# Post WW2 Early Jets



## skeeter (May 29, 2010)

Stopped off at The Flying Leatherneck Aviation Museum, Marine Corps Air Station Miramar and snapped a few photos with my Droid Smart Phone. Hope these turn out okay. This is a free little museum and worth your while if you are ever in the San Diego area.


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## skeeter (May 29, 2010)

Panther in photos 1 and 2
SkyKnight in photos 3 and 4 (night fighter)
Douglas Skyray (post Korean War)


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## skeeter (May 29, 2010)

More photos...described in next post


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## skeeter (May 29, 2010)

Above:

Photo 1 McDonnell F2H-2 Banshee
Photo 2 Banshee, SkyKnight, Panther
Photos 3 and 4 and 5 are of the North American FJ-3 Fury


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## skeeter (May 30, 2010)

Chance Vought F4U-5N Corsair


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## Matt308 (May 30, 2010)

Great pics! I love the Panther, but the Skynight is UUUUuuugly. And look at that Corsair and its bad self. Wow!


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## skeeter (May 30, 2010)

Yes, the SkyKnight is ugly, but believe it or not, it shot down more aircraft than any other Navy or Marine fighter during the Korean War, or so I've been told. Sneaking up on them at night with a radar interceptor officer next to the pilot directing him, and then the pressing of the firing button and those four big 20mm cannon beneath the nose belching flame, it must have been a surprising and wicked sight.


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## syscom3 (May 30, 2010)

Well this is a museum I need to visit. Thanks for posting the information!


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## wheelsup_cavu (May 30, 2010)

Flying Leatherneck Aviation Museum and Historical Foundation
Nice website too.


Wheels


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## Matt308 (May 31, 2010)

skeeter said:


> Yes, the SkyKnight is ugly, but believe it or not, it shot down more aircraft than any other Navy or Marine fighter during the Korean War, or so I've been told. Sneaking up on them at night with a radar interceptor officer next to the pilot directing him, and then the pressing of the firing button and those four big 20mm cannon beneath the nose belching flame, it must have been a surprising and wicked sight.



Yep, absolutely I did. Lots of books with their exploits.

On another question... anyone notice that the warheads of the 5in HVARs extend right into the 20mm cannon muzzle blast? Really?


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## skeeter (May 31, 2010)

Love how these look in the air


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## vikingBerserker (May 31, 2010)

Very cool!


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## skeeter (May 31, 2010)

"While the Skyknight was not as aerodynamically advanced as the sleek MiG-15 and did not have an excess of engine thrust by any means, its four cannon packed a hefty punch, and it could easily out-turn a MiG-15 whose pilot was foolish enough to get into a turning contest. Probably the biggest factor in the Skyknight's favor was that the MiG-15 did not have search radar, being directed to targets at night under ground radar control, and in a night fight the MiG pilot was largely blind while the Skyknight crew could "see" perfectly well."

This is per a website as follows (not sure how to link yet): http://www.vectorsite.net/avskykt.html:)


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## JoeB (Jun 11, 2010)

OTOH the F3D had highly visible exhaust, even for a jet, at night. This was often commented on later in Vietnam as well when the EF-10 electronic warfare version was still used at night. It did have a rear warning radar though, even in addition to forward looking search radar, a notable advantage compared to the USAF's F-94 which relied on its ground controllers to warn of tail threats.

F3D's were credited with 5 MiG-15's downed, but only one of those victories corresponds to a known Soviet loss; one other incident is very puzzling (the Soviet as well as F3D's and B-29's saw an a/c fall in flames but neither recorded losing an a/c), some others can be positively correlated to MiG's hit by 20mm but not downed. So 1 is not the absolute max of F3D victories over MiG's, but it wasn't 5. After the intial weeks of F3D v MiG-15, the F3D's seldom got shots at the MiG's. The MiG's ground control got too good at warning them, and vectoring in other MiG's on the F3D's tail, which the US crews assumed were planned ambushes. But the F3D's tail warning radar made it hard to catch unaware, either. An F3D was also credited with a Po-2 night intruder

F9F's were credited with 5 victories over MiG-15's in Korea and the Soviets lost 5 per their accounts (though not the same 5, there was an overclaim in one case and an underclaim in another). 

F4U's though were credited with more enemy a/c in Korea than any other Navy/Marine type, 12, including 5 NK night intruders by one pilot Guy Bordelon of VC-3 Det. D, flying from land in defense of the Seoul area near the end of the war, in F4U-5N. Most of the F4U credits though were v NK a/c and the records of their actual losses are unavailable. F3D pilots were skeptical of Bordelon's victories at the time, feeling they were awarded on less evidence than was required of them, and we see their own victory credits don't check out at a high rate. No wrecks were recovered for any of Bordelon's victories; though flown in defense of friendly held territory (albeit fairly near the front lines). One Marine F4U-5N night Po-2 victory yielded a wreck, one Yak-9 wreck was found offshore after the daylight battle between VMF-312 and Yak's April 21, 1951, and victories by F4U's over 'Il-4' (actually a Soviet leadlease A-20G) Sept 4 1950 and Jesse Folmar's victory over a MiG Sept 10 1952, are verified in Communist accounts.

Joe


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