# Grumman F4F Wildcat



## Snautzer01 (Sep 28, 2016)



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## Wurger (Sep 28, 2016)




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## Gnomey (Sep 28, 2016)

Good shots!


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## Snautzer01 (Sep 28, 2016)



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## Wurger (Sep 28, 2016)




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## Old Wizard (Sep 28, 2016)




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## Snautzer01 (Sep 29, 2016)



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## buffnut453 (Sep 29, 2016)

Erm....first pic in Post #1 is an F6F not an F4F. Sorry for the pedantry.


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## Snautzer01 (Sep 30, 2016)

buffnut453 said:


> Erm....first pic in Post #1 is an F6F not an F4F. Sorry for the pedantry.



Thanks for the correction,

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## Snautzer01 (Sep 30, 2016)

VF-3 1942

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## Wurger (Oct 1, 2016)




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## Old Wizard (Oct 1, 2016)




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## XBe02Drvr (Oct 2, 2016)

buffnut453 said:


> Erm....first pic in Post #1 is an F6F not an F4F. Sorry for the pedantry.



Buffnut, are you seeing the same picture I am; one plane pulled apart from the rest on a carrier deck, wearing a pre-1943 color scheme, with the deck apes standing around getting their change of shift briefing? Sure looks to me like an early Pratt 1830 powered F4F, with its mid wing, fuselage mounted "pop-out"(hand cranked, BTW) landing gear, and its four wing mounted guns. (Don't be fooled by the outboard port on th starboard wing; it's a light.)

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## buffnut453 (Oct 2, 2016)

Nope...it's changed. There were originally 3 pics in Post #1, the first being an F6F against a backdrop of another ship going past (destroyer, maybe...it was a shippy thing so I wasn't paying attention to it  ).


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## Snautzer01 (Mar 11, 2017)

Martlet

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## Wurger (Mar 11, 2017)




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## Capt. Vick (Mar 11, 2017)

She held the line in the Pacific


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## Robert Porter (Mar 11, 2017)

It is what I love about this forum, I learn just enough to tickle my "I need to know more about that" button. I did not even know what that aircraft was until now.


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## Capt. Vick (Mar 11, 2017)

In that case you should ask Terry (Airframes) to tell you all about her. That's his favorite plane in the whole wide world. Mine is the EE Ugly, I mean Lightning.

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## Old Wizard (Mar 11, 2017)




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## Robert Porter (Mar 12, 2017)

I am with you on the Lightning but it is pretty cool to learn new to me stuff!


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## Gnomey (Mar 19, 2017)

Nice shots!


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## Snautzer01 (Aug 11, 2017)

Henderson Field attacked by Japanese bombers, Guadalcanal, 1942.

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## Wurger (Aug 11, 2017)




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## XBe02Drvr (Aug 11, 2017)

Snautzer01 said:


> Henderson Field attacked by Japanese bombers, Guadalcanal, 1942.


I've seen this picture before. The oral surgeon who relieved me of my impacted wisdom teeth, Capt. Lew Slagle USN, had it and a bunch of other Wildcat/Hellcat photos on his office wall. In his younger days he was a fighter pilot in VF-10 (Grim Reapers) and was sent on detachment to Henderson Field in its early days, where one day he tried to take off in front of a gaggle of strafing Zeros. He got off in his "swiss cheese" F4F and was cranking the gear up when a bullet hit something in the gear mechanism and jerked the crank out of his hand, which flailed around as the gear flopped back down, smashing his forearm, leaving the bones sticking out and bleeding profusely. So here's a one armed pilot stuck at low altitude in a rapidly disintegrating Wildcat, gear and takeoff flaps down, engine at full throttle, and a bunch of Zeros shooting at him. About a mile beyond the runway was a river with trees arched over it so he dropped through a gap in the foliage and flew up the river under the canopy. As he went upstream, the river got narrower, so when he came to another gap he pulled up for a look-see and the Zeros pounced again, so he did a wingover and headed back downstream in his "tunnel". This time one of the Zeros tried to make a firing pass shooting through the foliage, caught a wingtip in the trees (Lew thinks) and crashed. The others went off in search of easier targets, and Lew brought his battered bird home barely conscious from loss of blood.
Thirty-one years later he still had massive vivid scars on his forearm, and after two consecutive careers in the Navy, more "fruit salad" on his uniform shirt than most admirals. Not all that often you see a dentist wearing a DFC and wings. He could teach instrument and multi-engine at the flying club, run a mean intercept from the back seat of an F-4, show the "young guns" (lieutenant commanders and commanders) a thing or two when he went for his monthly "flight skins" in the TA-4, and show up incognito in civvies at the EM Club to have a few brews with the enlisted guys, most of whom thought he was "some old-timer retiree". Senior pilots in VF-101 (Grim Reapers again) would vie for the opportunity to give Lew his monthly rides for flight pay. Even though no longer an active pilot, he was allowed to remain flightcrew qualified under some "aeromedical observer" clause, and those Top Gun trained instructors let him fly the TA-4 from the front seat where he could dogfight with the best of them. Not bad for an old geezer, huh? They even painted his name under the cockpit of whichever plane was this month's hangar queen. (No active pilot or RIO wanted his name there!) Lew had held every rank from Seaman Recruit to Captain, had refused Admiral twice ("Who wants to be stuck in Bethesda for the rest of their career? It's too close to DC!"), had entered the Navy as a 17 year old dropout, and acquired a PHD, a Doctor of Dental Surgery, and an ATP along the way. At his age and time in service he needed and got annual Congressional authorisation to remain on active duty, and the taxpayers got their money's worth in (unofficial) counseling and retention (do you know how much it costs to replace a Naval Aviator who decides to quit and go fly airliners?). In his quiet way, he was a powerful influence on why the Navy was a good choice for a young aviator to stay and make a career. Not your average joe, but that's what he thought of himself as. After he returned your salute, he wanted you to address him by his first name. A true national treasure!
Cheers,
Wes


