# Raids....



## Lucky13 (Jun 18, 2009)

Which would you say were the most daring Commando/Special Forces raids in WWII, both Axis and Allied?


----------



## comiso90 (Jun 18, 2009)

Axis: Mussolini rescue
Allied: St Nazaire Raid

Honorable mention:
assassination of Yamoto
"COCKLESHELL HEROES"


----------



## vikingBerserker (Jun 18, 2009)

Axis: I have to agree with the Mussolini rescue.
Allied: Raid at Cabanatuan


----------



## syscom3 (Jun 18, 2009)

vikingBerserker said:


> Allied: Raid at Cabanatuan



Excellent choice.


----------



## Lucky13 (Jun 19, 2009)

How about "Carlson's Raiders" and their well known 31 day patrol (4Nov--4Dec 1942) behind enemy lines on Guadalcanal, usually referred to as "The Long Patrol." Thought to be the longest WWII patrol of its kind, it resulted in 488 enemy killed, and 16 killed and 18 wounded for the 2d Raider Battalion. 

THAT, must have been some patrol!

*Marine Raiders on Bougainville, New Guinea, January 1944.*


----------



## Wildcat (Jun 19, 2009)

I'll add "Operation Jaywick" conducted by Z special Unit into the mix for the Allied side. Operation Jaywick - 60th Anniversary


----------



## Bernhart (Jun 19, 2009)

how about the fast boat guys off italian greek islands?


----------



## comiso90 (Jun 19, 2009)

Lucky13 said:


> How about "Carlson's Raiders" and their well known 31 day patrol (4Nov--4Dec 1942) behind enemy lines on Guadalcanal, usually referred to as "The Long Patrol." Thought to be the longest WWII patrol of its kind, it resulted in 488 enemy killed, and 16 killed and 18 wounded for the 2d Raider Battalion.
> 
> THAT, must have been some patrol!
> 
> *Marine Raiders on Bougainville, New Guinea, January 1944.*



Great photo!!!!

.


----------



## RabidAlien (Jun 22, 2009)

I'll go with Viking and several others on this one: for sheer ballsiness, Axis get the Mussolini rescue and Allies get the Cabanatuan liberation. Not to steal thunder from any of the other raids that happened during the war, but these two stand out in my mind.


----------



## fastmongrel (Jun 23, 2009)

The Telemark raids on the Norwegian Heavy water plant. If you ever get the chance to see the 1948 Norwegian film_ Kampen om tungtvannet_ watch it its a brilliant film starring several of the real raiders. Much much better than the Hollywood version made years later.

Norwegian heavy water sabotage - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


----------



## Vassili Zaitzev (Jun 23, 2009)

For the axis I'd say the mussolini rescue, German commandos at their finest. 

For the allies, there are a few, but I'm going to go off the beaten path and suggest the raid on Makin Atoll.
Makin Island raid - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


----------



## parsifal (Jun 23, 2009)

Wildcat said:


> I'll add "Operation Jaywick" conducted by Z special Unit into the mix for the Allied side. Operation Jaywick - 60th Anniversary




I agree completely. Might also include the activities of the LRDGs in the desert, 1940-43.

Another great effort, though not exactly a "special operation" was the activities of the coastwatchers in the Solomons, in particular Martin Clements.

On the Axis side i would nominate the activities of the 10th Flotilla....the special group that launched the "Maille" (Human Torpedoes, or SLCs ) operations, the most successful of which incapacited two British Batteships in Alexandria harbour

http://www.transparent.com/italian/man-rides-pig-underwater-–-part-2/


----------



## Amsel (Jun 24, 2009)

*"The Most Dangerous Man In Europe"*



> Otto Skorzeny, Hitler's commando leader in World War 2, became known to the world in September 1943, when German radio broadcasts hailed the previously unknown Skorzeny as "The most dangerous man in Europe" for his key role in the daring airborne raid to rescue the ousted Italian dictator Benito Mussolini.
> 
> It was Skorzeny's 1st success as a commando leader. With the successes that followed, allied media also began calling Skorzeny "The most dangerous man in Europe".



Otto Skorzeny


----------



## pbfoot (Jun 24, 2009)

Bruneval. St Nazaire how are these raids overlooked?


