# Did the Luftwaffe wear socks or something else?



## Lighthunmust (Sep 25, 2011)

This thread is not a joke. It is intended to be a fun and possibly funny inquiry into an important piece of European military equipment still in use at the end of the 20th century. A few countries held ceremonies honoring the usage of this equipment when it was discontinued. Any members having experience with the historically important piece of equipment I am alluding to please share your experience in a post.


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## tyrodtom (Sep 25, 2011)

What are you talking about ? Relief systems, the bombers had several systems, but fighters, I've wondered about them too. Nobody likes going into danger with a full bladder.


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## Lighthunmust (Sep 26, 2011)

tyrodtom said:


> What are you talking about ? Relief systems, the bombers had several systems, but fighters, I've wondered about them too. Nobody likes going into danger with a full bladder.




Hello tyrodtom,

I am not alluding to "Relief systems" or anything about going into danger with a full bladder. Believe me this thread is not a joke. What I am alluding to is indeed military equipment that was used not just for decades but centuries. I have read that the Wehrmacht used it in WW2 but I have doubts that the Luftwaffe did, especially the pilots and flight crews. Part of the "fun" and possibly "funny" part of this thread is someone figuring out what is the equipment I am attempting to find information on and more importantly posts from members with first-hand experience in using it. I was not joking when I wrote that some nations upon discontinuing its use held ceremonies honoring its use. I am surprised someone has not already figured out what equipment is the topic of this thread. I am guessing an Eastern-European member may be very familiar with it.


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## Readie (Sep 26, 2011)

Lighthunmust said:


> Hello tyrodtom,
> 
> I am guessing an Eastern-European member may be very familiar with it.



Still mystified Steve...


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## razor1uk (Sep 26, 2011)

A lack of pargraphing Lighthunmust, will confuse some with a big body of text, but I thought the title said it all...

I think the relief systems as a seperate topic would be sort of curious, informative while at same time a bit, mmm, 'conotated'. 
Also I think it would likely to end up in a fight about relief equipment sizes and specifications about spam daggers vs. pork swords vs. beef trunchons etc on the one hand, and similar disagreements about what bomb loadings can be withstood in the other. But if that doesn't happen, so the better for having more knowledge in the resource dump.


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## fastmongrel (Sep 26, 2011)

Readie said:


> Still mystified Steve...



I think he is asking if the Luftwaffe wore there wellies in the bath

Or he might be asking about socks I am mystified as well


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## razor1uk (Sep 26, 2011)

Military Personal Pocket 'Moggies' (aka...)? by perchance or maybe knitted or produced Willy Warmers, so you can pee outside of clothes; without worrying about frostbite in bloody cold temperatures or stinking of piss (or as much,) during briefings with officers brass in heated areas?


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## Lighthunmust (Sep 26, 2011)

fastmongrel said:


> I think he is asking if the Luftwaffe wore there wellies in the bath
> 
> Or he might be asking about socks I am mystified as well


 


razor1uk said:


> Military Personal Pocket 'Moggies' (aka...)? by perchance or maybe knitted or produced Willy Warmers, so you can pee outside of clothes; without worrying about frostbite in bloody cold temperatures or stinking of piss (or as much,) during a briefing with officers brass?



Sorry guys, it is not about "wellies" (Wellington Boots) or "Moggies" (?!). Here is a clue: Wellington would be very familiar with this equipment, so would the "little corporal" version 1.0 and version 2.0. "Wellies" would be very "close" to this piece of equipment. This piece of equipment apparently has some advantages over the equipment that has now almost completely replaced it.


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## Readie (Sep 26, 2011)

Lighthunmust said:


> Sorry guys, it is not about "wellies" (Wellington Boots) or "Moggies" (?!). Here is a clue: Wellington would be very familiar with this equipment, so would the "little corporal" version 1.0 and version 2.0. "Wellies" would be very "close" to this piece of equipment. This piece of equipment apparently has some advantages over the equipment that has now almost completely replaced it.



aha...the sandwich !!

Bully beef and crusty white bread with mustard.

we built an empire on that alone

Cheers

John


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## tyrodtom (Sep 26, 2011)

Going into danger with a full bladder ain't no joke. It's a serious distraction when your mind needs to be elsewhere.

