# "Move and you are DEAD!!" : Give this guy a medal



## Matt308 (Nov 26, 2007)

Don't mess with Texas. This guy deserves the keys to the city and free bullets for life. Poor bastard. He's the victim. He's gonna have to live with himself, while the Sheeple of Texas have the gall to want to charge him. Oh sweet irony.


_View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mA__Shw5x90_


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## Marcel (Nov 26, 2007)

Hmmm, a little bit too trigger happy for my taste. I can understand his motives, but it sounded like he didn't give them any chance at all to surrender. Maybe they were carrying guns as well?


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## Matt308 (Nov 26, 2007)

Oh I thought being a thief, exiting someone's home with their belongings, a man pointing a 12guage in your face and him yelling "Move and you're dead" was plenty effing clear actually.

Must be a southern thing.


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## Marcel (Nov 26, 2007)

Matt308 said:


> Oh I thought being a thief, exiting someone's home with their belongings, a man pointing a 12guage in your face and him yelling "Move and you're dead" was plenty effing clear actually.
> 
> Must be a southern thing.




But he fired directly after his shouting. Too bad he'll have to carry this on his concience.


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## comiso90 (Nov 26, 2007)

I wonder what kinda shot he used?

.


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## Matt308 (Nov 26, 2007)

Apparently an effective load. Three shots, two goblins. Not bad.


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## Matt308 (Nov 26, 2007)

Marcel said:


> But he fired directly after his shouting. Too bad he'll have to carry this on his concience.



Yep. I imagine that all he saw was asses and elbows. And it is too bad. He truly is the victim here.


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## ccheese (Nov 26, 2007)

Marcel said:


> Hmmm, a little bit too trigger happy for my taste. I can understand his motives, but it sounded like he didn't give them any chance at all to surrender. Maybe they were carrying guns as well?



Actually, Marcel, the law (in Virginia) is pretty clear. _*IF*_ the
"party" is in your home with the intent to commit a crime (which crime is
not germain) and _*IF*_ you have reason to believe your life (or
that of another) is in peril, you have the _*Right*_ to use _*Deadly Force*_. 
He need not show a weapon.... as long as, when the
police get there, they find one of your kitchen knives in his hand or about the body.

Just be sure to kill him, or he will sue you for maiming...

And, the time of day makes a difference.... during the day he was "breaking
and entering" and at night, he's "a burglar".

Charles


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## Matt308 (Nov 26, 2007)

And 24/7 he's a goblin.


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## Marcel (Nov 26, 2007)

ccheese said:


> Actually, Marcel, the law (in Virginia) is pretty clear. _*IF*_ the
> "party" is in your home with the intent to commit a crime (which crime is
> not germain) and _*IF*_ you have reason to believe your life (or
> that of another) is in peril, you have the _*Right*_ to use _*Deadly Force*_.
> ...


That's just amazing. But these guys were not in his house, but in his neighbours', is that why the government sues him?


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## ccheese (Nov 26, 2007)

On the other side of that, make sure you shoot him in the front part of his
body. If the coroner sez he has bullet wounds in his back, that means he 
was running away from you, and your life was _*NOT*_ in jeopardy.

It dooooo make a difference !

Charles


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## ccheese (Nov 26, 2007)

Marcel said:


> That's just amazing. But these guys were not in his house, but in his neighbours', is that why the government sues him?



Marcel: I can't see the Youtube thing, I'm blocked out. So I don't know 
what transpired. I guess he could say his neighbor's life was threatened.

Charles


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## Becca (Nov 26, 2007)

you can shoot them legally IF they are IN your house in Texas. I know, because dad always made me promise to either let them get a foot in the window, THEN fire. OR drag them into the house and then call the police. God bless him.


