# CAF A6M2-21 Zero for Sale



## A6M3 (Oct 11, 2005)

This is my first post and I think it is pretty good. 
The CAF A6M2 Model 21 Zero was just listed on Courtesy Aircraft.

http://www.courtesyaircraft.com/

It is currently at our Southern California Wing Camarillo facility, which I am a member of. That is where I met *evangilder*.

I have experience working on both the A6M2 and the A6M3 Zero. So if you have any questions about the Zero, feel free to ask me.

Eric


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## Nonskimmer (Oct 11, 2005)

Well this is just like a big ol' reunion then! Let's party! You bring the the fizzy pop, 'n I'll bring the chips! 



So the Zero's up for sale? If so, I certainly hope she goes to a good home.
BTW, is everyone at Camarillo named Eric?


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## A6M3 (Oct 11, 2005)

I think we are the only two Erics at the CAF. But I notice there are a lot of Bobs, which is kind of interesting.

What do you think of that fantastically restored A6M2 instrument panel?  

Eric


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## FLYBOYJ (Oct 11, 2005)

Very Cool, but why a LORAN? I figured you go for a smaller GPS?!?


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## A6M3 (Oct 11, 2005)

FLYBOYJ said:


> Very Cool, but why a LORAN? I figured you go for a smaller GPS?!?



Good joke!

If you want to see a real instrument panel, here it is below!





This is of our A6M3 Zero. This is the difference money can make.

Eric


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## Nonskimmer (Oct 11, 2005)

I thought something looked a little advanced about that instrument panel.


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## Wildcat (Oct 11, 2005)

Man, if only I was a millonaire!


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## A6M3 (Oct 11, 2005)

They say money can't buy you happiness, yet it can buy you warbirds!

Eric


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## evangilder (Oct 12, 2005)

Good to see you posting, Eric. Nice shot of the cockpit on the A6M3! I seem to recall you are the assistant crew chief on that, is that right?


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## A6M3 (Oct 12, 2005)

Well, I was assistant crew chief for a year or so, but now I am part of the C-46 crew. I worked on that plane when we were doing heavy maintenance. We had to rebuilt part of the landing gear system and Bill, the crew chief, really needed help doing that so that was when I started. But now the Zero is good as new. There is not much to do on that plane anymore so I moved on to the C-46.

Eric


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## evangilder (Oct 12, 2005)

Ah ok. I remember you guys working on the landing gear. Glad to hear she is tip top now! You are getting some great experience down there, Eric! I wish I had had that kind of opportunity when I was your age. 

The C-46 shoudl keep you pretty busy for a while!


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## FLYBOYJ (Oct 12, 2005)

A6M3 said:


> FLYBOYJ said:
> 
> 
> > Very Cool, but why a LORAN? I figured you go for a smaller GPS?!?
> ...



That's what the page showed for the sale of the aircraft?!?!? Which one are you guys selling?


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## evangilder (Oct 12, 2005)

Joe, there are 2 zeroes at Camarillo. The one that Eric posted above is the flyable zero (A6M3) that is not for sale. The other one (A6M2) that you show is the one that is for sale.


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## FLYBOYJ (Oct 12, 2005)

AH - OK, now it makes sense - But then again, a LORAN?


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## evangilder (Oct 12, 2005)

The Zero that is up for sale has been a Camarillo for a long time. When I first visited there in 1999, it was in many pieces. I don't know when it got there, but I think the reason it ended up staying is because of corrosion and it shouldn't have been flying when it did end up there.


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## FLYBOYJ (Oct 12, 2005)

evangilder said:


> The Zero that is up for sale has been a Camarillo for a long time. When I first visited there in 1999, it was in many pieces. I don't know when it got there, but I think the reason it ended up staying is because of corrosion and it shouldn't have been flying when it did end up there.



OK - Read the rest of the add - It seems that Loran must of been installed a long time ago.....


