# Star Wars the last jedi



## The Basket (Dec 20, 2017)

Er....
Not a fan.
Big fan of star wars. But not of this.
Kinda not my star wars.
Reading comment between people who love it and people who hates it.
But not for me. Don't want to be angry but it doesn't do anything for me.


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## fubar57 (Dec 20, 2017)

The last Star Wars movie I saw was the first one but then again, the last movie I sat in a theatre to watch was Never Say Never Again in '83

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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Dec 20, 2017)

I loved it. I found it was refreshing, but still had the star wars feeling to it. At some point you have to move on to the new characters if you want to keep the movies alive. I think this accomplished that.

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## parsifal (Dec 21, 2017)

story was a little "force fed" with all these seemingly arbitrary add on scenes . I liked it, as did my son, but as a long time fan, I found it dragged a bit


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## The Basket (Dec 21, 2017)

Not to get into spoilers for those that ain't seen.
There are factors at play. Is this entertainment? Of course although it's run time was way too long for my poor old bladder. But to me star wars is more than entertainment or box office or even a night out at the movies. The reviews and rants are between the lovers and the haters. Probably need to write a 5000 word essay to fully explain but the working title would be 'i have a bad feeling about this'


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## Wayne Little (Dec 21, 2017)

DerAdlerIstGelandet said:


> I loved it. I found it was refreshing, but still had the star wars feeling to it. At some point you have to move on to the new characters if you want to keep the movies alive. I think this accomplished that.



Right there with you Chris....


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## The Basket (Dec 21, 2017)

Let's say you become chief designer for Ferrari. Lovely job, red paint, 2 seats V12 engine. Sorted. But instead you design a 18 wheeler rig instead. There is nothing wrong with a big truck but it's not a Ferrari. You expect things from a Ferrari which don't include trailers or the need for haulage space.
That my problem with Star Wars. I expect a star wars film. Now, you could argue that the film was good....and fair play to you. But why not call it Battlestar Galactica instead? Unless it has the star wars baggage then it ain't star wars. It becomes some random film. You can grow the franchise and grow the characters but if you sell hot dogs and suddenly you sell cars then you can't call yourself a hot dog seller no more.
That's my rambling take on it.


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## nuuumannn (Dec 21, 2017)

> Right there with you Chris



Me too. Entertaining film.

The problem I have with hype is that fans in particular get their hopes up expecting one thing and when they don't get it, they gripe. Yep, Basket, I get what you are saying, but I think it is most definitely a Star Wars film; here's why.

It has Star Wars type characters, as well as obviously the original cast, there's annoying but cute random aliens (are the porgs really that annoying - they provided a bit of comic relief and we got to see Chewie throwing a little tanty in the cockpit of the Falcon again!), there's characters that should be likeable that annoy fans, there's subtle humour, something that the first three had, but the prequels had little of, there's an almost irrelevant sub plot going on behind the main plot, its riddled with plot holes and inconsistencies - why is this an issue? All Star Wars films are like that! There's intrigue surrounding a central character and its origins, there's family drama, there's psychopathic bad guys that betray others to achieve their own ends and do crazy stuff for cinematic effect to achieve it, there's epic space battles (yeah! Why we love Star Wars!) and cool space ships, random planets and grubby worn technology and droids, there's the force, reinstated as the mysterious energy it was intended to be (no midichlorians!). And Yoda is a puppet again!

Yes, the plot is slightly contrived and a bit corny, but it's a Star Wars film! The thing is, it doesn't pander too much to the kid's toy market, unlike Return of the Jedi, The Phantom Menace and The Clone Wars, all of which were shameless marketing exercises. It is also a more nuanced and mature film (for a Star Wars film) than the others, which sets it aside immediately - for a Star Wars film. I think in time to come it'll be recognised as being up there as one of the best Star Wars films, along with Empire.

I saw a comment on youtube that summed up some of the disappointment that fans have shown (not me, I'm a fan, too); Too much like the originals - The Force Awakens, too little like the originals - The Last Jedi - even though I think it has a lot of Empire Strikes Back dna in it, although not a deliberate rehash like The Force Awakens.

Too much?

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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Dec 21, 2017)

The Basket said:


> Let's say you become chief designer for Ferrari. Lovely job, red paint, 2 seats V12 engine. Sorted. But instead you design a 18 wheeler rig instead. There is nothing wrong with a big truck but it's not a Ferrari. You expect things from a Ferrari which don't include trailers or the need for haulage space.
> That my problem with Star Wars. I expect a star wars film. Now, you could argue that the film was good....and fair play to you. *But why not call it Battlestar Galactica instead*? Unless it has the star wars baggage then it ain't star wars. It becomes some random film. You can grow the franchise and grow the characters but if you sell hot dogs and suddenly you sell cars then you can't call yourself a hot dog seller no more.
> That's my rambling take on it.



I don't know, because it was a Star Wars film? Felt like a Star Wars film. Looked like a Star Wars film. Sounded like a Star Wars film. Must be a Star Wars film...

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## The Basket (Dec 23, 2017)

I can't go into details as that would be a spoiler and I ain't that guy.
But last film I saw in cinema before Last Jedi was Blade Runner 2049 and that stomps Last Jedi as a film and as cinematic art. However Blade Runner gets less score on Rotten Tomatoes than Last Jedi. Go figure.
I thought Rogue One was good although I was so-so with Force Awakens.

Last Jedi gets 92% on Rotten Tomatoes which makes it into the top 100 films ever made. Go figure.


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Dec 23, 2017)

It’s all subjective and opinion. 

I did not care for Blade Runner for instance. 

To pass off ones opinion as end all be all is impossible. Everyone has their own tastes and likes.


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## mikewint (Dec 23, 2017)

DerAdlerIstGelandet said:


> Everyone has their own tastes and likes.