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## twoeagles (Nov 26, 2007)

Texas law says it is legal to use deadly force when someone is in your house and/or on your property, and they pose a threat (serious injury or death) to you or your loved ones. However, someone killed as they are running off for your front fence may not sway a jury in your favor. I have a concealed handgun license here in Texas and it takes 12 hours of classroom and a lot of shooting to get it. My opinion of this guy in Pasadena is he has murdered two people who posed him no immediate danger, unsavory as they apparently were. You just don't perforate someone unless you have run out of other viable options.


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## Matt308 (Nov 26, 2007)

In that case, give him two medals. One for his deed. The second for making a command decision.


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## Marcel (Nov 26, 2007)

ccheese said:


> Marcel: I can't see the Youtube thing, I'm blocked out. So I don't know
> what transpired. I guess he could say his neighbor's life was threatened.
> 
> Charles



As far as I could figure, his neighbour wasn't at home. He himself was in no danger. He just ran out of the house with his gun as if he was John Wayne although told by the offical not to do it. He obvously eager to test his little shotgun toy. The shouted "Move and you are dead" like a real Hollywood actor and then shot twice. IMO his action was no comparisment to the crime commited. What he should have done was wait for the police and aid them as they probably had a fair chance catching these guys. He probably felt he was saving the world. But now he sold his soul for a couple of lousy dollars. Well I can feel for his sentiment an shed no tears for the death of these scum I feel the only thing he became victim of was his own stupidity. But it's easy for me to judge, save behind my computer, I wasn't there.


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## comiso90 (Nov 26, 2007)

I have shotguns in my house but I would never run outside and blast people breaking into a neighbors house unless someones life was threated.

Now if they were on my property... I'd shoot them and go through their wallets!


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## Gnomey (Nov 26, 2007)

He went a bit OTT there really. Yes they were stealing but it wasn't his property and for that reason (according to what I have read here with respect to the law) it is therefore technically murder/manslaughter and therefore wrong however good the reasons for him doing it are...


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## lesofprimus (Nov 26, 2007)

I could see him getting Manslaughter charges, but not murder... If one of the perps brandished a weapon, then its all about who pulls the trigger/knife first...

This IS Texas we're talkin about fellas, an Ol'Joe Horn is White...


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## Erich (Nov 26, 2007)

fitting sig Les.....kick ass, and in this case the guy did on two of those slimes


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## Aggie08 (Nov 26, 2007)

I saw this. I believe a new law in Texas will allow him to go free if his neighbor asked him to watch his things... I think it's wrong, they posed no threat to him and as the operator said there is no property worth killing over. We have weird laws here.


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## Torch (Nov 26, 2007)

I'm almost seeing some sympathy towards the bad guys. Lets remember they initiated the whole thing by being scumbags and breaking into someone's home, you know, one's castle. They started the whole sequence of events. If those dumb shits had any decent thought in their heads they would not of done what they did. They paid the ultimate price..


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## lesofprimus (Nov 26, 2007)

I woulda aimed for their legs... Close range, double ought shot??? Take the legg off below the knee...

Thatll teach em a lesson...


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## Matt308 (Nov 26, 2007)

While the situation is certainly disturbing, when you read all of our responses from beginning to end, it is rather amazing that we to a great extent are sympathizing with two goblins who at a minimimum had past convictions, were in the act of entering and leaving a neighbors home, stealing said neighbors life energy and this good citizen was being instructed to not even disturb these goblins while committing these activities.

We have become a nation of sheep. And there are too few sheepdogs.

God help us.


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## comiso90 (Nov 26, 2007)

Funny...

I don't see ANY sympathizing... 

big difference between sympathizing and running outta the house with a loaded shot gun killing a couple guys.

.


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## ccheese (Nov 26, 2007)

Marcel said:


> As far as I could figure, his neighbour wasn't at home. He himself was in no danger. He just ran out of the house with his gun as if he was John Wayne although told by the offical not to do it. He obvously eager to test his little shotgun toy. The shouted "Move and you are dead" like a real Hollywood actor and then shot twice.



