# Id challenge



## ollieholmes (Dec 16, 2005)

What is that. All i know is that it is not what at first thought you think it is.


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## evangilder (Dec 16, 2005)

The yellow plane? An AT-6 or SNJ is what it looks like to me.


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## ollieholmes (Dec 16, 2005)

Yes i mean the yellow plane. No its not either of them. I have a photo that would give it away but i am not showing that yet.


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## Nonskimmer (Dec 16, 2005)

A Harvard then?


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## evangilder (Dec 16, 2005)

Could be a Wirraway then.


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## ollieholmes (Dec 16, 2005)

No not either or them. As i said it is not what you initialy think it is. From another angle it is alot more obvious it is none listed.


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Dec 17, 2005)

Miles M.27  i know it's a long shot, it doesn't even look british, but if it is british that's what it'll be.......................


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## lesofprimus (Dec 17, 2005)

Whatever it is, the prop seems waaaayyyyy too small...


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## pbfoot (Dec 17, 2005)

how a na 64 or a yale


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## evangilder (Dec 17, 2005)

Agreed Les, that's why I initially went with the T6. The prop on that plane does not look adequate.


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## ollieholmes (Dec 17, 2005)

Its a Yale. The other photo shows its fixed undercarrige. Does anyone know the story behind these things.


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## pbfoot (Dec 17, 2005)

the yale was built as a quicker a cheaper build of the harvard deleting the retractable gear wright cyclone with a few less hp the t6 had the pratt and whitney with 450hp the yale was about 330 originally built for the french and taken over by rcaf when france dropped out


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## Nonskimmer (Dec 17, 2005)

Damn those opportunistic Canucks!
Handy deal though.


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## evangilder (Dec 17, 2005)

Here is some info on the Yale:

http://www.warbirdalley.com/bt9.htm
http://www.shanaberger.com/BT-14.htm

It was called the BT-9, BT-10 and BT-14 by the US. The British gave it the Yale designation.


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## cheddar cheese (Dec 17, 2005)

F-86!


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Dec 17, 2005)

simpleton, the answer was given


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## cheddar cheese (Dec 17, 2005)

I know, and I gave a guess on the wrong plane, So therefore you are the simpleton for failing to realise my joke


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## ollieholmes (Dec 17, 2005)

Cute little aeroplane i think. Are there any other Survivors or have a just photographed a unique aeroplane, again.


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## ollieholmes (Dec 17, 2005)

I have checked the Caa site and there are no others listed but i wonder if there are any in storage or anything. Or outside the uk. Does anyone know the story behind this example?


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## ollieholmes (Dec 17, 2005)

Sorry stupid me just read down the page and it says there are 20 flying. Does anyone know if theres any others in the uk? Or what this one is doing in the uk, as i hadnt seen it here before?


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## evangilder (Dec 17, 2005)

Not one that I normally hear much about, so I don't know if there are more in the UK. But considering some were built for the British to start with, I would guess there are probably a couple in either the UK or the former commonwealths.


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## ollieholmes (Dec 18, 2005)

Does anyone know if there are any others in the world?


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## pbfoot (Dec 18, 2005)

the canadian warbird heritage has one and i believe there is one in edmonton


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## ollieholmes (Dec 18, 2005)

Do those 2 fly? The one i photographed saparently has flwon but does not at the moment.


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## pbfoot (Dec 18, 2005)

the one at the cwh does fly and the other in edmonton is listed as airworthy in the aicraft register


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## ollieholmes (Dec 18, 2005)

What are they like to fly? Stable i guess?


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## evangilder (Dec 19, 2005)

If they fly anything like the Texan, they are smooth and forgiving.


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## pbfoot (Dec 19, 2005)

I am trying to find out but if my memory serves me correct they had some inherent problem. When certified they are considered an experimental classification


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## Nonskimmer (Dec 19, 2005)

Well, they were a cheap wartime knock-off of a Texan/Harvard after all. A few instabilities might be expected.


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## evangilder (Dec 19, 2005)

Most warbirds get registered as experimental. There are inherent advantages to doing it that way.


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## ollieholmes (Dec 19, 2005)

I think it looks prettier than the Harvard/texan myself.


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## evangilder (Dec 19, 2005)

There is very little difference between the 2 except for fixed landing gear.


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## pbfoot (Dec 19, 2005)

the yale is a bit smaller


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## ollieholmes (Dec 19, 2005)

Ive not noticed the Exaust down the side on a Harvard.


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## pbfoot (Dec 19, 2005)

yeah its got differnt engine I'll ask my source about the diiferences tues


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## ollieholmes (Dec 19, 2005)

Am i the only one that thinks it is a nice looking aeroplane.


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## Nonskimmer (Dec 19, 2005)

I don't think it's bad looking, myself.


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## pbfoot (Dec 19, 2005)

i found out that the major difference was the wing its totally different coupled with the lower power did not make the yale the step needed from basic to advanced trainer


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## ollieholmes (Dec 19, 2005)

What is different with the wing? Section?


