# Supermarine Spitfire



## Viper (Jan 28, 2004)

Everyone Who has seen a spitfire up close or flying would probualy always remember the scream of the merlin engine and that it send a shiver down your spine  . The spitfire was a prime aircraft of the R.A.F in the battle of Briton and for the remainder of the war. The spit could outpreform most of the German aircraft with speed,manuverabliity,and preformance. Reply on your opions about any varient of the spit


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Jan 29, 2004)

yea, it was good, but a bit over-rated


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## cheddar cheese (Jan 29, 2004)

yeah, but ask most normal people that know nothing about planes to name a famous ww2 plane and they will probably say the spitfire


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## Hot Space (Jan 29, 2004)

The Spitfire was a good Plane 8) 

Hot Space


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Jan 30, 2004)

yea, not as good as the lancaster


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## Hot Space (Jan 30, 2004)

Let's be honest, it's hard to Dogfight in a Lancaster and you can't drop a 22,000lb Grand Slam from a Spitfire   

So both were the BEST at they're own jobs  

Hot Space


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Feb 1, 2004)

ok, good point, and i suppose the spitfire was better looking than the spitfire (enjoy the moment, it's the last time i say somethink bad about the lancaster)


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## Hot Space (Feb 1, 2004)

the lancaster kicks ass said:


> i suppose the spitfire was better looking than the spitfire



Don't really understand here, M8  

Hot Space


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Feb 1, 2004)

ment to say lancaster, sorry


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## Hot Space (Feb 1, 2004)

Don't worry, we all say something wrong. We with me it was "I do......" at my Wedding  

Hot Space


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## Viper (Feb 2, 2004)

Hot Space said:


> Don't worry, we all say something wrong. We with me it was "I do......" at my Wedding
> 
> Hot Space


That would be the embarresment of a lifetime


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## Hot Space (Feb 2, 2004)

Hot Space


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## Anonymous (Feb 16, 2004)

"Give me a squadron of Spitfires"

How many planes can brag an enemy ace asked his Commander for a squadron of them? Only the Spitfire my friends! I think if the Spit had been allowed to carry more external fuel like the Mustang I'd be able to convince more Americans they didn't have the best fighter of the war! 

Oh man, this is going to get ugly now! -- Chris


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## Hot Space (Feb 16, 2004)

...............but fun 8) 

And I agree 8) 8) 

Hot Space


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Feb 17, 2004)

Viper said:


> Hot Space said:
> 
> 
> > Don't worry, we all say something wrong. We with me it was "I do......" at my Wedding
> ...


  i take it your wife doesn't read all this HS?


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## Hot Space (Feb 17, 2004)

If it's not Fashion, she not interested  

Hot Space


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Feb 21, 2004)

that says allot about both of you.............


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## Hot Space (Feb 21, 2004)

Hot Space


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Feb 24, 2004)

don't look at me in that tone of voice


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## Hot Space (Feb 24, 2004)

Double  

Hot Space


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## kiwimac (Feb 25, 2004)

You two are obviously Goons fans! and all I can say to this is <Stop this naughty-type bickering>

The Spitfire was a good fighter, not the best of the war by any means but a good one nonetheless. My own sympathies lie with the Hawker Hurricane personally but there we are thats what makes this life such an interesting and varied tapestry, eh?

Kiwimac


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## cheddar cheese (Feb 25, 2004)

oh yes, the hurricane 8) in my opinion the best looking british plane of the war 8)


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## Hot Space (Feb 25, 2004)

cheddar cheese said:


> oh yes, the hurricane 8) in my opinion the best looking british plane of the war 8)



  

Hot Space


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## Viper (Feb 25, 2004)

hurricane was kind of a dog for looks i think,but preformed well


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## cheddar cheese (Feb 26, 2004)

thats just cheek, it looks great 8)


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Feb 26, 2004)

it is kinda cool


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## Viper (Feb 27, 2004)

i know its cool just abit akward...


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## kiwimac (Feb 28, 2004)

Maybe so but it was responsible for far more enemy kills than the Spit, it enabled far more pilots to become aces simply because it was a far more docile machine.

