# AH-64 Gun Cam Footage



## seeker (May 13, 2005)

Not for the weak at heart......


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## cheddar cheese (May 13, 2005)

Nice! 8)


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## Royzee617 (May 13, 2005)

Detached destruction.... seems too much like a vid game esp since it is mono... no screams, no blood... not nice at all. I have reservations about whether vids like this one belong on this site... seems the moderators were asleep.


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## Nonskimmer (May 13, 2005)

The video can stay. It's no less acceptable here than the WWII gun camera footage.


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## evangilder (May 13, 2005)

There have been worse videos on this site. Some of the guncam footage is equally gruesome. Hiding the destruction does not make it go away. War is not a pretty business, as some of us know first-hand. 

What I will ask though is that if it is graphic and potentially disturbing that we are warned first.


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## Blitzkrieg Bop (May 13, 2005)

I agree with royzee. With ww2 aviation guncam footage u see pieces of metal blowing off. In this vid u can uctually see a human being blown up and see all eh, all 'sorts' of pieces of him flying everywhere (still, in both vids there is someone actually being killed at that moment!). But this is a bit to violence (especially becouse i did not ever witnessed this (and i aint planning to do either!!!!), but if i did, what does that matters...????? Does it makes me not knowing something other people do know????). And maybe im am an hider for destruction, but this is too cruel and just too much. What if it is your brother that u are seeing blown up? And i know, ur brother aint a terrorist, but whatever. It aint much of a pretty sight to see someone getting blown up even if it is your enemy. And if this can be putted on this site, what about the decapitation off all those people in Irak??? Thats the same destruction of people! That also is killing someone although not for the same reasons but for the same thoughts (he's wrong, i'm right). I think u just can't put this sort of vids on sites becouse people do deserve some respect, instead of being shot off like ducks in a video game!!!!

I'd like to know how all you guys think about this and i think i'm one of the non cambattants around here...


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## Nonskimmer (May 13, 2005)

I agree with evan. War isn't, and has never been, a pretty business. The WWII footage may not have shown men being carved to ribbons, but it happened nonetheless in many cases. 

I also agree that any graphic and potentially disturbing video from now on should be preceded by a warning of some kind. Then if you feel that you may be offended by it, you simply don't have to watch it.


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## Medvedya (May 13, 2005)

There was a warning. Not for the faint hearted. Kinda of gives you a rough idea of the content don't it?

A video game? In fairness, this is what much of modern warfare is like. And what on Earth do you think is happening to a pilot in a film of gun-cam footage? It's a safe bet he ain't thinking oh darn, I'm gonna have to respawn! 

Who said we're going to allow films of hostage executions? You're comparing apples and pears. What you're talking about there is close up footage of someone being murdered by having their throat cut.

The footage here is shot through an image intensifier of some unidentifiable people, who certantly aren't there for a midnight picnic. I'm sorry, but I can't see where you're coming from at all - if we disallowed this, then we'd have to junk half the pictures on the site.


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## Nonskimmer (May 13, 2005)

Nonskimmer said:


> I also agree that any graphic and potentially disturbing video from now on should be preceded by a warning of some kind.


I saw the warning Med. What I meant by this was that _all_ graphic clips should be preceded by a warning. I should have made that clear.

But I think it's safe to say that videos of this nature will continue to be allowed here. If you fail to heed warnings of graphic content and decide to view them anyway, the choice is entirely yours.


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## Hot Space (May 13, 2005)

Not woman with big breast's again? I had that last week..........ok 1st time since 1978 but I am getting old you know  

Hot Space


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## Nonskimmer (May 13, 2005)

I know.


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## Hot Space (May 13, 2005)

...............and my breast's  

Hot Space


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## Nonskimmer (May 13, 2005)

...hit the floor.


