# Kit Mustang goes for a tumble at Reno



## Colin1 (Sep 21, 2010)

The pilot in this horror crash yesterday had a miraculous escape after emerging from his smashed plane unharmed.

US racer George Giboney had been flying in high winds in his kit-built Thunder Mustang plane - Rapid Travel - at the Reno Air Races in Nevada. Lucky George, of Des Moines, let the crowd know he was fine with a thumbs up before going for a hospital check-up.


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## evangilder (Sep 21, 2010)

I saw the aftermath, but those photos are amazing. Glad to hear he got out okay. The winds out there on Sunday were pretty bad, from what I heard.


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## mudpuppy (Sep 21, 2010)

I'm glad to hear he's okay and no one else was injured...Geez!!! 
Do you think that 2nd picture is showing the craft after it had cart-wheeled at least once? Looking at the damage on the wingtip and wondering how the engine and tail section are seperating...it looks like that to me.
Derek


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## Colin1 (Sep 21, 2010)

Almost certainly
judging by the complete change of both foreground and background


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## Capt. Vick (Sep 21, 2010)

mudpuppy said:


> Do you think that 2nd picture is showing the craft after it had cart-wheeled at least once? Looking at the damage on the wingtip and wondering how the engine and tail section are seperating...it looks like that to me.
> Derek



Yes definately. The opposite wing tip is damaged, the spinner is smashed and throwing dirt and the background is different. How does someone survive that?


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## tail end charlie (Sep 21, 2010)

Capt. Vick said:


> Yes definately. How does someone survive that?



Very dizzy and relieved I guess


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Sep 21, 2010)

Wow! Glad to hear he made it out alright.


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## mikewint (Sep 21, 2010)

eagle, as with everyone i am certainly glad that the pilot is OK but I have two questions.
1. I would call this pilot error. if he had been higher the wing tip would have missed the ground. or did the high winds cause a problem that could not have been foreseen?
2. In general a "kit" plane. how safe? the kit maker cannot control construction of his kit. could this be due to poor material or construction?


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## Colin1 (Sep 21, 2010)

mikewint said:


> eagle, as with everyone i am certainly glad that the pilot is OK but I have two questions.
> 1. I would call this pilot error. if he had been higher the wing tip would have missed the ground. or did the high winds cause a problem that could not have been foreseen?
> 2. In general a "kit" plane. how safe? the kit maker cannot control construction of his kit. could this be due to poor material or construction?



In the first pic
looks like he was just coming in or just going out; critical times for a pilot and aircraft. 

Kit plane yes, but it could just be the light construction of such an aircraft that caused the tip-over when the wind caught him


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## evangilder (Sep 21, 2010)

Winds were gusting at 30 knots at the time of the accident. He was making a dead-stick landing at the time, which really gives no margin for error. As for the safety of the Thunder Mustang, there are many of them out there that fly safely and a few were involved with the races over the week.



> Officials say mechanical difficulties and high winds were to blame for plane crash Sunday at the National Championship Air Races at the Reno Stead Airport.
> 
> The Thunder Mustang piloted by George Giboney went down during the final lap of the Super Sport Gold championship race, according to a publicist for the event.
> 
> Giboney says he heard his plane -"Rapid Travel"- misfire a couple of times, and then the engine cut out and stopped completely. He called a "mayday," and when he attempted to land he hit the runway and bounced. That's when a wind gust took the plane off course and into the dirt, the plane then hit a bump and shot up into the air. The plane began to cartwheel and the plane came almost completely apart as it tumbled.



Pilot walks away from dramatic crash at Reno-Stead Airport - My News 4 - KRNV, Reno, NV


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## tail end charlie (Sep 21, 2010)

evangilder said:


> Winds were gusting at 30 knots at the time of the accident. He was making a dead-stick landing at the time, which really gives no margin for error. As for the safety of the Thunder Mustang, there are many of them out there that fly safely and a few were involved with the races over the week.
> 
> 
> 
> Pilot walks away from dramatic crash at Reno-Stead Airport - My News 4 - KRNV, Reno, NV




Looking at that it hardly seems the same accident, the second still photo shows the engine approximately where it should be but it had already been ripped off and bounced back approximately where it should be (for a fraction of a second). I'm not a pilot, would he be better with the wheels up, if he had time?


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## Capt. Vick (Sep 21, 2010)

Wow the video explains better to me how he was NOT killed. It looks as though he was on the ground already and either bounce (hard landing) or hit something that threw him into the air and maybe wind played a part like they say... But boy those first couple of picture in my mind made it look like he was going hell-bent and dragged a tip.


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## evangilder (Sep 21, 2010)

tail end charlie said:


> Looking at that it hardly seems the same accident, the second still photo shows the engine approximately where it should be but it had already been ripped off and bounced back approximately where it should be (for a fraction of a second). I'm not a pilot, would he be better with the wheels up, if he had time?



He was attempting to land the airplane properly and winds took hold. When you have a dead motor and everything happening quickly, you only have so much time to get it right. Looking at where he was heading when it bounced, it was probably better that he hit the wingtip and cartwheeled. He was close to parked jets and just beyond that, the crowd line.


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## Gnomey (Sep 21, 2010)

Pretty remarkable he got out unharmed. Pretty terrible crash.