Truer words were never spoken: De gustibus non est disputandum. 
Star Wars fans are a diverse group and I think it depends on exactly when you entered the saga. I stood in line for 3 hours to see IV New Hope and was blown away. Initially I was very happy that Disney bought Lucas out Star Wars but then the more I thought about it the more I worried about what a HUGELY PC company like Dizzy was going to do (Lucas original inspiration was that the Rebels were the VC and the Empire was the USA) to Star Wars and these last two have born that out in spades. Have you noticed, by chance, that ALL the strong characters who lead are female and all the evil characters are white males? Did you notice that the new leads are a young white women, a black man, an Asian woman, and a Latino. Oh yea, again the baddies are all white males. Glorious PC-dom here we comith.
I think that if you entered the saga as I did you developed the story in your own mind. Lucas himself stated that he envisioned a trilogy of trilogies wherein I -III were the beginnings and establishment of a Galactic Republic and its degeneration into an Empire. IV - VI were the growing Rebellion, defeat of the Empire and re-establishment of the Rebublic. VII - IX were the degeneration of that new Republic, i.e. Cyclic history.
The Force Awakens was IMHO a joke, a total rehash of IV just with new characters like Rey (lives on a desert planet, collects junk, Force adept witn zero training, dreams of seas and oceans never having seen any, speaks fluent Wookie never having seen one, ect.) So I had hopes for the Last Jedi chapter breaking new ground. And boy did it shatter that ground. 
SPOILERS AHEAD.......
Where to start.... Rey - one of the big build-ups in Force was Rey's parents...WHO were they and why did they abandon her. After all the build-up and speculation and dragging out .... Nobodies WTF???
Snoke - introduced as THE most powerful and MOST Evil character. No mention of who he is or where he comes from. My thought was that he is/was Mace Windu who survived his fall and had come to hate the Skywalkers or also I thought he was Palpatine who also survived his fall (did any of you think it was ridiculous that Masters of the Force like Mace and Palpatine would just fall to their deaths and could not summon enough Force to arrest their falls???) Any way this Most Powerful and Most Evil Force Adept gets simply cut in half by an unwatched light saber and is gone...WTF???
Knights of Ren - remember the big build-up...where is they????
Luke Skywalker - what a sad dismal treatment of the hero of 5 previous movies. Even Mark Hamill rebelled at the writers treatment of his character and insisted on re-writes. The Jedi decorated hero of the rebellion abandons all his friends and twin sister, exiles himself on Ahch-to, plunders his X-wing for parts, survives in an old Jedi temple by "MILKING" ugh Alien "Birds" of green milk UGH!! and spearing giant "fish". Remember the big build-up about Luke's Light-Sabre. It "called" to Rey, was somehow in the possession of Maz Kanata, and when Rey returns it to Luke he tossed it away like garbage....WTF??? Luke refuses to train Rey though she wanders into that silly cave of mirrors where she only sees reflections of herself (shades of Luke on Dagobah). Then in the big turn around Luke suddenly appears millions of LY's across the galaxy to Crait (anyone else develop a longing for Red Velvet Cake?), calls out Kylo, but Kylo seems to cut Luke in half when Luke disappears and is back on Ahch-to where he vanishes into a pile of robes (a fate reserved for a select few like Yoda, and Obi-Wan. Anakin and Qui Gonn had to be cremated. Apparently the Force allows you to project yourself across the galaxy (when did that happen??? WTF) AND now Force ghosts can actively take physical form and interact with the living and zap trees on fire. When did THAT happen...WTF
Stormtroopers have always been a joke and couldn't hit the broadside of a barn but NOW the ultimate....The ENTIRE First Order Fleet of hundreds of front line spaceships cannot catch or track ONE old freighter and they have to wait until IT RUNS OUT OF GAS!!! WTF & WTF.
With Fisher dead Leia had to be written out but that silly Mary-Popins spacewalk and then half the movie in a coma. Rey has to tell Leia that Luke is gone but Leia still survives. She can't be in the next film so...WTF Whose the next leader?? the Hothead Poe???
Then there's DJ (well they are remaking Roseanne) who is this new Gomer? Anyone notice he cares ONLY about money and sells out Finn and Rey then vanishes in his spaceship filled with Credits ( think his ship might be the Annual Bird of Prey and he has a big Sheepdog as a Pal).
Former SW Fan


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## The Basket (Dec 23, 2017)

This is pretty much how I feel.
They had a precious jewel called Star Wars and did everything they could to smash it.
Fiat own Ferrari so they could put the Ferrari badge on any awful Fiat hatchback and call it a Ferrari. They don't because it would ruin the Ferrari brand.
And that's what Star Wars is...a brand. Not just a film or toys. It's a brand you buy into because it has a mystique than you want to be part of.
And it just feels that Last Jedi is just taking the urine. It just feels like cultural vandalism.

Mark Hamill has gone on record saying this ain't my Luke Skywalker.

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## mikewint (Dec 24, 2017)

Apparently there is an on-line petition that Dizzy recall the Last Jedi and remove it from the Star Wars Trilogy and then re-make the film. Not that it will get anywhere...Tis the year of the anti-Hero


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## The Basket (Dec 24, 2017)

Maybe we can create a Kickstarter fund to buy back the rights from Disney.
All we need to raise is over $4 billion.
Chicken feed.
My new Star Wars film is going to be Sith and Boba Fett and his bounty hunters fighting over hookers and casinos to be the biggest drug dealers in the galaxy.

Not an ewok or porg in sight. I haven't decided on the levels of nudity yet.

It's John Wick v Goodfellas v The Sopranos v Porn hub.


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## fubar57 (Dec 24, 2017)




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## mikewint (Dec 24, 2017)



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## Rogi (Dec 24, 2017)

It felt like the Jason Bourne of Star Wars when I'm expecting James Bond, that's the easiest way I can describe it without spoilers. It was good I liked it but it isn't a standard or general star wars movie.


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## The Basket (Dec 25, 2017)

I have to clarify that my views on the new Star Wars is nothing to do with an Asian lady being a star of the film.
I often watch Asian ladies in movies so I don't want to be tarred with that brush.
But this time of year is about the chosen one who was conceived by virgin birth and that is of course Anakin Skywalker.
May the Lord of the Sith be with you.


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## Wayne Little (Dec 26, 2017)

It Quacked like a duck to me....


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## mikewint (Dec 26, 2017)

Wayne Little said:


> It Quacked like a duck to me



Yes but did it LOOK like a duck AND Walk like a Duck


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## michaelmaltby (Dec 26, 2017)

Indigenous Storm Trooper - British Columbia


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## The Basket (Dec 26, 2017)

It has the star wars name. But it like the stores own coffee. The cheap non brand stuff. It's coffee but not nice.
Luke Skywalker is Luke Skywalker so he must act like Luke Skywalker. Mark Hamill is quoted saying he said to the director that his Luke is acting totally out of character and he don't like it.

If I put a Ferrari badge on my car don't make it a Ferrari.


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## Rogi (Dec 27, 2017)

The Basket said:


> It has the star wars name. But it like the stores own coffee. The cheap non brand stuff. It's coffee but not nice.
> Luke Skywalker is Luke Skywalker so he must act like Luke Skywalker. Mark Hamill is quoted saying he said to the director that his Luke is acting totally out of character and he don't like it.
> 
> If I put a Ferrari badge on my car don't make it a Ferrari.



Agreed, Luke gave me a scared Yoda vibe, Loda perhaps ? :S 

I had the same feeling for a movie as when the new Start Trek Movie rebooted, it was ok, just not the same feel, and I get it they need to re-vamp things occasionally, but not to the extent of where things start falling apart. 
Star Wars has turned into Humpy Dumpty, I think there might be another movie, but it would be the last, as all this revamping and editing has created some movies which are memorable, and some which aren't. 

I would have preferred some of the core items, like stormtroopers, etc. to stay the same, the revamp on the trooper looked more clone than anything, the helmet wasn't as intimidating as the originals. 

The highlight of the movie for me was Vice Admiral Holdo and I really wish they could have developed her character more. Benicio's Character "DJ" was great as well, but I would have preferred he switched back to the Rebels at the end and lended some aide (ie a nod to Han saving the day)


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## mikewint (Dec 27, 2017)

Rogi said:


> all this revamping and editing has created some movies which are memorable, and some which aren't.


I guess part of the problem (if there is one, opinions vary) is the directors. As they change from movie to movie each projects his own image of what the universe should do and be. Then you have the Dizzy take on all things and one eye toward toy profits ( the silly rolling robot and pogues.
DJ is Solo's replacement, just consider all the similarities. Remember IV, the only way Luke got Solo on board with rescuing Leia was to mention money so I think we'll see more of the new DJ/Solo in the next movie.
Just as an aside, the Cretins can't leave Star Trek alone either. Now most of those changes were due to the advancements in CGI and having more money to create sets and IMHO that is/was an improvement but have you seen the "NEW" Klingons!!! Good Grief!!! There must be one heck of a lot of radiation on their home world to produce such massive genetic changes in such a short period of time.