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## Wayne Little (Aug 12, 2017)




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## Old Wizard (Aug 12, 2017)




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## Gnomey (Aug 14, 2017)

Good shot!


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## Snautzer01 (Aug 21, 2017)




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## Wurger (Aug 21, 2017)




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## XBe02Drvr (Aug 21, 2017)

America's answer to the Komet? Guess the "space race" started earlier than we thought!


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## Old Wizard (Aug 21, 2017)




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## Wayne Little (Aug 22, 2017)

More power....!!!


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## buffnut453 (Aug 22, 2017)

I think I can...I think I can...I think I can.


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## johnbr (Aug 21, 2018)



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## johnbr (Aug 21, 2018)



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## Wurger (Aug 21, 2018)




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## johnbr (Aug 21, 2018)

Grumman F4F Wildcat float plane.

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## Wurger (Aug 21, 2018)




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## johnbr (Aug 21, 2018)

Damaged aircraft after typhoon. This photo was taken in the fall of 1944, before the "big" typhoon of Dec 17 and 18, 1944. It shows a small part of the damaged aircraft (_*F6F Hellcats*_) on the hangar deck a day or so after the first of the typhoons that the Independence survived. This one caught the ship partially unprepared. Much damage was done because while the planes were lashed down, the hydraulics of the landing gear had not been drained, the planes thus stretched their lashes and broke loose in many cases. On the left airplane there is an air ordnance man working on the starboard guns, possibly replacing one or more if they were damaged.


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## Wurger (Aug 21, 2018)




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## johnbr (Aug 21, 2018)

Warbird Information Exchange • View topic - Grumman, the people that made the planes 12 SEPT 2010
Mockup


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## Wurger (Aug 21, 2018)




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## Snautzer01 (Jan 25, 2019)

WW2 original photo Lt ( jg) La Verve H. Peck VC-7 at Fleet post office | eBay


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## Wurger (Jan 25, 2019)




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## Snautzer01 (Feb 2, 2019)

1943 vintage original color magazine photo Fighter Pilot Awaits Orders WWII | eBay


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## Wurger (Feb 2, 2019)




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## Snautzer01 (May 7, 2019)

WWII Grumman F4F "Wildcat" in Flight Original Press Photo | eBay


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## Wurger (May 7, 2019)




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## Snautzer01 (May 19, 2019)

WWII F4F Wildcat Aircraft Glass Lantern Photo | eBay

Grumman G-36A, NXG2


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## Wurger (May 19, 2019)




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## Gnomey (May 21, 2019)

Good shots!


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## Snautzer01 (Jun 15, 2019)

1942 Wildcat Fighter Leaves Carrier for Gilbert Marshall Islands Orig News Photo | eBay


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## Wurger (Jun 15, 2019)




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## Snautzer01 (Sep 3, 2019)

VINTAGE MILITARY AIRPLANE AIRCRAFT PHOTO PHOTOGRAPH 8X10 GRUMMAN F4F-3 WILDCAT ^ | eBay


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## Snautzer01 (Sep 3, 2019)

VINTAGE MILITARY AIRPLANE AIRCRAFT PHOTO PHOTOGRAPH 8X10 GRUMMAN MARTETTI G-36A | eBay


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## Snautzer01 (Sep 3, 2019)

VINTAGE MILITARY AIRPLANE AIRCRAFT PHOTO PHOTOGRAPH 8X10 GRUMMAN XF4F-3 WILDCAT | eBay


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## Snautzer01 (Sep 8, 2019)

VINTAGE WWII MILITARY AIRPORT AIRPLANE FACTORY INDUSTRIAL PHOTO PHOTOGRAPH 8X10* | eBay


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## Snautzer01 (Sep 8, 2019)

VINTAGE WWII MILITARY AIRPORT AIRPLANE FACTORY INDUSTRIAL PHOTO PHOTOGRAPH 8X10 | eBay


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## Wurger (Sep 8, 2019)




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## Snautzer01 (Sep 17, 2019)

Marine F4F Wildcat Fighters at Henderson Field, Guadalcanal '43 | eBay

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## fubar57 (Sep 17, 2019)

Primitive.