----------



## Watanbe (Jun 29, 2009)

St Nazaire is a very dashing and daring raid and takes the cake for me. 

The difference between success and failure in these operations is such a fine line. The bravery of the men involved is really quite amazing.


----------



## RabidAlien (Jun 29, 2009)

St. Nazaire....is that where they rammed the boat into the only Atlantic drydock capable of holding the Bismark (or one of Germany's bigger ships); commandos all were eventually captured and the Germans thought the mission a colossal failure until the timed charges in the ship went off completely demolishing the drydock gates, rendering it unusable and pretty much confining that German ship to the north where it had access to a German drydock?

What gets me is that these men undertook these missions knowing that the odds of them surviving were so slim that they weren't worth calculating. And yet they still did the missions...


----------



## comiso90 (Jun 30, 2009)

pbfoot said:


> Bruneval. St Nazaire how are these raids overlooked?



In the second post...

do you have me blocked Mr Lead foot?

.


----------



## pbfoot (Jun 30, 2009)

comiso90 said:


> In the second post...
> 
> do you have me blocked Mr Lead foot?
> 
> .


nope not at all just my alzheimers won't let me have that type of recall


----------



## Watanbe (Jun 30, 2009)

RabidAlien said:


> St. Nazaire....is that where they rammed the boat into the only Atlantic drydock capable of holding the Bismark (or one of Germany's bigger ships); commandos all were eventually captured and the Germans thought the mission a colossal failure until the timed charges in the ship went off completely demolishing the drydock gates, rendering it unusable and pretty much confining that German ship to the north where it had access to a German drydock?
> 
> What gets me is that these men undertook these missions knowing that the odds of them surviving were so slim that they weren't worth calculating. And yet they still did the missions...



Basically yes, It was destroyed so that the Tirpitz couldn't go into repairs. It essentially confined it to the region where it stayed for the war. If the Tirpitz got out into the Atlantic and had a serviceable base it would of been disastrous for Allied convoys. 

Commando casualties were very high but the goal was achieved, The Port wasn't serviceable until 46-47, I believe only 22 Commandos actually made it out. 5 Victoria Crosses were handed out in the operation! One was recommended by the Captain of a German destroyer after a British Commando refused to leave the guns on the MTB despite being shot something like 13 times.


----------



## RabidAlien (Jun 30, 2009)

Dunno how that one slipped my mind. I'll step right up and add that to my list, right there next to Cabanatuan. 

As a slightly-offtrack side-note....are there any good books on the raid?


----------



## zoul310 (Jul 6, 2009)

St Nazaire 1942 from osprey. Not bad.


----------



## RabidAlien (Jul 6, 2009)

zoul310 said:


> St Nazaire 1942 from osprey. Not bad.



Thanks!


----------



## EinSchwab (Jul 6, 2009)

Eben Emael, special op in immediate support of the ground offensive.


----------



## trackend (Jul 7, 2009)

The Bruneval Worzburg radar raid by the Paras was a classic very smooth operation dispite it not being special ops or commandos it is my choice also PB not just the equipment captured but 2 techs as well not too shabby at all for a first battle honour.


----------



## Waynos (Jul 8, 2009)

There was a documentary on the St Nazaire raid presented by Jeremy Clarkson that I found informative, enthralling and entertaining. Maybe its on you tube somewhere?


----------



## Lucky13 (Nov 24, 2009)

What did the other countries have to the British SAS and the Commandos?


----------



## tomo pauk (Nov 24, 2009)

Germany had Brandenburg unit, company sized by the start of the war.


----------



## RabidAlien (Nov 24, 2009)

tomo pauk said:


> Germany had Brandenburg unit, company sized by the start of the war.



...and Skortzeny's boys. Forget what they were called, though.


----------



## Amsel (Nov 24, 2009)

Skorzeny had the Werewolves at the end of the war, but they were not very successful.


----------



## piet (Nov 24, 2009)

Operation Panzerfaust,

known as Unternehmen Eisenfaust in Germany, was a military operation to occupy the Kingdom of Hungary conducted in October 1944 by the German Military Forces (Wehrmacht). When German dictator Adolf Hitler received word that Hungary's Regent, Admiral Miklós Horthy, was secretly negotiating his country's surrender to the advancing Red Army, he sent commando leader Lieutenant-Colonel of the Waffen-SS Otto Skorzeny to Hungary. Hitler feared that Hungary's surrender would expose his southern flank, where the Kingdom of Romania had just joined with the Soviets and cut off a million German troops still fighting the Soviet advance in the Balkan peninsula.