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## Hot Space (May 13, 2005)

..........downstairs on the person below  

Hot Space


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## Blitzkrieg Bop (May 14, 2005)

Well Medvedya, i think we just disagree. You think ur right and i think i'm right. I think u just cant show this sort of stuff on the internet, but thats just my opinion, and im not the administrator. And about the guncam footage, i allready said that that aint much of a heroes death... And im not comparing apples with peares. You just said it for yourselfe, in the guncam footage and in that AH64 clip are both people bein killed. But anyway, like i said, u think ur right and i think i'm right. I hope u can see my point. 

Greetings!


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## lesofprimus (May 14, 2005)

> I think u just cant show this sort of stuff on the internet, but thats just my opinion


Are u kidding me dude???? The pussification of the world has begun.... Everyone put on ur blinders........ Only look at the nice and cuddly things of life... Stay away and avert ur eyes from the scary and nasty........

Gimme a break........ Those idiots that were being blown apart by those wonderful little 20 mm shells are insurgents, hence terrorists.... They make bombs and blow up innocent civilians and MY FREAKIN COUNTRYMEN!!!!!!!! 
Men and women laying THEIR lives on the line for a bunch of people that they dont know........ 

If u dont want to see blood and guts then dont look at the images and/or videos.....

JUST DONT CLICK ON IT................

I think that there should be more clips and videos of terrorists being made into Allahs Chosen Ones. Maybe the terrorists will start seeing them and realize that the whole Allahs Kingdom crap is exactly that...........


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## evangilder (May 14, 2005)

Trust me, there are way more graphic depictions of firefights and it's after-effects out there on the internet. If it carries a disclaimer that it is not for the faint of heart or that it is graphic and may be disturbing to some, then that should really be enough. It is up to the individual as to whether they want to view it or not.


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## Nonskimmer (May 14, 2005)

Exactly. In short, if you don't want to see it, don't look. Simple.


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## Blitzkrieg Bop (May 14, 2005)

Man. I'm not even goin to awnser that.. And i agree that i just dont have to click on it and i wont...


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## Hot Space (May 14, 2005)

Where did you find this m8?

Hot Space


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## lesofprimus (May 14, 2005)

Ive had this clip for over 2 years now it seems like......... Its been all over the net......


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## Erich (May 15, 2005)

Frankly I luv it ! the assholes got what they deserved...........


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## Nonskimmer (May 15, 2005)

To say the least. That last guy shouldn't have stuck his head out like that.
"Good-bye, stupid!".


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## Royzee617 (May 15, 2005)

Phew this has stirred up a hornets' nest.

Some further points...

1. After viewing it I don't think I want to see this kind of vid clip on this site. It is one of the most unpleasant clips I have ever seen. I certainly would not want my kids to see it.

2. I say that whether there is a warning or not. Or whether it goes into a special thread of 'gun camera footage only' etc. 

3. It hardly qualifies for a World War II site either - but I have to be careful as some of my stuff is post-WW2.

4. I am puzzled it is here and wonder where it came from. This sort of thing is either faked (I doubt it) or in effect stolen from some official footage because I can hardly see the people who made this release it into the public domain. This is especially pertinent given the recent fuss about soldiers abusing their prison charges. Uncle Sam 'throwing its weight around' like this is IMHO counter-productive. OK these soldiers were following orders and maybe these are terrorists (maybe not). But it is surely a good recruitment film for those who are against the US.

5. Finally, I also wonder who the person is who posted it? Seems odd to me to post something unpleasant like this on your first posting (and possibly last). To me it would seem to be not his/her property and was put up here to show off to his/her friends. So in that respect I think it is certainly an abuse of the site and its freedoms to post larger files. 

Other sites have a 2 meg limit or you have to submit it for moderation first. So I hope this will not lead to us frequent posters having our serious fun spoiled by this piece of trash.


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## lesofprimus (May 15, 2005)

I suppose that with the title "AH-64 Guncam footage" u thought the vid was of the Iraqi countryside and all the pretty camels and dunes????



