# What happened to the Axis planes after WW2?



## Watanbe (Jun 15, 2009)

This has always puzzled me. What happened to the surviving German and Japanese planes after WW2? Were they simply scrapped in their native countries or were they flow back to America/Britain/Russia etc. Obviously some would of had flight tests conducted, designs studied (particularly jets) etc, but what happened to the vast majority. 

I remember seeing at one stage a picture of a load of US fighters that were made redundant by the close of WW2. Was their a similar place were German or Japanese planes were placed in storage? Its a real shame these planes have been lost, as they are now amongst the rarest of warbirds.


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## Stitch (Jun 15, 2009)

I assume that the "extra" Axis a/c were scrapped, particvularly as they weren't many raw materials left in many of the Axis contries after the War since they were all geared up for the armaments industry. I know that's how Ferruccio Lamborghini got a lot of materiel after the War in Italy; he went around the country collecting wrecked and abandoned war equipment, and recycled them for his tractor factory, _Lamborghini Trattori_.


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Jun 15, 2009)

The majority were scrapped and destroyed. Man examples were captures and flight tested. Many of those that were flight tested were eventually scrapped. Some were put in museums when they were no longer needed.


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## GrauGeist (Jun 15, 2009)

There's a bunch of photos I have seen in the past that shows the Luftwaffe aircraft shoved into scrap piles by bulldozers...it's heart-breaking to a certain degree, not because of what they could do, but because of what they're worth today...


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## Soren (Jun 15, 2009)

Since the Germans had made some aircraft which were a good deal ahead of anything that the Allies possesed, these German a/c were put on aircraft carriers and shipped to the US and thuroughly examined and flight tested. The British simply flew them over as they weren't such a long way off


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## GrauGeist (Jun 15, 2009)

Dang, there's 262s, some 190s...a Do335 in the back....a beautiful sight!

Just imagine if someone had run around and stashed a bunch of those away in the days following the close of the war, and they were pulled out today...


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## vikingBerserker (Jun 15, 2009)

God I would be in heaven.......


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## Soren (Jun 15, 2009)

One of the 190's is a Dora-13, capable of 770 km/h. Notice the enlarged supercharger intake on the right side.

There's a regular Dora-9 at very bac of the pack, to the left.


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## vikingBerserker (Jun 15, 2009)

GrauGeist said:


> There's a bunch of photos I have seen in the past that shows the Luftwaffe aircraft shoved into scrap piles by bulldozers...it's heart-breaking to a certain degree, not because of what they could do, but because of what they're worth today...



That just would have made me sick!!!


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## GrauGeist (Jun 16, 2009)

vikingBerserker said:


> That just would have made me sick!!!


Then best look away...

Be advised that these photos are graphic, and may cause some folks to be ill...


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## Thorlifter (Jun 16, 2009)

That was not nice GG, but at least your post came with a disclaimer.


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## Watanbe (Jun 16, 2009)

Very interesting...these were the kind of photos I was expecting. Did the scrap metals go to the Allies or the Axis countries?

On that aircraft carrier photo. I can't believe they would wreck all those ultra rare aircraft. I find it hard to believe that nobody had an eye for history, or even future potential profits. I suppose at the time anything Nazi was detested and despised!

What a shame!


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## gumbyk (Jun 16, 2009)




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## Stitch (Jun 16, 2009)

Watanbe said:


> Very interesting...these were the kind of photos I was expecting. Did the scrap metals go to the Allies or the Axis countries?
> 
> On that aircraft carrier photo. I can't believe they would wreck all those ultra rare aircraft. I find it hard to believe that nobody had an eye for history, or even future potential profits. I suppose at the time anything Nazi was detested and despised!
> 
> What a shame!



Actually, most of those planes did end up going to a good home; that was the HMS _Reaper_, and she had a good proportion of the aircraft that Watson's Whizzers had managed to round up at the end of the War (incluiding several flying examples of the Me 262). For instance, the Do 335 you see on the back of the ship eventually ended up (after a convoluted history) at the Smithsonian Air Space museum. In the '70's, it was temporarily returned to Dornier GmbH, who totally restored the aircraft, then returned to the US and put on permanent display at the Steven F. Udvar-Hazy Center of the SA&SM in Washington DC, where it can be seen today.


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## Watanbe (Jun 16, 2009)

Stitch said:


> Actually, most of those planes did end up going to a good home; that was the HMS _Reaper_, and she had a good proportion of the aircraft that Watson's Whizzers had managed to round up at the end of the War (incluiding several flying examples of the Me 262). For instance, the Do 335 you see on the back of the ship eventually ended up (after a convoluted history) at the Smithsonian Air Space museum. In the '70's, it was temporarily returned to Dornier GmbH, who totally restored the aircraft, then returned to the US and put on permanent display at the Steven F. Udvar-Hazy Center of the SA&SM in Washington DC, where it can be seen today.



