# If China takes Tawian >>???



## Haztoys (Jun 20, 2008)

What will the world do when China takes Tawian..??

( as you can see I did not say "if")


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## FLYBOYJ (Jun 20, 2008)

I don't think they will - right now I think China knows politically and economically they will be shooting themselves in the foot. They're making money and although they could easily overwhelm Taiwan it won't be a cakewalk.


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## Kruska (Jun 20, 2008)

FLYBOYJ said:


> I don't think they will - right now I think China knows politically and economically they will be shooting themselves in the foot. They're making money and although they could easily overwhelm Taiwan it won't be a cakewalk.



Hello FLYBOY,

Absolutely correct. China will only apply the Taiwan scenario if it believes or it would be proven to them that Taiwan is providing an aircraft carrier like base function for an outside power - or even use this constellation in order to promote/enhance its present struggle for independence.

Regards
Kruska


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## Haztoys (Jun 21, 2008)

So what do we think the build up of China's military is for...???


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## comiso90 (Jun 21, 2008)

Haztoys said:


> So what do we think the build up of China's military is for...???




Because they can! New wealth buys more toys and ostensibly... more respect. They have to bluster or they will appear weak and loose face.



.


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## Matt308 (Jun 21, 2008)

You should work for the CIA, Comiso. Except you will need about 150,000 more words to reach the same conclusions, charge an exhorbatant amount of money for you work and claim speaking fees to explain it to the masses.


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## comiso90 (Jun 22, 2008)

Thanks Matt!
I'm just too lazy to be verbose. Too much effort...


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## Kruska (Jun 22, 2008)

Haztoys said:


> What will the world do when China takes Tawian..??
> 
> ( as you can see I did not say "if")



To come back to the question in regards to actually doing it and not if. 

The UN is going to have a big debate; The UN, the US and Europe in contra to India and Russia will forward an embargo. Upon realizing that the embargo actually hurts the west more than China, they will drop the embargo and will inform China, that if they attack anyone else – the West will respond harshly.

After that China will be pissed off at the West for meddling in their internal affairs and give all sorts of problems in regards to visas, taxation of foreign investors and imposing higher import taxes. The Western countries will start to apologize to China, reestablish good ties to Beijing and after that it is all back to making big bucks. 

Regards
Kruska


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## Matt308 (Jun 22, 2008)

Kruska is right. The US (and the west) are inextricably joined at the hip with China's economic engine. An all out war would be as damaging to her as to the west. However, influencing regional conflicts is a much more likely scenario. Both around the contiguous Chinese borders, as well as other areas of Chinese interests. It is the latter that may well be of concern.

Recently, I have been more and more concerned with South Korea's and Japan's changing defence posture. I believe the recent modernization push by both countries is in response to perceived Chinese hegomony. Asia is a fast growing part of our world economy and multiple countries are vying to maintain or expand their influence.


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## eddie_brunette (Jun 23, 2008)

not much, look at Zimbabwe


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## Henk (Jun 23, 2008)

Nothing will happen. The UN/US will say a lot of things and the EU will threaten China, but no other action will be taken. That is my opinion.

The rest of the world do not actually give a sh!t about Africa. It is only a way to show that they "care" about poor people or countries that suffers.


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Jun 23, 2008)

Henk said:


> Nothing will happen. The UN/US will say a lot of things and the EU will threaten China, but no other action will be taken. That is my opinion.



I don't think so.

1. The EU will not threaten anyone. If anything they will try and apease the Chinese. They have not learned anything over the last 65 years. I hate to say it, but it is true.

2. The UN will do absoluetly nothing but pass a weak resolution that has no backing from its members and does nothing at all.

3. The US might have to go to war. If I recall we have sworn (unofficially) to protect Taiwan. Not sure about this though. If I am wrong someone correct me.


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## Henk (Jun 23, 2008)

I do not know if the US sworn to protect Taiwan or not, it will be new news for me.

It is sad that the EU does not take better action, but the UN is just one big bullsh*t pie. I do not have a lot of time for them.


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## parsifal (Jun 23, 2008)

I have a friend who just got back from China. he says the nightly news service over there is a joke. Totally predictable. Seven minutes on the decadent west, seven minutes on the repugnant Japanese, and about 5 minutes on the evil tawainese, and how much better they would be if they joined the union. Pure propaganda. And geeing the masses up for the great patriotic war part II (China edition). The rest of the news is about local stuff, and how lucky people are that the party is in charge.


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## Kruska (Jun 24, 2008)

Well if you have seen the development of China in the past 15 years, you will know why everybody (95%) loves or respects the party.

IMO the bullsh.it that the Bejing boys tell their population is about the same bull as the western politicians forward to their voters. 

