Thoughts on the Nakajima Ki-84 and Kawasaki Ki-100

GregP · Feb 14, 2022

Yes, it has gear-down pins. Since it is a civil warbird, there is no excess weight. The guns have fake barrels and there is no ammunition in it. The rear fuselage is empty except they still have the Oxygen bottles (small ones ... light) in the rear cockpit. The modern radio is WAY lighter than a wartime unit (if it was ever so-equipped). So, this A6M5 Model 52 is considerably lighter than a wartime combat-ready unit. I don't know the exact empty weight, but it is light.

Same with the other warbirds. The P-51A is VERY light. A stock P-51A is about 6,450 pounds. The Planes of Fame P-51A is about 5,000 pounds empty. It makes that particular aircraft quite a good performer. Last time they herded it around the Reno unlimited course, it turned a lap at 365 mph! On a stock, non-tuned-up Allison. That's stock P-51D territory.

VA5124 · Feb 17, 2022

GregP said:
The Zero was being shipped to Japan for display at the site of the first Japanese flight. It is on a hill, sort of like Kittyhawk in the U.S.A.. There is an aviation museum there, but no runway, so they shipped it in, reassembled it, started the aircraft every day for about 3 - 4 weeks for the crowds, and let old Japanese WWII Veterans sit in the cockpit. Many cried.

That was the only trip to Japan so far when it didn't fly, but the people got to get a LOT closer.

Of course, they NOW have a flyable Zero of their own in Japan, and that is just great.

Here is an in-cockpit flight at one of the living history event at the Planes of Fame. The pilot is John Maloney.

Dont know much about the KI series fighters but i do have a soft spot for the zero something about a fast piece of paper that has 20mms and turns well just sounds great

BiffF15 · Feb 17, 2022

VA5124 said:
Dont know much about the KI series fighters but i do have a soft spot for the zero something about a fast piece of paper that has 20mms and turns well just sounds great

One must be careful around those pesky Zero's, I saw one almost flame a Tomcat once... In a movie... The Final Countdown...

VA5124 · Feb 17, 2022

BiffF15 said:
One must be careful around those pesky Zero's, I saw one almost flame a Tomcat once... In a movie... The Final Countdown...

Not funny

Snautzer01 · Feb 17, 2022

VA5124 said:
Not funny

It is.

VA5124 · Feb 17, 2022

Snautzer01 said:
It is.

As a cat fan its not

nuuumannn · Feb 17, 2022

BiffF15 said:
I saw one almost flame a Tomcat once...

You can't have! Zeroes were made of rice paper and spontaneously exploded as soon as you looked at them with a frown! Fake news, maaan!

VA5124 said:
Not funny

Given that it comes from an actual fighter pilot, it's hilarious!

BiffF15 · Feb 17, 2022

VA5124 said:
As a cat fan its not

Be careful letting emotions rule versus logic.

Logic: The Zero never gunned or even took a snap shot on a Tomcat in real life.

Emotion: In a movie once, something happened which wasn't real.

One of those two comments are factual and important, the other is not factual nor important.

In real life if you allowed yourself to be ruled by emotions, you will get played for various reasons, all to your detriment.

And no, I wasn't playing you.

Cheers,
Biff

VA5124 · Feb 17, 2022

nuuumannn said:
You can't have! Zeroes were made of rice paper and spontaneously exploded as soon as you looked at them with a frown! Fake news, maaan!

Given that it comes from an actual fighter pilot, it's hilarious!

The paper thing was a refence to them having no armor

GregP · Feb 17, 2022

I thought one of the Tomcats in Final Countdown stalled at low altitude and almost got wet when I saw the movie. At least. it LOOKED like he departed controlled flight at low altitude. I heard he pulled out only a few feet (less than 50 feet) over the ocean on full A.B. .

nuuumannn · Feb 17, 2022

GregP said:
I thought one of the Tomcats in Final Countdown stalled at low altitude and almost got wet when I saw the movie. At least. it LOOKED like he departed controlled flight at low altitude. I heard he pulled out only a few feet (less than 50 feet) over the ocean on full A.B.

