# Remembering George Gamble, Died 24 Sep 1917



## buffnut453 (Sep 26, 2017)

Hi Folks,

Please forgive a little indulgence here but, as some of you know, I've been doing some family history research lately and came across a relative (my grandmother's cousin), George Gamble who died 100 years ago last Sunday during the Battle of Passchendaele.

George came from a very humble background. His family lived in a 2-up/2-down house in the industrial northwest of England. The census record for 1911 lists his occupation as "Labourer" but it seems likely he had a more technical role maintaining machinery for the local brewery.

When war broke out in August 1914, George was quick to volunteer, enlisting on 2 September 1914 in The Rifle Brigade. Army life clearly suited Pvt Gamble because, when his Bn embarked for France in January 1915, he'd been promoted to LCpl and he was promoted again, to Cpl, while in France in June 1915. In November 1915, George's Bn was transferred to the Salonika front where he would remain for the next 13 months.

In April 1916, while still in Salonika, he was promoted to Acting Sgt with the full rank and pay coming a month later. By the end of the year, he'd been recommended for commissioning and returned to the UK in January 1917 to be evaluated for Officer Cadet School. He was duly accepted and was sent to Pirbright, gaining a commission as a 2Lt on 27 June 1916.

By mid-August 1917, George was back in France with The Rifle Brigade, officially joining his unit on 24th of that month. Barely a month later, on the night of 23 September 1917, a German force approached the Rifle Brigade's trench position. According to one report, George heard the Germans cutting the wire and went to warn 2Lt C B Matheson of the danger. While providing this warning, the Germans lobbed "bombs" (presumably hand grenades) into the trench, killing 2Lt Matheson and 2 Sgts instantly. George was wounded, along with 5 other ranks, and was evacuated to a casualty clearing station. George died of his wounds on 24 September 1917.

George's brother, James, followed a similar path. He enlisted in the Royal Flying Corps in early 1915 as an aircraft mechanic. Promoted to Sgt, he was selected for pilot training in late 1917, he gained his wings in June 1918 and was then posted to 11 Sqn flying Bristol Fighters in France in September 1918. James survived the war despite crashing into a trench due to engine failure in October. 

Sorry for the rather personal sharing of this info but I'd never heard of George or James Gamble until a few weeks ago. Both were cousins of my Grandma, and they lived on the same street where my my Grandma and my Mum were born. My family has a pretty humble background, largely coming from the "labouring class" as it was known in the 19th Century. Learning about George made me ponder again how many able leaders were lost during the First World War and the impact down the generations for the families they never had the opportunity to raise.

As you can imagine, George is on my mind quite a lot at the moment. Hope you can forgive my sharing this memorial to him at the centenary of his death.

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## pbehn (Sep 26, 2017)

Good post Buffnut. The passing of time somehow can make things more not less sad. It isn't common now but it used to be for many members of a family to have houses close together. My wife had four aunts and uncles living in the same street as she did or the one next to it, the last passed away last month, but the streets went in the 1960s.


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## buffnut453 (Sep 26, 2017)

Yep...the houses on my Grandma's street were condemned in 1967. My Grandma's family had lived there for around 70 years.


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## fubar57 (Sep 27, 2017)

Thanks for sharing Mark


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## Wayne Little (Oct 12, 2017)

same response.....thanks for sharing mark.....


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## buffnut453 (Oct 12, 2017)

Thanks for the thoughts, gents. I very much appreciate them.

I'm currently reading "The Anger of the Guns" written by a Lieutenant who served alongside George Gamble in the 2nd Battalion, the Rifle Brigade at the time when George was killed. The book is one of the best accounts by a junior officer of life on the front line during WWI. The author documented his memoirs for his family but, after his death, the family decided to publish them. Honest evaluations sometimes suffer in the publishing process when the author focuses on making a statement or strives to gloss over his/her own failings. This book retains an honesty and straightforwardness because it wasn't "written for publishing", with the author freely admitting that he wasn't brave or particularly talented...just an average middle-class young man living through scenes unprecedented in human experience.