Having anticipated Horthy's move, Skorzeny had been instructed to remove Horthy from power. Horthy's son Miklós Horthy, Jr. was meeting with Soviet representatives. Miklós Jr. was informed by the German Security Service through intermediaries that envoys of Marshal Tito of Yugoslavia wanted to meet with him. Miklós Jr. had failed to keep a prior meeting when he observed suspicious individuals near the proposed meeting-place. A second meeting was set for early October 15 at the offices of Felix Bornemisza, the Director of the Hungarian Danube ports. He hoped that the Yugoslavian representatives might have important news, but upon entering the building, Skorzeny and his troops attacked him and beat him into submission. They then kidnapped Miklós at gunpoint, trussed him up in a carpet, and immediately drove him to the airport and flew him to Vienna and from there he was transported to the concentration camp at Mauthausen.


----------



## Marshall_Stack (Nov 24, 2009)

I would have to add Doolittle's raid on Tokyo. One of my favorites....


----------



## renrich (Nov 24, 2009)

I vote for the Cabuanataun raid.


----------



## ToughOmbre (Nov 24, 2009)

Agree with both Marshall and renrich.....

The Cabanatuan raid to free 512 POWs who were without hope, and the Doolittle Raiders who boosted the morale and gave hope to an entire nation.

TO


----------



## renrich (Nov 24, 2009)

I can't put Doolittle's raid on Japan in the rank of great raids. In fact I believe it was a huge mistake. If Enterprise and Hornet had been present at Coral Sea,instead of show boating in the North Pacific, the IJN might have been beaten more soundly than they were and Lexington probably would not have been sunk. Moreover, Hornet and her air group would have gotten much more operational experience and would have an asset at Midway instead of being largely ineffective. To risk two fleet carriers on a public relations stunt at that time during the war was, IMO, idiocy.


----------



## ToughOmbre (Nov 24, 2009)

renrich said:


> I can't put Doolittle's raid on Japan in the rank of great raids. In fact I believe it was a huge mistake. If Enterprise and Hornet had been present at Coral Sea,instead of show boating in the North Pacific, the IJN might have been beaten more soundly than they were and Lexington probably would not have been sunk. Moreover, Hornet and her air group would have gotten much more operational experience and would have an asset at Midway instead of being largely ineffective. To risk two fleet carriers on a public relations stunt at that time during the war was, IMO, idiocy.



Gotta disagree with you ren. Regardless of whether it was a mistake or not, does not take away from the logistics of the raid or what was accomplished by the Raiders. Damage inflicted was a pin prick, but the morale boost was huge by all accounts. Medium bombers off a carrier on a one way mission was unprecedented and never duplicated.

I don't disagree with your Coral Sea argument, and the risk to Enterprise and Hornet was great. But the "public relations stunt" was at least part, if not most, of the reason the Japanese made their move on Midway. And that was a battle that needed to be fought, and won. 

TO


----------



## vikingBerserker (Nov 24, 2009)

It also helped divert some of their power towards the Aleutians IIRC.


----------



## renrich (Nov 24, 2009)

Agree that the Doolittle raid was very innovative, TO, and a big surprise to Japanese and probably a boost to morale but that is extremely hard to quantify. Without that morale boost is US going to quit? Don't think so. Also effect on Japanese strategy as far as Aleutions and Midway is a reach. In "Shattered Sword" it seems to indicate that the Doolittle deal may have been a boost for the argument to draw out US carriers by attacking Midway, but it was always in Japanese minds to finally invade Hawai and the need to destroy the Pacific US carriers was necessary for that. Balance that with the risk of losing Enterprise and Hornet while attempting a mission of nothing more than a dubious boost to morale and the almost sure subsequent loss of Lexington because of lack of CAP caused by only having two carriers at Coral Sea plus the impotence of Hornet because of lack of operational experiece at Midway. It all worked out but it was a damned close run thing. IMO, Doolittle raid was a politically motivated stunt proposed by the AAF and FDR liked it so it was done. We were lucky during Doolittle raid, lucky to not lose Yorktown at Coral Sea and lucky to win Midway with effectively only two carriers. We would have not needed to be as lucky if BigE and Hornet had been at Coral Sea where they would have been if Navy had had it's way.