Marcel: I just saw the Youtube thing. I don't know about the law in Texas,
but in Virginia Mr. Horn would be in serious do-doo. After repeatedly being
told by the police dispatcher (in Va. dispatchers are mostly female but have
full police/arrest powers) to stay in his home and not go outside. From what
I heard and saw, no one's life was in danger. He just shot and killed two
men who, if apprehended, might have gotten five years for breaking 
entering. It will be interesting to see what the glorious state of Texas
(all bow your heads, please) does. Talk about a redneck !!

I think he took two lives needlessly.... and I thought I heard three shots ??

Charles


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## Matt308 (Nov 26, 2007)

That's what I mean though Comiso. It sounds like your statement sympathizes with the "couple guys". If you had said "big difference between sympathizing and running outta the house with a loaded shot gun removing two scumbag thieves/robbers/burglars", that would be different.

And I don't want to hear about any "alleged" bull$hit. We all know those guys were guilty as the day is long. If they were local choirboys returning donations for a blind pygmie orphanage in Belize back to the neighborhood pastor, then our shotgun toting individual is in deep kimchee. But you know that's not the case as well as I do. So lets call it what it is. That is my point.


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## Matt308 (Nov 26, 2007)

ccheese said:


> Talk about a redneck !!
> 
> 
> Charles




To a redneck, that term of endearment is not insulting. I know. I are one.


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## comiso90 (Nov 26, 2007)

Matt308 said:


> That's what I mean though Comiso. It sounds like your statement sympathizes with the "couple guys". If you had said "big difference between sympathizing and running outta the house with a loaded shot gun removing two scumbag thieves/robbers/burglars", that would be different.



So I'm a lazy typist for not using more colorful adjectives...

This will give you some insight:

My automotive anti-theft device - 
Take one joint rolled in cyanide
leave it in your car ash tray so it is visible
Leave keys in ignition
get plastic seat covers

Some jerk-off steals the car, smokes the joint and dies 

Another:
I used to shoot competition using iron sites and a M-1 Garand at 600 yards. I'd love to be on shopping mall security duty in a tower waiting to spatter the skull of any offender with my .270. (signs would be posted of coarse!)

But I still think its wrong to run out of your house administering lethal force.

.


.


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## Matt308 (Nov 26, 2007)

Gotcha. I feel better now.


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## Marcel (Nov 27, 2007)

Torch said:


> I'm almost seeing some sympathy towards the bad guys. Lets remember they initiated the whole thing by being scumbags and breaking into someone's home, you know, one's castle. They started the whole sequence of events. If those dumb shits had any decent thought in their heads they would not of done what they did. They paid the ultimate price..



No sympathy for them here. I'm not sad that they died, it's the risk they were taking. But what this guy did wa not very bright IMO. He should have waited for the police and handle things as they were already on their way. Now he will be a killer forever, only because of the few dollar these guys took. He was lucky on one hand, that these guys really were criminals, he could ahve easily shot inocent people. Holywood...


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## Aggie08 (Nov 27, 2007)

These guys were definitely doing something they shouldn't have been, but at worst it's a few hundred dollars, and I would much rather let them go then kill them even if they took it right under my nose. To take a human life is a serious thing and you'd need a good reason to do it. That being said, if they were in _my_ house, you can bet I'd use lethal force to protect myself and my family, but not my things.


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## Matt308 (Nov 27, 2007)

Well my things are bits of my life energy. I wouldn't kill a man over taking a piece of gum. But if he and his goblin buddies showed up, broke into my house, and were intent on taking something of which I had no indication... I'd shoot first and ask questions later.


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## FLYBOYJ (Nov 27, 2007)

Info...

The Make My Day law is represented in several states of the United States guaranteeing "absolute safety" for citizens within their own homes and property. Its origins are from Oklahoma, though it has been adopted in other states such as Colorado.