Actually how fascinating, I think I have seen that plane in person.


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## Soren (Jun 16, 2009)




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## Thorlifter (Jun 16, 2009)

I read on Wiki where the Do-335 sits they also have other "unique late-war German aircraft such as the only known example of the Arado Ar 234B-2 Blitz jet recon-bomber, and the only surviving Heinkel He 219A Uhu"

Hell, it would be worth going just to see these three planes.


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## Soren (Jun 16, 2009)

The Ar-234 is right behind the Do-335 in the pic I presented above


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## Airframes (Jun 16, 2009)

It really is a shame that so many types, not just axis, were scrapped after the war. But, I suppose after more than five years of war, the last thing on people's minds was the preservation of aircraft for history.
Sadly, it's still happening now. About four or five years ago, I was amazed, and slightly puzzled, to see a Tornado F3 in the museum at Duxford. This aircraft was/is a type still in service with the R.A.F., so my immediate reaction was 'What's it doing here?!' But at least it shows that some people have the foresight to preserve current, or soon to be out of service, aircraft types for future generations. It might mean very little, today, to see a modern jet in a museum, but in 50 or 60 years time, it'll be the equivalent, to the generation then, of us seeing, for example, a Spitfire or Mustang.
Let's hope this practice continues, although it really is a shame that at least one of all types weren't preserved at the end of the war - it'd be nice to have a Stirling, a Dornier 17, Whirlwind etc.


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## glennasher (Jun 16, 2009)

Some of the 262s were flown at Seymour, Indiana, right up the road from me, here in Louisville, KY. They did a LOT of flight testing after the war in little Seymour. I knew nothing about it until going to a gunshow in the National Guard Armory there, and saw a bunch of old photos on the wall while waiting to go in. There's still an airfield there, though it's no longer used by the Guard, it's now the commercial airport.


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## GrauGeist (Jun 16, 2009)

I agree Terry, it's a real shame some of the rarer types didn't somehow survive, like a He280 or some of the Allied limited runs or prototypes. Then again, it wouldn't have been all that practical to have saved a Me264 or a B-19 after the war, so recycling claimed 'em


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## beaupower32 (Jun 17, 2009)

I think I will be sad for the rest of the night due to that photo of all the planes that are all trashed. What I wouldnt do to get my hands on one, even if it wasnt flight worthy.


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## zoul310 (Jul 5, 2009)

The french Air Force used german planes for quite a while during and after WW2.

In 1945 a french squadron of captured JU 88 was used to help reduce the pocket of "Fortress Royan" on the Atlantic coast.
German camo with white stripes on wings and french roundels.

Just after WW2 transport airplane were DC3 and JU52. The SNCASO had a production line for the JU and it was called "Toucan". It was used extensively in Indochina for transport, paradrops and... bombing.

As well the Fieseler Storch was used in Indochina.

All my documentation is in France and I now live in the US, I just rely on memory. It could be another company than SNCASO. Immediate post WW2 was a mess in France.

I know they tried to use FW190 in operation and it failed rapidly because of lack of spares.
And in Indochina they used some left japanese planes also !

Fascinating forum by the way !


G.


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## nachtjager (Jul 24, 2009)

The RAF set up Air Disarmament units whose sole role was to follow the front line units,and to take away totally the Luftwaffe's capability to fight, as an airfield was captured they would go in and assess what aircraft and equipment was found. They had a number of specific targets to look for , jet fighters, rocket fighters etc and any thing that showed interesting scientific developments.

Any aircraft that were not required at the Royal Aircraft Establishment at Farnborough were scrapped on site, a lot were blown up, others were cut up by ground personnel, others were bulldosed etc, the remains being sent for scrap or buried on site.

Most of the aircraft that were sent to the RAE were left out in open storage at various locations, RAF Sealand in Cheshire being one and during the very bad Winter of 1947 they suffered very badly due to the weather and most were scrapped, others were used in training exercises by station Fire crews.

I did hear that an aircraft factory in Chicago was used as as a storage facility for a lot of captured material, but when the Korean war broke out, the factory was re-commissioned and all the captured equipment was scrapped.

Russia is believed to have a very large number of Luftwaffe aircraft lying undiscovered in remote locations and lakes, and a large number of aircraft are believed to lie in European lakes, only time,money and resources will tell.


