Wind Power****a can of worms?

[Old Wizard]

I've been hearing more and more stories of wind power problems that are not getting much media coverage. Check this out:
A Problem With Wind Power [AWErg]

Even the fact that space and ground based temperature monitoring have showed a decline for the past 4 or 5 years gets scant, if any, mention. Too many scientific and political reputations are at risk. Of course the media will blame both if the myth of 'Global Warming' turns out to be wrong

 

[lingo]

Very interesting. The media here in the UK sees it as a holy grail to be pursued at all costs.

 

[RabidAlien]

Heh. I've always wondered what they did when the winds died down....

 

[michaelmaltby]

OW I agree ... a real can of worms.

Bad science is taking over ... people believe that if they REALLY REALLY believe something passionately enough it will somehow come true. Just the opposite is true. Subsidize to build wind, sell surplus at a loss, and buy high when you're low. It quickly turns into a downward spiral. I am a pragmatist but I am grateful for what the earth gives us. Greenies seem to be earth spiritualists (Gaia'istas) who hate humankind and think humans are uniquely evil. Some hard times are needed to undo the effects of prosperity, boomerism, and prolonged (relative) stability - I am afraid.

Nature is all about peaks and crashes ... it's not FAIR but it's the way life regulates life. Of course greenies know better.

M

 

[Heinz]

Yeah however both sides miss valuable points. Future energy reserves be it naturally occuring fossil fuels or renewable something has to be developed in terms of guranteeing the continuious growth and development of the current civizilation.

Energy security through renewable and fossil combined usage is the key in my eyes anyway. The issue of Global Warming is just a procrastination tool.

 

[syscom3]

Wind power should be seen as just one of several energy sources to be exploited and not seen as the only one.

It works in some applications/area's, but not others.

 

[RabidAlien]

I think they're hyping it as the savior of the environment too soon. There's potential, but with current technology, there's still gaps. And all the coverage seems to be shoving other alternative sources out of the public's view: I recall reading something off the coast of England where they were using the changing tides and ocean currents/waves to generate electricity? And geothermal activity....there's quite a few active volcanoes around where folks have talked about setting up geothermal stations. Not sure if anything has come of that one, though.

 

[Marcel]

Of course, it surprises me that you guys didn't know about these back draws on wind power. Here in the NL we know for years that it's only an addition, althoug our country is quite suitable for the turbines (flat and windy ). Turbines are not efficient enough, or at least at this time. The idea is that all wind power that's created doesn't need to be produced by burning fossils, which is the idea. But it was never intended to replace it. As Sys said, it's only one way of generating energy.

Even the fact that space and ground based temperature monitoring have showed a decline for the past 4 or 5 years gets scant, if any, mention.

Because it's not true or at least doubtful. Most scientific groups on the issue still agree on the fact that the Earth is still warming, although the increase in temperature has slowed a little. This last point is misinterpreted by some media that the temperature is falling again.

 

[trackend]

Super conductor techknowledgy is not being supported nearly enough.
If effective super conductors can be developed to work at normal temperatures all the generating devices we use currently will be more than enough to supply our needs for years to come. Back EMF (electro motive force) is the killer for all genorators electric motors, resistance is the bain of all circuits, do away with that and 2 motors not much bigger than the size of your cars starter units will power it along easily and you wont need a bank of cells the size of a truck to supply the energy.Also all power transmissions could be made at supply voltage instead of sending out 250,000volts you would just send out 220v or what ever your domestic supply happens to be that your country uses.

 

[lingo]

there's quite a few active volcanoes around where folks have talked about setting up geothermal stations. Not sure if anything has come of that one, though.

About 20 years ago there was a 'hot rocks' project undergoing trials in Cornwall, drilling down deep into the granite of an abandoned tin mine. Cold surface water was pumped down into these holes and there was sufficient steam coming back other holes to power a turbine which produced electricity. The project was relatively small scale and the trials team were more than pleased with the results but the government pulled the funding and that was the end of that scheme. Perhaps it may be looked at again. Siting a geothermal station near a volcano sounds a promising idea.