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## The Basket (Dec 27, 2017)

I don't get the 5 star rating the film gets. 3 absolute tops. Odd I watched back to the future over Xmas and that is a 5 star movie in anyone's book. Back to the Future is everything Last Jedi isn't.
It's the basic Hero Journey.
Normal ordinary chap gets in an adventure...usually by accident. Has a older wiser guy helping them out. Faces trials and tribulations on the way. Has some female love interest but wins the day in the end. We can empathize with the hero because he is you or me. And therefore he is relatable. 
That's sums up Luke Skywalker or Marty McFly or a Hobbit.

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## mikewint (Dec 27, 2017)

Reviewers tend to fall into basic groups. Some can get well-known enough to receive all kinds of perks and special treatment and a massive company like Dizzy wields a LOT of clout. Hence a reviewer who slams a Dizzy offering will tend to get fewer and fewer perks and shabbier and shabbier treatment while the reverse is true for the "Golly GEE it was WONDERFUL" group. The old "Don't bite the hand that feeds you". Then there are the rabid fans in both camps that will go to a sites like Rotten Tomatoes and spend many hours pushing the "Like" or "Hate" buttons to influence the ratings. One rabid hater even created a Bot to "push" the Hate-button to decrease the rating. Then there is Dizzy itself. With millions at stake do you think that they will sit idly by while getting slammed. The Dizzy publicity machine is hard at work shaping public opinion and denigrating the anti-crowd. I've seen many reviews that are now are calling Last Jedi the Greatest Star War Movie Ever Made.
I seldom if ever trust either review. The power of Dizzy is such that there is now an interview online with Mark Hamill wherein he essentially apologises for his "creative difference" over his view of Luke Skywalker and the director/writers. He praises them for even considering his ideas and states that now that he has seen the movie in its entirety he realizes how wrong he was and how utterly fantastic the movie actually is. Sad but we all gots to eat.


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## fubar57 (Dec 27, 2017)

This.....is why I quit going to movies back in the last millenium


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## mikewint (Dec 27, 2017)

Much as I love to say that things were "different" in Ye Olde Times it really wasn't. Things have just shifted location. In my Heyday Movie Magazines, gossip columnists (Hedda Hopper, LA Times; Louella Parsons, Hurst Newspapers) wrote columns read by millions published in hundreds of newspapers and could easily make or break a Star or a movie. As print media slowly gave way to TV, critics like Roger Ebert, Pauline Kael, and Gene Siskel wielded a very similar power. But another shift is also starting to surface as recent Media mergers have brought TV networks into the same companies that produce and create movies. 
Lately the power has shifted to the internet and the internet powerhouse Rotten Tomatoes. Fandango now posts RT scores right next to the Purchase button where a rotten score literally says "You're an idiot if you but this". Something like 15 million people a month check RT before going to a movie. The movie Baywatch got a Tomatometer score of 19...and died. The King Arthur Legend of the Sword got a 28 and died loosing Warner Bros. over $130 million.
Now here's the REAL catch to all this: Fandango OWNS Rotten Tomatoes AND Fandango is in turn owned (a division of) NBCUniversal WHICH also owns Universal Pictures. RT execs claim total independence...Yup and I'm young, handsome, and rich!


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## The Basket (Dec 27, 2017)

If Disney want to give me a big bag of cash then my view on this film can change. Those are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, I have others.

Hamill wants to ride that dollar pony because he needs a new pair of shoes.

I should hate him for selling out for money but I would only be jealous.


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## JKim (Dec 28, 2017)

I'm in the LIKED IT camp. I liked it more than Rogue One. More than The Force Awakens. I'd rank it between the original trilogy and the prequels, which I detested. While TFA was an unabashed redo of ANH, I felt that this one took some chances and I appreciated the daring to break some unexpected ground. I like what they did with the idea of the Force and I enjoyed the relationship between Rey and Kylo. It was a wee bit too long and personally thought some of the characters/story arcs were unnecessary (Captain Phasma, the casino detour and Benicio Del Toro's character, for example). But overall, I enjoyed it and am looking forward to Episode Nine.


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## mikewint (Dec 28, 2017)

Differences of opinion and tastes make the world a very interesting place. You and I are in 100% agreement and 100% disagreement, amazing.
I detest what they did to the character of Luke and the unabashed in-your-face feminism and PCness REALLY raised my hackles and ire. There are simply too many cooks in the Star Wars pot and the thematic elements zag and zig with minimal continuity. At least with I - VI Lucas was in charge and the episodes had some continuity though IV was the furthest out as Lucas expected it to be the only SW movie and had to do some major backpedaling to continue the storyline. The "Vader killed your father" to "Vader is your father" and the Luke and Leia kiss are prime examples
Now I LIKED Rogue One and totally agree with your assessment of VII as a remake of IV - VI all in one movie sans Luke, who is apparently in a snit off on some armpit of a rock milking birds and contemplating his navel, abandoning everyone and everything he ever held dear. Nope...NOT!


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## JKim (Dec 28, 2017)

Yeah, alike but different. From my perspective, what Rian Johnson did with Luke's character pales to what Lucas did to Vader in the prequels. And the "modifications" to the original trilogy? Hans shooting first? Sticking that Hayden Christiansen in with the other Jedi ghosts? You gotta be kidding me! No, I lost major respect for Lucas after that prequel disaster and the DVD money grab. I, for one, am relieved that he turned over the keys to other more capable people.


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## mikewint (Dec 28, 2017)

Yea, me too. I was also really glad when Lucas bowed out. I also had high hopes that Dizzy with its essentially limitless resources and talent would do spectacular things for SW and that I might actually see all 9 movies in my lifetime. Alas and Alak the wanting is always better than the having.
Now I always thought that the change from Anakin to Vader was handled relatively well in the limited time available sort of the "in for a penny, in for a pound transformation"
Now the handling of the Force has always been kinda done on the fly. Think about I where we suddenly hear about Midichlorians and that there is a test for them. Obi-wan had just stated that the Force was an energy field created by living beings that binds the galaxy together...very spiritual. Then 
all of a sudden, instead of there being an energy field that “binds the galaxy together,” there are little microscopic life forms inside of the Jedi, allowing them to… do what? What do the microscopic entities have to do with the galaxy-wide life force? Are they like symbiotes that allow you to connect to the energy field? If the Force is in every living thing, then why do only some people have midichlorians? Does the Dark Side of the Force have different-flavored midichlorians than the light side? What was a fairly clear-cut explanation suddenly becomes incredibly muddled.
Now there is a bit more in the SW Expanded Universe and I get these Midichlorian counts:
Anakin Skywalk/Darth Vader (27,000) is the consensus #1 on this list. His count was considered to be off the charts.
Emperor Palpatine/Darth Sidious (19,000) is usually ranked #2, the most powerful Sith aside from Darth Vader, and slightly above...
Yoda (17,000) is the most powerful Jedi ever.
Luke Skywalker (15,000) is the son of Anakin Skywalker.
Leia Organa (15,000) is Luke Skywalker's twin, so she has an identical midichlorian count.
Some other notable individuals and the midichlorian estimates:
Anakin Solo/Ben Solo/Kylo Ren (13,500) the son of Leia Organa and Han Solo
Count Dooku/Darth Tyranus (13,500) the Sith who defeated...
Obi-Wan Kenobi (13,400) the Jedi who defeated...
Darth Maul (12,000)
The consensus is that the midichlorian count does not in itself determine an individual strength in the Force but only their potential. Wonder what if anything more Dizzy will do with/to the Force . Though apparently Force Ghosts can now take physical form and interact physically with the living...so where's Anakin, Palpatine and Obi-wan. The Force also now allows a living Jedi to project themselves in a physical form millions of LYs across the galaxy...
Poor Hayden (I don't like sand) was only 19 at the time reading Lukas' corney script. Now as I understand it at the end of VI the young Anakin joins Yoda and Obi-wan as a Force ghost BECAUSE as Vader he killed Palpatine thus redeeming himself and abandoning the Darkside to rejoin the Lightside thus it is the young Anakin who had not yet joined with the Darkside that appears with Yoda and Obi-wan. What confused me was that Yoda and Obi-wan had vanished after death leaving only a pile of robes while Vader/Anakin had simply died, did not vanish and was cremated. Then there is the appearance of Liam Neeson’s Qui-Gon Jinn who was killed, did not vanish, and was also cremated also appears as a Force Ghost. WTF is going on here?


