# Lynyrd Skynyrd crash



## The Basket (Sep 9, 2020)

Reading about this. Not sure.

My only conclusions is that the pilots were not of high quality.

And not up to the task. Surely aircraft simply don't run out of fuel. 

If anyone can enlighten me then please illuminate away.


----------



## Capt. Vick (Sep 9, 2020)

My understanding is that these were new pilots on this particular aircraft and were not aware of the particular fuel tank guage quirks associated with it.


----------



## FLYBOYJ (Sep 9, 2020)

From what I understand they mistakenly dumped fuel instead of transferring and miscalculated the aircraft's fuel consumption.


----------



## FLYBOYJ (Sep 9, 2020)

From the NTSB:

*Conclusions:*

Both engines of N55VM ceased to produce power because the aircraft's useable fuel supply was exhausted.
The crew failed to monitor adequately the fuel flow, en route fuel consumption and fuel quantity gages.
The crew failed the take appropriate preflight and maintenance action to assure an adequate fuel supply for the flight.
The crew operated the aircraft for an indeterminate amount of time before the accident with the right engine's mixture control in the auto rich position.
There were no discernible discrepancies between the amounts of fuel added to the aircraft and the amounts shown on the fuel receipts from the servicing facilities.
There was no evidence of a fuel leak.
There was no fire after impact because little fuel remained in the aircraft's fuel system.
The survival of many passengers was due to the lack of severe impact deformation in the center of the fuselage and the absence of a postcrash fire.
The provisions of the lease intended to satisfy the requirement for a truth in leasing clause did not result in this lessee having an adequate understanding as to who was the operator of this flight and what that means.
*Probable Cause:*

The NTSB determines that the probable cause of this accident was fuel exhaustion and total loss of power on both engines due to crew inattention to the fuel supply. Contributing to the fuel exhaustion were inadequate flight planning and an engine malfunction of undetermined nature in the right engine which resulted in higher than normal fuel consumption.

A good read;

Lynyrd Skynyd: The NTSB Report

Reactions: Informative Informative:
1 | Like List reactions


----------



## The Basket (Sep 9, 2020)

Stuff to think about

When the aircraft crashed there was no fire as there was no fuel onboard. So that was a reason for so many survivors.

The right engine was known to have some kind of fault. And the airplane flew anyway. It was going to be looked at in Baton Rouge. Why did it fly with a known fault?

Didnt the pilots monitor the fuel situation? And why did the Convair have poor fuel guages? 

The pilots both had about 60 hours on the Convair which is pretty low. That is both Pilot and Co-Pilot. So not expeirnced. 

The aircraft was trying to get to a nearby airport which is why it was flying over trees. There was said to be plenty of open fields which would have been a better bet for a belly landing.

It said that the right engine quit and then fuel was dumped when they were trying to feed the left. How this happen?

Seems the airplane was not A1 and the pilots not experienced enough to fix the problem.

Oddly Skynyrd were banned from commercial travel cos they used to smash the place up! So thats why they were on the Convair.

Reactions: Informative Informative:
1 | Like List reactions


----------



## pbehn (Sep 9, 2020)

The Basket said:


> The right engine was known to have some kind of fault. And the airplane flew anyway. It was going to be looked at in Baton Rouge. Why did it fly with a known fault?
> 
> .


I think famous high profile people contribute to accidents in many ways, just by being famous high profile people. Graham Hill, Leigh Mallory, Diana Spencer etc.


----------



## GreenKnight121 (Sep 11, 2020)

pbehn said:


> I think famous high profile people contribute to accidents in many ways, just by being famous high profile people. Graham Hill, Leigh Mallory, Diana Spencer etc.


Kobe Bryant.

The pilot(s) feel obligated to "push on" to try to make the famous passenger happy - when in reality the famous passenger would rather arrive late after an unplanned stopover than to "die trying".

Reactions: Like Like:
1 | Like List reactions


----------



## pbehn (Sep 11, 2020)

GreenKnight121 said:


> Kobe Bryant.
> 
> The pilot(s) feel obligated to "push on" to try to make the famous passenger happy - when in reality the famous passenger would rather arrive late after an unplanned stopover than to "die trying".


