# Mystery B-25



## ccheese (Feb 3, 2009)

Had to drive to Franklin, Va. on Sunday, and on the way past Franklin Airport
I saw this B-25 just sitting on the ramp. Had the trusty Nikon D70 with me
so I pulled in. There was a man working in a hanger on a Navion, so I asked
him about the B-25. He said it hasn't moved in 10 years, and he hasn't seen 
anyone working on it in five. The port engine is missing, but it looks in good
shape otherwise. I don't suppose anyone has any info on this, huh ??

Charles


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## comiso90 (Feb 3, 2009)

History:
Delivered to USAAF as 44-31508, 19??.
- Up for disposal at Olmstead AFB, PA, Jan. 1960.
Nathanial A. Kalt/Stinson Field Aircraft, San Antonio, TX, Jan. 1960.
- Registered as N6578D.
William P. Strube, Marietta, GA, Jan. 1960-1961.
Trans Calypso Inc, Miami, FL, Oct 1961-1965.
Leon H. Patin, Miami, FL, May 1965-1967.
John Hawke/Euramericair Inc/Airspeed International Inc., Ft. Lauderdale, FL, June 1967-1975.
- Modified for use as camera ship, Nov. 1967.
- Delivered to Bovington, UK, Dec. 15, 1967.
- Used as camera ship for Battle Of Britain movie, Spain UK, 1967-1968.
- Returned to USA, Jan. 10, 1969.
Reported as derelict Caldwell-Wright Field, NJ, 1969-1977.
Ten Plus One Inc, Mar. 1975-1977.
Tom Reilly, Kissimmee, FL, Apr. 1977-1979.
- Ferried from Caldwell to FL for rebuild, Feb. 3, 1979.
- Restoration to airworthy started in Caldwell, finished in Kissimee, 1979-1981.
- Flew as 431508/Chapter XI.
B-25 Bomber Group Inc, Ocalla, FL, Feb. 1979-1994.
Dan Powell, Fair Oaks Ranch, Boerne, TX, Aug. 1994-1999.
- Flew as Lucky Lady.
Rio Grande Aviation, McAllen, TX, June 16, 1999-2002.
- WFU, poor condition, Franklin, VA, 1998-2006.


warbirdregistry.org - A Warbirds Resource Group Site - B-25 Mitchell

same tail number and registry

_*- Used as camera ship for Battle Of Britain movie, Spain UK, 1967-1968.*_





.


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## Aaron Brooks Wolters (Feb 3, 2009)

Great shots Charles. Is that at the Franklin airport? Looks like it.Great sites comiso and information


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## Soundbreaker Welch? (Feb 3, 2009)

That's pretty cool!


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## evangilder (Feb 3, 2009)

Good find, Charles, and great that you had your camera with you!


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## Njaco (Feb 3, 2009)

> - WFU, poor condition, Franklin, VA, 1998-2006.



????

I've seen worse. Thats incredible, Charles!


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## ccheese (Feb 3, 2009)

This B-25 is sitting on the west end of the ramp at Franklin Airport. 
According to commiso's info, it's been around, and seems to be heading
downhill. I emailed a friend in Franklin and asked her to call the airport
tomorrow to get whatever info the airport is willing to give. I also asked
her to inquire if the plane is for sale. I'll let you know what I find out.

Charles


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## Aaron Brooks Wolters (Feb 3, 2009)

That's cool. I grew up in that area, many fond memories.


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## Heinz (Feb 4, 2009)

Group purchase?

ww2aircraft.net first co-owned warbird?


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## seesul (Feb 4, 2009)

Heinz said:


> Group purchase?
> 
> ww2aircraft.net first co-owned warbird?


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## Njaco (Feb 4, 2009)

Heinz, I was thinking that exact same thing!! First stop: Lucky's pub - drinks on Jan!!!


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## ToughOmbre (Feb 4, 2009)

That B-25 has got to be saved!

Sad to see any warbird revert to nature.

TO


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## Airframes (Feb 4, 2009)

Great find and pics Charles. It's a darn shame it's 'going downhill', even though it looks reasonable from the outside. I remember seeing this aircraft, in it's gaudi, multi coloured livery, when it was the camera ship for the Battle of Britain movie, fitted with an optically correct domed perspex nose; seem to recall it was used for other aerial work in the UK also. It would be great to see her back in the air, or even preserved on the ground - I like the idea of a Group Purchase!


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## rochie (Feb 4, 2009)

Heinz said:


> Group purchase?
> 
> ww2aircraft.net first co-owned warbird?



right these group builds are getting out of control now !!!!!!   
wish i had the cash for it though


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## beaupower32 (Feb 7, 2009)

Heinz said:


> Group purchase?
> 
> ww2aircraft.net first co-owned warbird?



