# The Red Baron



## Oskar the Pilot (Dec 27, 2011)

Greetings everyone, it's me again! *_groans_*

World War I aviation really doesn't get enough credit, and I created this post purely for us to discuss our thoughts on the best fighter pilot of the Great war, the German _Red Baron_!







-_Oskar_


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## Njaco (Dec 27, 2011)

Welcome to the forum!

http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/world-war-i/red-baron-25432.html

http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/aircraft-pictures/red-baron-his-aircraft-30056.html

http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/world-war-i/who-do-you-think-shot-down-red-baron-3887.html

http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/world-war-i/91-years-ago-today-17984.html


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## Gixxerman (Dec 27, 2011)

Seeing as he has been mentioned here I'd just recommend the film 'The Red Baron' of 2008, I thoroughly enjoyed it (along with Flyboys of the same year about the Lafayette Escadrille).

I don't know if this has been brought up before but here's a topic to gross-out to.......early engines running on Castor oils (and so burning them surrounding the pilots in the fumes), not only did those poor sods have to suffer the terrifying possibilities of fighting (with no parachutes) each other in relatively flimsy planes but the planes themselves by virtue of the engines could cause serious, er, 'trouser accidents' thanks to the castor oils used.
Lovely huh?


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## Oskar the Pilot (Dec 28, 2011)

Njaco said:


> Welcome to the forum!
> 
> http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/world-war-i/red-baron-25432.html
> 
> ...




Woah, I'm happy you guys appreciate all the awesomeness the Red Baron let off during those 4 tough years!


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## Maximowitz (Dec 28, 2011)

Gixxerman said:


> Seeing as he has been mentioned here I'd just recommend the film 'The Red Baron' of 2008, I thoroughly enjoyed it



File under "Fiction."


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## Gixxerman (Dec 28, 2011)

Maximowitz said:


> File under "Fiction."



Well to be fair it's not really the historical accuracy I was interested in as much as some beautiful air-to-air film of those old birds in their natural element (even if a lot of it is scale replicas, models, CGI or other planes dressed up to fake the part).


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## mikewint (Dec 28, 2011)

Congrats, Gixx, seldom is the constant explosive diarrhea and abdominal cramps mentioned. one of the reasons so much drinking went on. the castor bean is very difficult to harvest causing severe health problems and producing the oil releases a very toxic compound. Mussolini force-fed dissenters large quantities of castor oil as a means of control.


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## tyrodtom (Dec 28, 2011)

Ricin is made from the castor bean, just eating castor beans can kill you. Though the posion is partly broke down by stomach acids.


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## Oskar the Pilot (Dec 28, 2011)

Gixxerman said:


> Seeing as he has been mentioned here I'd just recommend the film 'The Red Baron' of 2008, I thoroughly enjoyed it (along with Flyboys of the same year about the Lafayette Escadrille).
> 
> I don't know if this has been brought up before but here's a topic to gross-out to.......early engines running on Castor oils (and so burning them surrounding the pilots in the fumes), not only did those poor sods have to suffer the terrifying possibilities of fighting (with no parachutes) each other in relatively flimsy planes but the planes themselves by virtue of the engines could cause serious, er, 'trouser accidents' thanks to the castor oils used.
> Lovely huh?




Ooh, I watched the Red Baron, beautiful film. Although, I expected more dogfights and less romance...


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## Readie (Dec 28, 2011)

This is much more amusing...


_View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMx0RH_YXgU_

John


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## Gixxerman (Dec 28, 2011)

mikewint said:


> seldom is the *constant explosive diarrhea* and abdominal cramps mentioned.



Oh man, it just keeps on getting better and better, huh?
Those poor buggers.


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## vikingBerserker (Dec 28, 2011)

Readie said:


> This is much more amusing...
> 
> 
> _View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMx0RH_YXgU_
> ...




LMAO


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## nuuumannn (Jan 1, 2012)

I read somewhere that Roy Brown, the Camel pilot initially credited with shooting Richtofen down had piles!

On the subject of hero worship, the Aviation Heritage Centre at Omaka (Peter Jackson's museum) has a diorama of Richtofen's triplane being looted by the Aussie troops. This was torn from the wreck.
















The RAAF Museum at Point Cook also has fragments of the triplane.


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## Njaco (Jan 1, 2012)

Thats a bit macabre.


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## nuuumannn (Jan 1, 2012)

Especially the blood trickling out of his mouth. The guy stealing his boots comes from an anecdote I'm not sure of the origin of. They survive at the Australian War Memorial in Canberra together as a pair after being separated for some time.


