# Saudi Typhoons



## The Basket (Sep 17, 2007)

Saudi Arabia have bought 72 Eurofighter Typhoons costing 4.4 Billion pounds. With maintanence and training...it could be over 20 billion quid!

Now that is plenty of the old cash coming to the UK. Nice.


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## mkloby (Sep 17, 2007)

Does the UK have to share revenues with any of the other nations involved in the development of the aircraft? I take it they will be manufactured in the UK??

I am guessing that they will downgrade some of the avionics.


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## Glider (Sep 18, 2007)

The aircraft are built in a number of different countries so presumably the other partners will benefit from the sale. As the lead country I would guess that the UK has an extra slice.
I am not aware of any downgrading in the equipment suite. We didn't downgrade the Tornado in any way so don't see why we should for the Typhoon.


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Sep 18, 2007)

I think it is a mistake to sell the Eurofighter to the Saudis. 

I dont believe there friendship is very true...


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## Matt308 (Sep 18, 2007)

Glider said:


> The aircraft are built in a number of different countries so presumably the other partners will benefit from the sale. As the lead country I would guess that the UK has an extra slice.
> I am not aware of any downgrading in the equipment suite. We didn't downgrade the Tornado in any way so don't see why we should for the Typhoon.



Rest assured it will be downgraded and provisions inserted (if they already haven't been) to hide the source code for the critical avionics.


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## Matt308 (Sep 18, 2007)

DerAdlerIstGelandet said:


> I think it is a mistake to sell the Eurofighter to the Saudis.
> 
> I dont believe there friendship is very true...



I agree. But then again, if they didn't sell them Typhoons, the French would give them Rafales and a case of wine. They can't seem to entice anyone to buy that beautiful machine.


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## The Basket (Sep 18, 2007)

What the difference selling Typhoon to the Saudis? The Americans sold them F-15s.


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## Glider (Sep 18, 2007)

Fair point and there is no doubt that more were on offer.

Re source code, I agree that will not be available, but thats different from downgrading the aircraft.


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## Matt308 (Sep 18, 2007)

You think you guys are going to give them a Typhoon with latest generation AESA and integrated processing? I don't believe it. That's only what the marketing dept would have them believe.


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## Glider (Sep 18, 2007)

Yep, I believe its possible. I don't know obviously, but I do know that they had the full spec Tornado.
Maybe thats why they bought it.


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## CharlesBronson (Sep 18, 2007)

> think it is a mistake to sell the Eurofighter to the Saudis.
> 
> I dont believe there friendship is very true...



Selling the latest fighter to a country full of supporters of Bin laden...how much clever is that ?


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## Matt308 (Sep 18, 2007)

The Saudi populace may support Bin Laden... and note that that has not been demonstrated either, CB. Your comment is well taken, but ill informed. The Saudi gov't, while a fickle allie, is yet an allie that continues to provide the western world some hope and a basis for continued aid. One may argue that the reason for that is their own preservation, true, but an outright confrontational gov't in support is Islamic fundementalists would be bad for the US. And worse for the rest of the world. I hope you rest confortably knowing that King Abdullah is not overtly against capitalism and destruction of our world economy.

You might wish to contrast that with your own president. For he is bent upon destruction, with little long term goals and objectives that are visible to the sane world.

Cheers.


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## Aussie1001 (Sep 19, 2007)

hmm oh well i guess that if they hadn't got the typhoon they would have got something equally good or better.... Why didn't they get F22's or preorder some F35's they certinally have the money to do so....


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## The Basket (Sep 19, 2007)

I am sure the Americanos would have sold them new versions of the F-16 or F-15 or F-18 if asked.

The F-22 and F-35 are hi-tec and there are doubts that America would sell even to Nato allies. Even down graded ones. It is said that even Norway would only get a very downgraded export version of the F-35.

If the Saudis didn't get Typhoon...they would go Rafale or Gripen or even Sukhoi. So they would get a jet from somewhere and someone would get paid.


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## CharlesBronson (Sep 19, 2007)

> You might wish to contrast that with your own president. For he is bent upon destruction, with little long term goals and objectives that are visible to the sane world.



Sorry but I dont understand a thing of what you re talking about, if you can explain better was is the "destruction" planned.

Is not ill information, is my opinion, all the region is tilting to the extremism.
In my point of view Europe is selling weapons for his own destruction.


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## Matt308 (Sep 19, 2007)

CharlesBronson said:


> Sorry but I dont understand a thing of what you re talking about, if you can explain better was is the "destruction" planned.
> 
> Is not ill information, is my opinion, all the region is tilting to the extremism.
> In my point of view Europe is selling weapons for his own destruction.