Sounds good to me. Im in!


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## FLYBOYJ (Feb 7, 2009)

According to the Feds, these are the owners...

N-Number Results


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## Hollywood (Feb 8, 2009)

Group Purchase? COUNT ME IN!!!!


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## GrauGeist (Feb 8, 2009)

I'll contribute what I can for the cause!


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## Airframes (Feb 8, 2009)

Hey! If this becomes serious (which it could!), I'm in! I might not be able to donate much, but I'd rather miss a meal or a few pints than see that bird rot!
I suppose it's not unrealistiic to purchase it, but hangaring/restoration and display for static exhibition etc would be another thing. Unless there's a museum that could support the idea also?


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## GrauGeist (Feb 8, 2009)

I don't think it's really out of reason for us to all pitch in and purchase that bird. We have a number of folks here that are involved in aircraft restoration and know how to raise funding through various activities.


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## beaupower32 (Feb 8, 2009)

How cool would it be to see this bird flying at airshows flashing the ww2aircraft.net logo. Sweet huh!


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## Airframes (Feb 8, 2009)

We doing it then?!!
EDIT: Just remembered, I posted some pics of a similar-looking B25 in this thread a couple of days ago. This was the one that arrived at Duxford, UK, in 1988, and is a relatively rare early example. Just so people know what it looks like, and what can be done, this aircraft was operational, but was then fully restored inside and out, as a R.A.F. Mitchell III, and now looks superb!


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## Njaco (Feb 8, 2009)

Well, purchase is one thing - upkeep totally different.

Of course, though, I know of a friendly, WW2 airport and museum close-by that has the room to store if needed.

It also begs the question - where's Pbfoot? Doesn't he volunteer at a great place for just this sort of thing?


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## Aaron Brooks Wolters (Feb 8, 2009)

Heinz said:


> Group purchase?
> 
> ww2aircraft.net first co-owned warbird?



I don't make any money now, hell I'll volunteer to work on it.


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## Heinz (Feb 9, 2009)

What have i started............


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## MacArther (Feb 9, 2009)

> What have i started............



You must realize by now Heinz, you're dealing with bunch of people who are extremely enthused about World War Two and wh OH YEAH WW2 FORUM BIRD!! COUNT MY MONEY IN!!!


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## ccheese (Feb 9, 2009)

FLYBOYJ said:


> According to the Feds, these are the owners...
> 
> N-Number Results




My question is, if the owners are in Texas, what's the plane doing in Franklin,
Va. ?? Dare I write a letter making some discreat inquiries ??

Charles


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## FLYBOYJ (Feb 9, 2009)

ccheese said:


> My question is, if the owners are in Texas, what's the plane doing in Franklin,
> Va. ?? Dare I write a letter making some discreat inquiries ??
> 
> Charles



They might be keeping it in its current location for tax purposes or maybe it simply was to be worked on in Virginia and never got completed.

You'd be surprised how many aircraft are left to rot on airport tarmacs. Its even worse when one is a B-25!


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## wilbur1 (Feb 9, 2009)

Charles you gotta do it.....count me in ill help in anyway i can


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## FLYBOYJ (Feb 9, 2009)

Charles - talk to the airport manager and see what he knows about the aircraft. Also find out if the owner is up to date on their tie down fees. I worked for someone who acquired a Cessna 150 and a Stinson 108 by paying off their delinquent tie down fees and then placing a lien on the aircraft.


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## pbfoot (Feb 9, 2009)

isn't the Fighter Factory in Virginia Beach Airport they are doing a b25j up to go with the other nice birds they have like the P40, 51, Spit , Hurricane , Avenger , Skyraider some russian I 153, I16
Fighter Factory - WWII Aircraft Recovery and Restoration
Wheres the Pics cc


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## ccheese (Feb 10, 2009)

FLYBOYJ said:


> Charles - talk to the airport manager and see what he knows about the aircraft. Also find out if the owner is up to date on their tie down fees. I worked for someone who acquired a Cessna 150 and a Stinson 108 by paying off their delinquent tie down fees and then placing a lien on the aircraft.



Good idea, Joe. I have been informed that one of the three owners lives
in Franklin, and my contact is getting me his phone number. I will try to 
get in touch with the airport manager.

Charles


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## Njaco (Feb 10, 2009)

Why do I have a weird, tingly feeling?


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## Airframes (Feb 10, 2009)

I've got the same feeling Chris! I think I'm going to have to sell some paintings to raise some cash for a good cause........


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## Aaron Brooks Wolters (Feb 10, 2009)

Njaco said:


> Why do I have a weird, tingly feeling?



Get your toe out of the wall socket NJ.


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## Wayne Little (Feb 11, 2009)

Jeez...missed this Charles.....nice shots mate!


