# top scoring aces



## jrk (Aug 15, 2005)

http://images.google.co.uk/imgres?i...ages?q=edward+mannock&svnum=10&hl=en&lr=&sa=G



theres my man mannock again.and a nice picture of some lovely se5a,s


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## elmilitaro (Sep 1, 2005)

Hey, the Red Baron had the most kills and probably the most feared, but he mostly only shot down planes more obsolete and underarmed than his. I still have respect for him, but the most famous and well known was a french ace who battled planes better than his and died in a sortie. Arghh, I can't remember his name but he had over 50 kills. If somebody knows please tell me. Thank you.


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## FLYBOYJ (Sep 1, 2005)

elmilitaro said:


> Hey, the Red Baron had the most kills and probably the most feared, but he mostly only shot down planes more obsolete and underarmed than his. I still have respect for him, but the most famous and well known was a french ace who battled planes better than his and died in a sortie. Arghh, I can't remember his name but he had over 50 kills. If somebody knows please tell me. Thank you.



*Georges M.Guynemer*


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## elmilitaro (Sep 1, 2005)

Thats his name. Thanks flyboyj, I meen it from the bottom of my heart.


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## jrk (Sep 3, 2005)

hey flyboyj i was gonna say that guys name but you beat me too it


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## FLYBOYJ (Sep 3, 2005)

I'm Quick!


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## Gnomey (Sep 4, 2005)

Good link to WW1 aces http://www.theaerodrome.com/aces/by_score.php
Also contains information by country etc as well as info on planes.


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## Nonskimmer (Sep 4, 2005)

It's interesting how they only credit Mannock with 61 victories. I've seen that before in various sources, both online and in print, and I've been told that it's because only 61 of his claimed 73 victories were ever confirmed. It's actually become quite a debate in some circles. Personally, I find it difficult to believe that all of the victories of many of these aces were actually confirmed. Bishop included. But ninty years after the fact we'll likely never really know for sure.


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## jrk (Sep 5, 2005)

you have a good point there nonskimmer.we do have knowledge of how courageous they were though.


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## Nonskimmer (Sep 5, 2005)

True enough. They didn't exactly give away the Victoria Cross for nothing.


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## plan_D (Sep 5, 2005)

The key word there being "didn't" - they did in the Iraq War. I cannot believe they gave a VC to someone who was just doing his job. A MM at most in my opinion, even the person who received didn't think he deserved it.


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## mosquitoman (Sep 5, 2005)

Sorry to say but it was a bit of propaganda, not taking anything away from the guy but it took the front pages off of "look how many of our boys died yesterday"


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## plan_D (Sep 5, 2005)

I know. He didn't deserve that VC at all. It's kind of a disgrace that he got it for something he should have been doing anyway.


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## FLYBOYJ (Sep 5, 2005)

It's because these guys came out on top, if not for anything else....

Funny thing though - Eddie Rickenbacker got the Medal of Honor years after WW1. At the end of hostilities he did received the DSO - probably fitting for his service....


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## jrk (Sep 6, 2005)

i think it is.and then going on to fly as an air sea rescue pilot in a b-17.


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## elmilitaro (Sep 7, 2005)

Wow, I didn't know that. Thanks for the info.


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## jrk (Sep 8, 2005)

no worries 

i think he lived until 1975 also?


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## FLYBOYJ (Sep 8, 2005)

jrk said:


> i think it is.and then going on to fly as an air sea rescue pilot in a b-17.



ACUTALLY, no........

He was an advisor touring the pacific in WW2 and the B-17 he was flying in crashed (he was not flying) he floated for a few weeks until found.....

Eddie Rickenbcker was awarded the MOH I think in early 30s by presidential order. He never obtained a driver's license or pilot's license and when he ran Eastern Airlines he initally refused to install autopilots in his aircraft stating "he pays piolts to fly, not to sit on the duffs."


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## jrk (Sep 8, 2005)

thanks for correcting that flyboyj.i knew there was some connection between rickenbacker and a b-17 somewhere.

so he must have been racing cars illegally?


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## FLYBOYJ (Sep 8, 2005)

jrk said:


> so he must have been racing cars illegally?


  Yep! If they need a license at Indy!


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## jrk (Sep 9, 2005)

i was at waterstones book store in birmingham today and i picked this book up about american aces from the great war.eddie was in it with quite a few pictures of him and fellow pilots stood with him.it was interesting to see how many american airmen served in the french escardrilles.


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## 102first_hussars (Oct 4, 2005)

HEY CANADAS OWN BILLY BISHOP WAS THE HIGHEST SCORING ALLIED ACE DURING WW1 SCORING 10 LESS THAN THE RED BARON, 

aND IT WAS CANDAS OWN ROY BROWN WHO ACTUALLY SHOT DOWN THE RED BARON.


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## Nonskimmer (Oct 4, 2005)

102first_hussars said:


> aND IT WAS CANDAS OWN ROY BROWN WHO ACTUALLY SHOT DOWN THE RED BARON.


That's highly debatable. At the time it seemed that way to many, and indeed it was a claim that existed for many, many years, but I believe that new evidence has recently come to light that makes it much more likely that it was in fact the Australian gunners on the ground who shot down von Richthofen. I'm not entirely sure of it, but I seem to have read that not long ago somewhere, and it was a pretty compelling argument. I dunno. Maybe it _was_ Brown after all.

The highest allied ace thing has been debated for decades too. Many still say Eddie Mannock shot down 73. I don't think it'll ever really be proven one way or the other.


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## Gnomey (Oct 4, 2005)

There was a program on TV in the UK about this and they said the Aussie gunners shot Von Richthofen down not Roy Brown.


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## FLYBOYJ (Oct 4, 2005)

Roy Brown had to be credited with this kill. The same month the RFC became the RAF - a big headline was needed.

Back in 1967 the first book was written about this. The author cited autopsy notes and if one would read them, it was impossible for Roy Brown to have kill Richthofen. The wound came from below and exited the chest area. By his own admittance, Brown never fired at the Baron from below.

If the red Baron's aircraft wasn't torn apart by souvenir hunters, maybe the truth wold of been more apparent, but I think the Australian unit on the ground pillaged the aircraft because they were pretty sure they killed him


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## Nonskimmer (Oct 4, 2005)

Right, so there you are. The evidence isn't so recent after all. I guess I should have actually said that I'd read about it fairly recently. 

Also, in my previous post I'd completely forgotten about the Frenchman René Fonck, who was actually the top allied ace of WWI with a tally of 75 enemy planes downed. The Mannock/Bishop debate is over the top British Empire ace.


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## Gnomey (Oct 4, 2005)

Yep.

Here is the top 15: http://www.theaerodrome.com/aces/by_score.php


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## FLYBOYJ (Oct 4, 2005)

http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2003/12/25/13258/202

I couldn't find the author of the first book written on this subject back in 1967 (it could of even been 1968) but the above link has great information on this subject.


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## Nonskimmer (Oct 4, 2005)

Actually FJ, I think that's exactly where I'd first seen it. 
Good link.


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## FLYBOYJ (Oct 4, 2005)

Thanks NS - in the link it even talks about medical personnel orginally determining he was killed by ground fire.


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## jrk (Oct 17, 2005)

nice post guys that was one interesting piece of information keep it coming


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## ollieholmes (Nov 7, 2005)

I dont think anyone now understands the sheer bravery and courage it took those guys to go to war in something made of wood and canvas. In my mind they all deserve alot of respect for what they did.


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