# What do you make of this HE 111 picture?



## Capt. Vick (May 17, 2012)

Here is an odd picture (at least to me). Other then it being erroneously labeled as a cockpit scene from a Fw 200 what do you notice unusual about this picture? Well for starters it’s a dedicated dual control cockpit with no swing-over yoke. Also, what is that non-standard instrument box mounted on that equally non-standard pillar mounted in front of and between the two crewmen. What do you make of it? I’m perplexed. A trainer of some sort? An equipment testbed aircraft? Anybody know for sure?







Oh, and the picture is from the very first Squadron-Signal In Action Book Luftwaffe Volume 1


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## A4K (May 17, 2012)

Can't say for certain Jim, but would gues an experimental bird (maybe the V-1 (Fiesler Fi 103) test carrier or high-altitude TKL-15 supercharger test bed..? )


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## Capt. Vick (May 17, 2012)

Good guesses evan, but I would argue against a V-1 controller aircraft with the dual controls...just my 2 cents


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## A4K (May 17, 2012)

You could be right mate. Think the TKL-15 test bed might be a runner up though, that may have required the extra set of hands on steering. (I'm not an expert, mind you)


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## Airframes (May 20, 2012)

I'm wondering if it's a Ju188, not a Heinkel ?


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## vikingBerserker (May 20, 2012)

I wonder if it's of an He 111Z?


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## Aaron Brooks Wolters (May 20, 2012)

Looking at what photos I could find David, I think you may be on to it. Not sure though.


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## Njaco (May 20, 2012)

Cockpit doesn't look like a 200 or 111.


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## fubar57 (May 21, 2012)

How about a Do17 Z-4 dual control trainer. Can't find an interior shot yet but from the outside the cockpit looks very side by each comfy.

Geo


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## A4K (May 21, 2012)

Could be a He 177 with fixed double yoke in place of the usual hinged item (?). Canopy, layout, and instrument panel seem to match a photo I have.


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## Capt. Vick (May 21, 2012)

Though initially I had a problem figuring out what plane it actually was, I'm pretty sure it IS a He 111. A selection of photos from the web (google) seems to back that up. So the only new contender we should consider is the Zwilling, but again I think the original picture argues against that as it seems to have the standard throttle quadrant of a twin engined version. Again I refference the pictures below...

NOTE: The second photo appears to show another Luftwaffe dual control bird. Interesting, huh?


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## vikingBerserker (May 21, 2012)

Excellent point about the throttle.

I was reading about the He 111 in _Warplanes of the Third Reich _by Green and it mentions the He 111P-3 being a dual control trainer modification of the earlier P-0 P-1's (page 295). That would be my guess.


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## A4K (May 22, 2012)

Very good points Jim and Dave. 
I believe yas may be right, especially since checking pics and coming to the conclusion that my 'He 177' cockpit photo is actually a mislabelled He 111 cockpit... 
No wonder the details were the same...

Curious about that instrument box though in the first pic you posted, it would appear to be attached below the main instrument panel. What was the function?


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## Njaco (May 22, 2012)

I think VB has it. My books list a He-111P-3 as a dual control trainer.


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## Capt. Vick (May 22, 2012)

A4K said:


> Curious about that instrument box though in the first pic you posted, it would appear to be attached below the main instrument panel. What was the function?



That I guess is the whole point of this thread. What is that darn thing?


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## A4K (May 22, 2012)

Cable TV for long flights?


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## FLYBOYJ (May 22, 2012)

Capt. Vick said:


> Here is an odd picture (at least to me). Other then it being erroneously labeled as a cockpit scene from a Fw 200 what do you notice unusual about this picture? Well for starters it’s a dedicated dual control cockpit with no swing-over yoke. Also, what is that non-standard instrument box mounted on that equally non-standard pillar mounted in front of and between the two crewmen. What do you make of it? I’m perplexed. A trainer of some sort? An equipment testbed aircraft? Anybody know for sure?
> 
> View attachment 201429
> 
> ...



It looks like two of the instrument are "T'd" together - guessing that they are static instuments, I'd further guess that's a panel for instrument flying


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## Capt. Vick (May 22, 2012)

What would they need, in addition, to the standard panel for instrument flying? Maybe a homing set of some sort?

I'm going with cable tv!


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## Airframes (May 22, 2012)

Nah, it's a 1940s computer, and they're logged on to this forum!!


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## FLYBOYJ (May 22, 2012)

Capt. Vick said:


> What would they need, in addition, to the standard panel for instrument flying? Maybe a homing set of some sort?



Larger turn coordinator, directional gyro, Vertical speed indicator and an ADF




Capt. Vick said:


> I'm going with cable tv!


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## A4K (May 22, 2012)

Good stuff Joe, wonder if you're right.

...and Terry and Jim...


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