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## RabidAlien (Feb 11, 2009)

Well....I'll be able to contribute enough to buy a gallon of paint or a seatbelt or something, but I'll donate what I can! That'd be awesome, having a ww2aircraft aircraft!!!!


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## Airframes (Feb 11, 2009)

Sure would! I'm like you, can't give much, but willing to do what I can, if this goes live. Of course, if I won on the Lottery....!


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## ccheese (Feb 11, 2009)

I just finished sending an email to a Mr. Everett Williams, whom I have been 
informed is one of the three owners of the B-25J. I asked him for any infor-
mation on the aircraft that he would give me, especially as to the owners'
intentions. I also asked if the aircraft was for sale..... as is... where is.

I'll let you know what he says, when I get a reply.

Tomorrow I am going to phone the Airport Manager and see what he will tell
me..... especially about the tie down fees.

Hey Joe.... can you get type qualified to fly a multi-engined warbird ?

Charles


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## ccheese (Feb 12, 2009)

Had to opportunity to talk to Mr. James [Jimmy] Gray, the manager of the Franklin Airport, this morning. He told me he gets five calls every day about the B-25. [Which he refers to "a hunk of junk"] The tie down fees are paid up. He wishes someone [anyone !] would come and take it away. He says it's been fifteen years since anyone has worked on it. He suggested, if I was really interested in it, to contact the owners in Texas.

Guess that's the next move, huh ?

Charles


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## Trebor (Feb 12, 2009)

do it, Charles!  I'll be glad to help out!


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## FLYBOYJ (Feb 12, 2009)

ccheese said:


> Hey Joe.... can you get type qualified to fly a multi-engined warbird ?
> 
> Charles



I would love to but we're talking some bucks. Actually I know some folks who coud get there a lot quicker than I.


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## Njaco (Feb 13, 2009)

ummmm, can I make a suggestion that we at least let Horse and whoever else may need to be contacted - just to let them know and get the ok.


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## DBII (Feb 13, 2009)

I always wanted a B-25. I wish I had the funds or connections. Set up a non profit organization, throw money into a trust fund and get a couple of corporate sponsors. Once the bird is flying, tour the world selling rides. I would name her _*Get Lucky *_or _*Breaking News *_ with a nice pin up.


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## MacArther (Feb 13, 2009)

I don't know if I mentioned this or not, but I may not be a financial powerhouse, but if there is any chance of purchasing that B-25, I'll donate as much as I can....


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## Bryster51 (Feb 13, 2009)

Here is a site with a photo of it in 1969, paint and care was not top notch then. Air-Britain : N6578D
FAA Info: N-Number Results


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## Airframes (Feb 14, 2009)

At the time those photos were taken, the aircraft wouldn't have been too bad. The minimal paintwork is the remains of one of the multi-coloured patches applied to the otherwise natural metal airframe, to aid in formating for the various camera angles required during filming of the BoB movie the previous year. The aircraft had been owned and flown by Jeff Hawkes, who disappeared in a light aircraft, in 'mysterious circumstances', I think in the late '80's. Apparently the Mitchell, lightened by the removal of many uneccessary fittings, handled more like a fighter than a bomber, according to Hawkes.
The hemispherical, optically correct nose cone was made and fitted especially for filming, and a large astrodome-like perspex dome fitted in place of the top turret, together with a retractable camera 'turret' in the belly.
The aircraft was subsequently used for a number of years for other aerial filming work, including, AFAIK, the war movie 'Hannover Street', filmed at Bovingdon, UK (also used for 633 Sqn., The War Lover etc), with a further 6 or more B25's as 'stars'.


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## mudpuppy (Feb 22, 2009)

Any more news on this neglected B-25 Mitchell in Virginia? I'd be happy to help as much as I can, shoot I'll drive down there and help to sand off rust and chipped paint.  But I can't even think of all the details involved in even starting such a venture.


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## proton45 (Feb 23, 2009)

Wow...cool, I wondered what had happened to that aeroplane. I just assumed it was still being used for filming. Nice find.


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## evangilder (Feb 23, 2009)

I know you guys like to talk about ownership of an airplane like that, but do any of you know how much it costs to operate an old bird like that? That's not mentioning what restoration and/or corrosion work would need to be done. 

We have had a PBJ (a REAL one, the last of it's kind) at Camarillo in restoration for as long as I can remember. They are making process, but it is a LOT of sweat and blood. And it is a ton of money. The original plan was 15 years. That was close to 20 years ago and they still have a long way to go. The fuselage and wing roots have been cleared of corrosion and primed, but they still have to do the wings and the engines.

To get it airworthy and keep it there is out of the reach for most individuals, and even some foundations.