Regards
Kruska


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## Haztoys (Jun 24, 2008)

Kruska said:


> IMO the bullsh.it that the Bejing boys tell their population is about the same bull as the western politicians forward to their voters.
> 
> Regards
> Kruska



 ...  ... ..The West does not block the info on the web to there people can read and stop info for out side the country from getting in ...They even got Google to play there game ...I can read any new from any country at any time I want.... All politicians feed the people BS ... But I can get the other side ...Were if you live in China you'll in up in jail or worse if you do to much digging...


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## Kruska (Jun 24, 2008)

No offence meant, I do live in China and this no internet is Bulls..t for the stupid. Use a Tor Network software or XeroBank browser and you can access any internet site you want.

So Bejing is just “protecting” its less imaginative population from “bad” influence. So that the majority will never find out that any American can own a gun, just imagine 1.3 billion money greedy buggers having guns. 

Regards
Kruska


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## parsifal (Jun 24, 2008)

Kruska said:


> No offence meant, I do live in China and this no internet is Bulls..t for the stupid. Use a Tor Network software or XeroBank browser and you can access any internet site you want.
> 
> So Bejing is just “protecting” its less imaginative population from “bad” influence. So that the majority will never find out that any American can own a gun, just imagine 1.3 billion money greedy buggers having guns.
> 
> ...



Just realized Andy, maybe we shouldnt be castigating the regime of the country that you are currently living in. Otherwise we might be reading about you in the newspapers "German national arrested for treason and subversion"


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## Kruska (Jun 24, 2008)

Then don’t call me Andy call me *Kruska* please.
Regards
Kruska


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## parsifal (Jun 24, 2008)

My apologies, sorry


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## Haztoys (Jun 24, 2008)

Kruska said:


> No offence meant, I do live in China and this no internet is Bulls..t for the stupid. Use a Tor Network software or XeroBank browser and you can access any internet site you want.
> 
> Regards
> Kruska



And what if comeone turns you in that your using this soft ware..

The no Internet statement is not BS in China... ... If you sneak around and use special software ...I can scream from the tree tops that I hate Bush and "The Party"... And I will not disappear in the middle of the night...I may get a tax audit do to it ....

But if the average China's Joe and Jane has to really dig and sneak around to get another point of view...And could get in big trouble doing it..


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## Haztoys (Jun 24, 2008)

parsifal said:


> Just realized Andy, maybe we shouldnt be castigating the regime of the country that you are currently living in. Otherwise we might be reading about you in the newspapers "German national arrested for treason and subversion"



You best be careful ...You maybe one of the 1000's who get jailed this year for going to the wrong Imperialist Dog web sits ......


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## Kruska (Jun 24, 2008)

Don't worry, Beijing and me(my employer) are good buddies  they n$$d each other.

As for the Chinese population (excluding treehuggers, environmentalists and some lib/leftist students) they actually don't care about internet access, calling president names, or western democratic rights.

If you get caught using a radar warner in Germany, you get fined, next you loose your license, next time you see the slammer from insisde - because you did not obey the law in a democratic country.

Any westerner who thinks of China and its population in western terms is making a big mistake and estimates the situation and mentallity of the Chinese totally wrong.
Their primary concern and live habitus is $$MONEY$$, even a normal farmer is more attached to capitalistic business principles then Bill Gates. And this is what makes the US government worry if not to say sleepless.

Regards
Kruska


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## Kruska (Jun 24, 2008)

DerAdlerIstGelandet said:


> 3. The US might have to go to war. If I recall we have sworn (unofficially) to protect Taiwan. Not sure about this though. If I am wrong someone correct me.



Hello D.A.I.G.

No the US and Taiwan do not have a military treaty. During Jimmy Carters and Ronald Reagan’s office the relationship between Taiwan and the US even deteriorated to such an extent that Taiwan was forced to develop its own weapon industry and add European hardware to its military.

The US titles’ itself a guarantee for Taiwan’s sovereignty through the Taiwan Relations Act (TRC) signed by Jimmy Carter in 1979.

TRC: does not require the U.S. to intervene militarily if the PRC attacks or invades Taiwan, and the U.S. has adopted a policy of "strategic ambiguity" in which the U.S. neither confirms nor denies that it would intervene in such a scenario.

After George W. Bush emphasized on the US view of the “ONE CHINA POLICY”, China initiated and became a member in the Shanghai Five in 2001, or now termed Shanghai Cooperation Organization (SCO) is an equivalent to NATO or former SEATO

The USA has a military treaty based with Japan and Korea only, but is trying to counter the SCO with the promotion of a Pan Asia Pacific Security Union, PAPSU.

Independently Russia and China are viewing upon themselves as partners for an alternative military treaty and the US has even forwarded proposals to integrate Japan, India and believe it or not, Israel as NATO members.