 

[Njaco]

To paraphrase the scientific credo "To every action there is an opposite and equal re-action", - evey alternate energy source comes with baggage. How much of that baggage are we going to tolerate is the question. Here in NJ the gov authorized wind mills to be built out at sea. But numerous groups are complaining.

It spoils the skyline.
Migratory birds are killed by the props.
Cost is too much for the return. along with what has been posted here.

Its not the Holy Grail of energy.

 

[pbfoot]

Its just one of many options all of which used together should be a viable path

 

[Soren]

You guys seen this?:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cLIiGTZxH5s

I started reading about this a few years back, it's really quite an ingenious idea.

 

[gumbyk]

To paraphrase the scientific credo "To every action there is an opposite and equal re-action", - evey alternate energy source comes with baggage. How much of that baggage are we going to tolerate is the question. Here in NJ the gov authorized wind mills to be built out at sea. But numerous groups are complaining.

It spoils the skyline.
Migratory birds are killed by the props.
Cost is too much for the return. along with what has been posted here.

Its not the Holy Grail of energy.

Njaco,
Sounds like here in New Zealand.
Can't have wind turbines because it spoils the view
Can't have tidal generators because it'll kill fish/other marine life
Can't build new dams because it destroys ecosystems
Can't build new fossil fuel power stations because they proiduce too much CO2
Can't build Solar because we can't afford it (and we don't get enough sun)

We've already got to the point where the Govt has had to run major energy saving campaigns because we simply cannot generate enough electricity.

But I agree with Sys, what is needed is variety in generation sources. I was pretty impressed with what I saw in Las Vegas. 1 square mile of solar arrays, soon to be built up to 5 sq miles, to provide 95% of their electricity, with Hoover dam as back-up.

 

[Soren]

Njaco,
Sounds like here in New Zealand.
Can't have wind turbines because it spoils the view
Can't have tidal generators because it'll kill fish/other marine life
Can't build new dams because it destroys ecosystems
Can't build new fossil fuel power stations because they proiduce too much CO2
Can't build Solar because we can't afford it (and we don't get enough sun)

We've already got to the point where the Govt has had to run major energy saving campaigns because we simply cannot generate enough electricity.

Hey, how about you guys build a nuclear powerplant ? It's powerful, it's CO2 free, very small compared to output AND "safe"

 

[gumbyk]

Well, there's some down here who think its the way to go.

But, we're sitting on one huge geothermal area that is almost untapped. Go figure...

 

[RabidAlien]

Saw a news report tonight while passing through the livingroom. Some new city office building was just completed, with all sorts of energy-saving addons (they were so proud that the lights were on a timer and could turn themselves off....yep....must be brand-spankin-new technology, there....meh): the best feature was the million-plus-dollar solar panel setup on the roof, that will supply a certain (small) fraction of the electricity needed to power the building, and will pay itself off in (wait for it) seventeen years. 17. Solar energy is cool, and all, and I'm not knocking it, but I just got the impression that the media was desperate for a hook to throw into this thing to make it sound good. We need to take some of that surplus "stimulus package" tax-dollars and give it to the research guys, to improve what we have. Not to some fatcat CEO who's already run one (or more) company into the ground.

 

[javlin]

Super conductor techknowledgy is not being supported nearly enough.
If effective super conductors can be developed to work at normal temperatures all the generating devices we use currently will be more than enough to supply our needs for years to come. Back EMF (electro motive force) is the killer for all genorators electric motors, resistance is the bain of all circuits, do away with that and 2 motors not much bigger than the size of your cars starter units will power it along easily and you wont need a bank of cells the size of a truck to supply the energy.Also all power transmissions could be made at supply voltage instead of sending out 250,000volts you would just send out 220v or what ever your domestic supply happens to be that your country uses.

That was my first thought TE in thinking about it's use with trains it being applied to turbines and I am by no means a greenie in fact deplore most of the talk.But Hey if theres a better way to make the wheel then let's look at it.