# Best Euro jets for Korean War



## Admiral Beez (Mar 22, 2021)

Britain and France fought in the Korean War, 1950-53. Which jet fighters could they send to best match the MiG-15 and the other North Korean fighters? The Gloster Meteor isn‘t going to cut it. Maybe the Supermarine Swift and Dassault Mystère (both introduced early 1954) can be expedited by seven or eight months? Without these, it’s Attackers, Vampires, Sea Hawks and Ouragans. Outside of Britain and France and purely hypothetically, Europe’s best match to the MiG-15 may be the Saab 29 Tunnan.

As it was the best Commonwealth jet fighter in Korea was the Canadair Sabre.


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## FLYBOYJ (Mar 22, 2021)

Admiral Beez said:


> Britain and France fought in the Korean War, 1950-53. Which jet fighters could they send to best match the MiG-15 and the other North Korean fighters? The Gloster Meteor isn‘t going to cut it. Maybe the Supermarine Swift and Dassault Mystère (both introduced early 1954) can be expedited by seven or eight months? Without these, it’s Attackers, Vampires, Sea Hawks and Ouragans. Outside of Britain and France and purely hypothetically, Europe’s best match to the MiG-15 may be the Saab 29 Tunnan.
> 
> As it was the best Commonwealth jet fighter in Korea was the Canadair Sabre.


Out of actual contenders, it seems the Tunnan would be the only one available at the time of the conflict, the Mystere might have made it as well (as you pointed out). The rest mentioned weren't going to compete with the MiG-15 to include the Swift which was placed in service too quickly.

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## michaelmaltby (Mar 23, 2021)

.. the Canadair Sabre was good but I was not aware that any served in Korea ... RCAF pilots on exchange service with the USAF like Sqd. Ldr. Andy MacKenzie flew the issue F-86 as far as I can tell.


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## Shortround6 (Mar 23, 2021)

US apparently got 60 Canadian Sabres in late 1952 to help augment US production. 
No idea if any actually made it to Korea.

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## Admiral Beez (Mar 23, 2021)

michaelmaltby said:


> .. the Canadair Sabre was good but I was not aware that any served in Korea ... RCAF pilots on exchange service with the USAF like Sqd. Ldr. Andy MacKenzie flew the issue F-86 as far as I can tell.


That makes more sense. I wouldn’t want to take a CF-100 to Korea.


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## michaelmaltby (Mar 23, 2021)

" ... That makes more sense. I wouldn’t want to take a CF-100 to Korea."
Agree ...
But why not - take over/suppliment the USAF night-fighter Lockheed 'Starfires' and Maine 'Sky Knights'. A much better airframe and AC, IMHO.
I can see the UK aerodesign lineage in 'the clunk'-- a jet Beaufighter.


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## Admiral Beez (Mar 23, 2021)

michaelmaltby said:


> I can see the UK aerodesign lineage in 'the clunk'


Certainly, Avro Canada was a wholly-owned subsidiary of Hawker Siddeley. But the poor devil would be a disaster in Korea... no gun, and no faster than a contemporary Gloster Meteor. It's too bad the Hawker Hunter was so delayed, it would have given the MiG-15 a worthy challenge.


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## FLYBOYJ (Mar 23, 2021)

Admiral Beez said:


> Certainly, Avro Canada was a wholly-owned subsidiary of Hawker Siddeley. But the poor devil would be a disaster in Korea... no gun, and no faster than a contemporary Gloster Meteor. It's too bad the Hawker Hunter was so delayed,* it would have given the MiG-15 a worthy challenge.*



Agree.

Something about the Canadair Saber - for the most part they were identical to the US produced versions (I met people who built Canadair Sabers and there were claims that "theirs" were built better, I find that arguable). The Big difference came with the Saber Mk V which first introduced the Orenda 10 engine. The best of the Saber series were the Canadair Saber Mk VI and the CAC Saber IMO. Ironically the Mk V Saber first flew within days of the Korean cease-fire.

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## FLYBOYJ (Mar 23, 2021)

Admiral Beez said:


> That makes more sense. I wouldn’t want to take a CF-100 to Korea.


Don't rule out the Clunk - I think it would have done fine as an all-weather interceptor in the same capacity as the F-94 or the F3D.

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## Admiral Beez (Mar 23, 2021)

FLYBOYJ said:


> Agree.
> 
> Something about the Canadair Saber - for the most part they were identical to the US produced versions (I met people who built Canadair Sabers and there were claims that "theirs" were built better, I find that arguable). The Big difference came with the Saber Mk V which first introduced the Orenda 10 engine. The best of the Saber series were the Canadair Saber Mk VI and the CAC Saber IMO. Ironically the Mk V Saber first flew within days of the Korean cease-fire.


I recall that the Canadair Sabre and Folland Gnat were well matched over India-Pakistan.


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## FLYBOYJ (Mar 23, 2021)

Admiral Beez said:


> I recall that the Canadair Sabre and Folland Gnat were well matched over India-Pakistan.


During the conflicts between India and Pakistan, one really has to consider pilot skill and training in the forefront. The Gnat gave the Saber a run for its money and shot down several Saber VIs, but also consider that a PAF pilot flying a Saber claimed 5 Hunters in one fight and 9 over-all. An F-86 claimed an IAF MiG-21FL.

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## special ed (Mar 23, 2021)

I recall reading when RCAF took it's Sabre VI unit to NATO that in response to comments by USAF F-100 pilots an impromptu combat trounced every F-100.

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## FLYBOYJ (Mar 23, 2021)

special ed said:


> I recall reading when RCAF took it's Sabre VI unit to NATO that in response to comments by USAF F-100 pilots an impromptu combat trounced every F-100.


This probably happened on more than one occasion.

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## Admiral Beez (Mar 25, 2021)

FLYBOYJ said:


> During the conflicts between India and Pakistan, one really has to consider pilot skill and training in the forefront.


A good point, we mustn’t forget the man at the tiller. The Israelis shot down every MiG they seemed to come across.


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## Dimlee (Mar 25, 2021)

I just saw the title, and "Tunnan" came to mind immediately.
Still inferior in climb and thrust/weight compared with Mig-15. 4x20mm would be more deadly than Sabre's MGs.
But probably Saab did not have the production capacity to built enough in time if ordered? Another "what if" subject.

Old threads:
NA F-86 vs Saab J29 -which why?
J29 v F86 v Mig 15

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