Kiwimac


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Feb 28, 2004)

more than just the spit, in the BoB it claimed more enemy aircraft than all the other air and ground defences combined


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## cheddar cheese (Feb 28, 2004)

wow


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## Archer (Feb 28, 2004)

I read a book by <insert some British pilot from BoB that later was affiliated with the royal family somehow I think> that covered from WWI until the end of WWII and how the RAF and Luftwaffe grew, fought, in the case of the Luftwaffe died, then rebuilt in Russia, then fought some more...

Anyways, the book said the Hurricanes were a lot better than Spit against the bombers because they were more stable gun platforms, unlike the Spits whose wings would flex when they shot. Hurricanes were as important as Spits (if not moreso) in the BoB because they were normally the ones killing bombers and occasionally fighting 109s whereas the Spitfires generally just fought the 109s (but to the credit of Spits, they kept them (or some) busy while the Hurricanes could get their work done).


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Feb 29, 2004)

> Hurricanes were as important as Spits (if not moreso) in the BoB



definately morso, they claimed more enemy aircraft that ALL other air and ground defences combined


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## Hot Space (Feb 29, 2004)

They sure did 8) 

Hot Space


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Mar 1, 2004)

do i detect a hint of spam there? 

BTW, i realise this, and allot of my other posts, are spam


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## Hot Space (Mar 1, 2004)

the lancaster kicks ass said:


> do i detect a hint of spam there?
> 
> BTW, i realise this, and allot of my other posts, are spam



If your talking about me, then yes, it's my Hobby   

Hot Space


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## Crazy (Mar 1, 2004)

hobby? it's your way of life!!

That, and pissing off hospital managment


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## Hot Space (Mar 1, 2004)

Again, that's a..................    

Hot Space


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## cheddar cheese (Mar 2, 2004)




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## Hot Space (Mar 2, 2004)

Hot Space


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Mar 3, 2004)

btw, C.C. had this whole day off just to spam here by the looks of it, i hope you're gratefull, i sure4 aint, i was gonna thrash him at top trumps, ww2 ones of course................


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## cheddar cheese (Mar 4, 2004)

ill hve you know i was out all day in plymouth, i wasnt here at all 8) andi so whooped your arse today, 3-1 to me 8)


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Mar 6, 2004)

ah! but it was at least 3-1 on friday (that's so my day) 8)


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## cheddar cheese (Mar 6, 2004)

yup but the corsair made you pissed off 8)


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## Archer (Mar 6, 2004)

Go Corsair! 8)


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Mar 7, 2004)

you don't know the half of it mate..........................


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## Viper (Mar 8, 2004)

the hawkers better than the spit??,i think not


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## Archer (Mar 8, 2004)

In the BoB they were more important, not necessarily better. Although from the little I've read the Hurricanes were the superior gun platform, and due to this superior to the Spitfire when attacking bombers, but the Spits were better against 109s.


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## cheddar cheese (Mar 9, 2004)

ill stay by the hurricane though if you dont mind 8)


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Mar 9, 2004)

me to, the spit was overrated (just don't tell Mrs. Banks)


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## Hot Space (Mar 9, 2004)

But the Hurricane stop being a Front Line Fighter 1941  

Hot Space


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## Viper (Mar 9, 2004)

the spit was a fighter and the hurricane was an intercptor,they had thier own roles


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## GermansRGeniuses (Mar 10, 2004)

no not really im just interested in WWII's general history in pretty much all aspects (excluding the french  )

Reichsmarschall Batista


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## cheddar cheese (Mar 11, 2004)

WWII has always been one of my fave subjects 8)


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Mar 28, 2004)

back on topic, it think the spitfire was overated on the BoB...................


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## Gemhorse (Mar 30, 2004)

Well , between them , they settled the BoB hash - The Hurricane's thicker wing chord wide-track U/C made it more hardy and took more weight of armament , the Spit was more manoevrable, faster, but the range factor held them back...that's where the Mustang came in . Also the thick wing of the Hurri had been used again with the Typhoon, again weight of ordenance and wide-track U/C . The Spit was delicate by comparison...