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## The Basket (Dec 28, 2017)

I did enjoy Rogue one. The bit when Vader went nuts is the highlight of cinema for me. More Vader going nuts and less social justice commentary.
It was all made up on the fly and George Lucas got lucky. I remember reading or hearing somewhere that the force was originally going to be a ring. Bit like Spaceballs.
There is a YouTube with Alec Guinness in which he treats Star Wars with grace but believe that people may look too deep into it. Like make it a religion.
To be honest I hope Disney lose some feathers over this and realise that its a film about war set in space with spaceships and lasers and magic wizards with laser swords and bad guys dressed in black with heavy breathing issues.


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## JKim (Dec 28, 2017)

Just curious... where do you guys see this feminism, political correctness and social justice commentary in the Star Wars films? Is it because the main characters are female and people of color?


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## The Basket (Dec 28, 2017)

The casino planet was full of awful rich people. Who were ing in Thier opulence. Then thier slave creatures were released and destroyed the casino and probs killed a few wealthy patrons.
This is made by Disney!!! What's that? Rebel against the rich? I thought it smacked of Marxist propoganda!
What the hell!!!! Star wars had non whites for years. Yoda was green! Mace Windu and Lando. The Luke Skywalker character was basically castrated. Also Rey is such an unrealistic character. She can fly the millennium falcon without any kind of training or knowledge. She can laser sword fight a trained Sith and beat him??? She can fix and repair stuff. And can understand Wookies and robots
So a strong female lead without weakness and perfect at everything.

As noted before, one should be able to happily urinate on a film without being called racist. And say Rey is a stupid character without being called sexist. In these social justice warrior times that is simply not allowed to have a dissenting view


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## JKim (Dec 28, 2017)

Hey, I'm just asking. I'm not labeling anyone! I grew up as a minority in the US and I have two daughters (no sons), so my viewpoints tend to be appropriately skewed. I didn't think TLJ or Rogue One reeked of feminism or political correctness or social justice so I was curious where people saw it. That's all. Sorry if the question offended.


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## The Basket (Dec 28, 2017)

I am not offended. I apologize if I come across as such. 
But The Last Jedi makes me angry. And it grinds my gears.
And anger leads to the dark side of the force.


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## JKim (Dec 28, 2017)

Understood! I watched Star Wars when it came out in 1977. I remember seeing an article in Time magazine that got me excited to see it. The movie was playing at the old Cinerama theater in Honolulu and the line wrapped around the block twice. It was more than a movie... it was an event and a seminal moment for me as a 13 year old kid. I've found that those moments can't be easily replicated and I no longer look for movies to have a profound effect on me. And it's not a matter of whether a movie is good or bad. I think a movie's ability to leave imprints on peoples' psyche diminishes as one gets older.


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## mikewint (Dec 28, 2017)

JKim said:


> Just curious... where do you guys see this feminism, political correctness and social justice commentary in the Star Wars films?


I guess it depends on how hard you look and how you interpret what you do see. I guess my sensitivity to these kinds of issues began when I got out of the Army and could not get into med school because I was too old and had too much training. My MS degree, 3.9 average, military MOS meant nothing as 5 openings were being held for minorities with no regard to grades or experience. Yea I'm still PO'd.
Anyway read my #12 post:
*Have you noticed, by chance, that ALL the strong characters who lead are female and ALL the evil characters are white males? Did you notice that the new leads are a young white women, a black man, an Asian woman, and a Latino. Oh yea, again the baddies are all white males. Glorious PC-dom here we comith.*
I suppose that could all be by sheer chance
Oh one more thing we had 2 girls also and they both did everything the boys did and vice versus. My girls hunted, shot guns, knew the basics of auto mech, could change a flat tire unassisted, took out the garbage and so on. I have no problem with women in combat as long as they can do, do do, and meet the same criteria as a male. I do object when the Army lowers the standards women have to meet to receive the same ratings as a male.


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## JKim (Dec 28, 2017)

mikewint said:


> I*Have you noticed, by chance, that ALL the strong characters who lead are female and ALL the evil characters are white males? Did you notice that the new leads are a young white women, a black man, an Asian woman, and a Latino. Oh yea, again the baddies are all white males. Glorious PC-dom here we comith.*



Not exactly... There are strong leading characters that are male (Poe). There are baddies that are not male (Phasma). And there are baddies that are not white (Del Toro's character). So the ALL descriptor is not accurate.

But I get what you're saying. But please understand, as an Asian-American growing up in this fine country, I've had to endure the stifling Hollywood portrayal of Asians as sleazy villains, kung-fu experts, math nerds or exotic geisha girls. So when one Asian American actor gets cast in a blockbuster with a prominent role and has no special powers or even particularly good-looking, my reaction is "It's about freaking time!"

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## tyrodtom (Dec 28, 2017)

So here I am watching a series of movies that first came out the year my first child was born. 
Now I'm watching the continuation of it with her and my grandchildren 40 years later.
And all of us enjoys it !!!

Not many series can accomplish that.

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## rochie (Dec 29, 2017)

tyrodtom said:


> So here I am watching a series of movies that first came out the year my first child was born.
> Now I'm watching the continuation of it with her and my grandchildren 40 years later.
> And all of us enjoys it !!!
> 
> Not many series can accomplish that.


Same here, though with my Daughter who is now 20 !

There was one scene in the Ladt Jedi I thought was incredible and if it was in Alien or another Ridley Scott movie it would of been lauded to high heaven.


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## The Basket (Dec 29, 2017)

But this is SJW in a nutshell. Is an Asian American girl is in a film because she is the best actress or is it because she was the first Asian through the door? Her sister in the film is played by Veronica Ngo who meets the 'good looking' quota. there was of course an Asian in Rogue One Donny Yen.

Anyhoo....What one scene was good? I may have been out taking a whizz when that was on


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## mikewint (Dec 29, 2017)

JKim said:


> There are strong leading characters that are male (Poe). There are baddies that are not male (Phasma). And there are baddies that are not white (Del Toro's character).


