# Heinkel He 177



## Hesekiel (Jun 11, 2009)

I have received two pics of He-177 from a friend.
A relative of him was Crewmember in this bird. Unfortunately i have no Unit Informations, but he told he have some Field post letters. So i maybe can discover the unit if i see the field post number on the envelopes. And maybe he will find more pictures


----------



## Wayne Little (Jun 11, 2009)

Nice!...hopefully there will be more?


----------



## Hesekiel (Jun 11, 2009)

We will see... I think no, but i love surprises


----------



## Flyboy2 (Jun 11, 2009)

Very good pictures.. Thanks for sharing


----------



## Lucky13 (Jun 11, 2009)

Agree! Great pics mate, thanks for sharing!


----------



## Matt308 (Jun 11, 2009)

One of the most beautiful bombers of WWII. Thanks for the post.


----------



## Hesekiel (Jun 11, 2009)

Thanks for all your comments!
I´m sharing with pleasure.. The best picture is nothing worth if it is covered in a drawer .... That´s my opinion


----------



## Airframes (Jun 11, 2009)

Great pictures Mr.H, and very rare of course. Thanks for sharing.


----------



## vikingBerserker (Jun 11, 2009)

They really were beautiful bombers. It's the first time I have ever seen more then one flying in a pic before.


----------



## Njaco (Jun 11, 2009)

Great pics! If it is possible to lighten that first one so we can see the code we can find out which unit. Nice shots!


----------



## vikingBerserker (Jun 11, 2009)

I tried, all I ccould make out was a "J", assuming the pic is flipped.


----------



## Soren (Jun 12, 2009)

Excellent pics, many thanks for sharing Hesekiel!


----------



## snafud1 (Jun 12, 2009)

That's a beautiful pic! Thanks for sharing.


----------



## Hesekiel (Jun 12, 2009)

I also tried out here everything to find a code on the plane.. no chance...
There is a writing on the backside, but this is heavy "overpainted".. I tried to make carefully the writing visible, but all you can read (with really good will) is "gelbe" So maybe the stand something like "gelbe J". I don´t want to destroy the picture by doing more on it....
What me confuse is that no Werknr is painted on the tai on the second picture... Maybe in two weeks i will receive the field post letters i wrote about. With luck i can then "discover" the unit...


----------



## Maximowitz (Jun 12, 2009)

Beautiful pictures, thank you for sharing.


----------



## Juha (Jun 12, 2009)

Thanks a lot Hesekiel!
Very nice photos, the second one also reveals nice details on the tail.

Juha


----------



## comiso90 (Jun 12, 2009)

wow... stunning photos!

they would make a great book cover


----------



## Maximowitz (Jun 12, 2009)

Possibly KG40? Just a guess.


----------



## Hesekiel (Jun 12, 2009)

@ comiso 90..  ... Of course... But i would like to asked by the author *gg*

@ Maximowitz.. : This is also my thought.. I compared this photos with all pics i found in books and the internet.. And the only ones with the light spinners and the same camouflage fits with KG 40


----------



## Yerger (Jun 12, 2009)

what is the Feldpost number ? I have a copy of all of them with unit


----------



## Hesekiel (Jun 12, 2009)

As i wrote before... I will receive the envelopes with the fieldpost number in two weeks... And i hope this letters are from the Heinkel crewmember. Another relative from my friend was in the Army... I will know that if i have them


----------



## imalko (Jun 12, 2009)

Yerger said:


> what is the Feldpost number ? I have a copy of all of them with unit



Hello Yerger,

Then maybe you could help me? Check out this thread: http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/ww2-general/help-advice-needed-17900.html

If you have any information regarding the question asked there that would be most helpful and very much appreciated.

Cheers!

By the way... Hesekiel, that are some very nice pictures indeed. Thanks for sharing.


----------



## vikingBerserker (Jun 12, 2009)

Near the engine nacelles, it looks like some kind of rack, for Fritz X or Henschel?


----------



## Aaron Brooks Wolters (Jun 12, 2009)

Excellent find Hesekiel Thank you for sharing!


----------



## Hesekiel (Jun 14, 2009)

Today i "played" a little with the first picture together with a friend... There is a code in front of the balkenkreuz and it looks like "E8" or "F8" in great black letters... 
My friend told me his relative died in Russia in his plane... But i didn´t know the year....
It seems to be usual in this time to "censore" the Unit code.. I have a few photos of my uncles Ju88 in the air, where the Code "B3" also is removed, but with a graphic program can make visible.....

So the He 177 looks either from KG 40 or FKG 50.... Still have to wait for the fieldpost letters


----------



## HerrKaleut (Jun 14, 2009)

Hesekiel, can't help with your pics but can give 177 units . They were;
Fernkampfgeschwader 50
KGs 1, 4, 10, 40, 100(wiking), 200.