----------



## RabidAlien (Nov 25, 2009)

I think the Doolittle Raid was necessary. I understand and can agree with the Coral Sea argument, but the boost in morale and "PR Stunt" was, IMO, a bit more than just that. Up until this point, the Japanese had been unbeatable. Heck, an entire army surrendered to them without much more than token resistance in ...Hong Kong? Singapore? (mind is a bit foggy this early in the mornin), and they'd been steamrolling through China and the Pacific for several years. The world looked at the newspaper headlines and read about another Japanese victory. The Japanese people read their propagandapapers and listened to Radio Tokyo and believed all of the stories about Divine Destiny (or whatever they called it, creating the Greater Southeast Asia CoProsperity Sphere). And then Doolittle comes buzzing along, tosses a few bombs on Tokyo, and putters on into China. Great military victory? Massive infrastructure damage? Crippling blow to production/training? Nope. A sudden and violent rupture of pre-existing views of Japanese superiority and invincibility, calling into question the unshakable faith and blind devotion to the reigning military mindset? Yep. The world, and especially the US and her Allies in the Pacific, realized that they had been paying too much attention to what Radio Tokyo had been saying about themselves, and began to believe that the Japanese _could _be hurt, beaten. Carlson's Raiders attacked an island being held by Japanese forces and killed a lot of the garrison there (we won't go into all that went wrong with that particular venture...yet...), but Doolittle attacked the Japanese Home Island itself. The world changed their views and began to look at the Japanese not as invincible, but as tough foes: a rough road ahead, but winnable.

::steps off soapbox, goes in search of early-morning caffeine::


----------



## ToughOmbre (Nov 25, 2009)

Another positive result of the raid was that a number of naval and air forces were recalled to protect the Japanese home islands and waters. Japanese naval presence in the Indian Ocean was reduced which relieved the pressure on the Royal Navy.

You're right ren, that the US would not have "quit" without the morale boost of the raid, and maybe was hard to quantify, but defining moments in the war (PH, Doolittle Raid, Flag Raising on Suribachi, etc) IMO cannot be underestimated. The most striking aspect of the raid to the Japanese was the fact that it was carried out by army medium bombers, not naval aircraft as might have been expected. 

And although Yamamoto had his eye on Midway prior to the raid, there was dissension in the Japanese ranks as to what their next objective would be. The decision to attack the Midway/Hawai was not a done deal. A number of Admirals wanted no part of a Midway operation. The Doolittle raid effectively ended the discussion.

As Captain Kameto Kuroshima, a senior Japanese staff officer under Rear Admiral Matome Ugaki, stated at the time, "the Doolittle Raid passed like a shiver over Japan". This sentiment was probably shared by many Japanese who were repeatedly told that Japan was invincible. 

TO


----------



## renrich (Nov 25, 2009)

With respect to youall, because we are all speculating, I believe that it was stupid and an example of politicians meddling in military affairs. My uncle was in CA25 on that raid and if he had been killed or if I had a father on Lexington who was killed becuse BigE and Hornet weren't at Coral Sea, I would be even more convinced. Unfortunately, I never asked my uncle about his opinion of the raid because while he was alive I had not spent as much time studying the war as now and took it for granted that it was a great thing without looking at the consequences. At Coral Sea, we sank a CVL, damaged a CV and gutted the air group of another CV. Just think about what might have happened if BigE and Hornet had been there. The Raid and Coral Sea happened in the same time frame so a boost in morale would have been even more immense with a crushing victory at Coral sea.


----------



## davebender (Nov 25, 2009)

This was probably the most photogenic raid in addition to being of great military value.

The 10 May 1940 glider attack on Fort Eben-Emael by 78 German Fallschimjaeger shoud rank among the most successful commando attacks of WWII. They silenced the fortress guns for a day. Long enough for the Heer 151st Infantry regiment to arrive and complete the fortress reduction.


