# F-18 Crashes In San Diego



## FLYBOYJ (Dec 8, 2008)

San Diego Jet Crash - Yahoo! News Photos

Bad new, especially for this time of the year.


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## beaupower32 (Dec 8, 2008)

Thats crazy.


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## Vassili Zaitzev (Dec 8, 2008)

Sh!t, that's not good. Was it mechanical failure?


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## 109ROAMING (Dec 8, 2008)

Glad to hear the pilot ejected

amazing


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## Freebird (Dec 9, 2008)

There were 2 houses totally destroyed, they don't know if anyone was inside. Also they have the bomb squad out, the second {empty} ejector seat in the F-18 is in the wreckage, and is in danger of blowing


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## seesul (Dec 9, 2008)

They speak about 3 victims in our morning news...


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## Gnomey (Dec 9, 2008)

Yep, 3 killed, 1 missing on the ground I heard this morning 

Sounds like a mechanical failure of some kind. Also heard the pilot was trying to make it over the residential area before bailing out, evidently didn't manage


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## 109ROAMING (Dec 9, 2008)




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## evangilder (Dec 9, 2008)

Hate to see this happen, and ythe pilot must feel terrible.


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## ccheese (Dec 9, 2008)

Does anyone know what section of SDiego the plane went down in ? I have
good friends in the Clairmont section....

Charles


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## wilbur1 (Dec 9, 2008)

Yeah Charles its about 15 miles from claremontits 10 min down the road from me i could see the smoke but only barelly they were keepin quiet yesterday but now it seems its everywhere today


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## Catch22 (Dec 9, 2008)




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## Lucky13 (Dec 9, 2008)




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## SoD Stitch (Dec 9, 2008)

ccheese said:


> Does anyone know what section of SDiego the plane went down in ? I have
> good friends in the Clairmont section....
> 
> Charles



The news said University City, wherever that is.

A retired Marine Lt. Cmdr. went to the scene right after the crash, and managed to talk to the pilot after he came down out of the tree he had landed in. The pilot said he had declared an in-flight emergency shortly after taking off from the USS _Abraham Lincoln_, and was trying to make it to Miramar before it got worse. Apparently, he didn't make it.


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## FLYBOYJ (Dec 9, 2008)

SoD Stitch said:


> The news said University City, wherever that is.
> 
> A retired Marine Lt. Cmdr. went to the scene right after the crash, and managed to talk to the pilot after he came down out of the tree he had landed in. The pilot said he had declared an in-flight emergency shortly after taking off from the USS _Abraham Lincoln_, and was trying to make it to Miramar before it got worse. Apparently, he didn't make it.


 Marine Lt. Cmdr???? maybe Lt. Col?????


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## SoD Stitch (Dec 9, 2008)

FLYBOYJ said:


> Marine Lt. Cmdr???? maybe Lt. Col?????



Yeah, that makes more sense doesn't it, 'specially if he's a Marine.


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Dec 9, 2008)

What a tragedy! My heart goes out to the families of the dead.


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## FLYBOYJ (Dec 9, 2008)

We were just looking at the crash scene through Google Earth - another 20 seconds and he would of made it to the runway or at least to a dirt area away from the homes.


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## v2 (Dec 9, 2008)




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## Messy1 (Dec 9, 2008)

Saw this last night on the news. Feel terrible for that pilot and all involved. The pilot must be replaying everything over and over in his mind trying to find something he could have done differently. This will be a big mess for sure.


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## FLYBOYJ (Dec 9, 2008)

According to the early reports he lost an engine after take off - was on his way into Miramar when he lost his second engine.


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## evangilder (Dec 9, 2008)

Not a whole lot you can do with no engines. I can't imagine the F-18 has much of a glide slope.


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## FLYBOYJ (Dec 9, 2008)

Considering it took out 2 houses i think it came down like a lawn dart. Very lucky there weren't more people killed!


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## Messy1 (Dec 9, 2008)

I agree FlyboyJ, I was surprised it only took out 2 houses. I saw a few pictures and the houses in that neighborhood are not spaced too far apart. Very lucky more were not hurt. I think all 3 dead were from the same house.


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## Freebird (Dec 9, 2008)

FLYBOYJ said:


> Considering it took out 2 houses i think it came down like a lawn dart. Very lucky there weren't more people killed!



I wonder if he realized he couldn't make it, and "nosed down" right at the end so that it would do just that. If he came in obliquely he could have taken out a dozen.


Might be a good idea not to have houses so close to the runway, if that's the case.


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## SoD Stitch (Dec 9, 2008)

freebird said:


> I wonder if he realized he couldn't make it, and "nosed down" right at the end so that it would do just that. If he came in obliquely he could have taken out a dozen.
> 
> 
> Might be a good idea not to have houses so close to the runway, if that's the case.



Well, the runway was there first, not the houses; but you're right, they probably shouldn't have built so many houses on the approach to the runway.