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## cheddar cheese (Mar 31, 2004)

i think the tempest was a good plane - the speed of a spit (nearly) 1,530 miles range and i presume it had the thick wing construction your on about 8) 2000lb payload too, not such a shabby plane 8)


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## plan_D (Apr 1, 2004)

32 Squadrons of Hurricane and 11 Squadrons of Spitfire in the BoB. The Spitfire was a better fighter, and it was just as good at interception of bombers as the Hurricane. The reason Spitfires were told to go after the fighters was because they were better than the Hurricanes in the job. 
In the BoB the Spitfire is over-rated but overall it was the best Britain had as a fighter. And it was brilliant, definately the best dog-figther of the war. The Hurricane was more important in the BoB and they shot down more, also, they still went on to be ground attack aircraft which they did well. 

The Spitfire was fluent, delicate graceful and deadly. The Hurricane was the 'working mans hero', strong, powerful and just mean. It was the meat on the bone..


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## cheddar cheese (Apr 1, 2004)

> The Spitfire was fluent, delicate graceful and deadly



like a ferrari



> The Hurricane was the 'working mans hero', strong, powerful and just mean. It was the meat on the bone..



like a mitsubishi lancer evo 8 8)

sory, just bringing my knowledge of car into things 8)


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Apr 3, 2004)

well please don't..................


> the Spit was more manoevrable, faster, but the range factor held them back...that's where the Mustang came in



i don't recall 'Stangs taking part in the BoB................


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## R Pope (Apr 3, 2004)

Cheddar- the Typhoon had the thick Hurri airfoil, the Tempest used a wing much like the Spitfire, so it worked at much higher altitude.


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## cheddar cheese (Apr 5, 2004)

> so it worked at much higher altitude



its max ceiling isnt much more thn the hurri or the tiffy though


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Apr 11, 2004)

yes but you find that the higher you get, the more sluggish it becomes..........


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## cheddar cheese (Apr 20, 2004)

hmmmm....


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Apr 20, 2004)

it will perform better at about 20,000ft for most fighters..................


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## Maestro (Apr 20, 2004)

plan_D said:


> 32 Squadrons of Hurricane and 11 Squadrons of Spitfire in the BoB. The Spitfire was a better fighter, and it was just as good at interception of bombers as the Hurricane. The reason Spitfires were told to go after the fighters was because they were better than the Hurricanes in the job.
> In the BoB the Spitfire is over-rated but overall it was the best Britain had as a fighter. And it was brilliant, definately the best dog-figther of the war. The Hurricane was more important in the BoB and they shot down more, also, they still went on to be ground attack aircraft which they did well.
> 
> The Spitfire was fluent, delicate graceful and deadly. The Hurricane was the 'working mans hero', strong, powerful and just mean. It was the meat on the bone..



Plan_D is right.

I would add that the Spit got better after the BoB. (When they created the Mk. V and the Mk. IX.) In a book I have at home, the writer interviewed a pilot that flew both Spitfire Mk. IX and P-51 Mustang. He said that the Mk. IX was as good as the Mustang. The only difference was that the P-51 had a greater range than the Mk. IX and the Mk. IX was more powerful. (Two 20 mm canons and four Browning 303 machine guns for the Spit compared to six Browning 303 machine guns for the Mustang.)


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## plan_D (Apr 21, 2004)

Of course, as the war went on they became better and better, the Spitfire of which ever mark could match up to anything the Luftwaffe threw at it, unfortunately for the Hurricane it could not.


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Apr 21, 2004)

you gotta admit it was better in the early years....................


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## plan_D (Apr 22, 2004)

The Hurricane was easier to produce. A Hurricane Mk. I against a Spitfire Mk. I the Spitfire would come out on top unless it had an inferior pilot. I'm not saying the Hurricane was a bad plane because it was a great plane but it wasn't as good as the Spitfire.


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Apr 22, 2004)

had more appeal though, i think i would rather fly a hurricane to a spit..........