My most sincere apologies for what you had to endure. Not any kind/type of excuse but IMHO some of that was unconscious. One of my best friends from the 6th grade on, Richard, was Mexican and we immediately called him Pancho. It was the days of the Frito Bandito. There was no meanness or denigration meant by that name and he quickly became a very close friend who stayed at my house, ate meals with us, was "adopted" by my mother, etc. The closest I've personally come is/was returning home from Vietnam. I was spit on, called foul names, and was even rejected by Veteran organizations like the VFW and American Legion.
Water under the bridge and again IMHO pushing an exact reversal doesn't rectify past transgressions. People come up to me today and thank me for my service both the VFW and Legion continually invite me to join. I smile and say Thank You but it does not (for me anyway) rectify the past.
I digress and I'm off the soapbox---
POE - I do not consider him a strong male lead in fact quite the opposite. He is the counterpoint to the superior female leaders like Leia and Holdo. Poe's refusal to follow orders and his mutiny cost the rebellion hundreds of lives. ALL of which could have been averted if the DA male had only listened to the women AND somehow he gets away with it. He is today's world in microcosm where powerful men did bad things and got away with it until brave women, 40 - 50 years later, remembered and blew the whistle. If Poe had been in my team he'd have fallen on a grenade or got accidentally shot a long time ago.
Phasma - Again a strong lead, well female, a villian, and with that reflective armour certainly a stand-out ready to crush the rebels, then she unceremoniously get dumped into a trash compactor before the Starkiller base get blowed-up. Well now in LJ she has escaped from that fate and is on Snokes ship and she is supposed to execute Finn but Holdo's crash allows Finn (the ex-janitor remember) to knock Phasma down, break her helmet for a glimpse of her face (remember Vader's scenes) then the ground crumbles and she falls into intergalactic flames...Your typical stormtrooper fighting style...Except The ex-janitor, ex-stormtrooper with a conscience, Finn. Is she dead...now...finally?
DJ - Hard to know at this point where Dizzy is going with this character. He is IMHO a replacement for Han Solo (IV), on neither side, the rebels and the Empire/First Order are simply opponents neither good nor bad. To DJ they present opportunities for him to make a buck, much as Han the smuggler was in the beginning. So Finn and Rose need DJ's code breaking skills and, for the money he's on board but offered more he betrays Finn and Rose for a pile of credits and takes off in his POS ship. I think he'll return in force, as a Hispanic male he'll serve as a lure for the countries 58.6 million Hispanics


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## The Basket (Dec 29, 2017)

Poe is the Hispanic character.


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## mikewint (Dec 29, 2017)

Benicio Monserrate Rafael del Toro Sánchez is a Puerto Rican-American and Oscar Isaac is a Guatemalan-American actor both are thus Hispanic. In the order presented Poe was presented as a strong male lead and del Toro as the non-white character thus I dealt with them in those terms


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## rochie (Dec 29, 2017)

The Basket said:


> But this is SJW in a nutshell. Is an Asian American girl is in a film because she is the best actress or is it because she was the first Asian through the door? Her sister in the film is played by Veronica Ngo who meets the 'good looking' quota. there was of course an Asian in Rogue One Donny Yen.
> 
> Anyhoo....What one scene was good? I may have been out taking a whizz when that was on


I am talking about the way the scene where the vice admiral takes out snokes fleet.
The effects were great and the use of a few seconds silence followed by muted sounds of ships blowing up was incredibly well done


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## The Basket (Dec 29, 2017)

If you are familiar with the Rebels cartoon... Commander Sato does a similar collision. And a large object at light speed should have destroyed whatever it hits. Not chopped a bit off.
For JKim Sato is Asian and voiced by an Asian actor. So Star Wars was representing Asians before Last Jedi.

Rebels is a better showing of the Star Wars universe than the tripe we are discussing.


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## tyrodtom (Dec 29, 2017)

How can you hear a ship blowing up in the vacuum of space, unless you're in that ship ?


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## rochie (Dec 29, 2017)

tyrodtom said:


> How can you hear a ship blowing up in the vacuum of space, unless you're in that ship ?


Well yes we all know that really !

The clue is in the genre "science fiction" documentaries they are not.

Is it the greatest movie made, no !
its not even the best star wars episode, but its a pretty decent nights entertainment for me as a fan of the star wars movies (not that bothered by the whole expanded universe) since seeing a new hope when i was a 7year old kid.


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## The Basket (Dec 30, 2017)

I wonder if Asian cinema go on about how many white people are in their films.
Keeps Kim Jong Un up all night with worry.


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## The Basket (Feb 12, 2018)

New Han Solo film.
Early doors but the critics out saying it's garbage already even though not out yet. Based purely on trailers. I will keep judgement until I sees it. If I sees it. Not decided if I will go cinema to see it. Depends on what I hear. But not going to jump as Last Jedi has certainly made me think twice.
Oddly it's the market what decides good and bad and toy sales are below expectations and China was a flop so Disney will have to decide why that was the case. Probably not enough gay characters. 
It's all about the money and Disney bought a formula with Star Wars which worked and then they tried to change it which didn't and now we face star wars films until the end of time.
Once the magic and public goodwill goes then you're flogging a dead horse and I fear Disney will kill star wars off until the last dollar can be milked.
I hope Disney realise this.


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Feb 12, 2018)

How can anyone judge a movie by a single trailor?


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## The Basket (Feb 12, 2018)

Star Wars has become politicised so there are people out there who want to see Disney fail or have an agenda.
I just want Star Wars!
Although the Han Solo actor is said to be cardboard so that could be a weak link and the film has virtually been reshot which is never a good omen.
But I will only judge when I watch the whole film. In my experience the better the trailer, the worse the film.


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Feb 12, 2018)

Cardboard? You see him for like 5 sec in the trailor.

People just want to bitch to bitch...


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## Ivan1GFP (Feb 12, 2018)

> My Family saw this a few weeks back but not all at the same time.
> I have already seen this mentioned a few times, so my opinions won't be new in this thread.
> 
> The Last Jedi was a fun example of a Space Fantasy, after all, that IS what SF stands for right?
> ...



Hello Gentlemen,
I actually wrote this about a month ago in another forum but I believe it is still a pretty good summary of my thoughts on "The Last Jedi".
We have all grown attached to the old characters in Star Wars and it is kind of hard to see them "messed up" in the name of political correctness. As with many things, we don't own them though. Disney does and doesn't seem to mind using them up.

<SPOILER ALERT>

I thought the Episodes 7 & 8 were entertaining but don't fit well as a part of a bigger universe They like the more recent Star Trek movies and Discovery series are pretty light on the Science part of science fiction. 
They don't even fit well within their own "Physics".
Why didn't the First Order fleet just jump a few ships through Hyperspace and cut off the Resistance fleet? The audience of this genre tends to be pretty science and tactics oriented and notice these things.
How the heck do you "Drop" bombs in space?
(Both of these questions were brought up in other forums and not by me.)
The vast distances in space are apparently of no concern if it does not support a story line.

As for race and homosexuality, I believe we are a little too hung up on ourselves and what we have on this planet.
This is supposed to be a "Space Fantasy".
What race was Snoke?
I personally never cared to find out what race was for the actor that played Poe.
expanding this a bit to Star Trek....
What race is an Orion slave girl?
How about Klingons, Vulcans, Tellarites, Gorn, Tholians, Cardassians or Ferengi?
Why does it matter? I thought we were supposed to be well above this kind of quota system. 

The scenes ARE pretty though.
I guess this is a whole lot like dating a beautiful woman who doesn't have a brain in her head.

- Ivan.