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## Wurger (Sep 17, 2019)




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## Snautzer01 (Sep 30, 2019)

1942 Press Photo Navy Fighters Fire Machine Guns before North Africa Operations | eBay

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## Wurger (Sep 30, 2019)




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## Snautzer01 (Oct 5, 2019)

Fighter Planes ready for take off on the HMS Formidable 8"x 10" WWII Photo 354 | eBay

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## Wayne Little (Oct 6, 2019)

NICE shot.


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## Gnomey (Oct 7, 2019)

Nice shots!


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## fubar57 (Oct 10, 2019)




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## T Bolt (Oct 15, 2019)




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## Snautzer01 (Nov 5, 2019)

Original WWII Snapshot Photo ALLIED BRITISH RAF? Fighter Tunisia North Africa33 | eBay

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## Wurger (Nov 5, 2019)




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## Gnomey (Nov 7, 2019)

Good shots!


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## fubar57 (Nov 7, 2019)

Good one


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## Snautzer01 (Feb 10, 2020)

WW II Press Photo Gumman Wildcat Being Towed to Guadalcanal Dump | eBay


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## Snautzer01 (Feb 10, 2020)

1942 AP WIRE PHOTO from US. NAVY* Airplane* Anti Aircraft Guns* Deck Crew | eBay


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## Wurger (Feb 10, 2020)




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## Snautzer01 (Feb 12, 2020)

four Grumman Wildcat fighters in formation Two-sided WWII Color Magazine Photo | eBay

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## Wurger (Feb 12, 2020)




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## fubar57 (Feb 12, 2020)

A well known photo, used it on one of my GBs


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## Snautzer01 (Feb 17, 2020)

AK Grumman G-36 Single-Seat Fighter, New Fleet Air Arm Machine from America | eBay


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## Wurger (Feb 17, 2020)




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## Snautzer01 (Feb 24, 2020)

VINTAGE WWII MILITARY AIRPORT AIRPLANE FACTORY INDUSTRIAL PHOTO PHOTOGRAPH 8X10 | eBay


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## Snautzer01 (Apr 21, 2020)

1943 Press Photo crewmen reload guns of Grumman Wildcat planes aboard ENTERPRISE | eBay

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## Wurger (Apr 21, 2020)




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## fubar57 (Apr 21, 2020)

Seller says it original


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## Snautzer01 (Apr 22, 2020)

Org. Photo: British Royal Navy Airmen w/ Martlet Fighter Plane on Airfield!!! | eBay


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## Snautzer01 (Jun 7, 2020)

Org. Photo: US Navy F4F Wildcat Fighter Plane Being Refueled on Airfield!!! | eBay

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## Wayne Little (Jun 7, 2020)

Cool.


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## Wurger (Jun 7, 2020)




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## Snautzer01 (Nov 23, 2020)

GRUMMAN WILDCAT - ORIGINAL AVIATION PHOTO- MOYES & BOWYER COLLECTIONS | eBay

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## Wurger (Nov 23, 2020)




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## Snautzer01 (Nov 30, 2020)

1943 WW2 aircraft print Photos Navy F4F-3 Wildcats , Brewster Buccaneer ,041620 | eBay

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## Snautzer01 (Feb 5, 2021)

interesting photo of the royal navy grumman wildcat F4F-3 looks to be a post war | eBay

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## Wurger (Feb 5, 2021)




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## Snautzer01 (May 5, 2021)

WW2: F6-F HELLCAT ORIGINAL BRITISH AIR MINISTRY PHOTOGRAPH | eBay

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## rochie (May 5, 2021)

Nice, last one looks a strange colour


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## Wurger (May 5, 2021)

No wonder... F6F 
I would say we should ask Terry about that colour.

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## Crimea_River (May 5, 2021)

Terry will see red. What's hanging under the wing?

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## Wurger (May 5, 2021)

Crimea_River said:


> Terry will see red. What's hanging under the wing?



Judging by its head it's a British CLE supply container. Also found the info via the net ......

"FM1 Martlet Mk V (Wildcat) JV330 ---- jul-45-Airbone Forces Extablishment Beaulier, Hants, used for carrier and dropping canister."





the pic source: Kampfgruppe Willow: D-Day and Arnhem, supplies from the sky! Airborne CLE canisters and Baskets

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## fubar57 (May 5, 2021)



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## Gnomey (May 7, 2021)

Good shots!


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## Snautzer01 (Jun 29, 2021)

Lot of 15 WWII US original Photograph Wild Cat & corsair Fighter plane pilot etc | eBay


Estate find. Condition is "Used". There will be age/use imperfections. All 15 photos shown are included. Sold as found.



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## Snautzer01 (Aug 4, 2021)

WWII US Brewster Buffalo Grumman Wildcat Vought Kingfisher 1942 MAGAZINE PHOTO | eBay


Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for WWII US Brewster Buffalo Grumman Wildcat Vought Kingfisher 1942 MAGAZINE PHOTO at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!