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## Maestro (Apr 22, 2004)

plan_D said:


> The Hurricane was easier to produce. A Hurricane Mk. I against a Spitfire Mk. I the Spitfire would come out on top unless it had an inferior pilot. I'm not saying the Hurricane was a bad plane because it was a great plane but it wasn't as good as the Spitfire.



Once again, I have to agree with Plan_D.

If ever I had the choice between flying a Hurricane or a Spitfire, I would chose the Spitfire any day.


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## Gemhorse (Apr 22, 2004)

My feeling is the Hurricane could take punishment better, and tackled the bombers while the Spitfires sorted out the fighters, in the BoB.- They kept developing the Spitfire because of it's superb dogfighting ability, some models were better at low altitude, others at higher. Probably not until they installed the Griffon did they really have an all-rounder, my personal favourite being the Mk.XIV., 2050hp, 2x 20mm cannon, 4x.50 cal machine guns and a rate of climb of + 5000 fpm and 448mph. The early Mustang was faster than the then model of Spitfire [ Mk.V @ 350mph' and the first real multi-role Spitfire], to 375mph for the 'Stang, but having the Allison and not being supercharged, it was useless at height and was far better doing low level work - They never had .303's, but 4x.50 and 4x.30's. It wasn't until Nov. 1942 - June 1943 that they installed the Packard Merlin XX [same as Merlin 61] that the Mustang B achieved 450mph @ 29,000ft , after trying different combos on 4 Mustangs. After this, the Mustang was superior to Fw190's Me109's in dive turns. With the advent of extra fuel tanks, both the Spitfire Mustang benefited with greater range, the Mustang in particular. - With the Tempest, it's elliptical wing shape was much thinner than the Typhoon, as with the Mustang, the later models had a laminar flow wing which gave far less drag - The final Spitfire, the Spiteful, had laminar flow wings, but by then everything was going jet and it wasn't produced in number.


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## Maestro (Apr 22, 2004)

Gemhorse said:


> They never had .303's, but 4x.50 and 4x.30's.



May be you're right concerning the 303s, but I never heard about a Mustang with 8 machine guns.  

I heard about the Mustang having 6 Browning machine guns, or an other type with 4 machine guns. I even heard about a Mustang III (the British version of the P-51) with 20 mm cannons. (I think this one was a reconnaissance plane.)

May be I'm wrong, but I never heard about a Mustang with 8 machine guns. (I must say that I don't know American planes very much.)


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## GermansRGeniuses (Apr 23, 2004)

the British mustang Mk1 was an armed photo recce plane with 6 .303 brownings in the wings and two .50s under the engine in the nose (loading was done via clips)


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## plan_D (Apr 23, 2004)

The Hurricane was sent after the bombers because it was inferior to the Spitfire in taking on the 109s, although it would be stupid to try and deny Hurricanes could tangle with 109s since they did on several occasions and came out on top.


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Apr 23, 2004)

i still prefer the hurricane to the spit....................


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## Maestro (Apr 23, 2004)

GermansRGeniuses said:


> the British mustang Mk1 was an armed photo recce plane with 6 .303 brownings in the wings and two .50s under the engine in the nose (loading was done via clips)



Finaly, I think I was right concerning the Mustang armed with 303s. But I was wrong concerning the number of guns.

Thank you for pointing it out, mate.


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## GermansRGeniuses (Apr 23, 2004)

no problem Herr Maestro! well anyway, concerning spits (ive decided to make close to 100% of my posts meaningful today) were any of the (Beautiful) bubble canopied ones used in WWII or were they too late? (I think they were Mk.XVI on but im not sure since i know VERY little about the spit, any help would be great. Danke in advance)


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Apr 24, 2004)

the Mk.XIV and XVI both had buble canopies and were both used, the XIV was "armed" with the griffon engine.................