> 1. After viewing it I don't think I want to see this kind of vid clip on this site. It is one of the most unpleasant clips I have ever seen. I certainly would not want my kids to see it.


A. U dont determine what goes and is deleted on this site... U can go to another site that doesnt have a Off Topic Forum and these kind of GHASTLY and Horrendous clips wont be found....
B. U didnt have to view it, but the fact that u did shows that u wanted to see it.......
C. It is ur choice to show ur child this clip or not... Not the internets... Or this sites.... U as a parent are responsible for what ur children view, whether its TV, DVD's, or the internet... NetNanny and NetWatch are great programs for parents who cannot control their children.......



> 2. I say that whether there is a warning or not. Or whether it goes into a special thread of 'gun camera footage only' etc.


A. And I say ur some kinda discombobulated nincompoop........



> 3. It hardly qualifies for a World War II site either - but I have to be careful as some of my stuff is post-WW2.


A. Hence why it is located in the OFF TOPIC / MISCELLANOUS FORUM...... If u do not want to see any Unrelated info/pics/vids/topics of Aviation, then dont go to a forum labeled OFF TOPIC............



> 4. I am puzzled it is here and wonder where it came from. This sort of thing is either faked (I doubt it) or in effect stolen from some official footage because I can hardly see the people who made this release it into the public domain.


A. Have u ever heard of The Discovery Channel??? Or the Learning Channel??? American Shows..... They have shows dealing with subject matter such as the "Fire Control Systems of the AH-64" and whatnot.. They get their rights to use said footage from the United States Govt....



> This is especially pertinent given the recent fuss about soldiers abusing their prison charges.


B. This clip was from the opening days of the war, a long time ago, as I stated before in this thread... It has no bearing on todays politics....



> Uncle Sam 'throwing its weight around' like this is IMHO counter-productive.


C. What in the living hell are u talking about???? What kind of pussificated pansy are u??? Sounds like some Anti-American Feelings there.....



> OK these soldiers were following orders and maybe these are terrorists (maybe not)


D. So are u actually implying the the US Army just haphazzardly goes around the counrtyside dismembering innocent civilians with 20mm cannonfire cause its a "Fun" thing to do??? Are u honestly that retarded???? Or has the soft leftest media pumped enough of that anti-war crap up ur ass that ur actually starting to believe it???



> But it is surely a good recruitment film for those who are against the US.


E. Like urself???



> 5. Finally, I also wonder who the person is who posted it? Seems odd to me to post something unpleasant like this on your first posting (and possibly last).


A. The person who posted it is probably a patriotic individual who supports his troops and his country's decision to end tyranny and abuse...
Or, he just like seeing terrorists get blown to little tiny pieces as payback for the 13 people he knew, like myself, who died a horrible and horrific death in the World Trade Center Terrorist Attack........



> To me it would seem to be not his/her property and was put up here to show off to his/her friends.


B. I have no idea what the hell u mean by this, so ill ignore it.........



> Other sites have a 2 meg limit or you have to submit it for moderation first. So I hope this will not lead to us frequent posters having our serious fun spoiled by this piece of trash.


Blah Blah Blah........ If this is serious fun 4 u, typing on a keyboard in ur room, by urself, u need to find a new hobby...... 

There are these things out there called "Women"... They are usually slightly shorter than urself, have longer hair and have 2 bumps where they shouldnt..... Dont be surprised if u suddenly find out that they are pink inside.... Everythings OK........

Oh and 1 more thing... Always remember, one mans trash is another mans treasure........


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## plan_D (May 15, 2005)

SHAME ON YOU, LES!

It's 30mm, not 20mm. M-230 30mm to be precise. How dare you shame those Apache pilots into thinking they have a pussy 20mm between their legs.


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## lesofprimus (May 15, 2005)

And so I have been corrected.... TY...


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## plan_D (May 15, 2005)

Oh yeah and the ones that are being pussies, stop it. Those people who got blasted were stupid enough to get in the way of a 30mm round, they deserve it. 