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## Trebor (Feb 24, 2009)

we can dream, can't we?


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## evangilder (Feb 24, 2009)

Sure, dreaming is allowed. I just want to make sure that unless someone is exceptionally wealthy here, and willing to shell a bunch out, the thought of a board owned B-25 is just a dream.


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## mudpuppy (Feb 24, 2009)

Good point. So which one of us here is the boy-toy of a very wealthy and extremely grateful heiress?


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## RabidAlien (Feb 24, 2009)

mudpuppy said:


> Good point. So which one of us here is the boy-toy of a very wealthy and extremely grateful heiress?



Heh....referring back to that other post about "dreaming"....


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## MacArther (Feb 25, 2009)

Ey, it probably won't be much at this point, but I would gladly give my savings (~$950+) to help this bird out!


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## ccheese (Aug 31, 2009)

Was up in Franklin, Va. over the weekend, and decided to stop at Franklin Airport to see if the B-25 was still there. It
is, and it looks just like it did last time. The weather is slowly taking it's toll. Also talked to the airport manager and
he still wants it off his tarmac.

Something new has been added, tho. In June the owner's of the B-25 flew in with three Fairchild PT trainers to refuel
and continue their flight to Florida. One of them would not start, and they decided to leave it there. It's sitting, like
the B-25. The blue stuff on the prop is a cloth wrap of somekind that has started to deterioate. 

Charles


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## beaupower32 (Aug 31, 2009)

Its a damn shame what those guys are doing to those planes. That B-25 should get the proper attention it needs instead of just rotting away. I say we hunt down the owners with pitch forks and shovels and give them a good thrashing


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## ccheese (Aug 31, 2009)

The owners of both the B-25 and the Fairchild are: Rio Grande Aviation, Inc. in Texas.

I just wonder if bombarding them with letters of protest would do any good ???? Anyone who wants to organize a letter
writing campaign PM me. If you want to write a letter yourself, go here for the address:

FAA Registry - Aircraft - N-Number Results

Charles


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## vikingBerserker (Aug 31, 2009)

That's just frickin tragic!


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## GrauGeist (Aug 31, 2009)

What the heck...does that guy just poop vintage aircraft or something? Looks like he leaves a trail of a/c where ever he goes...unreal.

I would really like to see an outfit like the EAA, CAS or a flight heritage museum get that aircraft and bring it back from the edge of oblivion.

Thanks for the photos and update, Charles.


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## Airframes (Sep 6, 2009)

Thanks for theupdate Charles. I agree, it's a darned shame to see vintage birds like those just lying there, rotting away. It would be nice to be able to lodge some form of protest, but I'm guessing the response, from 'those' sort of people, would probably be along the lines of '%$£% off', or 'If you want them, give me x million and they're yours'!


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## B-17engineer (Sep 6, 2009)

We should buy it  . I know it costs a lot and I'm a kid but I got a birthday coming up.....  I could not get a gift but rather the family members generous enough to get me something I could ask for a "Donation" instead ....just a thought and a start. I'm willing to give up gifts for this beauty.

But as Eric pointed out it's going to cost a lot.......... so sad. 

Maybe the trainer is more within our range.


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## GrauGeist (Sep 6, 2009)

Perhaps if folks here worked to bring the aircraft's situation to the attention of restoration organizations might be almost as good as us "purchasing" it. 

And if an organization did purchase it, then we could sponsor it's restoration through donations and maybe fund-raising. Kind of like adopting it.

Just an idea


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## Heinz (Sep 9, 2009)

Well its no suprise it does cost a fortune to operate a vintage aircraft. Preservation to museum standard is my thinking. Still whoever owns can do what they like with it, unfortunately for the rest of us


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## beaupower32 (Sep 9, 2009)

GrauGeist said:


> Perhaps if folks here worked to bring the aircraft's situation to the attention of restoration organizations might be almost as good as us "purchasing" it.
> 
> And if an organization did purchase it, then we could sponsor it's restoration through donations and maybe fund-raising. Kind of like adopting it.
> 
> Just an idea




Great idea!


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## Messy1 (Sep 9, 2009)

It is sad to see any old aircraft sit there and rot away. Guys with old cars do it all the time too!


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## Frantish (Jul 27, 2010)

I am an A&P, get me a place to stay and food and would gladly restore it. 

We could try a community sponsored salvage program.
Making phone calls and establishing connections is not that expensive.

The hard part is to get it from the owner, and I doubt he will sell for a reasonable price. 

(I know another who collects aircraft and other items like Fred G. Sanford (from Sanford and Son), but he smashes them, does not take care of them, and always wants too much for them).