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## FLYBOYJ (Jul 24, 2009)

nachtjager said:


> I did hear that an aircraft factory in Chicago was used as as a storage facility for a lot of captured material, but when the Korean war broke out, the factory was re-commissioned and all the captured equipment was scrapped.


What factory was that?


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## PJay (Aug 22, 2009)

The Spanish got a bunch of He-111's and Bf 109's. Re-engined with Merlins.
This is my first post here, I guess this has been mentioned before but I haven't read the rest of the Board yet (LOL)


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## imalko (Aug 22, 2009)

Spanish didn't got them, they build them themselves by licenced production and they used Merlin engines because the original DB and Jumo engines were in short supply.

And by the way welcome to the forum PJay.


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## Haztoys (Aug 22, 2009)

Now Japanese planes and wrecks stayed on some islands in the Pacific for some time after the war...Ssome whole ..Untell some years later they came back with scrap ships and halled it all back home ..


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## Beefy103 (Feb 25, 2012)

Hi, my first post,

I have always been wondered about what happened to Axis aircraft after the war, so googled it and found this excellent forum.

I have just been watching a 1953 British film called They Who Dare and it showed a group of soldeirs blowing up an airfield full of Savoia Marchetti SM.79's. What was interesting was the credits said thanks to the Lebonese Air Force, so I guess some of the planes could have ended up in the Middle East.

Don't worry, when they blew up it was clear they were models.


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## wuzak (Feb 25, 2012)

Weren't many destroyed by the Luftwaffe?

As the Allied armies closed in, aircraft that were not able to fly (due to lack of fuel or other reasons) were detroyed so they would not fall into Allied hands.

Certainly the case with some Do335s.


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## Kryten (Feb 26, 2012)

Never mind the Axis planes, it's a pure travesty that no Westland Whirlwind and only one Typhoon have survived!


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## johnbr (Feb 26, 2012)

And how on that.


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## GregP (Feb 26, 2012)

Interesting that an Fw 190D-13 was indentified since only two were ever confirmed as delivered, though 17 were supposed to have been built.


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## nuuumannn (Feb 26, 2012)

Sadly, even though a number of Axis aeroplanes survivied the war to be put in museums, some of these were destroyed by the organisations entrusted to save them. The Australian War Memorial had the only surviving complete Ki-21 'Sally' bomber, but it was scrapped in the 1950s because there was no space for it in the museum. A Bf 109E-4 was scrapped in 1948 (I think) in New Zealand because there was no longer any interest in it after being offered to the Canterbury Museum. There are a whole lot more stories like this in the UK and USA. 

I have a book somewhere called Broken Wings of the Samurai full of sobering images of Japanese aircraft being junked after the war. There were so many at some places they just bulldozed them into a heap and set the lot alight, then buried the remains.


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## proton45 (Feb 26, 2012)

I've heard jokes told about old Japanese fighter planes, being made into aluminum pots and pans....


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## yulzari (Feb 27, 2012)

proton45 said:


> I've heard jokes told about old Japanese fighter planes, being made into aluminum pots and pans....
> 
> View attachment 194182


By no means a joke. BMW only survived after WW1 by turning out pots and pans instead of engines.


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## Readie (Feb 29, 2012)

Airframes said:


> It really is a shame that so many types, not just axis, were scrapped after the war. But, I suppose after more than five years of war, the last thing on people's minds was the preservation of aircraft for history.
> Sadly, it's still happening now. About four or five years ago, I was amazed, and slightly puzzled, to see a Tornado F3 in the museum at Duxford. This aircraft was/is a type still in service with the R.A.F., so my immediate reaction was 'What's it doing here?!' But at least it shows that some people have the foresight to preserve current, or soon to be out of service, aircraft types for future generations. It might mean very little, today, to see a modern jet in a museum, but in 50 or 60 years time, it'll be the equivalent, to the generation then, of us seeing, for example, a Spitfire or Mustang.
> Let's hope this practice continues, although it really is a shame that at least one of all types weren't preserved at the end of the war - it'd be nice to have a Stirling, a Dornier 17, Whirlwind etc.




I completely agree with you.
It is a shame but, in war weary Europe preservation was not high on the agenda. Getting back to normal and in German cities, somewhere to live was a pressing need.
We continue to bin aircraft and naval vessels to this day. The vets of the Falklands are all but gone.
One day we'll be sorry.
John


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## Hotntot (Mar 1, 2012)

At least a Nimrod MR2 (XV244) - has been secured for a planned aeospace visitor centre in Moray for display alongside exhibits like a Seaking Heli, Tornado, Jaguar, Buccaneer, Harrier, and Hunter, together with other stuff like an IMAX theatre. The cockpit and forward fuselage section of another MR2 has been bought by the Morayvia charity group as well. All sounds like hopeful stuff and an interesting Museum experience with the extra section. And hopefully, their plan will be to allow vistors into the fuselage section to see an example of the inside in some sort of walk through. 

