# Strange photo



## Marcogrifo (Jun 1, 2009)

Days ago I came across this strange photo of an early model of Heinkel 111 bomber on the site Airwar.ru:







Can someone tells me for what reason they digged into ground wheels? 

I really can't figure out why...

Cheers


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## Colin1 (Jun 1, 2009)

The only practical reason I can think of for digging the wheels out is that it got bogged in, they waited for the ground to dry out sufficiently and then got to it


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## Marcogrifo (Jun 1, 2009)

Colin1 said:


> The only practical reason I can think of for digging the wheels out is that it got bogged in, they waited for the ground to dry out sufficiently and then got to it


Yep, I see the point, it make sense, thank you Colin.
Anyway seems a bit strange to me they had previously parked the plane into a real marsh...

Any other?


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## Colin1 (Jun 1, 2009)

Marcogrifo said:


> Yep, I see the point, it make sense, thank you Colin.
> Anyway seems a bit strange to me they had previously parked the plane into a real marsh...
> 
> Any other?



I don't think they deliberately parked it in a 'marsh'.
The onset of the Russian winter brought many problems for German mobility, mud or 'rasputitsa' severely hampered progress, resupply and affected all arms of the German offensive, roads and landing strips were quickly reduced to quagmires. Ground forces often resorted to wheeled vehicles being towed by tracked vehicles, the Luftwaffe just did the best they could.


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## GrauGeist (Jun 1, 2009)

Colin1 said:


> I don't think they deliberately parked it in a 'marsh'.
> The onset of the Russian winter brough many problems for German mobility, mud or 'rasputitsa' severely hampered progress, resupply and affected all arms of the German offensive, roads and landing strips were quickly reduced to quagmires. Ground forces often resorted to wheeled vehicles being towed by tracked vehicles, the Luftwaffe just did the best they could.


Funny how that same exact problem hampered Napoleon's troops too...


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## Matt308 (Jun 1, 2009)

Marcogrifo said:


> Days ago I came across this strange photo of an early model of Heinkel 111 bomber on the site Airwar.ru:



That's not an He-111. It looks to be an DB-3/Il-4.


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## pbfoot (Jun 1, 2009)

I think it might be am early HE111 A or B model


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## Colin1 (Jun 1, 2009)

I thought it was an early He111 too but I'm not familiar enough to positively identify it, be helpful if we could see the tail, that was unmistakeable


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## pbfoot (Jun 1, 2009)

Colin1 said:


> I thought it was an early He111 too but I'm not familiar enough to positively identify it, be helpful if we could see the tail, that was unmistakeable


I believe the Russian aircraft had radials


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## Marcogrifo (Jun 1, 2009)

I think there's no doubt it's an Heinkel He111-b1 like this below:


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## Colin1 (Jun 1, 2009)

Marcogrifo said:


> I think there's no doubt it's an Heinkel He111-b1 like this below:


They're too well-dressed to be Russian ground crew


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## Matt308 (Jun 1, 2009)

pbfoot said:


> I believe the Russian aircraft had radials



Yeah I know, but I was thinking they might have been Klimov diesels. I stand corrected.


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## A4K (Jun 2, 2009)

I think Colin hit the nail on the head with the reason for the attitude of the wheels - you can see the planks lying around ready to be used for traction when they pull her out.


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## HerrKaleut (Jun 2, 2009)

It is a 111B -1. I originally thought a b-2 but those nacelles are different


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## blimp (Oct 25, 2009)

hi folks , a quick i.d. check shows the lack of early wing mounted oilcoolers and larger radiators make this version a He 111 b2 .


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## Vic Balshaw (Oct 25, 2009)

A4K said:


> I think Colin hit the nail on the head with the reason for the attitude of the wheels - you can see the planks lying around ready to be used for traction when they pull her out.



I tend to agree, we had a similar problem with an Islander that landed on our short runway at Talbingo, Snowy Mountains, NSW. When it turn round on the grass, it was so wet the aircraft wheels just sank into the mud.


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## antoni (Oct 25, 2009)

One possibility that comes to mind is that it is the He 111 b-2 captured during the Spanish Civil War, dismantled and shipped to the Soviet Union where it was extensively tested.


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## JacquesDav (Dec 20, 2022)

Marcogrifo said:


> Days ago I came across this strange photo of an early model of Heinkel 111 bomber on the site Airwar.ru:
> 
> View attachment 401073
> 
> ...


Bloch 162… but I’m not the first to point it out.

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## Thumpalumpacus (Dec 20, 2022)

I think you're right -- I think I can see the tops of the vert stabs behind engines 2 and 3.


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## fubar57 (Dec 20, 2022)

Different angle

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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Dec 20, 2022)

Marcogrifo said:


> Days ago I came across this strange photo of an early model of Heinkel 111 bomber on the site Airwar.ru:
> 
> View attachment 401073
> 
> ...



That is not an He 111. The He 111 is a 2 engined aircraft.

Edit: I see I am fashionably late the party and others have already chimed in.


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Dec 20, 2022)

Wow! I’m way off my game. This thread is 13 years old. Way fashionably late!

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## fubar57 (Dec 20, 2022)

DerAdlerIstGelandet said:


> That is not an He 111. The He 111 is a 2 engined aircraft.
> 
> Edit: I see I am fashionably late the party and others have already chimed in.


I wonder why the thread went on for so long saying it was a -111. I kept going back to the picture looking for the -111 and actually thought the original photo had been edited.

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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Dec 20, 2022)

fubar57 said:


> I wonder why the thread went on for so long saying it was a -111. I kept going back to the picture looking for the -111 and actually thought the original photo had been edited.



Maybe the picture has changed.


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## Frog (Dec 20, 2022)

The picture was shot during the XVIth Salon Aéronautique at the Grand Palais, Paris in november and december 1938 (the last preceding WW 2).
The plane is the unique example of the Bloch 162 prototype 4 engines bomber. This must be the section from the Marcel Bloch company as there is a MB 151 fighter at the bottom right.

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## fubar57 (Dec 20, 2022)

I'm still curious as to why Matt had a diagram of the -111 and the mention of planks and people on the ground. There is no Edit in the original post


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Dec 20, 2022)

I do think that somewhere in the last 13 years the link to the picture changed. I have a feeling there was an He 111 there 13 years ago.

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## fubar57 (Dec 20, 2022)

Interesting. While searching for another photo of the not He 111 is saw the Airwar.ru site. Off we go................


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## GrauGeist (Dec 20, 2022)

I vaguely remember this thread (oddly enough) and there was an He111 hopelessly mired in the mud.

The result was that it looked like the Heinkel had no main wheels.


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## Wurger (Dec 21, 2022)

Frog said:


> The picture was shot during the XVIth Salon Aéronautique at the Grand Palais, Paris in november and december 1938 (the last preceding WW 2).
> The plane is the unique example of the Bloch 162 prototype 4 engines bomber. This must be the section from the Marcel Bloch company as there is a MB 151 fighter at the bottom right.



I agree. It's the Bloch MB.162 B5.





















the source: 1/72 Bloch MB.162

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## Frog (Dec 21, 2022)

An illustration of too little, too late as it first flew on june 1st, 1940.
Later seized by the Germans, it is said to have been used by KG 200 for clandestine missions, later fate unknown.

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