Under the law, citizens cannot be prosecuted for using deadly force against suspected threats to themselves in their houses and on their property - for example (and primarily), intruders. The origins of the law can be traced to a case of a break-in, involving Dr Frank Sommer from Oklahoma. After Sommer shot and killed an intruder, the law was passed within weeks. Advocates claim that the success of the law clearly demonstrates the use of self defense as a deterrent, and point out that the crime rates in Oklahoma for burglary fell from 58,333 in 1987 to 31,661 in 2000. Crime rates decreased nation-wide during that time interval, however, so comparison with the national crime rate would be needed to substantiate this claim.


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## syscom3 (Nov 27, 2007)

One thing is for sure.

The scumbag burglers wont be commiting anymore crimes. I have no sympathy for these guys. 

Just think how great things can be if the criminals fear the citizens.


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## Maestro (Nov 27, 2007)

If ever I move to the US, this is the first thing I'm gonna buy to defend my home.


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## Parmigiano (Nov 28, 2007)

I think it's a matter of putting things into perspective: 
this guys were thieves and deserved to go to jail, not to the morgue.

Even if we want to accept the concept that a citizen can legitimately take ownership of enforcing the law on behalf of Police, Judge etc. there is no way and no justification (at least in a civilized society) that law punishment for burglary is capital death. 

This is a case of 'excess of legitimate defense' and the guy who shot the thieves in the back should be prosecuted and jailed, unless it will be proved that he shot to defend his life (a bit unlikely looking at the vid and reading the conversation with the 911 operator)

If he wanted to stop them to run away he had many other options than shoot them point blank in the back: this for me is cold-blood homicide.


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## twoeagles (Nov 28, 2007)

Okay - now imagine that the neighbor was in desperate need of money, so he had these guys come steal some stuff so he could rake in the insurance claim.
The thing is, our Constitution, the one many of us spent the best years of our young lives defending, guarantees due process under the law. Don't get me wrong, I am ready to smack a bad guy if I have to, and I carry a .45 for personal defense, but that doesn't give me or anybody else the right in America to be the instantaneous judge and executioner. Where would you draw the line?


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## Matt308 (Nov 28, 2007)

Personally? I wouldn't realistically shoot them outright. Confront them yes. And then if I felt threatened, I would unleash.

And who says he shot them in the back? I didn't read that anywhere. For all we know they pulled a weapon on the poor dude or they made gestures that intimated a weapon.


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## Aggie08 (Nov 28, 2007)

They make it sound like he came over to his neighbor's property and shot them there with no prior threat to himself or his property. If they had, this would be justified but as it stands it seems he was a little too zealous.


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## Matt308 (Nov 28, 2007)

Awfully short time span between him leaving his home and his first yelling, "Move and your dead". Sounds like his neighbor and he must have shared pretty close living quarters.


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## Aggie08 (Nov 30, 2007)

That would add an interesting aspect, if they live so close that he felt physically threatened by them being in his neighbor's place.


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## Matt308 (Nov 30, 2007)

What makes me angry is that these goblins performed their deed and it resulted in a law abiding citizen having to make a decision that will affect the rest of his life, irrespective of the legal implications. If they had not robbed this house, this innocent man would still be watching Opera, drinking tea, twiddling his thumbs or whatever. Its not his fault dammit.


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## syscom3 (Nov 30, 2007)

I saw this on Liveleak.

Final score: Female store clerk 1, Male gangbanger "0"

LiveLeak.com - Man Shot During Robbery


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## DBII (Dec 3, 2007)

I just wanted to add my 2 cents. I grew up in the city where this happened. Yes it is a red neck area. In Texas, one can use deadly force to protect personal property even when you are not the property owner.

If I remember correctly from the local news report, the two people were in the process of carrying off a large screen tv. Both of these guys had a criminal record. There had been several break ins in the area. The home owner asked his neighbor to keep an eye on his place while he was away. The local news said that when the man approached the thieves, instead for stopping the the thieves started advancing toward him. The man shot one of them and then shot the second one as he started running. You can tell that things happened fast from the sounds on the tape. The homeowner may not have had time to not shoot the man that turned and ran. 

