model of a F4-J, and the shape and differences are immediately obvious. I once converted a 'J' or 'D' (can't remember which) to a FGR2 and it was a big job !!
The other RAF Phantom, the F4-J(UK) was virtually 'stock' ex- US Navy, even down to the crews having to wear US flight gear, and were painted overall in an 'equivalent colour' of 'Flint Grey', similar to the Barley Grey of the RAF version, but with a distinct blue tinge. These served only with 74 'Tiger' Squadron as a temporary 'fill in'.
Just a brief description of further differences between the FG1/FG2 and other Phantoms, additional to the small details already mentioned.
The RR Spey engines were bigger and deeper than the J-79s normally used, which meant that the entire aft fuselage was wider, with wider intakes. The rear section of the underside had a pronounced droop towards the rear, with the jet nozzles being very much larger in diameter, and an entirely different shape to those various styles seen on the J-79.
There were auxiliary intake doors on the top and bottom of the fuselage, very prominent, navigation and position lights were different, the radome shape was slightly different, lacking the 'bullet' beneath as on the 'C' etc, landing gear main wheels were larger and an entirely different pattern, and the fuel dump was different. The MB ejector seats were also the standard British type, with full harnesses, as opposed to the US torso harness type.
Smaller details abound and, of course, internally, including the cockpits, everything was completely different. Various additions were made, including periscopes for the 'back seater', but these were specific to certain aircraft within certain squadrons.
The 'British' Phantoms (part built in the UK) also had glide slope antenna on either side of the fin, and a different shape to the the small nose intakes, as well as the extra-extensible nose leg on the FG.1 with extra torque link. At roughly mid service point, the RWR/ECM pod was added to the top of the fin.
The in flight refuelling was done via a probe which folded into the fuselage on the starboard side, unlike the receptacle on the top of the fuselage on other versions.
Correct designations within the 'Phantom family' are F4-K, built for the Royal Navy as the FG1, which also had the slotted tail planes, for extra control at low angles of attack, and the F4-M, built for the RAF as the FGR2, which was equipped for the Fighter, Ground attack and Recce role.
Put a model of a FG1/FGR2 alongside say, a model of a F4-J, and the shape and differences are immediately obvious. I once converted a 'J' or 'D' (can't remember which) to a FGR2 and it was a big job !!
The other RAF Phantom, the F4-J(UK) was virtually 'stock' ex- US Navy, even down to the crews having to wear US flight gear, and were painted overall in an 'equivalent colour' of 'Flint Grey', similar to the Barley Grey of the RAF version, but with a distinct blue tinge. These served only with 74 'Tiger' Squadron as a temporary 'fill in'.
- Thread starter
- #38
Catch22
Major
More fantastic info Terry, thanks!
Airframes
Benevolens Magister
You're welcome Cory.
Just remembered, I did that conversion job twice - one in 1/48th scale, and one in 1/32nd scale !
I must have been mad !
Just remembered, I did that conversion job twice - one in 1/48th scale, and one in 1/32nd scale !
I must have been mad !
- Thread starter
- #40
Catch22
Major
Yes, you must have been! Even just looking at the sprues and the USMC F-4 I built a few years ago I can see they're quite different. Wouldn't want to tackle that rear fuselage.