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Dec 9, 2005)

Damn that cockpit looks more advanced than ours do! Somebody tell the Army spend some money and get out of the 1950's!


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## pbfoot (Dec 9, 2005)

if the US Army in the 50's I"m surprised we've moved out the 30's and not using a half empty or half full bottle depending as a turn and bank indicator up here


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Dec 11, 2005)

Naw we are not that bad off, it is just funny that our packages are quite out of date.


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## Harvard (Dec 18, 2005)

Hi Eric:

Can you tell everybody a little about the condition of the A6M2 which was sold? I've heard it was really rough inside. 

Thanks,

Chris


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## evangilder (Dec 19, 2005)

The biggest problem with it was that when they did the recovery, the cut the wings off, including cutting right through the spar. When it was restored, they welded the spar back together. That's a no-no and it is fortunate that no one was hurt, or worse flying it. When the CAF acquired it and the inspection began, they found the welded spar. That instantly grounded the airplane. It sat like that for quite a while and some minor corrosion work was done on it while it was decided what to do with it.

Other than that, it wasn't _too_ bad. It did fly in to Camarillo before being grounded.


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Dec 19, 2005)

Id fly it....


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## Harvard (Dec 22, 2005)

Evan wrote:



> The biggest problem with it was that when they did the recovery, the cut the wings off, including cutting right through the spar. When it was restored, they welded the spar back together. That's a no-no and it is fortunate that no one was hurt, or worse flying it. When the CAF acquired it and the inspection began, they found the welded spar. That instantly grounded the airplane. It sat like that for quite a while and some minor corrosion work was done on it while it was decided what to do with it.
> 
> Other than that, it wasn't too bad. It did fly in to Camarillo before being grounded.



How original is it? Were there any odd home made things put in?Is the skin all new, or did it use original? Are the formers and ribs in fuselage new or remanufactured? In a photo I saw that some of the fuselage skin was removed. What for? Just curious.

The cockpit looks like it had some crude home made furnishings in it too.


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## FLYBOYJ (Dec 22, 2005)

Harvard said:


> The cockpit looks like it had some crude home made furnishings in it too.



What are you referring to? That cockpit is beautiful cosidering it was "modernized" and the gunsight omitted. The only thing a bit crude is the installation of an old 360 channel NAV/COM mounted sideways toward the bottom of the center lower panel...


DerAdlerIstGelandet said:


> Id fly it....


When repairs like this are done a "Designated Engineering Representative" (DER) who is an FAA appointed engineer that provides engineering services to civil operators comes up with a repair scheme. It seems that this repair was done without DER approval and it was very smart of the museum folks to stop flying this aircraft. I would guess if this repair was accomplished the DER would of limited its G loading to +3.5/ -1.5 which is the same for light GA aircraft.


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## A6M3 (Dec 22, 2005)

Harvard,

The A6M2 Zero is pretty much original. It has a ton of Japanese parts in it. Basically the fuselage, including the tail section, landing gear, and most of the wing is original 1940s Japanese parts. The engine, cowling, prop, and spinner are not original. The wings have had some repair work done due to the sawing of the wings. They also removed the folding wingtips. And I believe the fuselage skin was removed because they needed to replace some stringers due to corrosion. 

Many things in that cockpit are original. It just looks odd because of the paint and newer instruments. The seat, rudder pedals, panel the instruments are mounted on, and various other handles and knobs are original. And it used to have a gunsight in it, but we put that in the A6M3 Zero.

Take a look at this website. It has many accurate drawings of the A6M3 Zero which woould also apply to the A6M2.
http://rwebs.net/avhistory/history/Zeke32.htm

Eric


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## FLYBOYJ (Dec 22, 2005)

Hi Eric!

Nice to see you posting - Hey I recognize that airport on your siggy, my old stomping grounds, the windiest place on earth!


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## A6M3 (Dec 22, 2005)

Mojave Airport! I think it's a great airport!

May I ask, what did you do at Mojave Airport?