And personally, I enjoy watching them get blown to pieces...serves them right for breaking the law when a AH-64 is around.


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## Erich (May 15, 2005)

anyone care to post an AH-64 for us.

3cm eh ? the way the rounds were hitting the targets / the trucks it appeared as 2cm as the debris really did not cover large distances. Would of thought the 3cm hits would of devastated the vehicles beside those insurgent maggots ............

yes we are a poweful nation and I stand behind her, her actions in the mid-east and her troops totally. I did back in the late 60's-early 70's and would do it again if I could........... 

don't get me pissed or my foot will be right up your crotch


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## lesofprimus (May 15, 2005)

Here u go.. Thx to Adler.........


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## plan_D (May 15, 2005)

It looks much better in grey, in my opinion. In fact, I'm going to steal that picture.


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## lesofprimus (May 15, 2005)

Feel freee..... I did..........


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## plan_D (May 15, 2005)

According to http://www.jolly-rogers.com/airpower/ah-64d/64d-arm.htm the Longbow Apache (AH-64D) carries a M230E1 30mm cannon under the fuselage.


> Rate of fire for the M230 is 600-650 rounds per minute, the spool-up time to acheive this rate being a brief 0.2 seconds. 1200 rounds are carried in the magazine-pack above the gun. Each round takes approximately 2 seconds to travel 1000m. However, as the shell's energy dissipates, it takes some 12.2 seconds to cover 3000m.


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## lesofprimus (May 15, 2005)

Basically, VERY bad news for someone lurking around in the nighttime with an RPG........


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## plan_D (May 15, 2005)

As those peckers found out. 

You may have been confusing the AH-1 armament with the AH-64 (because I used to). The AH-1 carries a M197 20mm three-barelled cannon. They're using AH-1W (?) in Iraq, so some of those terrorists get the feel of the 20mm while others get the 30mm...

And those lucky souls to meet a M1A2 get either a .50cal or 105mm...


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## Erich (May 15, 2005)

great pic but I thought the chin mount was a 2cm chain gun ?


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## plan_D (May 15, 2005)

No, it's 20mm on the AH-1.


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## Erich (May 15, 2005)

another fine pic, ok Ich verstehen  

carve em into dog meat boyz ...........


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## lesofprimus (May 15, 2005)

Never heard u talk like this before Erich..... Ur normally alittle more reserved........


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## Erich (May 15, 2005)

yes I try to be a bit reserved but it must be taking me back to the Vietnam dayz.....funny what can stir things up in the soul.....agent orange, red, blue, here we come ~


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## Royzee617 (May 15, 2005)

Wow thanks for the long replies. But I am puzzled. How come we are supposed to be able to express our opinions on a forum like this and yet there is always someone who has to resort to insults and question one's patriotism into the bargain?

I stand by what I wrote. 

I am from the UK and have the greatest respect for many (but not all) of the people in the military who defend us. I am not against the use of strong measures against the enemies whoever they are but the use of this video as entertainment is gratuitous nastiness of the worst kind. 

It just doesn't have a place on this site... pure and simple. Whoever posted it is probaly having a great laugh about all this verbiage and I wonder why I bothered in the first place.

Taken out of its context this video is worthless and could only do the respected US forces harm IMHO. Whatever these guys in the video have done, or were going to do, did they deserve this? To be blasted to pieces when they had not fired on the helicopter? When they were not given a warning? When they were not clearly presenting a threat?

I have seen another video where an Apache opens up on a target and destroys it. Only after does the pilot discover it is a US AFV. That was tragic. I have great reservations about this kind of offensive firepower. OK our guys deserve the best in equipment and the means to use it but sometimes it just seems cowardly, bullying almost, to stand off and blast someone like this. I hate to think what would happen if some of our guys did this in Northern Ireland against 'suspected terrorists'.