Flugzeugfuhrerschule..(B)15, (B)16, (B)31.


hope that is of assistance...good luck




Just seen the other posts, I didn' realise your reserch was that advanced!!


----------



## Hesekiel (Jun 14, 2009)

Thanks a lot HerrKaleut!
The units who used the 177 are known.. But only a dark and maybe censored Picture is a small source to "discover" someting 
My friend is looking to find eventually more pictures or informations.. I will post news at once


----------



## Erich (Jun 14, 2009)

look at the crewmans clothing this will give you some clues as to possible year and you might be able to deduct just what unit and also note the plain overall grey camo of the a/c


----------



## Hesekiel (Jun 14, 2009)

Yes Erich.. As i mentioned before... The Camouflage and the painting of the Spinners points to KG 40.. Clothing 1943/44
The thing that confuse me is my friend tell his relative died in russia... I think he is maybe wrong. Another relative of him was in the army and died there. This documents i have see... Maybe he is muddling something......


----------



## Erich (Jun 14, 2009)

might be a good idea to find someone who has Classic Publications He 177 Grief which should have a ton of information as well as photos of the time period/camouflage.


----------



## Hesekiel (Jun 20, 2009)

Today i was with my friend in his mothers house and we searched for some news.
Unfortunately we have found no more Pictures of the 177 yet. Only one of a belly landed Do 217 and a badly crashed He 111.
But nevertheless we found very useful informations 
I have "discovered" a case with LOTS of Felpost Letters... 
I have to sort them, because this letters are from 4 men (brothers)..
A Panzergrenadier (died 1944 in Italy), a Tank crew member (missed in Stalingrad) and two of the airforce.

During the first view i found two letters who discovered a lot of the "177 crewmwmber". A Letter to his father from his squadron leader about his shooting down on Feb. 2 1943 southwest of Orel and a letter from 1948 from a surviving crewmember after his return from Russion POW...
I will scan this letters tomorrow and show them here...

The Unit was Kampfgeschwader 4, "General Wever"
The Name of The Crewmember: Hans Wilhelm Schneidewind
Function: Kampfbeobachter (Observer)
40 Feindflüge
Number of his ID Tag: 214651/100

Crew:
Pilot: Uffz Karl Heinz Fedrowitz ID Nr.: 214651/42
Radio Operator: Obergefreiter Leonhardt Koppold (survived ! ) 55538/112
Gunner1 : Uffz Rudolf Dröttboom 214651/28
Gunner2 : Gefreiter Willi Holzhauser 214651/59
Observer : Uffz Hans Wilhelm Schneidewind 214651/100

Tomorrow MAYBE i will receive a Luftwaffe Soldbuch which one is from H.W. Schneidewind. This will give all answers.....
Sorry for this long post, but i think the informations are useful


----------



## vikingBerserker (Jun 20, 2009)

That's some excellent information, nice find!


----------



## Hesekiel (Jun 21, 2009)

So.. Here are the Scans of the Letters..

1. The letter from the Squadron leader












2. The letter from the radio operator Leo Koppold dated 1948 after returning home











And here are the two photos

This badly damaged plane was former a Heinkel He 111 !
Regarding the fuselage-stripe it seems to be a KG 54 plane






And here a belly landed Do 217






And here a little look of what i have to read and to do


----------



## Maximowitz (Jun 21, 2009)

Excellent research my friend, absolutely fascinating.


----------



## Kingscoy (Jun 21, 2009)

Hi,
Interesting post. I'm including two other pics of a different He-177 with two RAF members. Probably taken shortly after the war or maybe on their way towards Germany....don't know much about these pics, got them from a friend.
So any help in identifying this a/c is welcome.

These pics doesn't have much to do with the other postings but I'm hoping they will be appreciated.

Regards from Holland,
Sander


----------



## Hesekiel (Jun 21, 2009)

Great pics! Thank you for posting!
Of course your pics have "to do" with the thread 
As i received yesterday the whole estate i thought everything will be easy and i find all the answers i´m looking for.. But...
With this whole stuff there are more and more questions are coming up.
I asked in another forum for informations about the crash time and date, but the only loss of KG 4 on this day was a He 111 H6.. But the man i have the documents from was definitive a crewmember of a He 177... This all is confusing me...


----------



## Maximowitz (Jun 21, 2009)

I noticed your post on the other forum Tom. I'm sure they'll be able to help, they must be as intrigued with the mystery as we are!


----------



## Hesekiel (Jun 21, 2009)

Thanks Paul!
I hope we all together will solve this thing...
Thought i get the Soldbuch today.. But my friend called that it will hopefully come tomorrow in my hands. And i hope there are some other documents with it.
Like the letter from the squadron leader and the radio operator. Never hold those things in my hands before....


----------



## Maximowitz (Jun 21, 2009)

I love this sort of thing Tom, it's like the past reaching out to the present. History in your hands.