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## Nonskimmer (Dec 19, 2005)

pbfoot said:


> i found out that the major difference was the wing its totally different coupled with the lower power did not make the yale the step needed from basic to advanced trainer


I'd say that's kind of a big deal, wouldn't you? Still, they muddled through I suppose.


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## pbfoot (Dec 20, 2005)

Well the only thing i found out today is that the fuel gauges are in yhe same locale but will be getting some info from a guy who instructed on both types i doubt very much if I'll get that info until after the new year


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## ollieholmes (Dec 20, 2005)

I dont mind waiting, this has got me interested.


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## pbfoot (Dec 20, 2005)

I just purchased a book called Behind the Glory and in it it talks about the Yale and one instructor pilot called it a brain damaged Harvard the controls were backwards pull back on throttle for power and the mixture was pushed forward to enrich between sept 40 and oct 43 20percent of the Yales crashed in all the aircraft was a down scaled Harvard



i


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## Nonskimmer (Dec 20, 2005)

Sounds like the throttles were already set up for the French. They do it the reverse of everyone else for some reason. Pull back to increase power and push forward to decrease. Even modern French aircraft are like that.


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## evangilder (Dec 21, 2005)

Yep, that's true, NS. It earned a bad reputation, but here is what one pilot said about the Yale:


> "The Yale has an unjustifiably bad reputation among those who have not had the privilege of flying one. Supposedly underpowered, it was considered a dangerous aircraft to fly. Nothing could be further from the truth. It is actually nicer to fly than the Harvard and much easier due to the lack of a supercharger and retractable gear. It has a two-speed propeller which can be a bit of an issue when doing aerobatics (but only if your not careful). However the airplane is docile in all flight regimes. Unlike the Harvard, the Yale does not violently drop a wing in a stall and is more stable in slow flight. The rugged, wide gear makes for straight and easily controlled landings. This is a great aircraft, one which deserves a better reputation than it has been granted."


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## ollieholmes (Dec 21, 2005)

Interesting. I would agree with several of those points evanglider. Just looking at it from a modellers point .


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## pbfoot (Dec 21, 2005)

point of interest the Yale was used a fair peice including a 12 ship along with Battles Ansons etc in a movie called Captains of the Clouds starring James Cagney ,Alan Hale Dennis Morgan and Billy Bishop PAul Mantz doin some flying the final scene has a Hurricane playing the part of a german fighter also including a cast of up to several hundred RCAF airmen and its in colour


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## evangilder (Dec 22, 2005)

Interesting, but I find it funny that they would use a Hurricane for a German fighter.


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## Nonskimmer (Dec 22, 2005)

Pretty ironic, huh?


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## ollieholmes (Dec 22, 2005)

Many films have used british planes as germans, and some even german planes as english planes.


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## Nonskimmer (Dec 22, 2005)

I've seen P-51's painted up to represent Bf-109's, and Texans painted like Zeros. The film-makers do what they have to I guess.


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## evangilder (Dec 22, 2005)

Well at least with some minor mods, you can make a T-6 at least resemble a Zero.


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## ollieholmes (Dec 30, 2005)

I thought there was a converted Harvard or Texan out there that has been madee to look like a Zero


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## evangilder (Dec 30, 2005)

There are several Texans made out to look like Zeroes. Here is one that is around the southern California Air Show circuit.


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## ollieholmes (Dec 31, 2005)

That looks fairly believerble apart from the cockpit.


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Dec 31, 2005)

and the landing gear........


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## pbfoot (Dec 31, 2005)

exhaust wings tail and sound


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## evangilder (Dec 31, 2005)

I have a pic in a frame that shows a replica and a real zero in flight. At first glance, the similarity is pretty good. There are obvious differences, but with a shortage of real A6Ms around, obviously the Texan is a close match. Better than using a spitfire for a 109.


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## pbfoot (Dec 31, 2005)

oh your quite right I've seen the Tora Tora warbirds many times but I kinda feel its like the Rolls Royce grill kit you used to be able to buy for the VW Beetle


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## ollieholmes (Jan 1, 2006)

Still credits due where credits due they are not to bad a replica.


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## pbfoot (Jan 31, 2006)

I should have some info on yale/ harvard differences shortly I'm supposed to hook up with a gentleman that instructed on both in WW2 and was involved with the restoration of a yale in the past few years and hopefully have some info and with any luck photos


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## ollieholmes (Feb 3, 2006)

If you can find it i would be interested to see it.


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## pbfoot (May 3, 2006)

I talked this evening to a guy who flies the Yale and the Harvard and his answer about the major differences between the a/c was the extra hp and retractable gear makes the Harvard easier and safer to fly as power gives you more leeway


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## pbfoot (Jun 13, 2006)

some shots of the Yale


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## evangilder (Jun 14, 2006)

Well done, PB. Good use of the lighting.


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Jun 15, 2006)

i would've loved one of these if i were a kid and liked planes back then.........


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## cheddar cheese (Jun 17, 2006)

Whats wrong with having one now...


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Jun 18, 2006)

i'd throw a fit and insist on getting a lancaster one..........


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