Guncam footage of a dogfight is a different matter entirely. It is one armed man against another. They both know the score and only one can win. Strafing some guys messing about with a truck can be seen as an unequal contest. Bullying even. Yes, terrorism is wrong but this is not right either. If we lower our standards to their level then they have won.

That is my opionion and I am entitled to express it on this forum without being villified for my trouble.


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## lesofprimus (May 15, 2005)

Balh Blah Blah... U have ur opinion, as does everyone else... Justlike assholes, everyones got one.... 

U obviously have never served in uniform and defended ur counrty in a time of war, so ur opinion really means shiit to me in the first place...

BUT...........

I posted this video originally about 7 months ago here... There is a background story to it that wasnt followed on... These were Insurgents in Eastern Iraq who had previously shot at 2 helicopters earlier that afternoon...

These 2 Apaches were sent in at night to alieveiate the problem... I have the WHOLE clip where it shows them throwing weapons on the ground and hiding them, as they seem to hear the helicopters off in the distance and get skittish... One even throws down his RPG into the high grass...

They were eliminated with severe predjudice...

Whatever else u have to say is Greek......... I will Villify anyone or anything that I feel needs to be Villified......

I AM THE VILLINATOR!!!

Oh and BTW...


> yet there is always someone who has to resort to insults and question one's patriotism into the bargain?


Regard my sentence above...



> Whatever these guys in the video have done, or were going to do, did they deserve this? To be blasted to pieces when they had not fired on the helicopter? When they were not given a warning? When they were not clearly presenting a threat?


Why dont we give all the Terrorists of the World a Big Break... They are SOOOOO misunderstood... Maybe if we took the time to know them better, we'd find out what kind and devoted people they are.... So what if some of their bretheren and compatriots SLAMMED A COUPLE OF PLANES INTO NEW YORKS TALLEST BUILDINGS.........

Lets buy them some nice pajamas and have tea and crumpets with them on the front lawn of Taj Mahal...

STFU Moron......

If ur gonna sit there and try and fight for the rights of terrorists and insurgents, u had better take ur faggot-ass attitude, opinions and beliefs somewhere else pal...... Those kind of opinions arent welcomed here....


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## plan_D (May 15, 2005)

The terrorists started the war! They obviously never heard anyone say "War isn't fair!" because they would have realised, they'd be getting blasted from miles away when they had no chance to fight back. 

There's no 'bullying' - it's effective war with the least casualties as possible inflicted on your own men. The Coalition fly the flag of a standing army, they wear army colours, the let everyone know their presence in the country...the thick bastards that stand against them get blown to pieces, it's simple.

And I didn't post the video but I was laughing hysterically at them!


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## Nonskimmer (May 15, 2005)

Yeah, it made me feel kinda good to watch it too.
There's just something about seeing assholes getting shot to shit that just does it every time.


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## plan_D (May 15, 2005)

Someone should have told them "You don't warm your ass on a fire and expect not to get burnt"


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## Hot Space (May 16, 2005)

Has anyone seen my cat? I can't find him and I swear he was around here somewhere  

Hot Space


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## Blitzkrieg Bop (May 16, 2005)

Man, some of us here really did miss something in their education. Like royzee said, you guys lower your standards to the terrorists. Hate spraids more hate man, why dont you see that??!! violence causes more hate.. But luckily not all americans are that dumb.. And if u think we defend the terrorists, man than ur even dumber as the terrorists.. 

http://www.sorryeverybody.com/


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## Hot Space (May 16, 2005)

I know this isn't a great topic for a Thread, but can folk's be a little more "nicer" here shall I say, please  

Might put off the newbies that come here if they see us all bitching at each other all the time.

Hot Space


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## evangilder (May 16, 2005)

This is getting a little heated. Obviously, there are strong opinions on both sides of this. The way it was posted, with no background information led some to believe that this was just unjustified killing. I tend to disagree. Les has provided the background info that maybe should have been there to begin with. I think we all need to take astep back on this one and agree to disagree. If it continues, I will lock this post.