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## cptsmith (Aug 28, 2010)

Some owners I know establish corporations or foundations for the warbirds and solicit donations (501.c) for operation and up keep. When I was out in CA a few years ago there was a worse looking B-25 on a little airport north of San Jose. I would have stopped But we were packed on a bus.


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## ccheese (Sep 20, 2010)

Here's an update, guys....

Was up in Franklin, Va., yesterday [9/19/10]. I didn't stop at the airport, but the B-25 and the Fairchild are still sitting
in the same place. I had the camera and was going to get a pic from the road [US 58 business bypass], but there was
too much traffic and no place to pull over. It hasn't been touched.... 

Why would people who own an aircraft valued at about 3/4 million US dollars just let it sit ????

Charles


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## Airframes (Sep 20, 2010)

I'm wondering if there is some sort of 'hold' on the aircraft Charles. Perhaps a large, outstanding bill for services or parking, un-paid taxes, that sort of thing. Whatever the reason, it seems a darned shame to let an otherwise restorable, possibly to airworthy condition, veteran aircraft go to waste.
Twenty, thirty, fifty years from now, even such types as the F4 Phantom will be becoming rare and valuable, and should be preserved, so something like a B25, today, really needs to be rescued. Obviously, it's impractical to 'save' every retired airframe, but the more which are, rather than scrapped, the better, especially for future generations say, in the next century.


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## Trebor (Sep 20, 2010)

hey guys, i've got an idea. what if I were to talk to the museum of Flight in Seattle and get THEM to take this bird off that tarmac?


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## ccheese (Sep 20, 2010)

Trebor said:


> hey guys, i've got an idea. what if I were to talk to the museum of Flight in Seattle and get THEM to take this bird off that tarmac?



I talked to one of the owners of the B-25 last year, Rio Grande Aviation, in Texas, and he made it very
clear the aircraft was not for sale. I spoke to the airport manager and he told me the tie-down fees
are paid a year in advance. Unless the ownership of the aircraft is in doubt [which I doubt], or there
is some type of lien on it, Rio Grande Aviation is the sole owner of the A/C.

The airport manager told me the left engine was removed about fifteen years ago, and the plane has
not been touched since.

It's a damn shame.....

The fairchild aircraft, also sitting there is PT-26A. I managed to get this info on it:

1942 Fairchild PT-26A "Cornell" N128PT on the ramp at Franklin Municipal Airport. Served the US Army as 42-71150 and was based at Tonawanda Field, NY. 
This aircraft is part of the fleet belonging to the Old Dominion Squadron of the Commemorative Air Force. This aircraft is not currently flightworthy.
[Note: Is is not currectly owned by the CAF]


Charles


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## Aaron Brooks Wolters (Sep 20, 2010)

Thank you for the update Charles. It is sad, but unless they are willing to fix it or sell it there's not much else can be done.


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## Airframes (Sep 21, 2010)

Thanks again Charles. I can only think that the owners don't want to sell, but are unable to renovate it yet. Perhaps it's a long-term aim to restore it, possibly to airworthy status, when funds allow, or maybe speculation to sell when the value increases.


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## armadillomaster1 (Oct 16, 2010)

It's a crying shame. But everything has a price, if someone made a concrete offer maybe they would consider it?


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## CliffyB (Oct 16, 2010)

You could always try these guys down in Virginia Beach, VA. They already have one B-25 and I think they're restoring another one from scratch. Pulled it from the water I think. The cool thing is that every aircraft you see in their hangar is in flyable condition is maintained in such condition.

Military Aviation Museum


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## ccheese (Oct 16, 2010)

CliffyB said:


> You could always try these guys down in Virginia Beach, VA. They already have one B-25 and I think they're restoring another one from scratch. Pulled it from the water I think. The cool thing is that every aircraft you see in their hangar is in flyable condition is maintained in such condition.
> 
> Military Aviation Museum



The people at Rio Grande Aviation made it very plain that the aircraft was not for sale. However,
everything has it's price. I'm sure they would consider $750,000.00 [usd] in an "as is, where is" offer.

Now.... who's got 3/4 of a million dollars ??

Charles


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## GrauGeist (Oct 16, 2010)

ccheese said:


> ...Now.... who's got 3/4 of a million dollars ??
> 
> Charles


Let me look under my sofa cushions!


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## vikingBerserker (Oct 16, 2010)

I do have that spare kidney......


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## Airframes (Oct 17, 2010)

But Jan might need that ....... I've got a 1973 £9 note, supposedly genuine .......


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## ccheese (Oct 17, 2010)

Airframes said:


> But Jan might need that ....... I've got a 1973 £9 note, supposedly genuine .......



I have a US $20.00 bill that was slightly folded when it went through the printing press. Has a blank
streak diagnally across the middle. I hear it's worth about a grand.