MORAYVIA | Registered Charity SC042895. A tourism project to help diversify Moray's economy


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## nuuumannn (Mar 1, 2012)

> We continue to bin aircraft and naval vessels to this day.



One of the saddest losses of a ship was the German battlecruiser _Goeben_, the last survivor of the Kaiser's navy above water, which was given to the Turks in WW1 as the _Yavuz Sultan Selim _and survived until the late sixties. Turkey was offered by the West German government to preserve the ship, but tragically the Turks scrapped it in 1971-72.


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## Elmas (Mar 2, 2012)

Same old story........


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## Watanbe (Mar 10, 2012)

Do many design drawings/detailed plans exist, for example, would it be possible to build a decent replica of a Westland Whirlwind or some of the Japanese designs etc?

I've heard of companies that make replica FW190's and the like. 

Has the feasibly of doing so been investigated? I can imagine there would be some wealthy enthusiasts/warbird societies that would be interested in acquiring replicas.

I know it would horrifically expensive. But there a lot of people dedicated to warbirds and preserving history.

I just find it such a shame.


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## zoomar (Mar 27, 2012)

I suspect that replica building will become more prevalent as the number of flyable remaining warbirds diminsh. I am aware of firms that produce replica Me-262's, Fw-190s, I-16s, I-15s and others, Replicas are expensive, but probably no more than original collectors' items. Plus, with modern materials, instrumentation, and sometime engines, they are probably safer. Finally, if they suffer accidents, no actual historic aircraft are lost. I put myself in the category of preservationists that would rather see no actual 1940's vinage classics risked in flight demonstrations.


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## Edgar Brooks (Mar 27, 2012)

Though nostalgia has its place 70 years on, in the Europe of 1945/6 virtually every inhabitant of the occupied countries and the U.K. would have been happy never again to see a German aircraft in the air, which is understandable if you've been attacked by them.
It's difficult, I know, to understand the hatred felt towards the Germans (more so for the Japanese, when our POWs got home,) which persisted (and still persists) for years afterwards; my father thanked me for never buying a German or Japanese car (my reasons were simply pecuniary, not national, but I didn't bother to explain, since I understood.)
Incidentally, for those who go dewy-eyed at those photos of scrap aircraft, the Fw190, stood on its nose, was a cover for a booby-trap bomb, which exploded as the aircraft was moved, killing several men.


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## GrauGeist (Mar 27, 2012)

Edgar Brooks said:


> ... Incidentally, for those who go dewy-eyed at those photos of scrap aircraft, the Fw190, stood on its nose, was a cover for a booby-trap bomb, which exploded as the aircraft was moved, killing several men.


You referring to "blue 6" of 8.II/Jg26, found relatively intact by Canadian forces? Several people were killed when an American bulldozer pushed it over.

The Fw190 shown in the photos earlier in this thread is white 14, a different aircraft.


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## gumbyk (Mar 27, 2012)

zoomar said:


> I suspect that replica building will become more prevalent as the number of flyable remaining warbirds diminsh. I am aware of firms that produce replica Me-262's, Fw-190s, I-16s, I-15s and others, Replicas are expensive, but probably no more than original collectors' items. Plus, with modern materials, instrumentation, and sometime engines, they are probably safer. Finally, if they suffer accidents, no actual historic aircraft are lost. I put myself in the category of preservationists that would rather see no actual 1940's vinage classics risked in flight demonstrations.



The move now seems to be towards reproduction rather than replica aircraft. The FlugWerk FW-190 uses original designs and plans for everything, except the engine. I have heard, but cannot confirm that they even got permission to continue the serial numbering from the original production line, the only difference between the reproduction and the original is the engine (and instruments, in this case).

The Vintage Aviator in New Zealand is taking it one step further with their WW1 reproductions. They even go to the extent of reproducing the instruments, manufacturing their own ply-wood, and manufacturing propellers so that the aircraft is made according to all original specifications.

The term 'replica' has a lot of room for artistic licence, and you often end up with an aircraft that looks similar, but in reality is nothin like the original. I'm not a huge fan of replica aircraft - put 5 replicas together and you will see 5 different aircraft. I'd rather see the originals flying, but these reproductions are the next best thing, especially with the axis aircraft where there aren't enough flyable aircraft in existance.