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## Wurger (Aug 4, 2021)




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## R Leonard (Aug 4, 2021)

This is a shot of my father's VF-11 F4F-4, b/n 11985, at Fighter One on Guadalcanal.





And the side panels showing the VF-11 squadron insignia from same. Were you to turn them over and hold them up to the light at just the right angle you'd be able to make out "F-21" in pencil on the inside.

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## vikingBerserker (Aug 4, 2021)

Thats awsome!

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## Wurger (Aug 4, 2021)




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## Gnomey (Aug 7, 2021)

Nice shots!


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## Snautzer01 (Nov 22, 2021)

WWII: GRUMMAN / WILDCAT I ORIGINAL AIR MINISTRY PHOTOGRAPH SEPT 1940 | eBay


GRUMMAN / WILDCAT I. ORIGINAL AIR MINISTRY PHOTOGRAPH. AIR MINISTRY REF: 9,652 D. USED condition.



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GRUMMAN / WILDCAT I ORIGINAL AIR MINISTRY PHOTOGRAPH SEPT 1940 AIR MINISTRY

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## Snautzer01 (Nov 22, 2021)

F002432 Grumman F4F Wildcat 1 | eBay


Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for F002432 Grumman F4F Wildcat 1 at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!



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GRUMMAN / WILDCAT I ORIGINAL AIR MINISTRY PHOTOGRAPH SEPT 1940 AIR MINISTRY


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## Snautzer01 (Nov 22, 2021)

WWII: GRUMMAN / MARTLET I CYCLONE ORIGINAL AIR MINISTRY PHOTOGRAPH JAN 1941 | eBay


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## Wurger (Nov 22, 2021)




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## Snautzer01 (Feb 3, 2022)

WWII: WILDCATS ON BOARD HMS PURSUER OFF COAST OF NORWAY IWM PHOTOGRAPH 1944 | eBay


IWM PHOTOGRAPH. WILDCATS ON BOARD HMS PURSUER. OFF COAST OF NORWAY. Condition: USED.



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WILDCATS ON BOARD HMS PURSUER OFF COAST OF NORWAY IWM PHOTOGRAPH 1944

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## Wurger (Feb 3, 2022)




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## nuuumannn (Feb 4, 2022)

Snautzer01 said:


> interesting photo of the royal navy grumman wildcat F4F-3 looks to be a post war | eBay



Definitely taken during the war, probably in September 1940 when the first were delivered from the USA. Note the tricolor rudder, a hat tip to the original French order for the aircraft, which was taken over by a hasty request from the Royal Navy while they were still on the production line. The colour scheme was interesting and has been subject to much post-war comment. This surviving Martlet I is still in its delivery scheme - yup, this is the colour scheme the first Martlets arrived from Grumman in.




DSC_0673 



Snautzer01 said:


> GRUMMAN / WILDCAT I ORIGINAL AIR MINISTRY PHOTOGRAPH SEPT 1940 AIR MINISTRY



This is either AX826 or AX828, both of which were at Boscombe Down in September 1940. Initial reports stating that it was pleasant to fly with straight forward stalls, but its narrow track and gear was regarded as "twitchy". Comments included the placing together of the similar looking flap and fuel levers and contamination of the cockpit of fumes. Its maximum range, which was calculated at 930 miles from 136 gallons of fuel, which was very impressive.

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## Wurger (Feb 4, 2022)




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## EwenS (Feb 4, 2022)

nuuumannn said:


> Definitely taken during the war, probably in September 1940 when the first were delivered from the USA. Note the tricolor rudder, a hat tip to the original French order for the aircraft, which was taken over by a hasty request from the Royal Navy while they were still on the production line.



It wasn’t a request from the RN.

At 0330 on Monday, 17 June 1940, some five hours before the US Treasury froze all French assets in the USA, the head of the British Purchasing Commission, Arthur Purvis, signed a deal with French representatives, that assigned French interests in some 151 aircraft and engine contracts worth some $425m to Britain. Amongst those was the contract for 81 G-36A, Grumman’s export designation for the F4F. These became known as Martlet I when they arrived in Britain in Sept 1940.

This decision was to 
1. Obtain the aircraft
2. To convince the US public that Britain would fight on and 
3. Because of what was seen as a “moral” responsibility since the two countries had worked closely together to procure aircraft in the US and it was seen, at least in part, as a joint commitment.

Arthur Purvis, who signed the document, said it was the hardest decision he ever made. He is said to have sat for half an hour, pen in hand, before appending his signature to the document.

$425 million in 1940 is about $8.5 billion in today’s terms. All transferred with a single signature. No wonder he hesitated!

Article here about the Martlet /Wildcat in RN service.


The Grumman Wildcat in FAA Service by Bruce Archer

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## nuuumannn (Feb 7, 2022)

EwenS said:


> It wasn’t a request from the RN.



Thank you for that, Ewen, I was always under the impression that the RN ordered the aircraft. Good information.