Also the people themselves, despite all the conspiracy theories Diana and Dodi Fayed would have survived the crash if they put their seat belts on. It is the law in France to wear your seatbelt but some people are just so rich and famous they don't believe the law applies to them and no hired driver has the status to tell them otherwise. A startling number of Prince Charles friends have been killed and injured in skiing accidents. These are always on very expensive private slopes where you can go off piste on virgin snow. The rocks and trees there don't respect fame and wealth and the rich and famous have no idea what danger they put themselves in.

Reactions: Like Like:
1 | Agree Agree:
1 | Like List reactions


----------



## FLYBOYJ (Sep 11, 2020)

pbehn said:


> I think famous high profile people contribute to accidents in many ways, just by being famous high profile people. Graham Hill, Leigh Mallory, Diana Spencer etc.



I don't know if that was an issue in this situation



The Basket said:


> Stuff to think about
> 
> When the aircraft crashed there was no fire as there was no fuel onboard. So that was a reason for so many survivors.
> 
> ...



What you have is a typical slipshod operator, poor maintenance, and poor crew training. All this added to an accident chain that happens too often. Since those years the FAA has stepped up surveillance of such operators but they are still out there.

Reactions: Agree Agree:
1 | Like List reactions


----------



## The Basket (Sep 11, 2020)

A few days before a huge flame shot out the right engine which scared the band.

So the airplane was not A1. It was they typical lowest bidder nonsense and you get what you pay for. 

Even by the Standards of 1977 it was a pretty ropey affair. But the usual not one single item but multiple mishaps and failures.

The pilots are very blameworthy in this regard.

Had they crash landed in an open field rather than try to get to an airport they had no hope getting to then they wouldn't have crashed into trees.

Oddly the story is Aerosmith had checked out the aircraft and their expert rejected the crew and airplane outright. So no excuses.

Reactions: Like Like:
1 | Like List reactions


----------



## pbehn (Sep 11, 2020)

FLYBOYJ said:


> I don't know if that was an issue in this situation
> 
> 
> 
> What you have is a typical slipshod operator, poor maintenance, and poor crew training. All this added to an accident chain that happens too often. Since those years the FAA has stepped up surveillance of such operators but they are still out there.


Not to the crash itself but to it being "The Lynyrd Skynrd crash" The odd itinerary drawn up regardless of transport, then a band that decides it wants to fly leaves it to someone else to sort it out. The "gig" that no one really wants to do ends up being done by the least suitable people with the least suitable gear. Emiliano Sala's crash was similar There aren't a huge number of planes and pilots sitting around in Cardiff to ferry footballers to a night out in France. Sala and plane pilot 'exposed to carbon monoxide'


----------



## Capt. Vick (Sep 11, 2020)

Also an American singer and actress Aaliyah

2001 Marsh Harbour Cessna 402 crash - Wikipedia


----------



## The Basket (Sep 13, 2020)

Money can buy things that are not for sale.

It was a classic case of cheap ain't good and good ain't cheap.

One bizarre story is that Ronnie Van Zant had a death wish and the Convair was his ticket. 

We say so many died and so many survived. Many of the survivors had massive injuries which took years to recover if they recovered at all.

Plus of course the mental trauma and survivors guilt of the whole incident.

You are not getting out of that kind of crash alive without paying a large fee.

Reactions: Like Like:
1 | Agree Agree:
2 | Like List reactions


----------



## Koopernic (Jan 24, 2021)

GreenKnight121 said:


> Kobe Bryant.
> 
> The pilot(s) feel obligated to "push on" to try to make the famous passenger happy - when in reality the famous passenger would rather arrive late after an unplanned stopover than to "die trying".



The interesting thing about the Kobe Bryant nonsense is that he was an unknown outside of North America but the global media machine amplified his significance around the world. All of a sudden people were talking about him as if they'd lost a beloved school friend or uncle. I had no care or empathy of him or his business at all. Nothing in his sport involved making a decision that risked his or other lives or saves lives. The hero cult painted on to sports people and actors is vulgar. I did feel for the helicopter crew, working men and women like me, who were no doubt under pressure to conform to his schedule despite the weather.


----------



## nuuumannn (Jan 24, 2021)

The Basket said:


> It was a classic case of cheap ain't good and good ain't cheap



In aircraft maintenance you can have two of three things; good, cheap, fast. If you want good and cheap, it won't be fast, if you want good and fast, it won't be cheap, if you want cheap and fast, it won't be good.

Reactions: Like Like:
1 | Like List reactions


----------