But, being serious, $750K might just be the purchase price. How about the cost of a complete re-build ?
Then the normal monthly maintenance. Unless we got Joe B-25 qualified, we'd have to pay a pilot 
co-pilot. I really think it's way out of the reach of the members of this forum...... unless someone REALLY
hit's the lottery.

However...... it costs nothing to dream about it.

Charles


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## Airframes (Oct 17, 2010)

Yep, would need a really good lottery win just to keep it serviceable for one year! Ah well, back to the world of dreams .......


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## vikingBerserker (Oct 17, 2010)

..........but dam would it be fun..........


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## armadillomaster1 (Oct 18, 2010)

$750,000 is about £400k which isn't that expensive really...... Im sure to keep it running would cost more, but who needs to keep it running, buy it, restore it and museum it? Offer pictures for sale for kids in the cockpit and you can pay for the upkeep that way.


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## ccheese (Oct 18, 2010)

Lads I have some more information on the B-25 at Franklin, Va. I work with a guy who is very active at The Military 
Aviation Museum at Virgina Beach, VA. It appears the aircraft is for sale, and the musuem is negotating with the
owners for a sale. I heard the asking price was $775,000.00 *As is /Where is.*.

The guy that I work with sent me the following pic's. 
Pic One was taken in 1975
Pic Two was taken in 1993, in her hey-day.
Pic Three was taken in Franklin, but not by me.
Pick Four was taken in 1973

How quick they go downhill when they are not taken care of.......

Maybe this grand old lady will get back into the air ???

Charles


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## Night Fighter Nut (Oct 18, 2010)

What a shame... It would be nice to see her back in shape again.


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## timshatz (Oct 18, 2010)

Asking 775K for that bird, as is, is stupid. I've seen them, in flying condition, go for less. Here's on on Courtesy's page for 100K+ less than these jokers are asking for it.

N345BG North American TB-25N

Probably throw the 775K number out there to discourage anyone who isn't serious. But the rebuild on that one one will go into the hundreds of thousands, if not million+. As such, the purchase price, "as is" should be around 250-300K tops.

Just too much work to be done.


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## CliffyB (Oct 18, 2010)

^^^^Remember that its missing an entire engine as well.... How much does a Wright R-2600 Cyclone go for these days?


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## Airframes (Oct 18, 2010)

Thanks for the update Charles, and good to hear she might yet be saved.
I agree about the cost of re-build. When she was converted into the camera ship for the BoB movie, she was lightened and strengthened, as well as the numerous modifications for camera positions. No doubt this would have to be taken into consideration when a re-build is undertaken, as I'm guessing any non-standard mods would need thorough checking, NDT and approval, adding to the time and cost of the restoration.


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## timshatz (Oct 18, 2010)

CliffyB said:


> ^^^^Remember that its missing an entire engine as well.... How much does a Wright R-2600 Cyclone go for these days?



Missing an engine too! Forget it, for 775K, these guys are smoking crack! No way it's worth it.


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## armadillomaster (Aug 23, 2011)

If each member of the forum put say £/$10-20 averageinto a paypal account etc then purchasing a warbird wouldn't be out of the question.

People could get sponsorship too.


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## beaupower32 (Aug 23, 2011)

Might be true armadillomaster, but what would we do with it after we get it. Who knows how much money it would take to get it back to flying condition, plus that keeping it in flying condition. Would be more than what all of us forum members could muster up, especially now a days. Would be nice, but in the end it would be a lost effort for the members of the forum to try and buy a warbird and keep her going. just my .02 cents


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## vikingBerserker (Aug 23, 2011)

Heck, I'd be happy just to sit in the cockpit and make motor noises.


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## Trebor (Aug 23, 2011)

vikingBerserker said:


> Heck, I'd be happy just to sit in the cockpit and make motor noises.



don't we all do that?


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## beaupower32 (Aug 24, 2011)

motor noises with a nice set of......Oh wait, you mean actual motor noises that sound like airplanes, I think you can do that with a nice set of.......oh nevermind


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## armadillomaster (Aug 24, 2011)

beaupower32 said:


> Might be true armadillomaster, but what would we do with it after we get it. Who knows how much money it would take to get it back to flying condition, plus that keeping it in flying condition. Would be more than what all of us forum members could muster up, especially now a days. Would be nice, but in the end it would be a lost effort for the members of the forum to try and buy a warbird and keep her going. just my .02 cents



Or maybe restore it to Museum static condition. Then if the museum decide to make it airworthy they could?


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## beaupower32 (Aug 25, 2011)

It would be nice to restore it to Museum condition, but unfortuantly in this day and age it would be almost impossible for us to undertake a project like that. Alot of us are barely able to survive on what we are making, much less dish out some more for the restoration. I am pretty sure everyone hwere would love to help, but just wont happen any time soon. But hey, there is always hope though. We can still build plastic models and restore them that way!