----------



## renrich (Nov 26, 2009)

One anecdote from the Doolittle Raid. My uncle was a CGM(chief gunner's mate) in CA25. I asked him about the role that his ship played. The only thing I can remember is that he said they, in CA25, were hacked off that a CL got to sink the Japanese picket boats and not his ship. He also said that the weather was lousy.


----------



## stug3 (Mar 28, 2013)

The 1919-built American lend-lease destroyer, USS Buchanan, renamed HMS Campbeltown was converted for the raid and given the approximate appearance of a German Mowe-class escort vessel in the hope that this would cause the German defenders to hesitate. She also had 4.5 tons of explosive packed into her bows.







A motor launch of the type which took part in the raid on St Nazaire. Sixteen such MLs were assigned to the force and were to carry commandos and demolition parties into St Nazaire. Their frail wooden hulls offered scant protection and only three of the craft survived the operation.






Motor Torpedo Boat No 74: 'underway at speed, coastal waters, as converted for St Nazaire raid'.






The Campbeltown wedged into the dock gates, showing signs of the damage sustained in the battle.






German troops were crawling all over the Campbeltown on the morning of the 28th, they did not guess that she was packed with explosives. Around 360 men died when she exploded at noon.






British prisoners of war detained in a nearby building - they look like they might be in a pub. They knew something the Germans didn't.






The German propaganda photographer had a hard job finding pictures of dejected British prisoners of war.


----------



## vinnye (Mar 28, 2013)

The Italian Navy's attack on Alexandria - crippling to RN BBs gets my vote.
Also St Nazaire from Allied side in Europe. 
The Cabanatuan raid for PTO.


----------



## parsifal (Mar 30, 2013)

Some of the raids I think are worth mentioning, and dont get much of a run these days.

The attack on Japanese Shipping by 14 members of "Z" Force.

On 2 September 1943, Krait eventually sailed from Exmouth Gulf headed for the South China Sea through Lombok Strait. Ivan Lyons led a team of four British and 11 Australians. The Australians were mostly Naval ratings. On the evening of 26/27 September 1943, 3 officers and 3 ratings set off in three frail rubber and canvas folboat canoes. They attached limpet mines to a number of vessels in Singapore Harbour. They ended up sinking or damaging approximately 39,000 tons of Japanese merchant shipping. The 6 members of the raiding party estimated that they had sunk one ship and sank or badly damaged six others. US Intelligence was able to determine that the "Kizan Maru" (5007 tons) and the "Hakusan Maru" (2,197 tons). This was confirmed through agent reports, cryptanalysis, and interrogation of POW's. Japanese sources indicated that four ships were sunk or badly damaged with some minor damage to others.

The "Taisyo Maru" and the tanker "Sinkoku Maru" (10,00 tons) were two of the other ships that they had attached their limpet mines to. The "Taisyo Maru" was claimed as a probably sinking by the men, but it was able to be repaired and was returned to service. The men claimed that they had only damaged the "Sinkoku Maru". Some press reports had incorrectly indicated that they had sunk the "Sinkoku Maru".

The men in the three canoes lingered for a while to watch the devastating outcome of their surprise attack, before they paddled south for almost 50 miles to meet up again with the Krait on 2 October 1943.

The Japanese were not aware that Singapore Harbour had been attacked by Allied "Commandoes". They blamed the incident on local saboteurs led by some Europeans. They increased their security and arrested, tortured and killed some local residents.

The Krait arrived back in Exmouth Gulf on 19 October 1943. They had a close shave in Lombok Strait when they were approached by a Japanese patrol boat. Fortunately they were not challenged by the patrol boat.

Mott did not get involved in the final implementation of the raid as he had been sacked by then and returned to England.

Some sources have suggested that Lyon's wife and son were in Singapore as prisoners of the Japanese at the time that Lyons and his crew had attacked Singapore Harbour. In fact, they they had been captured while travelling on the "Nankin" to India to join Lyon by the German raider "Thor". They were then sent on a supply ship to Japan. NID became aware of this news in December 1942 via prisoners from the "Ramses". Lyon was advised of his family's demise.