Watch out Lighthunmust, I think you're about to lose control of another thread.


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## Lighthunmust (Sep 26, 2011)

Readie said:


> aha...the sandwich !!
> 
> Bully beef and crusty white bread with mustard.
> 
> ...


 


tyrodtom said:


> Going into danger with a full bladder ain't no joke. It's a serious distraction when your mind needs to be elsewhere.
> 
> Watch out Lighthunmust, I think you're about to lose control of another thread.



Sorry John, Bully beef and crusty white bread with mustard may have been a integral part of building the empire but that is not the equipment I am alluding too.

Tyrodtom I completely agree with you, "a full bladder ain't no joke". A truly serious distraction that fear usually creates an involuntary elimination.

The thread may go out of "control", but I can't lose something I never had or want. It is never about control, it is about creating mutual cooperation for purposeful consideration of a topic.

Here is another clue: Individuals always use two identical pieces of the equipment. If it is operated while wet or improperly "installed" it causes far more distraction than a temporarily full bladder, it causes casualties. Proper use is so important that elaborate instructions of its use were provided by some military organizations. A German soldier at Stalingrad would be just as familiar with it as soldier with Frederick the Great's army. I am not so sure Luftwaffe pilots would be using it, but they may have. It is entirely possible that a member of this forum native to Europe has used this equipment while serving in the military.Silly songs and jokes about this equipment are not uncommon amongst its users in certain countries. One joke is that it has a secondary use for chemical warfare.


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## tyrodtom (Sep 26, 2011)

Puttees? I've got no experience with them.


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## Lighthunmust (Sep 26, 2011)

tyrodtom said:


> Puttees? I've got no experience with them.



Sorry Tyrodtom, not Puttees. You are close, keep thinking about the area of the body near the bottom of puttees. If you really want to know I will send you a PM if you promise not to make the answer public. I think you deserve this for your perseverance. One member has all ready received the answer for making this promise. I don't want to spoil the fun of anyone who figures out the name of the equipment. It really is a head-smackingly simple answer if you are familiar with the piece of equipment.


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## razor1uk (Sep 26, 2011)

Boots!! Bloody (not actually literally covered in) Riding Boots!? - below knee high leather boots


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## Lighthunmust (Sep 26, 2011)

razor1uk said:


> Boots!! Bloody (not actually literally covered in) Riding Boots!? - below knee high leather boots



Sorry Razor1UK, not boots of any kind. Boots would be very "close" to this piece of equipment. In fact only one other thing would be as "close".


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## Readie (Sep 27, 2011)

So, not wellies, puttees or boots...ummm

Footwear

I GOT THE ANSWER...Cavalry spurs.

easy peasy

Cheers
John


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## ivanotter (Sep 27, 2011)

Got it.

Dunno the technical term. HOWEVER. it is a rather big piece of cloth. folded in mysterious ways around your foot. instead of socks. It absorbes better 9apparantly), being even more confortable (?) but folded incorrectly causing blisters in a tremendous amount.

Still used in Russia i have heard (don't know that).

Yes? did I get the prize?

Ivan


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## Lighthunmust (Sep 27, 2011)

ivanotter said:


> Got it.
> 
> Dunno the technical term. HOWEVER. it is a rather big piece of cloth. folded in mysterious ways around your foot. instead of socks. It absorbes better 9apparantly), being even more confortable (?) but folded incorrectly causing blisters in a tremendous amount.
> 
> ...



We have a winner!

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Footwraps - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

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Did all Luftwaffe personnel use footwraps?

Based on your personal experience, what are footwraps really like to use?

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## Readie (Sep 27, 2011)

Lighthunmust said:


> We have a winner!



B*ugger. I really thought I'd won with spurs...


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## Njaco (Sep 27, 2011)

I was gonna say Dr. Scholl's Inserts.......it sounded German.


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## Lighthunmust (Sep 27, 2011)

Njaco said:


> I was gonna say Dr. Scholl's Inserts.......it sounded German.



For originality and humor you win one of our delightful consolation prizes: Dinner for two at the spectacular Taco Bell located on the mysterious Pima Indian Reservation just a short walking distance from Lighthunmust Footwrap Contest Headquarters. (see note #1 and #2 in post #19 above, you will be dinning with our handsome and charming contest prize coordinator)


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## Crimea_River (Sep 27, 2011)

I was thinking condoms.


