# SS United States to be scrapped ?



## wheelsup_cavu (Mar 9, 2010)

I know every ship can't be saved but I think this is another one that should avoid the scrap yard.

Historic Ship May be Headed for Scrap Yard

SS United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Wheels


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## syscom3 (Mar 9, 2010)

Why? Its 58 years old. Theres nothing special about it.


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## timshatz (Mar 9, 2010)

Driven past it a bunch of times. Just sitting there. Was amazed it hasn't been scrapped so far. 

Would probably be better if it were striped and sank off NJ as an artificial reef/diving attraction, but that probably won't happen. 

Probably headed to Baltimore and the scrap yards.


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## Njaco (Mar 9, 2010)

[email protected], thats tough. I loved watching the ship as I ate lunch from the IKEA across the street!!


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## comiso90 (Mar 9, 2010)

I didnt know she was still afloat.

I believe she has outlived her usefulness. The Queen Mary has been a cash black hole on Long Beach ever since she found a perm home there. It would be nice if they could remove the main dining hall and turn it into a restaurant.

I'd like to walk around her decks though.


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## Loiner (Mar 9, 2010)

On a similar subject, how's the campaign to secure the future of USS Iowa at Vallejo, CA going? 

I can't believe that this priceless super-relic and last battleship in the world in reserve could be under any threat.


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## comiso90 (Mar 9, 2010)

Loiner said:


> On a similar subject, how's the campaign to secure the future of USS Iowa at Vallejo, CA going?
> 
> I can't believe that this priceless super-relic and last battleship in the world in reserve could be under any threat.



2 Iowa Class BBs are safe as Museums.. .. scrapping the remaining USS Iowas would be very sad but not a travesty.


.


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## Loiner (Mar 16, 2010)

I think three are preserved, USS Missouri is at Pearl Harbour, USS New Jersey is at Camden NJ, USS Wisconsin is in Norfolk. There's just USS Iowa left at Suisan Bay, a short distance from Vallejo (Mare Island) CA.

I think scrapping Iowa would be a travesty and should be avoided at all costs, once these great icons have gone, that's it they're gone. The UK were poor at preserving ships whereas the US have done much better, and well done to them for doing so and preserving their precious heritage.


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## wheelsup_cavu (Mar 17, 2010)

The three Iowa class battleships are located where you remembered them being Loiner.

Iowa class battleship - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I agree that once these ship are gone there is no bringing them back.

The Iowa is the ship that was used to take FDR to Casblanca for the Teheran Conference.


> U.S. Navy Battleships - USS Iowa (BB 61)
> 
> In the fall, Iowa carried President Franklin D. Roosevelt to Casablanca, French Morocco, on the first leg of his journey to the Teheran Conference in November. After the conference she returned the President to the United States.



A little side story about the _"uneventful"_ trip to Casblanca on the Iowa. USS PORTER DD579 STORY


@ Sys I really can't give a good reason why the SS United States should be saved I just felt it should.


Wheels


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## ToughOmbre (Mar 18, 2010)

Caught a glimpse of the "United States" as I was driving into Philly yesterday. 

But also got a look at the "New Jersey" further up the river.

First time I've seen either ship. "United States" looks like she needs a lot of work. Would rather see other warships saved instead if it was my decision.

TO


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## Njaco (Mar 18, 2010)

TO, you missed the Philly Navy Yard where there a bunch of ships collecting rust.


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## timshatz (Mar 19, 2010)

Njaco said:


> TO, you missed the Philly Navy Yard where there a bunch of ships collecting rust.



Not as many as there used to be. Now, most of them are cargo types. The Warships have all gone to the breakers. At least most of them. Used to be a great collection of 8" cruisers, Kidd Class Destroyers, Fram 2 types, all sorts of ships. All gone now. Even the stuff that was built in the 70s is pretty much gone or going. Probably starting to get rid of the early Burkes now.


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## comiso90 (Mar 19, 2010)

Now, the Olympia in Philly is an example of a ship that needs to be preserved..

one of a kind:

It is always on the list of endangered historical sites:

Historic Naval Ships Visitors Guide - USS Olympia


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## ToughOmbre (Mar 19, 2010)

comiso90 said:


> Now, the Olympia in Philly is an example of a ship that needs to be preserved..
> 
> one of a kind:
> 
> ...