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## Snautzer01 (Jun 12, 2022)

1943 Royal Navy F4F Martlet



















1943 Royal Navy F4F Martlet Wildcat Fighters 7x9 Original News Photo | eBay


Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for 1943 Royal Navy F4F Martlet Wildcat Fighters 7x9 Original News Photo at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!



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## Wurger (Jun 12, 2022)




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## Snautzer01 (Oct 6, 2022)

Martlet Western Desert Navy RNFS code ??725




















WW2 PRESS PHOTOGRAPH-ROYAL NAVY FIGHTER SQUADRON IN THE WESTERN DESERT | eBay


<p>WW2 PRESS PHOTOGRAPH -Original </p><p>See pictures for item </p>



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## Wurger (Oct 6, 2022)




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## R Leonard (Oct 6, 2022)

Probably starts with "AX"


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## Gnomey (Oct 6, 2022)

Nice shots!


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## Snautzer01 (Nov 9, 2022)

1942 HMS Formidable AM974




















Grumman F4F Wildcat 1942￼ HMS Formidable WWII Fleet Air Arm RAF | eBay


Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Grumman F4F Wildcat 1942￼ HMS Formidable WWII Fleet Air Arm RAF at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!



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## BlackSheep (Nov 9, 2022)

nuuumannn said:


> Definitely taken during the war, probably in September 1940 when the first were delivered from the USA. Note the tricolor rudder, a hat tip to the original French order for the aircraft, which was taken over by a hasty request from the Royal Navy while they were still on the production line. The colour scheme was interesting and has been subject to much post-war comment. This surviving Martlet I is still in its delivery scheme - yup, this is the colour scheme the first Martlets arrived from Grumman in.
> 
> View attachment 656876
> DSC_0673
> ...





Snautzer01 said:


> Marine F4F Wildcat Fighters at Henderson Field, Guadalcanal '43 | eBay
> 
> View attachment 552879


Can you imagine operating in those conditions with such narrow aspect landing gear? Just when you’re off the ground, relaxing all the tight muscles, you still have to crank them up, then you can go after Japanese bombers and fighters… Now people whine and cry that one time a year, they have to crank up a crappy little OEM jack to change a flat tire on their car.

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## fubar57 (Nov 9, 2022)

Snautzer01 said:


> 1942 HMS Formidable AM974
> 
> View attachment 693765
> 
> ...

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## Wurger (Nov 9, 2022)




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## nuuumannn (Nov 9, 2022)

BlackSheep said:


> Can you imagine operating in those conditions with such narrow aspect landing gear?



It might have been narrow, which it was, but it was surprisingly robust. The F4F remained operating in pretty rough conditions on Pacific landing strips throughout the war. I don't have to hand anything that displays failure rates because of the harsh conditions, but it is not something I have read. The F2A's gear was notoriously trouble prone.


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## XBe02Drvr (Nov 9, 2022)

BlackSheep said:


> Just when you’re off the ground, relaxing all the tight muscles, you still have to crank them up, then you can go after Japanese bombers and fighters… Now people whine and cry that one time a year, they have to crank up a crappy little OEM jack to change a flat tire on their car.


I think those F4Fs are -4s. They had electric gear. -3s had the hand crank. This per an ex Naval Aviator who flew both from Henderson. He said with the -3 you cranked til it got hard, then poked the stick forward to unload gravity on the gear and help it come up the rest of the way. "Whatever you do, don't lose your grip on the crank; it'll flail around and break your forearm!" He had the scar to prove it.

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## BlackSheep (Nov 9, 2022)

XBe02Drvr said:


> I think those F4Fs are -4s. They had electric gear. -3s had the hand crank. This per an ex Naval Aviator who flew both from Henderson. He said with the -3 you cranked til it got hard, then poked the stick forward to unload gravity on the gear and help it come up the rest of the way. "Whatever you do, don't lose your grip on the crank; it'll flail around and break your forearm!" He had the scar to prove it.


Great bit of info, thanks!

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## mjfur (Nov 10, 2022)

XBe02Drvr said:


> I think those F4Fs are -4s. They had electric gear. -3s had the hand crank. This per an ex Naval Aviator who flew both from Henderson. He said with the -3 you cranked til it got hard, then poked the stick forward to unload gravity on the gear and help it come up the rest of the way. "Whatever you do, don't lose your grip on the crank; it'll flail around and break your forearm!" He had the scar to prove it.


I'm not aware of an Electric Gear in any F4F/FM.








F4F-4 view of right side of cockpit showing landing gear crank & other controls







cdm16694.contentdm.oclc.org


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## XBe02Drvr (Nov 10, 2022)

mjfur said:


> I'm not aware of an Electric Gear in any F4F/FM.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


According to Capt Slagle, on the -3 the gear operating crank was on the left side and operated with the pilot's throttle hand. The -4 had an emergency gear operating crank on the right for when the electric/hydraulic system failed.


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## BlackSheep (Nov 10, 2022)

Here are a couple of photos that always interested me…





This was described as gun test firing on USS Ranger prior to Operation Torch… I always wondered if and how they test fired guns while on deck.