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## Aaron Brooks Wolters (Sep 27, 2011)

We are getting into the Top 20.


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## Lighthunmust (Sep 27, 2011)

Crimea_River said:


> I was thinking condoms.






Did you visit the "Hitler's battle with venereal disease" thread just before you came here and get confused?

Is wearing condoms on your feet something peculiar to western Canadians due to you having some really strange looking feet?

Is it just the shape of your feet that made you think the equipment was condoms? I'll bet you could cry me a river of tears over the teasing you get at the beach.

Oh I get it! Pardon me for being slow. You thought I when I wrote "socks" it was because I was too embarrassed and prissy to write condom. You know I think I just figured out why many people have not posted to this thread. Honestly, it was never an intended double entendre.

For your special help in helping me overcome my naivete you too win one of our delightful consolation prizes. Get ready for excitement when you visit the exotic lair of Canadian snowbirds and participate in a photo safari led by our daring and courageous Lighthunmust Footwrap Contest Big Game Hunter. (See notes #1 and #2 in post #19 above)

Seriously folks, do any of you have military experience wearing footwraps? I truly am curious about your opinions about them.


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## Njaco (Sep 27, 2011)

I actually hadn't heard of them before. I think its an item usually missed in all the history books.


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## Capt. Vick (Sep 27, 2011)

I don't know about socks, but they tied their shoes in little nazis! LOL


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## Lighthunmust (Sep 27, 2011)

Njaco said:


> I actually hadn't heard of them before. I think its an item usually missed in all the history books.



It has only been two months since I learned about how important they were considered to be. What I find interesting is they were apparently easier and faster to dry. I humped a ruck for several years mainly at Fort Bragg and remember what a pain it was to keep your socks dry. The other interesting thing is that a hole in a footwrap is easier to deal with than one in a sock. I would like someone to chime in that has experience with them. It cannot be low cost and tradition alone that kept them in use for so long. They apparently require precise folding or they rapidly cause problems. Did Luftwaffe pilots and aircrew use footwraps or did the prestige of their positions merit socks being issued?


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## Njaco (Sep 28, 2011)

Find a few pics and a discussion on another forum....

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=39625&st=40&p=304274 entry304274

The one pic is Red Army soldier T.F. Stebakov to wrap up feet in foot wrap before march. From Imageshack.

The other pic is explained on that forum.


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## Lighthunmust (Sep 28, 2011)

Thanks Njaco, that is a very interesting site. I remember how much time I spent ensuring my feet were kept in good shape. During the 1980-90s I tried various socks of different materials, issue wool, the synthetic mix sold at the Post Clothing Sales, Polysomething (middle-aged moment, need to drink my coffee), and Thermax. I never had much problem keeping the water out of my boots unless wading or fording, the problem was sweat and quickly drying out wool after removing the sock. The two last materials listed worked the best, but still I used alot of moleskin and bandage tape. The fact that something other than socks were used by major military organizations until very recently is very interesting. Socks could not have been to expensive to prohibit use in the second half of the 20th century. Did some soldiers really prefer footwraps?


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## tyrodtom (Sep 28, 2011)

That looks like one very young Russian soldier in the first picture.


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## Njaco (Sep 28, 2011)

fodder for the grist mill.


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## ivanotter (Sep 28, 2011)

Luftwaffe and foot wrap? can't see it. Goering would never go for it.

Come to think of it. I think it was even in one of the episodes of "Amazing Race" a year back. when the team ended up in Russia. One of the tasks was to dress up in Russian uniform and do something. Foot wrap was a part of it. (I think).

Ivan


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## mikewint (Sep 28, 2011)

When I first arrived in Vietnam we were issued leather boots. They were always wet, and rotted away in about a month or so. We wore one pair of socks, and kept at least one or two pair pair next to our skin to try to dry them. My feet looked like cottage cheese most of the time. we mixed up all kinds of stuff to try to keep the fungus infections down. One of my favorites was a mixture of a couple tubes of micolog, penicillin, and foot powder.
Never heard of "foot-wraps" except maybe when no boots were available


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## ivanotter (Sep 29, 2011)

Mike, that sounds like a horrible potion.