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## FLYBOYJ (May 16, 2005)

Before you lock this thread Evan I think we all need to take this test...

1) In 1972 at the Munich Olympics, athletes were kidnapped massacred by: 
(a) Olga Corbutt 
(b) Sitting Bull 
(c) Arnold Schwartzeneger 
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 40

2) In 1979, the U.S. embassy in Iran was taken over by: 

(a) Lost Norwegians 
(b) Elvis 
(c) A tour bus full of 80-year-old women 
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 40

3) During the 1980's a number of Americans were kidnapped in Lebanon by: 

(a) John Dillinger 
(b) The King of Sweden 
(c) The Boy Scouts 
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 40

4) In 1983, the U.S. Marine barracks in Beirut was blown up by: 

(a) A pizza delivery boy 
(b) Pee Wee Herman 
(c) Geraldo Rivera making up for a slow news day 
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 40.

5) In 1985 the cruise ship Achille Lauro was hijacked, and a 70 year old American passenger was murdered and thrown overboard by: 

(a) The Smurfs 
(b) Davy Jones 
(c) The Little Mermaid 
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 40.

6) In 1985 TWA flight 847 was hijacked in Athens, a U.S. Navy diver was murdered by: 

(a) Captain Kid 
(b) Charles Lindberg 
(c) Mother Teresa 
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 40

7) In 1988, Pan Am Flight 103 was bombed by: 

(a) Scooby Doo 
(b) The Tooth Fairy 
(c) Butch Cassidy The Sundance Kid who had a few sticks of dynamite 
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 40

8) In 1993 the World Trade Center was bombed the first time by: 

(a) Richard Simmons 
(b) Grandma Moses 
(c) Michael Jordan 
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 40.

9) In 1998, the U.S. embassies in Kenya and Tanzania were bombed by: 

(a) Mr. Rogers 
(b) Hillary, to detract attention from Wild Bill's women problems 
(c) The World Wrestling Federation to promote its next villain:"Mustapha the Merciless" 
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 40

10) On 9/11/01, four airliners were hijacked destroyed thousands of people were killed by: 

(a) Bugs Bunny, Wiley E. Coyote, Daffy Duck, and Elmer Fudd 
(b) The Supreme Court of Florida 
(c) Mr. Bean 
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 40.

11) In 2002 the United States fought a war in Afghanistan against: 

(a) Enron 
(b) The Lutheran Church 
(c) The NFL 
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 40.

12) In 2002 reporter Daniel Pearl was kidnapped and murdered by: 

(a) Bonny and Clyde 
(b) Captain Kangaroo 
(c) Billy Graham 
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 40.


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## plan_D (May 16, 2005)

And that's not including the acts against Britain...

I'm going to have to say A) for all of them.


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## evangilder (May 16, 2005)

I hear ya, but I would like the tone to be down a little bit.


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## FLYBOYJ (May 16, 2005)

evangilder said:


> I hear ya, but I would like the tone to be down a little bit.



I agree Evan, but when I found that I couldn't resist. A little devilish humor works wonders


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## Blitzkrieg Bop (May 16, 2005)

Guys, in your country its possible that arnold schwarzenegger can be a governor... no wonder that idiots want to bomb a country that has this sort of idiots in high positions with power in politics that take dumb ass decicions..


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## evangilder (May 16, 2005)

That's it. locking now


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## FLYBOYJ (May 16, 2005)

Blitzkrieg Bop said:


> Guys, in your country its possible that arnold schwarzenegger can be a governor... no wonder that idiots want to bomb a country that has this sort of idiots in high positions with power in politics that take dumb ass decicions..



EVAN, I THINK YOU NEED TO LOCK THIS


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## Blitzkrieg Bop (May 16, 2005)

Damn, i was just getting warming up


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## lesofprimus (May 16, 2005)

Yea, because I just stuck a spit up ur ass and had just thrown u onto the fire.....


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