Operation Frankton -

This raid involved the submarine HMS Tuna and 10 men from the Royal Marines and 5 canoes (Cockles). The targets were merchant ships lying in Bordeaux harbour - ships that were successfully breaking the Allied blockade particularly between Japan and Germany. Conventional methods such as bombing had been discounted. Operation Frankton was an unorthodox, imaginative and daring solution. At the end of the first night only 2 canoes and 4 men were still operational. Four nights later they inflicted damage to 5 ships lying in the harbour. Only two men survived and returned to the UK.

After circumventing four anchored Chasseur type boats the formation was more widely dispersed than planned and Cuttlefish was found to be missing. The remaining two canoes pressed on until 0630 hours and, after some difficulty in finding a suitable landing site, camouflaged their canoes and took cover in low scrub. They had covered 23 nautical miles and the force was reduced to 2 canoes and four men. Some fishermen and women from a nearby village discovered them but the marines convinced them that it was in their best interests not to discuss their presence with anyone. As the men prepared for the next night's paddling it was clear that the ploy had worked. 

The second night's paddling (Dec 8th/9th, 1942) was uneventful although bitterly cold as ice formed on the cockpit covers. However the crews landed easily and laid up in a field. This time their only visitors were some cows! An emerging problem occupied the minds of Hasler and his men. As they progressed up the river the timing and duration of the tides was becoming more critical to their calculations. They had for the first time to consider the logistics of the attack as well making progress up river. The next night there would be three hours of flood tide, 6 hours of ebb tide followed by another three hours of flood tide. Clearly progress against the ebb tide would be impossible.

In the event on the 3rd night (Dec 9th/10th) they curtailed their paddling and lay low on an island during the period of the ebb tide. They were now behind schedule and could not reach the harbour the following night with sufficient time to complete their tasks and withdraw safely. Hasler decided to establish an advance base camp on the fourth night (Dec 10th/11th) within easy striking distance of the harbour. A suitable site was found at 2300 hours. After a night's rest the men spent the day preparing their limpets and equipment for the attack. Hasler decided that Catfish would cover the west side of the docks and Crayfish the east. The fuses on the limpets were set for 2100 hours.

On the fifth night (Dec11th/12th) both canoes entered the basin without difficulty. Catfish placed 8 limpets on four vessels including the fast patrol boat Sperrbrecher. Crayfish also placed 8 limpets on two vessels - 5 on a large cargo ship and 3 on a small liner. A sentry on the deck of the Sperrbrecher spotted Catfish as it turned to return down stream. He shone his torch down but the efficiency of the camouflage left him in sufficient doubt for him to take no action. The two canoes later met by chance on the Isle de Caseau. They continued downstream together until the end of the withdrawal which came at 0600 hours when the crews scuttled their canoes about 400 meters apart. This was the last time Hasler saw the crew of the Crayfish as they set off on foot for the Spanish border.

A German High Command communiqué on the 10th Dec announced that a sabotage squad had been caught near the mouth of the Gironde and eliminated. Word of the damage caused to shipping in Bordeaux filtered through - mysterious explosions had damaged five ships! In the absence of other information all 10 men were posted missing presumed dead.

On February 23 a brief message via the Special Operations Executive (SOE) was received from Hasler himself giving details of the three canoes lost on the first day. A week later Hasler and Sparks arrived back in Britain by air from Gibraltar having passed through the French Resistance escape organisation.

It later transpired that Wallace Ewart, (Coalfish), Laver Mills (Crayfish) and MacKinnan Conway (Cuttlefish) were murdered by the Germans under Hitler's illegal order on Commandos ( HITLER COMMANDO ORDER. ) Sheard Moffatt (Conger) were presumed drowned. Hasler was awarded the DSO and Sparks the DSM (Catfish). Laver and Mills received posthumous mentions in dispatches.

"Of the many brave and dashing raids carried out by the men of Combined Operations Command none was more courageous or imaginative than Operation Frankton."

....And the raids on the Tirptiz by the Xcraft


----------



## Njaco (Mar 31, 2013)

I read about that 'Frankton' raid. Balls............


----------



## stug3 (Aug 22, 2013)

The beach at Dieppe after the Allied raid on 19th August 1942.





















Prisoners being marched away from the port area.


----------



## parsifal (Aug 22, 2013)

I would also dip my hat to the many raids undertaken by the Brandenburgers during the war, as well as skorzenys recuse of Mussolinis


----------