This next pic is captioned USS Hornet on route to Japan, during Doolittle Raid. I was always under the impression that the Hornet didn’t have access to her fighters with the bombers aboard. Also of note from the same article this picture came from, the author states that Doolittle and another officer made test take-offs from the Hornet, to prove it could be done. I’d always heard the first take-offs were for the actual mission. Anyone ever heard of this?

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## EwenS (Nov 10, 2022)

BlackSheep said:


> Here are a couple of photos that always interested me…
> View attachment 693891
> 
> 
> ...


There was a trial at Norfolk Virginia referred to here (Wiki says 3 Feb 1942) to prove the concept.





Doolittle Raid


Conceived in January 1942 in the wake of the devastating Japanese surprise attack on Pearl Harbor, the “joint Army-Navy bombing project” was to bomb Japanese industrial centers, to inflict both “material and psychological” damage upon the enemy. Planners hoped that the former would include the...




www.history.navy.mil





There is a series of photos here taken during the mission.


Aircraft Carrier Photo Index: USS HORNET (CV-8)



Things to note
1. Some show SBDs on deck amongst the B-25B


https://www.navsource.org/archives/02/020872.jpg



2. The B-25B were respotted on the deck prior to being flown off. When they left the USA they were parked from the aft end of the flight deck to forward of the island. They were respotted aft to allow a greater take off distance.



https://www.navsource.org/archives/02/020875.jpg



And by take off time with the aftmost overhanging the aft end of the flight deck.



https://www.navsource.org/archives/02/020846a.jpg

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## GTX (Nov 10, 2022)

BlackSheep said:


> View attachment 693891


Does that constitute firing a broadside?

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## BlackSheep (Nov 10, 2022)

EwenS said:


> There was a trial at Norfolk Virginia referred to here (Wiki says 3 Feb 1942) to prove the concept.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks for the great info!


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## BlackSheep (Nov 10, 2022)

GTX said:


> Does that constitute firing a broadside?


The mother of puff the magic dragon?


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## Snautzer01 (Nov 10, 2022)

Martlet Royal Navy 1943



















1943 Royal Navy F4F Martlet Wildcat Fighters 7x9 Original News Photo | eBay


Jan. 6, 1943. Grading Standard: News Agency 1st Generation AKA Original Press Photo. News Agency and Official photos fall into this category automatically. Press photograph. Soundphoto This type of photo was an early form of electronic transmission.



www.ebay.com

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## nuuumannn (Nov 10, 2022)

It's interesting how the typist refers to the Allies as the "United Nations", not the first time I've seen this term used in wartime correspondence, but intriguing, nonetheless.


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## mjfur (Nov 10, 2022)

XBe02Drvr said:


> According to Capt Slagle, on the -3 the gear operating crank was on the left side and operated with the pilot's throttle hand. The -4 had an emergency gear operating crank on the right for when the electric/hydraulic system failed.


F4F-3 Cockpit, gear handle on the right.


Wildcat cockpit details



Lewis AIr Legends F4F-3, 


https://i.pinimg.com/originals/d2/65/7c/d2657c2926d8f2051db0a93a1e2ae12a.jpg




https://i.pinimg.com/736x/09/4d/1f/094d1f893fde6bb9679a78ec88e11bb7--decks-jpg.jpg

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## special ed (Nov 10, 2022)

I have mentioned in another thread a comment I read in a book in the 1950s about how one could tell if a USN pilot flew F4Fs by the way he wore his watch. He had it on the edge of his wrist because, if he wore it with the face on the outside of his wrist, it was scratched on the on the crank wheel when retracting the L/G, if he wore it on the inside of his wrist, he scratched it on the seat frame cranking. If one watches the "Dogfight" video series, look for the piece about Jefferson DeBlanc. In telling of his combat, he says the Zeke pilot shot the watch off of his wrist, and he touches the edge of his wrist just where F4F pilots wore it.

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## BlackSheep (Nov 11, 2022)

While looking over F4F photos, I found a remarkable sequence of photos depicting a failed take-off from the escort carrier USS CORE (CVE-13). The pilot, Julius Brownstien, dictated in detail what is happening in all 9 of the pictures, from take-off attempt to climbing out of a rapidly sinking Wildcat. Apparently, his take-off signal was mistimed during rough seas and the carrier’s bow was heading down a trough when he started forward causing a loss of lift. An excellent read can be found at: 
F4F Wildcat – History, at Random

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## BlackSheep (Nov 11, 2022)

I had originally intended to post this interesting picture, when I discovered the story above, but I think this is worth giving the eyeball.. Imagine making this climb while the ship is steaming forward and the waves are lifting it…

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## XBe02Drvr (Nov 12, 2022)

mjfur said:


> F4F-3 Cockpit, gear handle on the right.
> 
> 
> Wildcat cockpit details
> ...


Thanks for setting the record straight. I stand corrected.