Yeah, either he pushed the stick over right before he ejected, or he was so low and slow anyway (he was on final) that when he lost the second engine (and his only source of power) the a/c simply stalled out and landed in a relatively flat configuration; I'm guessing the a/c stalled out right after the second engine failed. He probably had about one or two seconds to realize his second engine wasn't turning anymore, then punched out; at that altitude, you don't have much time to play around, you either get out of the a/c in a hurry, or you go in with it.


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## FLYBOYJ (Dec 9, 2008)

freebird said:


> Might be a good idea not to have houses so close to the runway, if that's the case.


Say that to the greedy developers - that base been there since the 40s.


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## evangilder (Dec 9, 2008)

I heard the press conference with the man who owned one of the houses. He lost his wife, 2 kids and mother-in-law. It was heart-wrenching to hear him. But he harbors no ill feelings toward the pilot, thankfully. 

If houses shouldn't be near runways, then someone needs to tell the zoning boards so they can deny the greedy developers.


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## comiso90 (Dec 9, 2008)

evangilder said:


> If houses shouldn't be near runways, then someone needs to tell the zoning boards so they can deny the greedy developers.



Certainly a heart wrenching tragedy but one component of longevity is minimizing your risks. Everybody living near the airport knows they're at a greater risk. I'm sure the houses were cheaper. They know that aircraft occasionally fall from the sky and your risks are greater near a runway.


I dont believe the zoning board or the contractors are even a tiny bit culpable! 
If you live in the Gulf Coast, you're at risk for a hurricane.
If you live along a earthquake fault, you are at risk for earthquakes.
If you live next to a runway... guess what.

Life is a gamble, minimize your risks by not raising a family next to a runway unless it's a gamble your prepared to take.

.


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## Wayne Little (Dec 10, 2008)

Very sad....


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## Glider (Dec 10, 2008)

freebird said:


> I wonder if he realized he couldn't make it, and "nosed down" right at the end so that it would do just that. If he came in obliquely he could have taken out a dozen.
> 
> 
> Might be a good idea not to have houses so close to the runway, if that's the case.



We had a similar case a number of years ago close to where I live. The plane reported serious engine problems at night and in the middle of a very large housing estate he hit the only retail premises, a car showroom, for some distance. No one was killed apart from the pilot.

There could be little doubt that he chose the spot.


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## evangilder (Dec 10, 2008)

Unfortunately, once you hit the eject button, you have no control over where it goes. Granted inertia and energy will have some influence, but I have heard of aircraft turning after a bailout. Not a good thing. We had an F-111 go down in Newmarket while I was there and it was described as a "miracle" where it hit. There was a U shaped area that had no buildings and it hit smack dab in the middle of that area. 10-20 feet either direction would have been a disaster.


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## FLYBOYJ (Dec 10, 2008)

comiso90 said:


> I dont believe the zoning board or the contractors are even a tiny bit culpable!
> If you live in the Gulf Coast, you're at risk for a hurricane.
> If you live along a earthquake fault, you are at risk for earthquakes.
> If you live next to a runway... guess what.
> ...



While I couldn't agree more, you have a lot of developers, especially in So Cal that will try to develop homes in places that they know will cause problems (airports, freeways, military bases) but could care less about the final impact - case in point, my old hometown, Palmdale. Plant 42 is a huge production facility, with Lockheed. Martin, Boeing and Northrop/Grumman having facilities there. Not only vital to this country, the facility is a major employment source for the community. Since the late 1980s developers have been encroaching on the facility with people stupid enough to buy property a stone's throw away from the main runways, then complain about the jet noise. I've been to a city counsel meeting where several of these folks were almost tared and feathered, but as the AV grows, more and more of these morons will move up from LA - another reason why I left the place.

This is one example, I could go on with other airports in the same boat (Santa Monica, Torrance, Van Nuys, even LAX)


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## evangilder (Dec 10, 2008)

Camarillo is starting to get encroached on as well. Developers plan even more housing development near the airport. Not like more houses are needed in this current economy...


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## comiso90 (Dec 10, 2008)

if i found "The Perfect House" and the little lady was in love with it but the only reason we could afford it was that it was on approach would we buy????

I honestly cant say... perhaps a roll of the dice is worth a beautiful home when an ideal home is normally out of reach.

.


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## davparlr (Dec 10, 2008)

evangilder said:


> Unfortunately, once you hit the eject button, you have no control over where it goes. Granted inertia and energy will have some influence, but I have heard of aircraft turning after a bailout. Not a good thing. We had an F-111 go down in Newmarket while I was there and it was described as a "miracle" where it hit. There was a U shaped area that had no buildings and it hit smack dab in the middle of that area. 10-20 feet either direction would have been a disaster.