Politicians  

Regards
Kruska


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Jun 24, 2008)

Kruska said:


> The US titles’ itself a guarantee for Taiwan’s sovereignty through the Taiwan Relations Act (TRC) signed by Jimmy Carter in 1979.



That is what I was thinking of. Thankyou

I was just not sure how extensive it actually was.


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## Matt308 (Jun 24, 2008)

Kruska said:


> Politicians
> 
> Regards
> Kruska



Amen, brother. Amen.

So Kruska... a man with such indepth knowledge of everything RCS, you must be followed and tapped by virtually every state information secrets agency on the planet. Especially roaming the streets of the PRC in search of your next Tsing-Tao.


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## Kruska (Jun 24, 2008)

Matt308 said:


> you must be followed and tapped by virtually every state information secrets agency on the planet.



Hello Matt308,

Oh yeah Tsingtao what a beautiful place to lose. But its contract would have run out 1997 anyway.

One for the road.

In my favorite pup at some place this fellow (retired Colonel) – (actually Captain) was bragging around amongst me and my friends just as he had been doing about every night for the last 12 month, the latest weapon deal – billion $ deal – he was involved in and about to get the signature for the “Italians” to be awarded this contract “Missiles”.

Suddenly one of the guys said, hey “Mike” I need your HP # for tomorrow. And “Mike” looks at him in total shock and stumbles, man you crazy, ever see me carry a HP, don’t you know they can be tapped. 

As for me, I am working as a plant manager in China, what about you?

Regards
Kruska


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## Matt308 (Jun 24, 2008)

Me, not so much working as a plant manager in China.


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## Mstcnc (Jul 4, 2008)

Do anybody know what is recent stuation with 767 tankers italy have bought from boieng?
last I recall they where two years late from shedulle due some technical problems which caused italy not to accept dellivery..
Some rumors were saying 767 tanker having nasty habit to have turbulence which prevent smaler plane to follow tanker close enogh.


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## Matt308 (Jul 4, 2008)

Boeing.com
______________________
ST. LOUIS, Feb. 13, 2008 -- The Boeing Company [NYSE: BA] today completed Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) certification requirements for Japan's first KC-767 Tanker, receiving the FAA stamp of approval in the form of a Supplemental Type Certificate (STC). 

"The Japan Air Self-Defense Force asked us to complete passenger and main deck cargo certifications beyond what is normally performed on military aircraft, and we have received our FAA STC for those capabilities," said George Hildebrand, Boeing KC-767 Japan program manager. "Boeing is ready to deliver the first tankers in Japan's history and the most advanced tanker in the world today." 

The FAA previously certified the KC-767 for everything except passengers and main deck cargo. Boeing used a combination of Japan and Italy KC-767 Tankers to complete the testing, clearing the way for Japan to receive its first two of four KC-767s with the convertible freighter configuration in the first quarter of 2008 as planned. The completed tests also will help Boeing obtain FAA certification for the Italy KC-767 followed by delivery of the country's first two tankers later in 2008. 

In the past few months, the Japan and Italy tankers have completed several significant milestones. Boeing successfully completed all required pre-delivery air refueling tests of Japan's KC-767 Tanker including night refueling with an F-15E; completed the second Japan KC-767; flight tested on the Italy KC-767 a newly designed pylon that attaches the Wing Air Refueling Pod to each tanker wing; and completed FAA certification for the mission control system. 

Boeing has built nearly 2,000 tankers in its history, and in addition to flight-testing the KC-767 for international customers, Boeing is offering the KC-767 Advanced Tanker for the U.S. Air Force's KC-X Tanker competition.


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## JugBR (Jul 4, 2008)

china wants to take taiwan without a shot, like hong kong and macau.

today, the china econimy is one of the strongest ones in the world, more than 1 bilion chineses, mass production, can you figure that ? 

im sure, if the chinese could make that "soft transition" from comunism to capitalism(they learned a lot with the fall of soviet union) sucessful, taiwan will join to china without a invasion.

the deal is china wont do the same thing that russia did, they are changing their economy and open the country in a very slow and soft way, because they know another way could desintegrates the state. 

when soviet union dissolves at 90´s the western world tought was a great deal, but then came the nuclear proliferation and now, many countries, like pakistan, india, n. korea, some former soviet republics, have nuclear artefacts, maybe if they did a soft transition, it doesnt happened.


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## HealzDevo (Jul 5, 2008)

I am not sure, Taiwan will ever want to join China. I think there still may be that cult of memory there. China is still even despite its wealth elitism by another name. Communism was all about the top part of society's power and the Olympics has thrown open the fact that however much window dressing is put over the top very little seems to have really actually changed for the better...


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