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## Wildcat_drvr (Nov 14, 2022)

Sorta like that plane,,


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## Barrett (Nov 14, 2022)

XBe02Drvr said:


> Buffnut, are you seeing the same picture I am; one plane pulled apart from the rest on a carrier deck, wearing a pre-1943 color scheme, with the deck apes standing around getting their change of shift briefing? Sure looks to me like an early Pratt 1830 powered F4F, with its mid wing, fuselage mounted "pop-out"(hand cranked, BTW) landing gear, and its four wing mounted guns. (Don't be fooled by the outboard port on th starboard wing; it's a light.)


What XBe said. The airplane marked 6F16 is most definitely a Wildcat. Reminds me that you could get in a pretty decent cyber food fight on Facebook with all the people who insisted Wildcats were Hellcats and vice Versagofigger!

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## GreenKnight121 (Nov 14, 2022)

BlackSheep said:


> Here are a couple of photos that always interested me…
> View attachment 693891
> 
> 
> ...



Note this image taken during the voyage - if needed they would catapult off, and ditch alongside a destroyer.

Text for photo:


> NS020833e
> Most of *Hornet*'s Air Group (made up of 30 F4F-4 _Wildcat_s from VF-8, 12 SBD-3 _Dauntless_es from VB-8, 12 SBD-3's from VS-8, and 10 TBD-1 _Devastator_s from VT-8) was carried down in the hangar, but five _Wildcat_s were kept up on deck in case they were needed in an emergency.

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## BlackSheep (Nov 14, 2022)

GreenKnight121 said:


> Note this image taken during the voyage - if needed they would catapult off, and ditch alongside a destroyer.
> 
> Text for photo:
> 
> ...


Thanks for the additional info on the pic. After reviewing these pics and more, I think a great disservice was done when the deck personnel were not commended for keeping that floating airstrip somewhat usable on the way to target. Reminds me of one of those little puzzles where one square is missing and you move the others to create a picture…

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## GreenKnight121 (Nov 16, 2022)

nuuumannn said:


> It's interesting how the typist refers to the Allies as the "United Nations", not the first time I've seen this term used in wartime correspondence, but intriguing, nonetheless.





Wiki said:


> The first specific step towards the establishment of the United Nations was the Inter-Allied conference that led to the Declaration of St James's Palace on 12 June 1941.[14][15] By August 1941, American president Franklin Roosevelt and British prime minister Winston Churchill had drafted the Atlantic Charter to define goals for the post-war world. At the subsequent meeting of the Inter-Allied Council in London on 24 September 1941, the eight governments in exile of countries under Axis occupation, together with the Soviet Union and representatives of the Free French Forces, unanimously adopted adherence to the common principles of policy set forth by Britain and United States.[16][17]
> 
> President Roosevelt and Prime Minister Churchill met at the White House in December 1941 for the Arcadia Conference. *Roosevelt, considered a founder of the UN,[18][19] coined the term United Nations to describe the Allied countries. Churchill accepted it, noting its use by Lord Byron.* [20][21] The text of the Declaration by United Nations was drafted on 29 December 1941, by Roosevelt, Churchill, and Roosevelt aide Harry Hopkins. It incorporated Soviet suggestions but included no role for France. One major change from the Atlantic Charter was the addition of a provision for religious freedom, which Stalin approved after Roosevelt insisted.[22][23]
> 
> ...


The story of that discussion between Roosevelt and Churchill.
Wordorigins.org

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## Gnomey (Nov 17, 2022)

Good shots!


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## R Leonard (Nov 17, 2022)

ALL F4Fs and FMs had hand cranked landing gear, no electric, no hydraulic, nothing but Mk I right arm turning a chain drive. Period. Full Stop.

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## Thumpalumpacus (Nov 17, 2022)

If y'all have the time, Drachinifel posted this interview with Rex about the Wildcat. Watched it last night, it's a really good interview.

ETA: Time is about an hour and fifty minutes, to be clear. A long watch, but worth it.

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## R Leonard (Nov 18, 2022)

special ed said:


> I have mentioned in another thread a comment I read in a book in the 1950s about how one could tell if a USN pilot flew F4Fs by the way he wore his watch. He had it on the edge of his wrist because, if he wore it with the face on the outside of his wrist, it was scratched on the on the crank wheel when retracting the L/G, if he wore it on the inside of his wrist, he scratched it on the seat frame cranking. If one watches the "Dogfight" video series, look for the piece about Jefferson DeBlanc. In telling of his combat, he says the Zeke pilot shot the watch off of his wrist, and he touches the edge of his wrist just where F4F pilots wore it.



Watches and gear cranks are only a problem in an F4F if one wears his watch on the right wrist. Like most righties, I've always worn my watch on the left wrist with face on the inside of the wrist. That's the way my father, a career naval aviator and an F4F driver, wore his, so, an early influence. I asked him once, probably about the time of my first wristwatch why he wore it that way when most everyone else I saw wore the face on the outside of the wrist. He said something along the lines of flying an airplane or even driving a car it was easier to glance down at the inside of the wrist without moving the hand from whatever it was doing and turning the wrist over. Works for me.