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## pbehn (Oct 12, 2017)

buffnut453 said:


> Thanks for the thoughts, gents. I very much appreciate them.
> 
> I'm currently reading "The Anger of the Guns" written by a Lieutenant who served alongside George Gamble in the 2nd Battalion, the Rifle Brigade at the time when George was killed. The book is one of the best accounts by a junior officer of life on the front line during WWI. The author documented his memoirs for his family but, after his death, the family decided to publish them. Honest evaluations sometimes suffer in the publishing process when the author focuses on making a statement or strives to gloss over his/her own failings. This book retains an honesty and straightforwardness because it wasn't "written for publishing", with the author freely admitting that he wasn't brave or particularly talented...just an average middle-class young man living through scenes unprecedented in human experience.


"The last Tommy", a biography of Harry Patch is similar. He only became noted by winning the "lottery of life" ending up as the last surviving soldier from WW1. Harry was the first to admit he was a bang average soldier, just one of many millions doing their bit. His account of the days after the cease fire and before being de mobbed were amusing. Some officers still wanted to run the army as an army while the mainly conscripted men were not interested The normal punishments for mutiny become ridiculous when the war is over, after charging a few soldiers they decided its best to relax the discipline and get everyone home ASAP.


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## mikewint (Oct 12, 2017)

buffnut453 said:


> how many able leaders were lost during the First World War and the impact down the generations for the families they never had the opportunity to raise.


That is something I think about every time I see a picture of Civil War dead or any dead soldiers. The 58,479 names on the Wall for example.
A prime example: Just to mention one, Henry Gwyn Jeffreys Moseley an English Physicist who devised a method to count the number of protons within the atomic nucleus and thus the Atomic Number revising the entire Periodic Table of Elements

When World War I broke out in Western Europe, Moseley left his research work at the University of Oxford behind to volunteer for the Royal Engineers of the British Army. Moseley was assigned to the invasion of Gallipoli, Turkey, in April 1915. Moseley was shot and killed during the battle on 10 August 1915, at the age of 27. Experts have speculated that Moseley could have been awarded the Nobel Prize in Physics in 1916, had he not been killed not to mention what further contributions to Physics he could have made had he lived.

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## buffnut453 (Oct 12, 2017)

mikewint said:


> That is something I think about every time I see a picture of Civil War dead or any dead soldiers. The 58,479 names on the Wall for example.
> A prime example: Just to mention one, Henry Gwyn Jeffreys Moseley an English Physicist who devised a method to count the number of protons within the atomic nucleus and thus the Atomic Number revising the entire Periodic Table of Elements
> 
> When World War I broke out in Western Europe, Moseley left his research work at the University of Oxford behind to volunteer for the Royal Engineers of the British Army. Moseley was assigned to the invasion of Gallipoli, Turkey, in April 1915. Moseley was shot and killed during the battle on 10 August 1915, at the age of 27. Experts have speculated that Moseley could have been awarded the Nobel Prize in Physics in 1916, had he not been killed not to mention what further contributions to Physics he could have made had he lived.



Entirely agree, Mike, although we must remember that not every soldier was a Nobel candidate, a born leader or even a model citizen. I have 2 other relatives who served in the British Army in the 19th Century, one of whom was court martialed TWICE while the second was imprisoned for assaulting a police officer and had his soldierly characteristics summed up in 3 words "Irregular. Intemperate. Bad." That said, all served and put their lives on the line for their country, which must count for something, right? Not all were heroic people but their willingness to serve is an act of heroism itself (IMHO).

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## pbehn (Oct 12, 2017)

buffnut453 said:


> Entirely agree, Mike, although we must remember that not every soldier was a Nobel candidate, a born leader or even a model citizen. I have 2 other relatives who served in the British Army in the 19th Century, one of whom was court martialed TWICE while the second was imprisoned for assaulting a police officer and had his soldierly characteristics summed up in 3 words "Irregular. Intemperate. Bad." That said, all served and put their lives on the line for their country, which must count for something, right? Not all were heroic people but their willingness to serve is an act of heroism itself (IMHO).