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## Gemhorse (Apr 24, 2004)

I'm very sure the Mustang 1's had 2x .5 under the nose, 1x .5 in each wing and 2x .3 in each wing.- .30 is an American calibre, .303 British - Browning handled them all. What made this low-level Mustang lethal was the .5 ammo; the M2 Ball Cartridge fired a 700 grain bullet @ 2810 fps, the armour-piercing M2, Tracer M10, Incendiary M1 and AP/Incendiary rounds, all at 800 rpm, per barrel. In Oct. 1943, they developed AP/Incendiary/Tracer rounds. The earlier Mustangs also did have a quad .5 set-up in the wings and also quad 20mm's, but the P51-D version had an improved Browning MG-53-2 set-up of 3x.5's in each wing, all 6 producing 80 rounds a second...


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Apr 24, 2004)

very impressive..................


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## plan_D (Apr 25, 2004)

When you're talking about the ground attack Mustang, you're talking about the A-36 Apache, right?


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Apr 25, 2004)

i'd never even heard of a ground attack 'stang............


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## plan_D (Apr 26, 2004)

Yes, there was the A-36 Apache, which was a Mustang (before being called Mustang) with the Allison engine, used as a ground attack aircraft.


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## plan_D (Apr 26, 2004)

This is the A-36, which was a ground attack aircraft before having a Merlin engine, it was not known as the Mustang. 

The (RAF) Mustang I, was armed as thus; 4 x .303 in wings, 2 x .50 cal in wings and 2 x .50 cal under nose.


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Apr 26, 2004)

I always thought it was just 6x.30s?, or is that the american ones?


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## Gemhorse (Apr 26, 2004)

The first A-36A flew in Sept 1942, [they wanted to call it 'Apache', but the Brit's 'Mustang' stuck- The Mustangs, were in fact developed FOR Britain..] The A-36A's incorporating mods to strengthen it, and had special hydraulic dive-brakes to slow in high-angle dives. It had 2x.5's in each wing, 500 were ordered and first saw action over Pantelleria in June '43 with the 27th BG. They had a high attrition-rate, being vulnerable in pull-out and were known to disentegrate due to wing over-stress. They were eventually replaced by P-47's in early '44. - ALL that I've studied of the Mustang, it never had .303's, but .30's, .50's and 20mm's.


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## plan_D (Apr 27, 2004)

It was called the Apache, the Allison engined dive bomber was called the Apache. It was only the Merlin engined ones that became the Mustang, which was a fighter, where the Apache was a ground attack plane. 

The P-51D had 6 x .50 cal in its wings. The Mustang I was armed as I mentioned before. The Mustang IA had 4 x 20mm in its wings.


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## plan_D (Apr 27, 2004)

I've put the A-36 in the Aircraft Database, although I forgot to put Apache.


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Apr 27, 2004)

i've never heard of a 'stang with cannon...........


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## plan_D (Apr 27, 2004)

Don't know much about Mustangs, do you?


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## cheddar cheese (Apr 27, 2004)

he doesnt know much about anything  (i can talk...)


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Apr 27, 2004)

1) that was verry verry cheap
2) no, i don't know allot about 'stangs...................


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## cheddar cheese (May 30, 2004)

hey, i did say i can talk


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## the lancaster kicks ass (May 30, 2004)

i never said you couldn't..............


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## cheddar cheese (May 30, 2004)

im aware of that, i was just looking for an excuse to spam


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## the lancaster kicks ass (May 30, 2004)

as i am doing at this present moment...............


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## plan_D (May 30, 2004)

At least you know something about the 'Stang now.


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## Gemhorse (May 30, 2004)

[' Yawn...']


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## cheddar cheese (May 31, 2004)




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## the lancaster kicks ass (May 31, 2004)

wow gemhourse, i never thought you had it in you..............


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## cheddar cheese (Jun 1, 2004)

and thats supposed to mean?


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## plan_D (Jun 1, 2004)

Never thought that Gemhorse would have it in him to SPAM!


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## cheddar cheese (Jun 1, 2004)




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## the lancaster kicks ass (Jun 1, 2004)

oh, was that spam Plan_D...............


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## cheddar cheese (Jun 11, 2004)




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## the lancaster kicks ass (Jun 11, 2004)

i take it back, that was sapm...............


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## cheddar cheese (Jun 13, 2004)

no, it was spam


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## the lancaster kicks ass (Jun 14, 2004)




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