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## XBe02Drvr (Nov 18, 2022)

R Leonard said:


> ALL F4Fs and FMs had hand cranked landing gear, no electric, no hydraulic, nothing but Mk I right arm turning a chain drive. Period. Full Stop.


Well, then the FM2 that visited our local airport back in the mid 80s must have been a one-off or a civil STC mod. While I was fueling his plane, I joked about the landing gear crank, and he said that it was for emergency extension only, and normal operation was electrically controlled hydraulic.
He had a cool little passenger compartment installed in the aft fuselage with blue tinted windows disguised in the horizontal bars of the national insignia. Musta raised hell with the CG.

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## R Leonard (Nov 18, 2022)

XBe02Drvr said:


> Well, then the FM2 that visited our local airport back in the mid 80s must have been a one-off or a civil STC mod. While I was fueling his plane, I joked about the landing gear crank, and he said that it was for emergency extension only, and normal operation was electrically controlled hydraulic.
> He had a cool little passenger compartment installed in the aft fuselage with blue tinted windows disguised in the horizontal bars of the national insignia. Musta raised hell with the CG.



Really doesn't matter what some fellow told you at the local airfield. Either 
a- he was pulling your leg, or
b- some sort of post manufactured, post service, modification.

In squadron, USN, active service, if you wanted the landing gear up or down, 28 turns on the crank, one way or the other, was the only option. See below, if the FM was any improvement over the F4F such improvements were most certainly not in the landing gear operation.

AN 01-190FB-1 Pilot's Handbook of Flight Operating Instructions – Navy Model FM-2 British Model Wildcat VI Airplanes – 

Note item #10





And operating from page 15

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## XBe02Drvr (Nov 19, 2022)

R Leonard said:


> Really doesn't matter what some fellow told you at the local airfield. Either
> a- he was pulling your leg, or
> b- some sort of post manufactured, post service, modification.
> 
> ...


Well, there it is in black and white. Thanks for that. That plane was clearly far from stock, with its well upholstered passenger compartment, modern com/nav equipment (including ILS), autopilot, and truly ferocious strobe light anticollision system. I'm guessing the landing gear was probably modded as well.
His R1820 rattled and clattered like they all do, however. Some things never change.

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## Snautzer01 (Dec 15, 2022)

nr 103
























Vintage B&W Photograph WWII Grumman F4F Wildcat Carrier Fighter Plane Rare | eBay


Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Vintage B&W Photograph WWII Grumman F4F Wildcat Carrier Fighter Plane Rare at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!



www.ebay.com

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## Wurger (Dec 15, 2022)




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## R Leonard (Dec 15, 2022)

This is, more correctly, an FM-2, not an F4F. Note exhaust location and the taller tail found only with the FM-2.

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## BlackSheep (Dec 15, 2022)

XBe02Drvr said:


> Well, then the FM2 that visited our local airport back in the mid 80s must have been a one-off or a civil STC mod. While I was fueling his plane, I joked about the landing gear crank, and he said that it was for emergency extension only, and normal operation was electrically controlled hydraulic.
> He had a cool little passenger compartment installed in the aft fuselage with blue tinted windows disguised in the horizontal bars of the national insignia. Musta raised hell with the CG.


That passenger cubby reminds me of some Skyraider info, I recently found and was going to add to the Skyraider thread still active. 
Before the 4-seat cockpit AD—5 was built, 35 AD-1Q and and an unspecified number of AD-3Ns were built. The AD-1Qs carried an ECM operator in the fuselage while the AD-3N carried 2 techs, an ECM operator and a radar operator for night attack and radar bombing. Talk about
claustrophobic, I don’t even want to think about the rumored 8-passenger model. And, I used to think flying radio operator in an Avenger sounded dicey……

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## SaparotRob (Dec 15, 2022)

I looked in Wiki about an ambulance version but couldn't find it. I thought there was one.


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## Snautzer01 (Dec 16, 2022)

1939 XF4F-3 during test flight















WW2 Picture Photo 1939 XF4F-3 during test flight 0048 | eBay


This is a nice reproduction of an photograph Size is about 4" x 6" (10x15cm). Type: New Print on high quality Photo Paper. Quality: This is NOT an inkjet or Laserjet print but one produced in a professional photographic lab.



www.ebay.com

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## BlackSheep (Dec 16, 2022)

SaparotRob said:


> I looked in Wiki about an ambulance version but couldn't find it. I thought there was one.


Wasn’t it also the cargo version with built in hoist?


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## Wurger (Dec 16, 2022)

Snautzer01 said:


> 1939 XF4F-3 during test flight
> 
> View attachment 698777
> 
> ...


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## Gnomey (Dec 28, 2022)

Nice shots!


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## hal bregg (Jan 2, 2023)

Spot the difference, censors job?:

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## BlackSheep (Jan 2, 2023)

hal bregg said:


> Spot the difference, censors job?:
> View attachment 700772
> 
> View attachment 700773


Great find!


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