Absolutely!

TO


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## Njaco (Mar 19, 2010)

If you've ever been there, to get on the 'Olympia' you have to cross over a submarine. At least the last time I went. Tim, I wasn't aware that most of those ships are gone. One of my towns is right across the DElaware from the Yard and I sometimes have lunch looking at those huge beasts.


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## comiso90 (Mar 19, 2010)

I was on the Olympia a few years ago but i dont remember a sub..

what kind of sub?

The Olypmpia is a mind f*ck... friendly white paint, wooden, brass, almost ornate fixtures and the cold utilitarian feel of a steel hull.
it's like something out of Jules Vern.


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## timshatz (Mar 19, 2010)

Njaco said:


> If you've ever been there, to get on the 'Olympia' you have to cross over a submarine. At least the last time I went. Tim, I wasn't aware that most of those ships are gone. One of my towns is right across the DElaware from the Yard and I sometimes have lunch looking at those huge beasts.



Njaco, I was stationed there back in the 80s. They still had a lot of warships then. The 8" Cruisers were mostly Des Moines class. Remember one of them had a barrell missing from one of the turrets. Word was it blew up during the Vietnam war on a NGFS shoot. Wiped out about 30 some odd Marines who were manning the turret.

There were a ton of DE/FFs, DDs, CAs and the odd CV or Amphib there. But they were moving them to the Breakers even then. A lot of WW2/Early Cold War stuff was there and it's all gone now. They really downsized big time after the Soviet Union collapsed. For example, I was on two ships. One was a WW2 DD. That one went away in 1983. They replaced it with a 1970 FF. That one was retired in early 90s. The DD ended up a missle target for Pakistan (so it was rumored) and the FF went to the Breakers in Baltimore around 1998. One had a life of 40 years, the other barely 25. 

Stuff moving through there now is late 70's/early 80s vintage. I think, but am not sure, that the ships there on long term are part of the reserve fleet for logistics. All I can see from 95N looks like there are no Warships in there, all cargo carrier stuff.


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## timshatz (Mar 19, 2010)

comiso90 said:


> I was on the Olympia a few years ago but i dont remember a sub..
> 
> what kind of sub?
> 
> ...



The Sub is a Gato class or similar. I think it's the Baccuna. Not sure.

Was on the Olympia myself about 30-40 years ago. It is a nutty ride through history. Practically no compartmentalization, all wide open. Hit it with a torpedo, anywhere, and that sucker is going down. Wood, varnished to a high gloss, paint, furniture and all sorts of things on it. If it ever took a couple of hits, it would burn like a box of matches. 

Or, as they used to joke, Damage Control consisted of the flooding putting the fires out.


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## Njaco (Mar 19, 2010)

And you had to be 4 foot nothing even to live/work in there! Tim, I think thats what I mostly see now are the cargo ships althought I thought I saw a LCT type ship a few months back.

Cosimo, here are some pics.....


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## Henk (Mar 21, 2010)

It is always sad to see a relic die, I would do almost anything to see the Olympic or a WW2 battleship or the Great Eastern, but noting is meant to last forever.


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## comiso90 (Mar 22, 2010)

Thanks NJ.. I wanna go back!


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## Njaco (Mar 22, 2010)

What really makes this special is almost directly across the river is the USS New Jersey. Its a cool section of the Delaware.


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## Capt. Vick (Mar 22, 2010)

What's the name of that floating restraunt in the background, in the old sailing ship, begins with an M I believe...

My 2 cents in a perfect world. The should move the United States to the west side of Manhatten, near the Intrepid, and make it something like a movie studio/shops/restraunt/convention center/hotel/jail/anything to save it...


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## Njaco (Mar 22, 2010)

The 'Moshulu'.

.:: Moshulu Restaurant Bar ::.

It really is a great area.


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## timshatz (Mar 22, 2010)

Njaco said:


> The 'Moshulu'.
> 
> .:: Moshulu Restaurant Bar ::.
> 
> It really is a great area.