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## The Basket (Feb 12, 2018)

I find it odd to discuss what is real in star wars universe. It's mumbo jumbo so saying bombs don't drop in space is like saying the Death Star has no plumbing for toilets. It's all faaake!
Problem is that if it says star wars on the tin then star wars is what people want and expect. So can't blame high expectation coz that is what Disney hype is for. So if Disney don't deliver on the trade description then they can only blame themselves if some fans get upset


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## Ivan1GFP (Feb 12, 2018)

The Basket said:


> I find it odd to discuss what is real in star wars universe. It's mumbo jumbo so saying bombs don't drop in space is like saying the Death Star has no plumbing for toilets. It's all faaake!
> Problem is that if it says star wars on the tin then star wars is what people want and expect. So can't blame high expectation coz that is what Disney hype is for. So if Disney don't deliver on the trade description then they can only blame themselves if some fans get upset



Hello The Basket,
When there is no connection to anything we know and expect, then is there any means of actually understanding the events or being able to place them in some kind of context?
We all know there is no sound in space, but don't mind hearing the swish as a starship flies by or hearing the Death Star explode because we know there has to be some license for dramatic effect.
We don't worry too much when every space alien speaks pretty decent English because subtitles get pretty cumbersome after a while.

- But -

If bombs can "drop" in space from one ship to another, then there is a "down" and gravity. If there is gravity in outer space and a direction it goes in, then is this really space?
If their galaxy just became so small that travelling from one star system to another only takes a couple hours without FTL travel, then how is this even remotely similar to the galaxy we live in?
This is like having a story set on Earth in which a character has breakfast in London and drives to Peking for lunch and then walks to a meeting in New York right after lunch.
Wouldn't it be cool if a child could split himself in the morning so that one remains in bed to sleep more while another goes online for video games and a third copy goes to school for the day? Perhaps this can be done by beings in some universe but we would not have very much in common with them.

Heck, we have been arguing about what the properties are of midichlorians and what the force can and cannot do and whether a corpse eliminates the possibility of a "force ghost". Those are all entirely inventions of the Star Wars universe and we are trying to gather some kind of understanding of their rules and limitations.
If we spend so much time trying to quantify and understand purely imaginative concepts, then how do we ignore the things we already "know"?

Should we be concerned if the next story has Darth Vader stroll in from Valhalla and unburn himself and shed his suit?
How about Han Solo coming back into the story.... "It was but a flesh wound...."
Both of these would be cool to see but would make no sense.

....and that is why I say this isn't that far from watching fireworks.

- Ivan.


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## The Basket (Feb 12, 2018)

Star Wars is fantasy and the universe and the force belong to Disney so if Disney say the force is unicorns and star beams then that's what it is. My main concern is Last Jedi was at best a mediocre film and the character of Luke Skywalker was totally out of synch. We were sold but never delivered the goods. People want escapist fantasy not how poor children in India have to beg for scraps. We don't want that. Escapist nonsense every time. 
The bit in Rogue One where Darth Vader went chop chop in the corridor was absolutely immense and I was aghast and staggered at such awful power. Imagine if you were in that corridor facing such power it was terrifying cinema.


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## Ivan1GFP (Feb 12, 2018)

The Basket said:


> Star Wars is fantasy and the universe and the force belong to Disney so if Disney say the force is unicorns and star beams then that's what it is. My main concern is Last Jedi was at best a mediocre film and the character of Luke Skywalker was totally out of synch. We were sold but never delivered the goods. People want escapist fantasy not how poor children in India have to beg for scraps. We don't want that. Escapist nonsense every time.
> The bit in Rogue One where Darth Vader went chop chop in the corridor was absolutely immense and I was aghast and staggered at such awful power. Imagine if you were in that corridor facing such power it was terrifying cinema.



Hello The Basket,
Do you see any contradictions in accepting that a universe and "the force" behave however Disney wants and then stating that a single person in that fantasy universe, an imaginary character named Luke Skywalker is "out of synch".

The fact that the law of Universal Gravitation has been repealed doesn't bother you but the odd behaviour of a single character does???
In case you were wondering, I didn't find Luke Skywalker's explanation of his actions to be very convincing either.
A little odd behaviour might be the mark of a genius. A bit more and the person is just plain nuts.

I never saw Rogue One, so I can't comment there.
Your description of "such power" tells me that you are using what you see on the screen and measuring it against other things that you know about.
Why is correct to do that and completely ignore astronomical distances, gravitation that you were taught in school and laws of the Star Wars universe that we have deduced from watching prior movies?

- Ivan.


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## The Basket (Feb 12, 2018)

In Rogue One, Darth Vader was acting in character and using force powers that we are aware of. 
Star Wars is not historical fact so the story can be whatever. Whether I like the story is the issue. Disney have paid 4 billion and if they want Mark Hamill to dress up in drag and hop on one leg and for gravity not to work then that's up to them. As far as I am concerned it's whether I buy into it that's the issue.


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## Ivan1GFP (Feb 13, 2018)

The Basket said:


> In Rogue One, Darth Vader was acting in character and using force powers that we are aware of.
> Star Wars is not historical fact so the story can be whatever. Whether I like the story is the issue. Disney have paid 4 billion and if they want Mark Hamill to dress up in drag and hop on one leg and for gravity not to work then that's up to them. As far as I am concerned it's whether I buy into it that's the issue.



That really makes for a difficult discussion with any kind of common understanding, doesn't it?

- Ivan.


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## The Basket (Feb 13, 2018)

It's very difficult to discuss Star Wars other than as entertainment.
A historical film like Braveheart is controversial because it's supposed to be based on actual history which is open for debate.
End of the day, this is a kids film which is designed for kids and not old men who should be doing stuff like mowing the lawn. So getting emotional charge from it or feeling cheated because it's not my Star Wars is just not what I want to do. I was annoyed but that has passed.

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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Feb 13, 2018)

Not for old men who should be mowing the lawn...wow


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## The Basket (Feb 13, 2018)

To be honest Last Jedi has killed off Star Wars for me. It was such a mediocre mess of a film that I begrudged the time and effort it took to watch it. 
There are better films out there.


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Feb 13, 2018)

We get it...

You must be in denial though, since you have been telling everyone this since December 20, 2017. You know telling yourself these things over and over reassures yourself.

Some of us have a different opinion, but we accept that, and don’t have to tell everyone this over and over in some weird attemp to convert.

Don’t you have a yard to mow anyhow? Mine can wait while I watch some Last Jedi...


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## Wayne Little (Feb 14, 2018)

Think I will join you Chris...


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## GrauGeist (Apr 25, 2018)

I absolutely LOVED that scene in Rogue 1 where Darth Vader went full-savage on the defenders in the passageway...that is the Darth Vader of legend (and SW canon). He was not a nice person.

And speaking of canon, Star Wars canon, much like Star Trek, has expectations among followers. It's nice that some people show up for the movie to be simply entertained. But for others, there is a level of expectations that the storyline will follow a path (more or less predictable) as the books (which the movies of either SW or ST) are drawn from.
When I went to see The Force Awakens, my expectations were rather let down. It had a familiar feel, but I left the theater wondering what just happened.
When I went to see The Last Jedi, I wasn't really impressed. There were some good scenes, but again, I left the theater a little let down.
On the otherhand, Rogue 1 was dynamic. It was classic fast-paced in-your-face Star Wars. It had the same feel of adventure and energy as episodes IV, V and VI did...complete with a Lord Vader beat-down! When I left the theater after seeing R1, I was already wanting to see it again. Episodes VII and VIII did not do that for me.

I am looking forward to the Han Solo movie. It looks like it should be good, and it does touch on the fact that Solo originally went to the Imperial pilot school and should explain quite a few questions that were left unanswered over 30 years ago in the original three movies. And many people have asked why Solo defected, but it wasn't unusual for TIE pilots to defect - many of the top Rebel X-Wing pilots were former TIE pilots.