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## Loyalwatcher (Aug 26, 2011)

Just saw this thread... it's a lovely-looking plane! I'll go buy a lottery ticket


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## ccheese (Dec 18, 2011)

Had to go to Franklin, Va. today, and took the business route US 58 just to pass by Franklin airport. The B-25 and the Fairchild trainer are still sitting on the tarmac. They both appear to be going derelict. It's now owned by a company in Texas. It's a real shame.... and BTW, this is the second time the B-25 has gone derelict. It went down hill in 1975 and was resurrected. I found this:



> Tom Cangialosi sends along an interesting photo of 44-31508 (N6578D) taken in New Jersey in 1975. This B-25 was used as the cameraship for the filming of the Battle of Britain in England in 1968. At that point, it was owned by Euramericair, a company operated by Jeff Hawke. Hawke also flew the airplane for the filming. After the filming was completed, a series of legal problems followed the airplane, not uncommon for Hawke and his airplanes. It was derelict at Caldwell, New Jersey, when this photo was taken. It went to Tom Reilly in 1977 and was returned to airworthy condition and operated as Chapter IX. It was later sold, and is now going derelict again, this time at Franklin, Virginia.



Charles


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## Aaron Brooks Wolters (Dec 18, 2011)

It's a real shame.But with the economy in the shape it's in it could be a long time before anyone attempts to restore it. Thank you for the update Charles. I wish there were something we could do about it.


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## Njaco (Dec 18, 2011)

Bring it back to New Jersey. We'll find a place for it!


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## Aaron Brooks Wolters (Dec 18, 2011)

I have an idea, let's get in touch with Dave from Virginia Beach and see if his boss would like to purchase it. You never know.


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## GrauGeist (Dec 18, 2011)

Hey, if they want some place to store it...have it shipped out here to Redding!


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## Njaco (Dec 18, 2011)

oh yeah, Reading, PA!


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## Aaron Brooks Wolters (Dec 18, 2011)

Sorry Dave.


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## GrauGeist (Dec 18, 2011)

Oh ha ha...

I meant the REAL Redding, in California (Redding Muni; RDD - to be exact)


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## Aaron Brooks Wolters (Dec 18, 2011)




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## ccheese (Dec 20, 2011)

Unfortunately, the B-25 is not for sale. And the tie-down fees are paid a year in advance. Trust me, I've looked into it.

Charles


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## Aaron Brooks Wolters (Dec 22, 2011)

I got in touch with Dave at and he said he would bring it up after the holidays. I informed him that it was not for sale but he said that he would still bring it up and see if there was some interest. So don't hold your breath but we stuck it out there, just maybe it can be saved.


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## B-17engineer (Dec 22, 2011)

Yeah Reading, PA we can have 5 B-25's at WW2 weekend.


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## Airframes (Dec 22, 2011)

Be nice to see it saved and preserved, even if only as a static exhibit, rather than see it rot to beyond recovery due to some speculator thinking a higher price can be achieved at some point in the future.
Given that the airframe was lightened, modified and 'customised' for the BoB movie, and Jeff Hawkes himself stated that it handled more like a fighter than a bomber because of this, there could be some fairly serious structural problems to contend with (above and beyond those expected after sitting unused for so long) in getting it airworthy.
Even if it was 'corrosion proofed', painted and made to 'look the part', it would be a darned sight better than leaving it to rot.


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## Aaron Brooks Wolters (Dec 22, 2011)

Terry, the gentleman whom I am try to get to is DavetheWWIInuts boss at the museum in Virginia Beach, Virginia. If I'm not mistaken, every thing they have there is airworthy so if he can work a deal to purchase it I think it stands a excellent chance of seeing the air again.


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## vikingBerserker (Dec 22, 2011)

Excellent Aaron!


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## Aaron Brooks Wolters (Dec 22, 2011)

My hopes are up David. Dave said that he would do what he could so who knows. Hope he keep us informed.


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## Airframes (Dec 23, 2011)

Me too. They do excellent work at the Virginia Beach museum, and are currently having a Mosquito restored to airworthy condition in New Zealand - an airframe that's been standing/stored for decades.


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## ccheese (Dec 24, 2011)

Aaron Brooks Wolters said:


> Terry, the gentleman whom I am try to get to is DavetheWWIInuts boss at the museum in Virginia Beach, Virginia. If I'm not mistaken, every thing they have there is airworthy so if he can work a deal to purchase it I think it stands a excellent chance of seeing the air again.



Maybe he can do something with the Fairchild trainer that's also sitting up in Franklin, to rot. If it's donations he needs, let us know. There are a few of us who would donate a quid or two.