Overheard from the Ready Room... "See, that's what happens when you tangle with a Zero! How many times do we have to learn this! Never dogfight a Zero!"

BlackSheep · Feb 18, 2022

BiffF15 said:
One must be careful around those pesky Zero's, I saw one almost flame a Tomcat once... In a movie... The Final Countdown...

Zeros were nothing if not robust. I served as an observer under Captain Robert Conrad in a couple of seasons of Corsairs vs Zeros and I'd be a liar if I didn't tell you that no matter the battle damage and horrific crashes into the Pacific, those clever Japanese had their planes repaired in time for the next week's mission.

Like content on the internet, if it came from Hollywood, it must be true.

GregP · Feb 18, 2022

Of course, THOSE Zeroes were really AT-6s converted to single seat configuration ... and so MUST have been easier to fix, since parts were available.

BlackSheep · Feb 18, 2022

VA5124 said:
Dont know much about the KI series fighters but i do have a soft spot for the zero something about a fast piece of paper that has 20mms and turns well just sounds great

"Piece of paper"? I assume you are referring to the Ww2 Top Secret Japanese aircraft manufacturing technique Project Origami?

VA5124 · Feb 18, 2022

BlackSheep said:
"Piece of paper"? I assume you are referring to the Ww2 Top Secret Japanese aircraft manufacturing technique Project Origami?

It was a joke because no armor

SaparotRob · Feb 18, 2022

Origami is the art of folding paper.

BlackSheep · Feb 19, 2022

VA5124 said:
It was a joke because no armor

I guess my attempt at a joke didn't go over well, my apologies.
Since you described the Zero as "a fast piece of paper…" I in an apparently lame attempt at humor attempted to take it one step further and describe the process of manufacturing such paper airplanes as "origami", the art of folding paper into clever items. R/Woosh

BlackSheep · Feb 19, 2022

SaparotRob said:
Origami is the art of folding paper.

See post #157

VA5124 · Feb 19, 2022

BlackSheep said:
I guess my attempt at a joke didn't go over well, my apologies.
Since you described the Zero as "a fast piece of paper…" I in an apparently lame attempt at humor attempted to take it one step further and describe the process of manufacturing such paper airplanes as "origami", the art of folding paper into clever items. R/Woosh

Sorry i didnt get it at first my fought

GregP · Feb 19, 2022

The only wood I know of in an A6M5 Model 52 is the handle on the throttle. Everything else is aluminum or a small bit of steel in some areas (main landing gear and maybe a few things like engine mount and control cables), with some fabric on the control surfaces thrown in and maybe some other material for the instrument panel top cover. Maybe aluminum ... maybe not. There are standard cable pulleys of G10-type material and rubber seals and tires. But make no mistake, it is a metal airplane, reasonably well-built.

This ain't no paper airplane! It's a real, live warbird complete with a 2-row radial engine and a prop made from Hamilton-Standard drawings by Sumitomo for Mitsubishi / Nakajima.

The Planes of Fame Zero, number 61-120, is the 2,357th A6M5 off Nakajima's production line. it was delivered in May 1943 and was assigned to the Japanese Naval Air Corps on Honshu. It moved to Iwo Jima and was later assigned to Asilito Airfield on Saipan. On 18 June 1944, Alilito Airfield was captured by the U.S. Marines with a number of intact Zero fighters. They were shipped to NAS North Island in San Diego.

61-120 was ferried to Patuxent River, Maryland on 23 Aug 1944 for use in the 1944 Fighter Conference flyoff, during which it was flown by Charles Lindberg, among others. It was ferried back to Dan Diego on 11 Jan 1945 where front line pilots were given a chance to fly it. Altogether, 61-120 logged some 190 hours of flying time before being declared surplus after the war. In 1950 it was acquired by the Museum. it was restored in 1978 with help from both Mitsubishi and Nakajima (now called Fuji Heavy Industries ... today they sell us Subarus).

Thoughts on the Nakajima Ki-84 and Kawasaki Ki-100

Major

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Tech Sergeant

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Unter Gemeine Geschwader Murmeltier XIII

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