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## vikingBerserker (Jan 1, 2012)

Yikes


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## pbfoot (Jan 1, 2012)

The seat from his aircraft is in Toronto at some obscure museum


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## evangilder (Jan 1, 2012)

Sad testimony to human barbarism. War is hell, and trophies of war, and the quest to get the trophies often turn men into animals. I remember seeing young soldiers carrying cameras to photograph their kills as if it were a sport. I remember asking them what they were going to tell their children someday, when they find those photos.


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## Readie (Jan 4, 2012)

evangilder said:


> Sad testimony to human barbarism. War is hell, and trophies of war, and the quest to get the trophies often turn men into animals. I remember seeing young soldiers carrying cameras to photograph their kills as if it were a sport. I remember asking them what they were going to tell their children someday, when they find those photos.



Pretty much on the money there EG.
John


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## nuuumannn (Jan 5, 2012)

Yes, well put Eric, must have been a surreal experience over there. I had a friend who served aboard HMS Glamorgan during the Falklands, it was one of the ships hit by an Exocet. He said after the war he remembers seeing all these photos of despicable things the Brits did with dead Argie corpses.

Regarding Richtofen; I believe the whole hero worship thing gets a little out of hand, a bit like the WW2 Luftwaffe lovers (dare I say it). The Aviation Heritage Centre is a terrific place, but its vision of the war is that one that has been perpetuated by the popular media; one of gallant, fearless Knights of the air and doesn't take into account the very real horrors of the war. Sure, the Richtofen diorama is graphic, but perhaps that is what's needed. Places like this need to enforce that the war in the air was as brutal and uncompromising as seeing a dead body being stripped of its dignity.


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## evangilder (Jan 5, 2012)

I hear what you're saying, but still think it doesn't need to be too graphic. A true realistic portrayal of war would shock most people and I certainly wouldn't want my children to see war in every gory detail. There can be a balance, but young children can get traumatized easily by graphic images. I would just assume that my kids never see the horrors of war, whether through the media, museums and especially the real thing. 

The air war in WWI was particularly brutal as air wars go. While there was chivalry displayed by both sides, there was also brutality by both sides. Having seen some of those crates they took aloft in museums, it is a wonder anyone survived! Having no parachutes was even more crazy. I could not imagine having an airplane on fire, falling from altitude while you burned. It's funny how it got so romanticized. But maybe one who survived so many aerial engagements in that environment deserves a little admiration.


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## nuuumannn (Jan 5, 2012)

> There can be a balance, but young children can get traumatized easily by graphic images. I would just assume that my kids never see the horrors of war, whether through the media, museums and especially the real thing.



Yes, Eric, you are right, but I think we need to pull back from the 'hero worship' angle in these places, however. I went to an exhibition on Hiroshima in the Imperial War Museum once; very effective and spooky without being too graphic. As for your comments about going to war in these machines - yes, very brave men, or boys. I recently read Saggitarius Rising by Cecil Lewis for the first time; a classic of the genre apparently; very enjoyable, I'd highly recommend it.


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## tyrodtom (Jan 5, 2012)

Maybe if more people saw war, with all it's warts, there'd be less war.


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## nuuumannn (Jan 5, 2012)

> Maybe if more people saw war, with all it's warts, there'd be less war.



It would be nice to think that might be so, but history has proven that that is just not the case, sadly.


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## stona (Jan 6, 2012)

nuuumannn said:


> Especially the blood trickling out of his mouth.



A .303 rifle bullet through the chest may well cause that.

I visited the AWM in Canberra last year and missed his boots! It's a bit too far to nip back for another look 

Cheers
Steve


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Jan 6, 2012)

evangilder said:


> I hear what you're saying, but still think it doesn't need to be too graphic. A true realistic portrayal of war would shock most people and I certainly wouldn't want my children to see war in every gory detail. There can be a balance, but young children can get traumatized easily by graphic images. I would just assume that my kids never see the horrors of war, whether through the media, museums and especially the real thing.



Having seen it first hand, I don't believe that the average person on this planet can handle the real details of war. It is nothing like Hollywood.



tyrodtom said:


> Maybe if more people saw war, with all it's warts, there'd be less war.



Agreed...

But I seriously doubt it.


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## nuuumannn (Jan 6, 2012)

> I visited the AWM in Canberra last year and missed his boots!



I _think_ they are at Omaka on loan, although it's been awhile since I was there.


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