Have a good lunch menu. Seating is downstairs, inside the ship. Deck is slanted away from the center but not a big deal. Windows face the USS NJ across the Delaware. Great place for lunch, Cheeseburgers are outstanding! Found it on the link:

Half Pound Prime Steak Burger $14 
Yellow Cheddar, White Vermont Sharp Cheddar 
Caramelized Texas 1015 Onions, Chipotle Aioli, House Fries 


I hear it's good for Happy Hour too but I've never been down for it.


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## Loiner (Mar 26, 2010)

timshatz said:


> Njaco, I was stationed there back in the 80s. They still had a lot of warships then. The 8" Cruisers were mostly Des Moines class. Remember one of them had a barrell missing from one of the turrets. Word was it blew up during the Vietnam war on a NGFS shoot. Wiped out about 30 some odd Marines who were manning the turret.
> 
> There were a ton of DE/FFs, DDs, CAs and the odd CV or Amphib there. But they were moving them to the Breakers even then. A lot of WW2/Early Cold War stuff was there and it's all gone now. They really downsized big time after the Soviet Union collapsed. For example, I was on two ships. One was a WW2 DD. That one went away in 1983. They replaced it with a 1970 FF. That one was retired in early 90s. The DD ended up a missle target for Pakistan (so it was rumored) and the FF went to the Breakers in Baltimore around 1998. One had a life of 40 years, the other barely 25.
> 
> Stuff moving through there now is late 70's/early 80s vintage. I think, but am not sure, that the ships there on long term are part of the reserve fleet for logistics. All I can see from 95N looks like there are no Warships in there, all cargo carrier stuff.



So all the Cold War era reserve warships have gone now? such as the Knox class FFs, Leahy class CGs and Coontz class and Charles F Adams class DDGs?

What is happening to the Perry class FFGs that are being retired? are they being broken up too or still in resrve? and the Spruance DDs? I know time flies but it doesn't seem that long since reading about these classes of ships being launched and commissioned.


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## timshatz (Mar 26, 2010)

Loiner said:


> So all the Cold War era reserve warships have gone now? such as the Knox class FFs, Leahy class CGs and Coontz class and Charles F Adams class DDGs?
> 
> What is happening to the Perry class FFGs that are being retired? are they being broken up too or still in resrve? and the Spruance DDs? I know time flies but it doesn't seem that long since reading about these classes of ships being launched and commissioned.



Loiner, I'm thinking the Spruance are going to scrap. Don't think they are still out there and they didn't do a refurbishment on them. They're old ships now, going on 30 years. And I don't think much of it was easy time. But the replacement for a lot of the FFs was supposed to be (I think anyway) the LCS and it's not turning out the way they wanted it. But I've read the Perry's are being retired and Taiwan wants them. 

The Burkes are still out there. They were supposed to be replaced by the DDG-1000 but that turned out to be a high priced dog, so they're making more Burkes at a billion a copy vs the 4 billion each for the 1K. 

Long and short, if it was built before 1990, it's questionable if it's still up for it. At least for the small stuff. The flight decks are 50 year ships and aren't going anywhere. 

But the reserve fleet in Phila is mostly support stuff. At least it was the last time I drove by.


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## davparlr (Mar 30, 2010)

All I remember of the SS United States is that when I was a kid some cereal boxes had a series of record setting vehicles. One was the SS United States. There was also a train which I do not remember but I think it was electric. I had forgotten about that until this thread started.


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## timshatz (Mar 30, 2010)

Funny thing, I drove past both the Navy Yard and SS United States on Saturday night and completely forgot to check up on both of them. Was talking with the wife about something. Think it was vacation. That usually gets my full attention!


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## Njaco (Apr 24, 2010)

This is disheartening......

USS Olympia seeks a new caretaker | Philadelphia Inquirer | 02/26/2010

*USS Olympia seeks a new caretaker*
By Edward Colimore 

Inquirer Staff Writer

During the Spanish-American War, Navy Commodore George Dewey stood on the bridge of the ship and uttered the words that became famous: "You may fire when you are ready, Gridley."

The vessel's mighty guns fired the first shots of the Battle of Manila Bay on May 1, 1898, announcing the United States as an international power. The USS Olympia was the Navy's state-of-the-art flagship, a source of pride for a country flexing its muscles. More than a century later, this last surviving vessel of the Spanish-American War fleet and longtime Penn's Landing attraction is looking for a new home and benefactor with deep pockets.