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## A4K (Mar 28, 2012)

gumbyk said:


> The term 'replica' has a lot of room for artistic licence, and you often end up with an aircraft that looks similar, but in reality is nothin like the original. I'm not a huge fan of replica aircraft - put 5 replicas together and you will see 5 different aircraft. I'd rather see the originals flying, but these reproductions are the next best thing, especially with the axis aircraft where there aren't enough flyable aircraft in existance.



Agree completely. I don't like replicas any more than I do an inaccurate model - I figure if someone's going to go to the trouble of reproducing something, why not do it as correctly as possible? The end result more than makes up for the little bit of extra work IMO. 
Likewise sad to see a beautiful restoration get trashed by a terrible paint job, as so often happens. (I remember Jerry Crandall's comment re the restoration of Fw 190D-13 Gelbes 10 - '...it's a shame it wasn't painted by a modelmaker ...')

Had read the same re the Flugwerk serial numbers too, and it's the same case for the 5 new-build Me 262s if I know right.


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## Readie (Mar 28, 2012)

A4K said:


> Agree completely. I don't like replicas any more than I do an inaccurate model - I figure if someone's going to go to the trouble of reproducing something, why not do it as correctly as possible? The end result more than makes up for the little bit of extra work IMO.
> Likewise sad to see a beautiful restoration get trashed by a terrible paint job, as so often happens. (I remember Jerry Crandall's comment re the restoration of Fw 190D-13 Gelbes 10 - '...it's a shame it wasn't painted by a modelmaker ...')
> 
> Had read the same re the Flugwerk serial numbers too, and it's the same case for the 5 new-build Me 262s if I know right.




If you have enough money you can buy a 'new' Spitfire. Remanufactured or Replica? Not sure, But I'd give my eye teeth for one.

John


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## A4K (Mar 28, 2012)

You're not alone there John !!!


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## FLYBOYJ (Mar 28, 2012)

Mentioned earlier, the French used a number of captured aircraft, especially in SE Asia.


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## Marcel (Mar 28, 2012)

Here in the netherlands we have a group that wants to make a G-1 replica. They have been working on the re-design for 15+ years and still a long way off. It appears that many drawings were destroyed and many modifications were done "on the flour" without drawings, making reproduction extremely difficult.


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## gumbyk (Mar 28, 2012)

A4K said:


> Had read the same re the Flugwerk serial numbers too, and it's the same case for the 5 new-build Me 262s if I know right.



The serial number of the one here is 990001, the first two letters being the year of manufacture, so although the s/n is a continuation, it could be debated whether or not this is a continuation of the series. I do know though, that they have retained the original designation, but put an 'N' suffix on it - to denote a new build.

But, I do see they day when there are more replicas/reproductions flying than originals. As long as there are people out there producing faithful reproductions, I can live with it...


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## DFM+BB (Feb 10, 2013)

On my side I can't live with the so call Flugwerk replica.
Let me explain ; to me replica came from the French word "réplique" witch mean to duplicate the exact same thing according to all drawings details etc...
On this point I am for replica to fly rather than historical/rare aircraft.
But this had to be done most accurately as possible ( engine is often the big problem so itis okay to me ) but it appears that Flugwerk had takes huges liberty with the original Fw190 drawings ( and I've took time to look closer to these newly manufactured Fw ) ; as not repecting the correct steel thikness differencial between left and right side of the fuselage...all this to produce quickly and reduce cost of a replica. But all these resluted in great certification difficulty and some crashes. Sorry I am fed up with these replicas ; as it is sayed above making a replica takes time (years) and accuracy ! money and warbirds only makes good friends when money is regardless to what enthousiasm decide  

Following up on the subbject ; a rumor ( and I am 80% this is a rumor ) says there are still hidden german factories undiscovered out there ! ( to me it might be true in the late 60 but not now ).
And to finish with this ( !! If you are German aircraft enthousiast don't read the following !!  ) one of my friends once came up in the late 70's rescuing a DB605 form a scrap yard, he discovered has he told me, the entire front section of a Bf109G ; and the guy from the scrap yard told him : "this is all we got we had to cut it in half because it was too heavy for us at the time we took it" ... Kill Me Now...


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## daveT (Feb 12, 2013)

The Axis surrendered! Terms of the surrender included destroying all their combat aircraft. In Japan they were piled up and burned.
rare photo attached of Japanese planes burning at Omura, Japan following Allied Occupation. Same thing happened all over.


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## Capt. Vick (Feb 12, 2013)

I know in the American Aviation Historical Society Journal (AAHS Journal), Volume 18, Issue #1 from the Spring of 1973, Robert Mikesh wrote an extensive article entitled "What happened to those Japanese Planes?" which examines what happened to the IJAAF IJNAF aircraft brought back from Japan after the war. (Mikesh, if you remember was a NASM Curator for Japanese Aircraft and wrote a book I have been looking for for ages, at a reasonable price, "Japanese Aircraft Interiors, 1940-1945") I see this very issue for sale on Ebay from time to time.