Eric


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## FLYBOYJ (Dec 22, 2005)

A6M3 said:


> Mojave Airport! I think it's a great airport!



I used to work and fly out of there - oh yea, it's a great airport, not the same Since Dan Sabovitch passed away....

Do you know Al Hansen out there?


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## A6M3 (Dec 22, 2005)

No, I don't know Al Hansen. What does he do?


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## A6M3 (Dec 22, 2005)

I came across some old photos of when the A6M2 Zero came to Camarillo. It don't know what year off the top of my head, but sometime between 1996 to 1998.






The Zero is still in one piece here, so this was probably taken soon after it was flown in.




Cowling and spinner removed.




After they re-skinned the tail.




This shot was taken after they started digging into the aircraft, probably before the problem with the spar was found.

Eric


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## FLYBOYJ (Dec 22, 2005)

A6M3 said:


> No, I don't know Al Hansen. What does he do?



He's the guy on the west end with all the war birds, he has several hueys, F-86s, he used to have a PBY as well.

I used to do a lot of side work for some of the guys there with warbirds and helicopters,

I also used to work at both Avtel and BAE right there on the airport..


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## A6M3 (Dec 22, 2005)

I've seen his planes, but did not know who owned them. I don't spend too much time at Mojave, mostly Camarillo.

Eric


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## FLYBOYJ (Dec 22, 2005)

A6M3 said:


> I've seen his planes, but did not know who owned them. I don't spend too much time at Mojave, mostly Camarillo.
> 
> Eric



If you ever get by and see him, he's a real nice guy...

Do you fly the T-28s at Camarillo?


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## A6M3 (Dec 22, 2005)

FLYBOYJ said:


> A6M3 said:
> 
> 
> > I've seen his planes, but did not know who owned them. I don't spend too much time at Mojave, mostly Camarillo.
> ...



I'm a student pilot right now. I fly a T-34 owned by a friend. Gotten stick time in the T-6. Someday I'd like to fly the T-28.

Eric


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## FLYBOYJ (Dec 22, 2005)

A6M3 said:


> FLYBOYJ said:
> 
> 
> > A6M3 said:
> ...



Hey that's great! I got about 60 hours in the T-34, I used to fly the Edwards Aero Club T-34...

A friend of mine is an FAA examiner on the T-28, he used to go out there a lot to check some of those guys out, he has an L-29 that I get to fly once and a while.


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## evangilder (Dec 22, 2005)

Hey Eric, have you been flying with Mark in the T-34? Good to see you have gotten some stick time in the T-6 too. Your grandfather must really be proud.


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## A6M3 (Dec 22, 2005)

Yes I have been flying with Marc. He is a great guy and his T-34 is great too.

Eric


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## evangilder (Dec 22, 2005)

Yeah, Marc takes great care of that T-34. She's a beauty. You are getting some instruction from some great pilots there.


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Dec 26, 2005)

FLYBOYJ said:


> When repairs like this are done a "Designated Engineering Representative" (DER) who is an FAA appointed engineer that provides engineering services to civil operators comes up with a repair scheme. It seems that this repair was done without DER approval and it was very smart of the museum folks to stop flying this aircraft. I would guess if this repair was accomplished the DER would of limited its G loading to +3.5/ -1.5 which is the same for light GA aircraft.



I was just joking around about that is why I put the ..... after it.


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## FLYBOYJ (Dec 26, 2005)

DerAdlerIstGelandet said:


> FLYBOYJ said:
> 
> 
> > When repairs like this are done a "Designated Engineering Representative" (DER) who is an FAA appointed engineer that provides engineering services to civil operators comes up with a repair scheme. It seems that this repair was done without DER approval and it was very smart of the museum folks to stop flying this aircraft. I would guess if this repair was accomplished the DER would of limited its G loading to +3.5/ -1.5 which is the same for light GA aircraft.
> ...



Come on Alder - you fly helicopters, what's a little welded spar repair?!?


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Dec 26, 2005)

You have a point.....


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