# Avenger vs. Grumman



## mikamee14 (Apr 6, 2009)

What is the better torpedo bomber the TBM Avenger or the Grumman


----------



## comiso90 (Apr 6, 2009)

an age old question... I cant decide between the Chance Vought and the Corsair myself.

Or even the Republic and the P-47... Hmmmm


----------



## FLYBOYJ (Apr 6, 2009)

mikamee14 said:


> What is the better torpedo bomber the TBM Avenger or the Grumman



I think the Mustang is better than the P-51!!!!


----------



## Amsel (Apr 6, 2009)

Ouch.


----------



## comiso90 (Apr 6, 2009)

FLYBOYJ said:


> I think the Mustang is better than the P-51!!!!



Nope....

The North American has them both beat!

It had more bullets!
.


----------



## mlsco (Apr 6, 2009)

OK, never having posted but having lurked for a while, could I be the straight guy?

1) How identical were the GM and Grumman versions of the Avenger?

2) Similarly, what about the versions of the F4F from each manufacturer?

This might well be covered in another thread, so please forgive me.


----------



## Magister (Apr 6, 2009)

_OK, never having posted but having lurked for a while, *could I be the straight guy*?_


----------



## FLYBOYJ (Apr 7, 2009)

mlsco said:


> OK, never having posted but having lurked for a while, could I be the straight guy?
> 
> 1) How identical were the GM and Grumman versions of the Avenger?
> 
> ...


For the most part you would see no difference in quality or performance. The only sub contractor of large airframes that had noticeable quality problems built into their sub contracted aircraft was Brewster when they were building F4Us.


----------



## JoeB (Apr 7, 2009)

mlsco said:


> OK, never having posted but having lurked for a while, could I be the straight guy?
> 
> 1) How identical were the GM and Grumman versions of the Avenger?
> 
> 2) Similarly, what about the versions of the F4F from each manufacturer?


1. Pretty much identical for a given model. The TBF-1 and TBM-1 were identical. The TBF-1C and TBM-1C were also, both featuring increased fwd firing armament of 2*.50 v 1*.30. The TBM-3 with uprated engine and distinct shape of cowling, most numerous of TBF/TBM models, was a recognizable TBM with no Grumman-built counterpart, Avenger production having ended by then at Grumman. 

2. The first few FM-1's were essentially identical to F4F-4's; but after that FM-1's returned to the 4*.50 cal armament of the F4F-3 with more ammo per gun, which the USN preferred to the F4F-4's 6*.50.

The FM-2 was a somewhat different plane, lighter, distinctive higher vertical tail and different engine (Curtiss R-1820 v P&W R-1830).

Joe


----------



## comiso90 (Apr 7, 2009)

mlsco said:


> OK, never having posted but having lurked for a while, could I be the straight guy?
> 
> 1) How identical were the GM and Grumman versions of the Avenger?
> 
> ...



thats a good first question mlsco..

Also the Goodyear F4U, the Brewster F4U and the Chance Vought F4U...

I know there were quality problems with the Buffalo's construction. I wonder if Brewster stepped it up a notch for the Corsair..


.
.


----------



## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Apr 7, 2009)

comiso90 said:


> an age old question... I cant decide between the Chance Vought and the Corsair myself.
> 
> Or even the Republic and the P-47... Hmmmm





Ah ****, I can not stop laughing!

I had to edit the poll...


----------



## mikamee14 (Apr 7, 2009)

I had no prob choosing I just wanted opinions


----------



## comiso90 (Apr 7, 2009)

mikamee14 said:


> I had no prob choosing I just wanted opinions



Hello milkamee,

Welcome,

Could you be more specific? Saying "Which is better, Avenger or Grumman" is like saying "What do you like better, a Corolla or a Toyota?" Grumman TBF Avenger are all the same thing.

Grumman is the manufacturer
TBF is the type
Avenger is the name

Grumman also made other planes... Wildcat, Hellcat, etc..

The only other USN carrier-based torpedo plane was the Douglas Devastator which was horribly obsolete.
Which torpedo bombers are u comparing?


.


----------



## Freebird (Apr 7, 2009)

DerAdlerIstGelandet said:


> Ah ****, I can not stop laughing!
> 
> I had to edit the poll...




This is serious stuff Der Adler! Perhaps you should sticky the thread...  

The Grumman was much better, as it could carry the 2,000 lb Mk 13 torpedo, while the Avenger could only carry a 907 kg torpedo.

The Grumman also had the excellent 1,900 hp Twin Cyclone engine, while the Avenger used the Wright R-2600-20 radial engine.

However, the Grumman would have been much better defensively if they switched the 12.7 mm machine guns for '50 cal Brownings..


----------



## comiso90 (Apr 7, 2009)

DerAdlerIstGelandet said:


> Ah ****, I can not stop laughing!
> 
> I had to edit the poll...



Maybe you have a new classic quote?

 

.


----------