Its owner, the Independence Seaport Museum, can no longer afford the upkeep and it told the Navy it "will relinquish its stewardship of this national naval treasure and its valuable artifact collections," said Peter McCausland, chairman of the museum's Board of Port Wardens. The museum seeks an owner who can pay up to $30 million to tow, restore, interpret, and endow the bedraggled-looking vessel. Small portions of the Olympia's half-inch steel hull along the water line have corroded to the point that only an eighth of an inch of thickness is left. The hull must be continually monitored and is often patched, even as water leaks through parts of the deck into the interior, causing further rust.

"We don't like to see the ship go, but you don't want to sink the entire museum because of the cost of maintaining" the Olympia, said the Independence Seaport's interim president, James McLane. "The museum is very financially sound, but if you put a drag on it, that puts it at risk over the next several years."

For more than 13 years, the museum has been "a good steward" of the Olympia, McCausland said. "We've spent $5.3 million on her. We love her." But efforts to find funding from private donors and the city, state, and federal governments have failed, he said. The attraction will close in September.

"She's not in imminent danger of sinking, but not far away from sinking," McCausland said. "We could have a situation develop and then proceed downhill quite rapidly."

Some sections of the hull "are exposed to air and water, air and water" as the tide rises and falls, speeding the rusting, said Jesse Lebovics, the museum's manager of historic ships.

"There is a concern for the future. Once deterioration starts, it goes faster and faster," he said. "The rubberized coating [on the deck] is eight years old. Water comes in, and that starts the rusting inside."

The riverbed around ship must be dredged before the Olympia can be towed to drydock for new decking, hull repairs, and painting. Cost of those basic repairs? At least $10 million. An additional $20 million would be needed for interpretation to turn it into a first-class tourist attraction and for an endowment to pay for its future needs, museum officials said. Unfortunately, a feasibility study showed that the museum would be unable to meet those funding needs in this economic climate, officials said.

"If we don't have the resources to take care of the vessel, then someone who does will be better for her," Lebovics said.

Finding an owner "willing and able to preserve and repair" the Olympia is the museum's responsibility, said Glen Clark, deputy program manager for the Navy's Inactive Ships Program in Washington. "The Navy does not own the ship." But the military has been "concerned about the condition" of the Olympia and it sent a letter to the museum in May asking for plans for drydocking, Clark said. "It's a national historic landmark."

The museum took over the one-of-a-kind ship Jan. 1, 1996, from the Olympia Cruiser Association, which had maintained the vessel with limited resources for 40 years. The Olympia is the world's oldest floating steel warship. It was used to carry the body of the unknown soldier of World War I from France to the United States in 1921, the museum said. It was docked at the Philadelphia Navy Yard from 1922 to 1959, and was on display at Pier 11 at the Benjamin Franklin Bridge through the 1960s until 1976, when it was moved to Penn's Landing. The ship was authorized in 1888 and commissioned in 1895. It led five other U.S. warships into Manila Bay in late April 1898, and fired shots in the battle to wrest the Philippines from the Spanish. The U.S. fleet - under Dewey's command - destroyed 10 Spanish cruisers and gunboats in a few hours without losing an American life.

Today, the Olympia is a time capsule, filled with a collection of paintings, photographs, and artifacts. It has been in the water since 1945, though historic steel-hull ships should be drydocked about every 20 years for maintenance. The deferred work makes restoration more costly.

"We will be rolling out our new strategic plan, connecting people in the region to the water," McCausland said. "But we cannot take care of the Olympia and execute our plan.

"We're very saddened by this, but it is what it is. We did our best."

Added McLane: "It's not what the museum wants to do. It's what we have to do."


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## vikingBerserker (Apr 25, 2010)

Dam............


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## RabidAlien (Apr 25, 2010)

My thoughts exactly. Dewey's flagship? Carried the body of the Unknown Soldier from France after WWI???? Oldest steel warship still afloat??? Holy crap, this needs to be preserved!!!


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## Njaco (Apr 25, 2010)

and for anybody who is curious, this is how the USS United States looks like today - courtesy of bing.com


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## wheelsup_cavu (Apr 28, 2010)

It will be a shame if that ship ends up being scrapped.
Thanks for the story Njaco.


Wheels


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