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## Gixxerman (Feb 12, 2013)

daveT said:


> The Axis surrendered! Terms of the surrender included destroying all their combat aircraft. In Japan they were piled up and burned.



Yes indeed.
There are a couple of pics of some very late war LW aircraft sitting in various states of disrepair (and some brand new) with fuel soaked hay bales waiting to be set alight.
Such a waste.....of the raw materials if nothing else, particularly at a time when everyone was broke must surely have appreciated the value of refined worked materials?


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## tyrodtom (Feb 12, 2013)

The allies wanted them destroyed quick, and no parts salvable to put other aircraft into flying condition.
Burning was a waste, but it was the quickest, and less labor intensive too, than any other method.


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## bobbysocks (Feb 12, 2013)

there was a thread long about where in norway they bull dozed a bunch in a hole and covered them over. wouldnt ya like to dig them up??


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## Shinpachi (Feb 12, 2013)

So many aircrafts were preserved in good condition as well as enough fuel for the last battle in the Japanese homeland.
Aircrafts in Manchuria and Korea were intact. Most of them were captured by Chinese and Russian.
I miss them as an engineer.


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## Elmas (Feb 13, 2013)

The same fate, by water if not by fire, happened to the German submarines that surrendered after 8th May 1945 (operation Deadlight), losing thousand of tons of very good steel.

Photograph of surrendered submarines on the River Foyle, Londonderry. July 1945





Surrendered at Weymouth, England on 20 May, 1945





But probably finding scrap iron was not difficult in Europe in those days.


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## DFM+BB (Feb 13, 2013)

I had the chance by the past to discuss with people who lived by this time and I asked them this question "why destroying everything ? " 
And I think now that this question was in fact "dumb" ; yes they needed to recreate Europe and Japan etc... but as they told me they also wanted to forget as quick as possible what happened during this war. As my Grand father was in forced labour camp making Subs, he never spoked me of this ( just once ) despite I was very interested in WWII.
So I think getting scrapped steel etc... is just part of the answer ; firstly I think they wanted to forget about those who make them suffer and by extension what represented them as aircrafts etc... and by that time a preserving a sub or an aircraft was not as prioritary as getting food one day after an other...


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## nuuumannn (Feb 13, 2013)

> The term 'replica' has a lot of room for artistic licence, and you often end up with an aircraft that looks similar, but in reality is nothin like the original.



I think we are getting our definitions mixed up here; a replica is an _exact_ reproduction of an object by the original artist, or in this case manufacturer. A good example is the reproduced Yaks at Orenburg; these are true replicas. The majority of warbirds flying today are reproductions or reconstructions incorporating original components, if you take the exact meaning of the word "replica" literally, because there is little in current warbirds that is from the original airframe - necessary for certification reasons.

Because of the fine standard of workmanship and the adherence to techniques and materials used at the time, some airframes can be described as "late production" models, such as the work of Desmond St Cyrien, who expertly crafted a number of fine reproductions of Sopwith aeroplanes in the 1960s, but concocted a story about them being originals that were 'discovered' in an abandoned barn in France. Even Tommy Sopwith himself, on examining St Cyrien's Sopwith Pup (now at the RAF Museum) claimed that it was exactly as Pups were built by his factory. The work of The Vintage Aviator or what Glynn Powell is doing for the de Havilland Mosquito come under this description, as well.

While some of you might decry the decision to preserve a Tornado F.3 in a British museum, but lament the fact that there are no Westland Whirlwinds (fighters, not choppers) surviving, at least the MOD has the foresight to recognise that today's airframes might mean something in years to come; they don't want to be making the same mistakes as their predecessors. Not everything can or should be saved because of space, cost of maintenance and upkeep etc, but starting with maybe one or two examples of things in proper care is a good thing.

It saddens me when historic ships are disposed of; the UK has an example in the Trafalgar era ship-of-the-line Implacable, which was sunk off the coast of the Isle of Wight in 1949 by the Royal Navy; an absolute travesty since it was originally a French vessel that took part in Trafalgar and was captured by the Brits - how could such an historic ship that survived for nearly 200 years be sunk? Protests from the public saw the clipper ship Cutty Sark spared from a similar fate. Implacable's stern facade and figurehead survive at Greenwich as a reminder of our lack of foresight, although the Falklands veteran HMS Plymouth is under threat now; do we never learn?


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## Njaco (Feb 18, 2013)




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## Capt. Vick (Feb 18, 2013)

WOW! Great picture! I'm always struck by how clear the images from that time are. Was it the film? Camera?