Matter of fact, when I went to see the first Star Wars movie (episode IV - A New Hope), I was enthralled by the TIE pilots. And so much so, that many years later, I ended up portraying one with Stormtrooper Ranch - we do charity work as Star Wars characters, especially for the benefit of children who are very ill.

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## wlewisiii (Apr 25, 2018)

Finally watched it this weekend with my son. We both loved it. 

My only comment is that the single most important scene in the movie is the last one.


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Apr 25, 2018)

wlewisiii said:


> Finally watched it this weekend with my son. We both loved it.
> 
> My only comment is that the single most important scene in the movie is the last one.



Prepare to be told how terrible it is over, and over, over...

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## wlewisiii (Apr 25, 2018)

That's ok. First time I saw Star Wars (No New Hope, no IV) was the day before both Time and Newsweek had it on their front covers. The theater was half empty but those of us there loved it. I even loved it waiting hours in line to see it again  Some of the movies since have been better than others - I'd say best to worst IV, V, RO VIII, VII, VI, III, II, I ) - but they all had good bits and were all enjoyable in their own way. I'm looking forward to Solo & even more to IX.

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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Apr 25, 2018)

wlewisiii said:


> That's ok. First time I saw Star Wars (No New Hope, no IV) was the day before both Time and Newsweek had it on their front covers. The theater was half empty but those of us there loved it. I even loved it waiting hours in line to see it again  Some of the movies since have been better than others - I'd say best to worst IV, V, RO VIII, VII, VI, III, II, I ) - but they all had good bits and were all enjoyable in their own way. *I'm looking forward to Solo & even more to IX.*



As am I.

Unfortunetely I won’t be able to see Solo on opening night, as I will be over the North Atlantic on my way to Germany.


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## Ivan1GFP (Apr 25, 2018)

The first time I saw "Episode IV: A New Hope" was in College a few years after the movie first came out.
It was a show on campus and my new Girlfriend fell asleep during the movie....
<sigh>

- Ivan.


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Apr 25, 2018)

Ivan1GFP said:


> The first time I saw "Episode IV: A New Hope" was in College a few years after the movie first came out.
> It was a show on campus and my new Girlfriend fell asleep during the movie....
> <sigh>
> 
> - Ivan.



I would have broken up with her...

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## GrauGeist (Apr 25, 2018)

Ivan1GFP said:


> The first time I saw "Episode IV: A New Hope" was in College a few years after the movie first came out.
> It was a show on campus and my new Girlfriend fell asleep during the movie....
> <sigh>
> 
> - Ivan.


No one needs that sort of negativity in their life!


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## The Basket (Apr 26, 2018)

The last trailer for the Solo film was very good and got me going. A good trailer usually means nothing so still on the fence.
I can see it when it opens on the 25 may in the UK but didn't want to see it until I got the full reviews and chatter.
But I probably will. Easily led.


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## mikewint (Apr 26, 2018)

The two non-sequential movies Rogue and Solo can be taken on their own merits almost as "stand-alones" where as Force and Last should be part of a sequence and as such should fit into the other six like a jigsaw puzzle pieces. Another big factor is/was the big time gap between Revenge and Force, i.e.: 10 years and it's even worse in terms of the numeric sequence of the films. The gap (our time) between Return and Force was 32 years. Another factor IMHO was the change in ownership to Dizzy. With their unlimited funds and vast talent pool a LOT of expectations were being formed. The almost totally un-original storyline of Force and the blatant PC casting was (to me) a huge let down but then again I was actually there for New Hope and first hand remember being totally blown away by that first movie.
So was Last a bad movie?? It's always point of view and had I never seen a previous SW movie I would most likely been stunned. BUT having "lived through" the first 6 films, Last's shabby treatment of Luke (even Mark Hamill objected til Dizzy waived their checkbook in his face) un-original storylines, super blatant PC casting, and all the other "it makes no sense" stuff that I previously posted about, Dizzy's two entries don't fit well into the established SW Cannon and in that sense they're "bad"


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## Ivan1GFP (Apr 26, 2018)

DerAdlerIstGelandet said:


> I would have broken up with her...





GrauGeist said:


> No one needs that sort of negativity in their life!



Whenever there is a lot of hype about a movie, I tend not to see it for a while if at all. I am not one of the bandwagon types.
I forget whether it was 1976 or 1977 that "A New Hope" came out, but this was probably late 1982 or early 1983 when I saw it with my Girlfriend at the time. My own thoughts at that time were that the special effects were pretty good and that the movie was good, but even for $1, I wasn't planning on going back to watch it again.
At the time, the movie like the girlfriend was good in some ways and both had potential.

Forty years later, our expectations are different. Movie technology is different. There is established canon.
People (outside the Star War franchise) think more about space travel and the physics of Faster than Light travel that is necessary to have any decent story in space.

The audience is smarter. There is now the Internet and not just ARPANet.

"The Last Jedi" wasn't any worse of a movie than "A New Hope", but it is being evaluated against 40 years of a lot of very smart people who have tried to understand the rules of this fantasy universe.
People today often get critical opinions from others all around the world and not just among the small group of friends who saw the movie with them..

FWIW My other friends didn't seem to like that girlfriend either and I never really figured out why.

- Ivan.


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## The Basket (Apr 27, 2018)

I have decided to watch Solo.
I have a bad feeling about this.

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## Wayne Little (Apr 27, 2018)

Take a couple of asprin to calm you....


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## Ivan1GFP (Apr 27, 2018)

The Basket said:


> I have decided to watch Solo.
> I have a bad feeling about this.



Don't worry.
I doubt you will encounter any profound revelations.
Nothing will be different as you leave the theatre.
The World will be the same minus the couple hours of your life that you can never get back.

- Ivan.


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## Lucky13 (Apr 27, 2018)

_Maaaan...._am I glad that yous no waffling aboot Fast & Furious!!  

Now I'm trying to remember which Star Wars it was, that I last watched!


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## The Basket (Apr 30, 2018)

Deadpool 2 is on same time.
I think I will watch that instead.

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## GrauGeist (Apr 30, 2018)

Han Solo is going to be cool.
It's going to answer questions about Han's early years that were brought up in the first 3 movies (episode IV, V & VI). I think they did a good job on casting a young Solo and for the die-hards out there, there is no effin' way that Harrison Ford can portray himself 40 years in the past, let alone Billy Dee Williams...it's just not possible.
Plus, Han Solo is also being directed by Ron Howard, I'm willing to bet that this movie will have people on the edge of their seats like Rogue One did.

Besides, if a TIE Pilot can have a Porg for a pet, you can at least go see the movie with an objective eye...

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## The Basket (Apr 30, 2018)

I will watch it but another time.
On VHS or whatever the young people watch things on nowadays.
At least I can press pause when it's time to go tinkle.


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## The Basket (May 26, 2018)

I was in two minds to watch Solo and had a window of opportunity yesterday on the day of it release.
But I cracked a tooth and instaed spent Friday at the dentist!
So I would rather have a filling and go dentist than watch Solo!
The reviews are lukewarm so maybe for the best so will await it's release on dvd or on pay TV.


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## GrauGeist (May 26, 2018)

I saw Solo on Thursday and thought it was really good!

No spoilers, but I will say that it was a solid performance by all, plenty of good action and dutifully used the correct props from that time period in the SW canon AND did not make an effort to introduce any new "marketable" characters outside of canon.

It did touch on several points that were introduced in the original movies (eps. IV, V and VI), it had the look and feel of the originals and was all in all a great time - I'm going back this evening to see it again.