Apologies CB. I don't know why, but I continually confuse Kirchner with Chavez.


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Sep 19, 2007)

The Basket said:


> What the difference selling Typhoon to the Saudis? The Americans sold them F-15s.



Different period of time is the way I see it. If the US were to sell them F-15s today I would not agree with it either.


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## rogthedodge (Sep 19, 2007)

C'mon guys the whole of the western world deals with Saudi.

We all know it's the home of jihadi islam (along with Pakistan). 

We all know Saudis have flooded the Islamic world with their hardline extremist Wahabbi (sp?) version of the Koran which changes 'live along-side in peace' to 'kill, kill, kill'. We know they've distributed this for free and radicalised many, many young muslims so far, and continues to do so (both)

We all know Al Quida is based funded by Saudis.

We knew all this well before 9/11, 7/7 etc etc 

We all sold them kit then and we'd all do it now

For one seller to accuse another is hypocrisy IMO

_Real Politik_ I'm afraid


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Sep 19, 2007)

rogthedodge said:


> For one seller to accuse another is hypocrisy IMO
> 
> _Real Politik_ I'm afraid



I dont believe anyone really did that.

I think you are reading too much into the discussion...


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## Matt308 (Sep 19, 2007)

No argument. But I don't think that it is Saudi gov't sponsored. At least not in a blatant overt fashion. I believe the same holds true with Musharraf. Neither regime can afford to publicly embrace extremism and in fact are considered as much of an enemy to fanatic islam as the western world. This is exactly what makes radical islam so damn evil. They hate everyone equally.


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## Matt308 (Sep 19, 2007)

Sorry, we clashed Adler.


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## CharlesBronson (Sep 19, 2007)

> Apologies CB. I don't know why, but I continually confuse Kirchner with Chavez.



 ........ 

Crazy. Actually I dont bother the comparative of persons, as while you dont mix Argentina with Venezuela.


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## Matt308 (Sep 19, 2007)

Fair enough.


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## Hop (Sep 20, 2007)

> Different period of time is the way I see it. If the US were to sell them F-15s today I would not agree with it either.



The US signed a $20 billion arms deal with Saudi this summer. They haven't announced what's included, but it's widely rumoured to be upgrades to the F-15 fleet and lots of smart bombs.


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Sep 20, 2007)

And for that I dont agree.

At the same time I can understand it though. They are technically allies and they could potentially stand with us against Iran.


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## rogthedodge (Sep 20, 2007)

DerAdlerIstGelandet said:


> I dont believe anyone really did that.
> 
> I think you are reading too much into the discussion...



Not sure I am - lots of gnashing of teeth when it's UK selling but when it's the US supplying justifications of them being allies are brought out. 

Selling F15 upgrades is just as questionable as selling them Typhoons but one draws more flak than the other???

We all deal with Saudi - we can't afford not to.

------------------------------------------------------------------

On the AQ / Saudi Govt thing - it's a very fine line. Saudi doesn't really have a govt as such, just a large royal elite. Some powerful guys within this are funding protecting the wahabbi evangalism and AQ.

If someone (US govt for example) wanted to 'prove' direct links between AQ and Saudi it wouldn't be difficult. 
It's the C21st 'Elephant in the Room' and everyone looks the other way, we can't afford not to.


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Sep 20, 2007)

Again you are reading to much into it. I dont think there was anyone saying:

"The UK sucks for selling them Typhoons."

I for example said that I thought it was mistake but I also said I think it was mistake for the US to do the same.


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## Matt308 (Sep 20, 2007)

Agree with Adler. In an ideal world, the Saudi regime would have to throw hunks of gold to fend off their enemies. But since oil is the lifeblood of the free world and Saudi Arabia has been a world player in keeping that oil free flowing, we cater to them. World politics.


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Sep 20, 2007)

Exactly.

I understand why we are building up Saudi's military. They are a potential ally in a potential conflict against Iran or any conflict in the Middle East let alone.

However I believe there freindship toward the west is a fuax one and I would never turn my back on them.


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## The Basket (Sep 20, 2007)

Money talks.
Business is business.
Nothing personal.


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## Matt308 (Sep 20, 2007)

Or rather

Money talks.
Business is business.
Don't make it personal.


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## The Basket (Sep 21, 2007)

In these kinda a deal...always a briefcase full of money. Maybe even a suitcase.

Hell...even a huge binbag full of the good stuff. The only bad thing is I don't get my taste.


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