I don't think it applies in this case, but, I think, its been a long time, we were told that if we were in trouble with the possibility of ejecting, try to find an uninhabited area (not hard to do in Oklahoma) and roll in a little aileron trim before you go. It keeps the aircraft from wandering around on its own.


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## timshatz (Dec 10, 2008)

Got a similar situation here in Pa. Brandywine Airport has land adjacent to it that has been purchased by a developer to build (your gonna love this)....

A RETIREMENT HOME! YEA! Old People and Airplanes! I can imagine the West Chester, Pa are just loving the moment that place opens up. Phone will be ringing off the hook with complaints. 

Brilliant, just brilliant.


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## FLYBOYJ (Dec 10, 2008)

davparlr said:


> I don't think it applies in this case, but, I think, its been a long time, we were told that if we were in trouble with the possibility of ejecting, try to find an uninhabited area (not hard to do in Oklahoma) and roll in a little aileron trim before you go. It keeps the aircraft from wandering around on its own.


Ever hear of this one...

_"An F-106 of the 71st Fighter-Interceptor Squadron, piloted by Gary Faust, entered a flat spin over Montana on February 2, 1970. Faust followed procedures and ejected from the aircraft. The resulting change of balance caused the aircraft to stabilize, and it landed wheels up in a snow-covered field, suffering almost no damage. The aircraft was then sent back to base by rail, repaired and returned to service."_


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## evangilder (Dec 10, 2008)

davparlr said:


> I don't think it applies in this case, but, I think, its been a long time, we were told that if we were in trouble with the possibility of ejecting, try to find an uninhabited area (not hard to do in Oklahoma) and roll in a little aileron trim before you go. It keeps the aircraft from wandering around on its own.



I agree in this case, especially with both engines out, that plane was only headed downward in a big hurry. But there are times when you have no choice but to get the heck out of the airplane and control is no possible. In some, but definitely not all, cases, the aircraft will go where it wants to.


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## SoD Stitch (Dec 10, 2008)

I read a very amusing article in Smithsonian Air Space magazine a while back (I can't find it now, of course) where a pilot ejected from his a/c near the airport (military) and, apparently, the a/c was trimmed perfectly; when he ejected, the a/c continued to fly around the airport in a circle, maintaining a constant altitude, until it finally ran out of fuel and crashed.


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## FLYBOYJ (Dec 10, 2008)

SoD Stitch said:


> I read a very amusing article in Smithsonian Air Space magazine a while back (I can't find it now, of course) where a pilot ejected from his a/c near the airport (military) and, apparently, the a/c was trimmed perfectly; when he ejected, the a/c continued to fly around the airport in a circle, maintaining a constant altitude, until it finally ran out of fuel and crashed.




Read 2 above your post.


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## SoD Stitch (Dec 10, 2008)

FLYBOYJ said:


> Read 2 above your post.



That's probably it; I don't recall what a/c he was flying, but how often could that have happened? I find as I get older, my memory fails me . . . .


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## FLYBOYJ (Dec 10, 2008)

SoD Stitch said:


> That's probably it; I don't recall what a/c he was flying, but how often could that have happened? I find as I get older, my memory fails me . . . .


That's the only situation I ever heard where a pilot ejected and the aircraft landed almost intact.


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## davparlr (Dec 11, 2008)

FLYBOYJ said:


> Ever hear of this one...
> 
> _"An F-106 of the 71st Fighter-Interceptor Squadron, piloted by Gary Faust, entered a flat spin over Montana on February 2, 1970. Faust followed procedures and ejected from the aircraft. The resulting change of balance caused the aircraft to stabilize, and it landed wheels up in a snow-covered field, suffering almost no damage. The aircraft was then sent back to base by rail, repaired and returned to service."_



Quite a blow to your ego when an aircraft can fly better without you. I heard about a T-37 once where the crew bailed out and later they found the aircraft where it had bellied in. They found it with engines still running, sucking up mesquite bushes. Very rugged those centrifugal compressors.


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## davparlr (Dec 12, 2008)

I grew up on the turn to final approach path to Sherman field at Pensacola NAS. Not the straight in but the overhead. Our homestead was probably there before the runway. I never remember worrying about a plane crashing into my house. There was an accident once, the plane was on a straight in final when he got too low and went end. We went exploring in the woods and found a great plowed area through the pines and oaks. At the end of the furrow, was the remains of a Navy T-2, the dead pilot long removed. That is a sight not forgotten. I use to have dreams of aircraft crashing in our back field. Much later, on a business trip to Melbourne, Florida, I was at the airport where I saw a small plane, like a Lear, but much smaller flying very low down the runway, bobbing. I knew he was in trouble. He turned left to fly a pattern, when he turned 90 to final he disappeard behind some trees. I thought he would crash. He didn't, he reappeared and decided to fly another pattern this time, when went behind those trees, only a towering column of black smoke came out. It seems he was a test pilot for a new small personal jet. All very distrubing.


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