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## tail end charlie (Sep 21, 2010)

evangilder said:


> He was attempting to land the airplane properly and winds took hold. When you have a dead motor and everything happening quickly, you only have so much time to get it right. Looking at where he was heading when it bounced, it was probably better that he hit the wingtip and cartwheeled. He was close to parked jets and just beyond that, the crowd line.




evan....I wasnt criticising the guy, with a dead engine he did well to get it down, I just thought it wouldnt have bounced up with the wheels retracted. I presume you need engine power to bring the wheels up anyway?


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## vikingBerserker (Sep 21, 2010)

Dam, I would have cried if I wrecked that. Glad he's ok!


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## FLYBOYJ (Sep 21, 2010)

I was about 200 feet away from the crash. I didn't see it as I was under my plane. I heard everyone yell and scream and saw a big cloud of dust when I got up to see what was happening. The pilot actually made it to the banquet and received his participation trophy!

Taken from my cell phone.


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## Aaron Brooks Wolters (Sep 21, 2010)

Very glad Mr. Giboney is ok.


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## mikewint (Sep 22, 2010)

non-pilot asking questions - i've watched the video several times and it looks to me like he came in perpendicular to the runway and hit the edge berm which bounced him into the air. i can also see that the prop is not turning so i understand no power, i.e. "dead stick" was he lined up properly with the runway or did he just bring it down with few options as to where


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## Colin1 (Sep 22, 2010)

mikewint said:


> non-pilot asking questions - i've watched the video several times and it looks to me like he came in perpendicular to the runway and hit the edge berm which bounced him into the air. i can also see that the prop is not turning so i understand no power, i.e. "dead stick" was he lined up properly with the runway or did he just bring it down with few options as to where


I'm not a pilot either Mike
but if he was dead-stick and conditions were very gusty, he may well have been as lined up as it was possible for him to be


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## FLYBOYJ (Sep 22, 2010)

mikewint said:


> non-pilot asking questions - i've watched the video several times and it looks to me like he came in perpendicular to the runway and hit the edge berm which bounced him into the air. i can also see that the prop is not turning so i understand no power, i.e. "dead stick" was he lined up properly with the runway or did he just bring it down with few options as to where


He was dead sitck and landed into a 15knot cross wind from what I was told. He was trying to do a wheels landing and seemed to get airborne again and came down hard then cartwheeled.


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## mikewint (Sep 22, 2010)

FBJ, that's a pretty decent wind and cross-ways to boot, is that enough to turn the plane 90 degrees into the edge berm? especially with no power to compensate?


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## FLYBOYJ (Sep 22, 2010)

mikewint said:


> FBJ, that's a pretty decent wind and cross-ways to boot, is that enough to turn the plane 90 degrees into the edge berm? especially with no power to compensate?


Yes - as the gusts were over 30 and there seemed to be some wind shear where he touched down at.


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## mikewint (Sep 22, 2010)

FBJ, thank you


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## Geedee (Sep 23, 2010)

Really glad he's Ok. Found this link to video of the 'prang....
LiveLeak.com - Plane Crashes at Reno Air Races; Pilot Survives


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## N4521U (Sep 24, 2010)

I got these today from the Eberhardt crew, Merlin's Magic P-51D and Archimedes T-6. They are copyrighted.


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## Southron (Mar 15, 2012)

Kit plane or NO kit plane-as a pilot I don't know of ANY AIRPLANE EVER MADE that would survive having a wing tip DUG into the ground like that Thunder Mustang. Airplanes are wonderful, magical inventions but they were never designed to plow up ground and survive!!!!


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## evangilder (Mar 16, 2012)

Better to start destructing than to stay in one piece. If it hadn't had the airframe breaking apart on impact, the G-forces of the impact and tumble most likely would have killed the pilot. That being said, looking at the pictures of it coming apart still makes it amazing that anyone survived that.


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## Shinpachi (Mar 16, 2012)

That's too much to say Thanks for sharing!


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## drgondog (Mar 18, 2012)

evangilder said:


> Better to start destructing than to stay in one piece. If it hadn't had the airframe breaking apart on impact, the G-forces of the impact and tumble most likely would have killed the pilot. That being said, looking at the pictures of it coming apart still makes it amazing that anyone survived that.



This comment is dead on in all respects. The airframe was absorbing and shedding energy as it started breaking up. IMO he was too slow for enough aileron/rudder control to compensate for the crosswind lift on the upwind wing - and he had zero altitude for any recovery... lucky gentleman


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## FLYBOYJ (Mar 18, 2012)

Exactly Bill! When he landed he had at least a 20 knot (If not more) crosswind. When the wreck came to a stop it was basically a firewall and cockpit bulkhead. As stated, he made it to the banquet that night!


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## Southron (Mar 19, 2012)

I am really THANKFUL that the pilot was uninjured and no spectators were hurt. There have been far too many tragedies recently in air racing.


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## FLYBOYJ (Mar 19, 2012)

Southron said:


> I am really THANKFUL that the pilot was uninjured and no spectators were hurt.



FYI - the crash of this aircraft happened quite a distance from spectators, I'd say at least 1/4 mile away




Southron said:


> There have been far too many tragedies recently in air racing.


We know the tragedy of this year all too well but aside from that it's been relatively safe for spectators although 2007 wasn't a good year.


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