Insofar as foot wraps seem to be superior in some ways, could it have been an option in Vietnam?

Ivan


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## mikewint (Sep 29, 2011)

I think the folding would have been a serious problem, even the smallest wrinkle in your socks could trigger a blister. Any skin break was a serious problem in that environment


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## Lighthunmust (Sep 29, 2011)

mikewint said:


> When I first arrived in Vietnam we were issued leather boots. They were always wet, and rotted away in about a month or so. We wore one pair of socks, and kept at least one or two pair pair next to our skin to try to dry them. My feet looked like cottage cheese most of the time. we mixed up all kinds of stuff to try to keep the fungus infections down. One of my favorites was a mixture of a couple tubes of micolog, penicillin, and foot powder.
> Never heard of "foot-wraps" except maybe when no boots were available



I assume you are referring to an all leather boot and not the leather/nylon jungle boot. Were you still in country when the jungle boot was issued and was there a similar problem with its leather rotting? The only time I experienced a boots rotting was during jump school. I went through in August when many days were near or at Cat 5. The Black Hats had us literally rolling through a series of out door showers twice a day to prevent heat casualties. This combined with the mysterious formula the Boot Blacks were putting on our boots every night, resulted in two pairs of boots only a couple of months old being thrown away at the end of training. I am sure it was the Boot Black's goop that resulted in most of the damage. 




mikewint said:


> I think the folding would have been a serious problem, even the smallest wrinkle in your socks could trigger a blister. Any skin break was a serious problem in that environment



I assume you were wearing the all wool padded sole issue socks. What was the enemy wearing in the same environment to cope with the problem of keeping feet fit for patroling? I suspect sandals were common among irregulars but what about NVA regulars? Did they use socks or footwraps? Since the variety of synthetic socks available today was not available, what about silk as way to reduce blisters?

Since I am not sure who is looking at this thread I am going to PM some members showing locations in eastern european countries to see if they have some answers about use of footwraps in their militaries.


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## N4521U (Sep 29, 2011)

All I know is when I took my first hop in a Sykorski 34J at HS-2 training squadron in San Diego I was told that black funnel on the bulkhead was the "emergency com tube" to the pilot!!!!!!!

[email protected]@rd!


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## RabidAlien (Sep 30, 2011)

Reading "Lafayette Escadrille" by Herbert Molloy Mason, Jr right now, about American volunteer pilots in the French Armed Forces during the beginning stages of WW1. Originally, most of them volunteered for the French Foreign Legion, to avoid nationality laws and stuff, or operated as ambulance drivers. When the idea of an all-American flying squadron was broached, a good portion of the prospective pilots (several of which had no prior flying experience, and just sorta bluffed their way in....and gave a good accounting of themselves, too! BTW, found out that the lion mascot, Whiskey, from "Flyboys" was actually true. Much of the rest of the movie was pure Bollockswood, but Whiskey actually existed. There was also, later on, a female lion purchased from the Paris zoo, inevitably named "Soda") were drawn from the Foreign Legion, since they sorta already had military training and combat experience. When they were first inducted into the Legion, though, there were no socks (whether from lack of supply, or they just didn't use em, I forget). The troops would either go without socks between foot and boot (guaranteed to cause blisters until feet became acclimated) or used the "Russian wraps", as they called them, which worked miraculously well if applied correctly (described as several square or rectangular cloths layered over the feet just so) or causing horrific blisters, lacerations, and sores if just the slightest bit off. Two future pilots had mishaps while on a march to the front, and fell out to the ditch to await an ambulance or supply cart to help carry them the rest of the way....a major or commander came along, asked what they were doing. They explained that their feet were so bad they couldn't stand, and were waiting for medics. The officer pulled out his revolver, pointed it at them, and declared them to be deserters or cowards and was about to shoot them. They got up quickly, and managed to hobble the rest of the way into town (two or three miles) with blood leaking out of their boots. Turned into excellent pilots not too long after that.

That was the first time I'd ever heard/read about Russian Wraps. What little I've read about the Eastern Front really didn't go into detail on skivvies.


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