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## Jenisch (Feb 18, 2013)

Not exactly related, but interesting anyway:


_View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qAKw6px4Nnk_

Sadly, the G8N Rita the Americans tested in the US was supposed to go to a museum, but ended up scapred. 

For us WWII enthusiasts, not only much of the Axis equipment was extinct, but some Allied stuff as well. The most famous American carrier which I don't remember it's name now was also scapped, against the wishes of many people.


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## Jenisch (Feb 18, 2013)

_View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jrXTHMtX5Nc_


_View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G_3pGAnxj4E_


_View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B24_tjVPIb0_


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## DFM+BB (Feb 18, 2013)

Capt. Vick said:


> WOW! Great picture! I'm always struck by how clear the images from that time are. Was it the film? Camera?



I agree the picture is great. By this time taking pictures war more like an art than now, at first cameras were not cheap, and you don't find all the electonical "user friendly" help that you find nowadays and most of the times war photographer were in charge (so professionals) so maybe guy were taking more time to do a good picutre. Also lens were not so bad, even comparable to what is done now ; I own serveral leica including a rare WWII one (and not a fake...) and lens are prefectly good that is crazy !
But as alway, if you look up for WWII pictures you will also find some poor ones, but they are never published in magasines because they are not presentable ( I mean for something you payed for...). I got some of these back in France taken in germany in german grave yards. Maybe I'll post them one day but I got to get French war archives authorisation ( they were given to me by them ; from negative I don't own originals ).

To Jenish, come one this is not exctly related but this is always great to see these videos ! thanks for sharing 
The Russian collection always makes me mad !


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## bobbysocks (Feb 18, 2013)

i wonder if that 262 shown at the wright patt air fair was the one that crashed flying around ohio/pa later?


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## Aozora (Feb 18, 2013)

More sad photos. An A6M3 mod 22, with what looks like the rear fuselage of a G4M:






Atsugi AB:











Captured B5N2 (P-47 in background, probably Marianas):











An Aichi B7A2:






Nakajima G8N1:






Ki-84s, Ki-43 and misc:






Ki-61 (not 244 Sentai):






Kawanishi N1K1s:






N1K2-Js ex 343 Ku:






Mitsubishi Ki-83 (scrapped in US):






Aichi M6K1 - orange undersurfaces, probably test or prototype:


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## CobberKane (Feb 18, 2013)

I guess what seems inexplicable to us now made complete sense given the mindset of the times – the war was over, derelict aircraft were everywhere and it was time to beat the swords into plough-shears. We can hardly blame those who scrapped these planes for not considering whether some might like to see them in one piece sixty years later – after six years of conflict they probably couldn’t wait to be rid of them.
One analogy might be the gun buy-back scheme we had here in Oz when firearms ownership laws were changed after a particularly nasty mass shooting a few years back. I won’t go into the politics of it - other than to say I’m a fire-arms owner and have absolutely no problem with being required to have a criminal check and obtain a licence as required – but the upshot was that the government gave unregistered firearm owners the option (amongst others) of surrendering their guns and being paid for them, and many owners elected to do so rather than go through the hassle of obtaining a licence. So, the government collected tens of thousands of rifles that had been collecting dust for decades – and scrapped them. You can bet your life that some very collectable guns ended up as six inch nails, but at the time people weren’t thinking of that so much as the image of thirty five bodies stretched out on the streets of Port Arthur .


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## GrauGeist (Feb 18, 2013)

Well, that's the deal right there...these aircraft (especially Axis aircraft) were symbols of fear and loathing...for so many years they were the heralds of death until the tide was turned and they were beaten back.

No one wanted these monsters sitting around, especially when raw materials were in such high demand as the world tried to regain it's composure and rebuild. The valuable metals these aircraft (and ships, tanks, helmets, rifles, etc) contained was needed for new building materials, automobiles, kitchen items and so on. Melt 'em down and move onward...

Decades later, we can sit back and lament about thier demise from the relative security of our generation but it wasn't until recently, that the surviving machines had any real value, anyway. Otherwise they would have been digging them up, restoring them and preserving them back in the 50's, 60's and 70's instead of scrapping them when they were no longer airworthy or of interest.


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## Njaco (Feb 18, 2013)

I have a cleaner image of the one just posted...