----------



## Hesekiel (Jun 21, 2009)

Yes. You are right Paul!

I will tell the community here a real tragedy...

By researching the estate i was really shocked...

This belongs not really to the thread, but i think it is worth to post it...

Family Schneidewind:

There were 4 brothers who served....

1. Feldwebel Ottomar Schneidewind (Tank)........*missing in action in Stalingrad*
2. Feldwebel Gerhard Schneidewind (Flak).........*died in Italy*
3. Unteroffizier Hans Schneidewind (AirForce).....*died at Orel*
4. Obergefreiter Ernst Schneidewind(Infantery)..*died in Stalingrad*

What a tragedy for this family ! Can you see some parallels to "saving private Ryan???

I have to put the fieldpost away for a moment......


----------



## Maximowitz (Jun 21, 2009)

An entire generation of a family wiped out. There is much to be learned from that about mankind. We must learn history so we do not repeat it.


----------



## Hesekiel (Jun 21, 2009)

I think it is a good idea to give the names a face......


----------



## snafud1 (Jun 21, 2009)

This is one of the most INTERESTING thread on the forums right now. (IMO) The research you are doing is absolutely incredible. It is sad to hear of the family being wiped out during the course of the war. I admire them as soldiers and fighting for their country. Any soldier from any country (with any kind of ethics) should be loked upon as heroes.


----------



## Hesekiel (Jun 21, 2009)

I thank you VERY MUCH for your kind words!
I have started this research only of interrest. As i received the documents and realized what happened there i was shocked.
The reading of the letters really bothers me... So i think it is simply my explicit duty to find those things together and tell that to the world. And you are right in what you say about soldiers. Everyone who will find those tragedys should make the same.. Tell it.... Those things NEVER EVER should happened again.....


----------



## Maximowitz (Jun 21, 2009)

This is what interests me the most about researching WWII aviation... the human stories behind the conflict. Who were these people? What were their lives like? What became of them? Through photographs and letters, documents and the spoken word of those who knew them, they can, in a way, live again and tell us of their fate.

Thanks you Tom. I can only echo Snafud1's words and say THE most interesting thread on the forum.


----------



## Hesekiel (Jun 21, 2009)

Thanks again to you, Paul!
If i will receive the other documents ( I hope really they are from Hans Sch.) i can continue this research and maybe will find the answers..
After that i will study the fieldpost letters of the other brothers much closer. And maybe...maybe i will open a new thread where i will took parts of the letters in. But i´m not sure about that yet.....


----------



## Airframes (Jun 21, 2009)

Fascinating, and yet sad and humbling research. It is a great pity that there are not many, many more people like us here on this forum, who can understand and appreciate the losses to families, on all sides, of a whole generation. Those who don't care, don't know, or, worse, disbelieve, should be made aware of all of this and, as you say, made to ensure that it never happens again.
Thank you for your time and courage in posting this information.


----------



## A4K (Jun 23, 2009)

Great thread mate - I agree with Snafud completely.
What a tragedy for the family...


----------



## Hesekiel (Jun 24, 2009)

Again thanks for your words!

The Soldbuch i received was the wrong one. So the research will take longer. I will post asap if i have some news...


----------



## Maximowitz (Jun 24, 2009)

Keep with it Tom, there are always setbacks. Great work so far my friend!


----------



## Junkers88A1 (Jun 25, 2009)

GREAT THREAD PAL  very interesting


----------



## vikingBerserker (Jun 26, 2009)

This is some awesome information!


----------



## c1951 (Jun 28, 2009)

That was a fabulous posting. The HE 177 also operated out of Bordeaux Merignac on anti shipping patrols and carried an anti shipping missile which was deadly. The Heinkel's engine combination was also deadly as was its designed ability to dive bomb! The engines had a tendency to catch fire since they were two engines mounted siames style and overheated easily, an example was built in Eastern Europe as Germany's atomic bomber.
The French company Farman built a four engined example which was used for test work and was scrapped in France in the early fifties - a brilliant posting


----------



## Njaco (Jun 29, 2009)

Some pics....

Category:Images from the German Federal Archive, year 1944 - Wikimedia Commons


----------



## vikingBerserker (Jun 29, 2009)

Excellent pics Njaco!

I never get tired looking at He 177 pics.


----------



## wheelsup_cavu (Jun 30, 2009)

Nice pics Njaco.
I like that they have the men in the pictures too, it helps give a perspective on the size of the aircraft.


Wheels


----------



## Njaco (Jun 30, 2009)

and those freakin' tires!


----------



## snafud1 (Jun 30, 2009)

Awesome pics.


----------



## A4K (Jul 1, 2009)

Bloody hell Chris, GREAT PHOTOS !!!


----------



## Wayne Little (Jul 1, 2009)

Great pics Chris!....not the prettiest aircraft though!


----------