When someone joins up at 21 he has had time to show that he was a brilliant scientist poet or whatever, we will never know what those who went in their teens could have done.

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## pbehn (Oct 12, 2017)

One area of losses that is never discussed because it isn't considered part of the war but was a side effect is accidents, especially road accidents. My wife would have had an uncle Alfie but he was hit by a bus in London during the blackout. Road deaths in UK were more than 8000 per year throughout the war at an all time record of 9,169 in 1941, Total deaths on the roads were estimated at about 45,000 with serious injuries/ injuries approx. ten times that. You cant say that Alfie was killed by war in any way but if there wasn't a war he wouldn't be in a blacked out city getting hit by a bus with no lights. Alfie was 21.

Reported Road Casualties Great Britain - Wikipedia


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## buffnut453 (Oct 12, 2017)

Any death or serious injury is a tragedy for the family involved. Sometimes the personal stories get lost in the sheer numbers of people killed or wounded (or otherwise damaged) in major conflicts. And I agree the "incidental" losses in warfare, like people killed by falling AAA shells or accidents in the blackout, ought to be remembered, as should those who served but lost their lives in mundane circumstances. 

I recall a Squadron Leader captured in Singapore, spent 4 years in Japanese POW camps, returned to the UK at the end of the war and stayed in the RAF. He lost his life trying to take photos of a De Havilland Vampire that was landing - the Vampire wingtip struck his head and killed him. After all he went through, he lost his life in an accident that was entirely avoidable. 

For those of us blessed to grow up in (mostly) gentler times, the sheer ability to survive events like the Western Front 1914-1918 or 4 years in a Japanese POW camp simply beggars belief. My Great-Great-Aunt Elizabeth's husband, William Pountney, joined up on 1 Sep 1914 and went to France with the Royal Welch Fusiliers. On the second day of the Battle of the Somme, William suffered a gunshot wound to the chest. Evacuated to Blghty, he made a full recovery but was back in France less than 4 months later. He was one of the lucky ones who survived the carnage of WWI.

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## mikewint (Oct 12, 2017)

Roughly 1,264,000 Americans have died in wars from the Civil War on. 620,000 in the Civil War alone. It's impossible to say in any meaningful way what effect their non-deaths would have had on today. Interesting to speculate. The good, the bad, fatherless-sons, fatherless-daughters, wives who remarried and had children who otherwise would not have existed and the reverse, wives who never remarried and did not have children that they might have had.
How different would the USA be if Lincoln and/or Kennedy had not been killed. Or Grant had been or Stonewall had not. Boggles the mind


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## vikingBerserker (Oct 12, 2017)

Thanks for sharing that Mark.


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## pbehn (Oct 12, 2017)

mikewint said:


> Roughly 1,264,000 Americans have died in wars from the Civil War on. 620,000 in the Civil War alone. It's impossible to say in any meaningful way what effect their non-deaths would have had on today. Interesting to speculate. The good, the bad, fatherless-sons, fatherless-daughters, wives who remarried and had children who otherwise would not have existed and the reverse, wives who never remarried and did not have children that they might have had.
> How different would the USA be if Lincoln and/or Kennedy had not been killed. Or Grant had been or Stonewall had not. Boggles the mind


WW1 was unique in UK military history. Total deaths were between 1 and 2% of the population whereas the English civil war was upto 10% in deaths from all causes. However the losses were asymmetric. Ideas like the "pals" regiments" meant some communities had 50% of their men killed or injured others hardly suffered at all. Officers were killed at a much higher rate than privates. On a human level a rich educated mans life is not worth more or less than the illegitimate son of a housemaid but no nation can conduct an activity that kills its brightest and best young men at a higher rate than any other. Henry Mosely was shot and killed by a sniper telephoning an order, he was educated so he was an officer and so he gave orders and it got him shot. Maybe making that call was no more or less risky than his company's activities but the statistics show in WW1 officers died more often than privates by percentage.

Hee


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