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## Aozora (Feb 18, 2013)

GrauGeist said:


> Well, that's the deal right there...these aircraft (especially Axis aircraft) were symbols of fear and loathing...for so many years they were the heralds of death until the tide was turned and they were beaten back.
> 
> No one wanted these monsters sitting around, especially when raw materials were in such high demand as the world tried to regain it's composure and rebuild. The valuable metals these aircraft (and ships, tanks, helmets, rifles, etc) contained was needed for new building materials, automobiles, kitchen items and so on. Melt 'em down and move onward...
> 
> Decades later, we can sit back and lament about thier demise from the relative security of our generation but it wasn't until recently, that the surviving machines had any real value, anyway. Otherwise they would have been digging them up, restoring them and preserving them back in the 50's, 60's and 70's instead of scrapping them when they were no longer airworthy or of interest.



Thus,all the more credit to those organisations and individuals who did decide in the 40s and 50s to store and preserve at least some of the Axis aircraft - that beautiful M6A1 Seiran at NASM and the D4Y at Planes of Fame to name just a couple. 

And of course credit and a big *THANK YOU* to all those dedicated enthusiasts who have done such great jobs of rebuilding/restoring so many of the few.


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## Aozora (Feb 18, 2013)

Njaco said:


> I have a cleaner image of the one just posted...
> 
> View attachment 225215



Much better than my version. Just looking at the American C-47s parked in the background centre-centre right. Also a couple of airmen tinkering in the cockpit of the P1Y2 "Francis", middle left.


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## Njaco (Feb 18, 2013)

I never noticed that before!


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## GrauGeist (Feb 19, 2013)

Sure those C-47s aren't a Showa or Nakajima L2D series (Tabby)?


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## Capt. Vick (Feb 19, 2013)

I wonder what happened to this He-112 found in Japan after the war...






I think I got this from the good fellows at Welcome to J


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## DFM+BB (Feb 19, 2013)

Do you really wonder ? 
Old, well known aircraft captured while everyone was looking for jet engines....


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## gumbyk (Feb 19, 2013)

Here's what happened to most of them..:


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## DFM+BB (Feb 19, 2013)

Good one Gumbyk !
And sometimes they follow up their original purpose (flying) when the cooker gets mad !


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## Shinpachi (Feb 20, 2013)

It's a good expansion.
Wheels were re-used for carts.


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## DFM+BB (Feb 20, 2013)

Shinpachi, 
I fond this also : Fuji Rabbit.com
It explain that Vespa Aircraft parts, was a ledgend but the japanese company named "Fuji Rabbit" actually used bomber tail wheel for the first Japanese scooter !


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## Capt. Vick (Feb 20, 2013)

DFM+BB said:


> Do you really wonder ?



No, not really. Just wanted to post that pic! 

And this one!


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## Capt. Vick (Feb 20, 2013)

And this one...






At least we know definitively what happened to the ki-78 Ken


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## DFM+BB (Feb 20, 2013)

Very nice Pics Capt !

WOW the tank actually destroying the Ki78 world speed record attempt japanese aicraft !!!!????? 
what a shame...... 

Btw I knew you were not really wondering  thanks for sharing


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## Njaco (Feb 20, 2013)

gehko has some great pics here....

http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/aircraft-pictures/after-battle-price-defeat-24586.html

.


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## DFM+BB (Feb 20, 2013)

Who got a time machine ??


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## Capt. Vick (Feb 20, 2013)

I wish! That would be awesome!


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## Capt. Vick (Feb 20, 2013)

DFM+BB said:


> Very nice Pics Capt !
> 
> Btw I knew you were not really wondering  thanks for sharing



I know brother! 

And another one to prove the He 112 was in Japan...


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## DFM+BB (Feb 20, 2013)

As far as I know Japan tested lost of German aircrafts during WWII or at least received partial or complete drawings.
At least Bf109E is well known.
But Germans were not so happy about sharing technical advanced technology ( as rocket or reactors ) that is why it came so lately when germans decided to share this technology.

Thanks for the pics ! 

And what about Notrh Africa ? As a P40 was discovered recently in the desert and a B24 before him ( long time ago ).


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## Aozora (Feb 20, 2013)

Capt. Vick said:


> And this one...
> 
> View attachment 225387
> 
> ...



The crewman on that M7 Priest looked like he was enjoying himself - shame on him!

Something slightly OT but still interesting

SpitfireSpares.com - warbird Undercarridge


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## DFM+BB (Feb 20, 2013)

Aozora said:


> The crewman on that M7 Priest looked like he was enjoying himself - shame on him!



It depends on the point of view, I think lots of his friends died or he saw war horros so it is understandable. I perfer him crushing an aircraft instead of killing anyone as a personal revenge.
But it is a shame to loose the airgraft I agree.


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## Shinpachi (Feb 20, 2013)

According to my father and mother's memories I listened, they did not care such destruction by the allies at all because the war was over.
They enjoyed new era.


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