I do not know how many times 911 was called but were I live, it can take hours to get a unit to responded. I called dispatch in the middle of the night, there were a couple of men fighting with pipes in the front yard and one of them had a hand gun. I told dispatch that I was loading the mini-14 and they better send someone out to the house. They are trained to tell you not to do anything. I told dispatched if they started shooting in my front yard, I am taking them both out. It still took law enforcement 30 mins to arrive and by then they had left the area. The police received at lease 5 calls about the distrubance. After the police had finished taking everyone's statement, one of the cars described drove back by the house. The police questioned the people and then let them go because they were minors. 

Around here there is a major shortage of law inforcement. A person has to be willing to protect himself. I cannot say if he did the right thing or not because I was not there. To bad two people were killed but that is the chance they took by being thieves. 

An acitivist from Houston tried to make this a race issue. He went to the press about a big protest he was having at the site. The local residents showed up in force and would not let the protestors speak and have their press conference. The protestor showed up later with more people and by that time several people from the city and arrived for there own protest. A couple of fights broke out and the police came in. The protestors from out of town were run off. It appears that this area was having a crime problem the the locals had to take care of themselves.

DBII


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## Matt308 (Dec 3, 2007)

Good post DBII.


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## HoHun (Dec 3, 2007)

Hi DBII,

>In Texas, one can use deadly force to protect personal property even when you are not the property owner.

Oh well, you can - legally - do that in Germany too. However, here you have to observe the principle of proportionality, meaning that the force you exert has to be limited with a view on the damage that is done by the people you are defending against.

The level of potential damage that justifies the use of lethal force is seen as fairly high by the German jurisdiction. I'd expect that Texan to be found as having exceeded the legal restrictions if he'd be judged by German law.

In fact, if my impression is correct that he announced "I'll kill them!" unconditionally to the operator (I might be wrong), I think might even be a chance that he'd be charged with (or sentenced for) murder instead of man slaughter as it could be concluded that he planned to use lethal force regardless of its requirement.

Not that I'm an expert ... and of course, I don't have a clear picture what happened that night.

Regards,

Henning (HoHun)


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## Soundbreaker Welch? (Dec 5, 2007)

Tough ole Texan. 

Good shot too.

I suppose them being blacks could have made him madder, but they were robbers.


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## Captn javy Wilson (Dec 5, 2007)

yeah give him 2 medals


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## dark child (Dec 5, 2007)

my sisters name is cheese!!!


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## lesofprimus (Dec 5, 2007)

And ur a fu*kin retard.... If u dont have something constructive to say, dont say anything....


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## Matt308 (Dec 5, 2007)

Uhhh... cerebral defect, me suspects.


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Dec 6, 2007)

Uh that is all this guy has been posting. Screw him...


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## Marcel (Dec 6, 2007)

DerAdlerIstGelandet said:


> Uh that is all this guy has been posting. Screw him...



I'd rather not


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## DBII (Dec 10, 2007)

Latest update. An plan clothes officer arrived on the scene in time to witness the shooting. No information about his statement has been released. In addition, the police have determined that the two thieves are members of a local crime ring. In addition to being involed with several break ins, they were in the country illegally from Columbia. They were also providing forged documents to people here illegally. 

DBII

DBII


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## Maestro (Dec 10, 2007)

In short, nobody is gonna cry at their funerals.


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## DBII (Dec 10, 2007)

The tax payers will when the family get lawyers.

DBII


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## Njaco (Dec 15, 2007)

I'm with Sys and Matt on this.

If more citizens reacted this way there wouldn't be scumbags to do this.

Screw the dynamics of the situation. Make him a Mayor and Chief of Police. Then see how safe it would be.

And somehow I knew they were illegal aliens. Just a hunch.


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