BTW, David Hunt is the director of the Aviation Museum and his email address is: [email protected]
if anyone wants to jump on the band wagon and try to save the B-25 email him with your concerns........ I did !

Charles


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## Aaron Brooks Wolters (Dec 24, 2011)

It's possible Charles. I forgot to mention it though. I will mention it also.


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## ccheese (Dec 27, 2011)

I just got an email from David Hunt, the Director of the Aviation Museum at Virginia Beach. It reads:



David Hunt said:


> Mr Cheeseman,
> 
> We tried to buy this airplane on several occasions with no luck. I'm informed by Mr Yagen that the gentleman who owns the plane has some kind of a problem and does not wish to talk about selling or any other type of a deal to make it air worthy. Sadly we have moved on and have many more projects that need time and money, but I know Jerry is keeping a close eye on the plane and the situation.
> 
> ...



That kinda puts the lid on it.... for now, anyway.

Charles


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## vikingBerserker (Dec 27, 2011)

Dam..............


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## Aaron Brooks Wolters (Dec 27, 2011)

Well, they are keeping an eye on it so there is hope.


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## evangilder (Dec 27, 2011)

Shame to see it happen. But I do know that B-25 restorations are very costly and time consuming. In Camarillo, they have been restoring a USMC PBJ (Navy version of the B-25, and the only one that survived), and they are hoping to have it ready for the 2013 airshow season. I have been watching that crew go over that aircraft rivet by rivet and it is starting to take form of its former self. But it's been years in the process and the costs are always an issue.

But there is a big difference between restoration to flying status and for static display in both money and time. If nothing else, it deserves to be displayed nicely, not left to rot.

Reactions: Like Like:
1 | Like List reactions


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## csteimel47591 (May 4, 2012)

haha, this thing is visible from google earth.... Poor thing has been there so long.... If we work during the nights, we can tack my old Lycoming IO-360 on that baby and fly her outta there... who is in?
She deserves a better home


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## Njaco (May 6, 2012)

And we are the dreamers of dreams,
Wandering by lone sea-breakers,
And sitting by desolate streams;—
World-losers and world-forsakers,
On whom the pale moon gleams:
Yet we are the movers and shakers
Of the world for ever, it seems.


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## B-25 fan (Oct 24, 2012)

I am currently in negotiations with a broker representing the owner of this B-25. Our foundation is attempting to acquire this airplane and return it to flying condition for the State of South Carolina. We would appreciate any and all support from this community of aviation buffs. Donations to assist in the effort to acquire this B-25 are sorely needed. Time to put you money to work in doing something special to save this airplane. Visit The South Carolina Historic Aviation Foundation (SCHAF) - The Story of a Special B-25C Mitchell Bomber or contact me thur this site. Gary Byrd (VP - SCHAF) [email protected]


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## ccheese (Apr 29, 2014)

Hey guys.... Remember the B-25 sitting at Franklin Airport, in Franklin, Va ? I just found it it was listed in Ebay !! 

If you like browsing eBay for good deals, you might have missed one in December. TB-25K 44-31508 (N6578D), also known as Lucky Lady, was offered on eBay and though it had 21 bidders by the time the auction closed on December 13, it did not meet the reserve price, when the bidding stopped at $82,600.

Wonder what the reserve was ?

Charles


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## vikingBerserker (Apr 29, 2014)

Such a shame!


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## Aaron D (Aug 2, 2014)

Hey all, new here but not new to knowing about the aircraft here. I live in franklin and have been here since 96, it's always been on the tarmac missing her engine. But here recently she was moved, where to is the mystery but my guess is she is is in the bigger hanger but she no longer is in view from the road.


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## GrauGeist (Aug 3, 2014)

Thanks for the update, Aaron...perhaps stop by the flight center there and check on it's disposition.


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## vikingBerserker (Aug 3, 2014)

Welcome aboard Aaron, and thanks for the update.


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## Aaron D (Aug 3, 2014)

IF I'm correct, I think there is also another older ww2 bird in the big hanger too, but its a single engine bird.

Anyway, if I get any info I'll pass it along.

Sidenote: Viking, I'm also from S.C. I was born in Sumter.


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## ccheese (Feb 19, 2017)

Aaron D said:


> Hey all, new here but not new to knowing about the aircraft here. I live in franklin and have been here since 96, it's always been on the tarmac missing her engine. But here recently she was moved, where to is the mystery but my guess is she is is in the bigger hanger but she no longer is in view from the road.



Aaron: The B-25 was purchased by The Reevers organization, in Australia. She's going on static display on Apiril 17, 2017.
She's in the process of being painted in the colors of a Dutch squadron. More info here:

Reevers Warbirds’s B-25 “Lucky Lady” Update.

Charles


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