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## mikewint (May 26, 2018)

I'm waiting til the crowds die down. I'm looking forward to it and since it is "out of sequence" like Rogue One I hope to be less critical.
I just hope Dizzy actually does a decent story line.


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## DerAdlerIstGelandet (May 26, 2018)

GrauGeist said:


> *I saw Solo on Thursday and thought it was really good!*
> 
> No spoilers, but I will say that it was a solid performance by all, plenty of good action and dutifully used the correct props from that time period in the SW canon AND did not make an effort to introduce any new "marketable" characters outside of canon.
> 
> It did touch on several points that were introduced in the original movies (eps. IV, V and VI), it had the look and feel of the originals and was all in all a great time - I'm going back this evening to see it again.



And prepare to be told you are wrong, and it sucks, over, and over, and over...

Oh, and again, over and over.

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## The Basket (May 26, 2018)

Considering the mess Disney got into making the film then making a passable film which makes even dollar one will be a win. Seems Disney have milked the cash cow dry as toy sales and Chinese box office are well below expected. It will be interesting times to see what happens with Solo and how this affects episode 9.


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## The Basket (Jun 23, 2018)

Seems as though Solo is going down as a loss making bomb. Which is a shame for the film as, although not watched it, but been told it's Okey dokey.
Doncha just love been right!


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## GrauGeist (Jun 24, 2018)

The Basket said:


> Seems as though Solo is going down as a loss making bomb. Which is a shame for the film as, although not watched it, but been told it's Okey dokey.
> Doncha just love been right!


I'm going to be extremely blunt here, so fasten your seatbelt.
You are judging a movie you have never seen, based on the opinions of who?
The critics who are paid for their opinion and don't know their azz from a hole in the ground?
The die-hard SW fanbois who think that there should have only been the three movies (eps IV, V & VI) and none other?
The staunch loyalists who feel that Harrison Ford should have played the part even though he is over 40 years older than his character?

Seriously. I am a hard-core SW fan, I saw Rogue 1 and Han Solo and felt BOTH had the spirit and energy that is worthy of ANH, ESB and RotJ. I wasn't impressed with Eps. I, II and III. I did not like Eps. VII and VIII BUT, I enjoyed Rogue 1 and Solo.

So at this point in time, you are not right. You are claiming you're right based on other people's opinions.

Therefore, I issue you a challenge; see the Solo movie. Be fair to yourself and the rest and sit down with a clear mind and see it through. Come back and write an honest review and then, we will accept your opinion.

And...by the way, provide a picture of your movie ticket stub or the review will be invalid.

BTW: I have my stubs and can provide pics on request.

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## The Basket (Jun 24, 2018)

The film is neither here nor there.
Fact is its losing money. Lots of money. 
Disney has taken the Star Wars fanbase and treated them as cash cows. And tried to Palm off political films as star Wars and called out any criticism as politics inspired.
So no I haven't watched Solo although I will do at some point Disney is a business and Star Wars which should have been a license to print money is now losing money. At the cinema at dvd sales and toy sales. End of the day it's about money. Not art or cultural social nonsense.


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## mikewint (Jun 24, 2018)

Dave, 100% agree. Solo and Rogue are good movies and stand alone very nicely. I personally don't give a fig's newton what any so called critic (especially Rotten Tomatoes) thinks or rates ANY movie. Now Dizzy's VII and VIII entries into the trilogy of trilogies are another story

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## nuuumannn (Jun 24, 2018)

Haven't seen Solo yet. Will do eventually being a SW fan, but I did see Deadpool 2, which I thought was awesome!

Was saddened to hear the s**tty nature of some of the criticism surrounding The Last Jedi, particularly that female members of the cast were harrassed online. That sucks. It's a fricken movie for god's sakes. These guys and girls deserve our support. So you don't like a movie they were in? So what? Go put Empire back on and remind yourself as to why we love the series. But online harrassment?! Cowards.


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## The Basket (Jun 25, 2018)

I agree that online racial and gender abuse is wrong and if you're not willing to say it to their face then don't say it.
However Lucasfilms and Disney have said very clearly that their is a political and race and gender bias in these films so have opened the door for the crazies. I am not excusing criminal behaviour but to be advised that any criticism of Last Jedi is due to hating women or racism has created a confrontational nature.


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## Graeme (Sep 12, 2018)

Off topic.

The original Star Wars had a floaty thingy with Luke and the other fella who played mind games on a guard - "You don't need to see his identification".

Saw this the other day and reminded me of that scene.....

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## GrauGeist (Sep 23, 2018)

Graeme said:


> Off topic.
> 
> The original Star Wars had a floaty thingy with Luke and the other fella who played mind games on a guard - "You don't need to see his identification".
> 
> ...


Not surprised, Graeme, George used a great deal of WWII inspired items throughout.
The Imperial TIE fighters had a Sperry ball for the cabin, the Imperial issued DL-44 blaster (best known as Han Solo's sidearm) is based on a Mauser C96, the Imperial blaster best known as the Stormtrooper's blaster, the E-11, is based on the British Sterling SMG.
The list goes on:
Imperial DLT-19D - German MG34
Imperial T-21 - American Lewis MG
DH-17 - highly modified L2A3 Sterling SMG

And so on...


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## The Basket (Sep 23, 2018)

The broomhandle more ww1.
Solo was a bust for Disney. Lost loadsa money. They saying it's 'Star Wars fatigue'
Not that fans stayed away in droves or that the messy production was to blame. 
Any franchise that abuses the fans gets its reward. 
A shame since a good stand alone film about Boba Fett or Obi Wan would be a killer. Still not watched the film but certainly will get there eventually.
Episode 9 will be a test of feeling. I think Disney need more laser swords.


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## nuuumannn (Sep 23, 2018)

A bit of the low sales with Solo is its release time. Within a month or so either side of it there was Black Panther, Avengers Infinity War and Deadpool, all three of which were box office gold and collectively spanked everything else released in the first half of 2018. Regardless of the 'universes' each of the films is from, most Star Wars fans will go to MCU films and whatever Deadpool is from (MCU too? I dunno), so too many mega blockbusters released at the same time - blockbuster fatigue? Star Wars films usually come out in December, so Solo was misplaced in that respect. I still haven't seen it, so can't hazard a guess as to whether or not it might have been a success had it been released in December.


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## Graeme (Sep 23, 2018)

GrauGeist said:


> Not surprised, Graeme, George used a great deal of WWII inspired items throughout.



Interesting Dave. 
Saw this one also, which reminded of a Star Wars movie - forget the episode, but the one with a young Darth Vader(?) skimming canyons in an air racer.
Although this one looks more like a super-duper floor polisher...


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## The Basket (Sep 23, 2018)

To my knowledge the guns would have been basic props and far easier to take an existing gun and add gizmos to it than make a new laser gun based on time and budget.
I kinda agree with the timing but Star Wars is the biggest of the franchises and so should have been number 1 regardless.
From my point of view Episode 9 should be a lock but even the optimistic are being pessimistic


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## GrauGeist (Sep 23, 2018)

When Lucas shot Ep. IV, he was on a shoe-string budget and England in the 1970's still had stockpiles of WWII material readily available.

So weapons like the Sterling L2A were abundant and easily modified.
The scope seen on the E-11 blaster rifle (stormtrooper's main arm) and the DL-44 (early version) was an M-19 telescope sight from several types of U.S. tanks, mainly the M4 Sherman.
The muzzle brake on the later DL-44 blaster was taken from an MG42.
The Lewis was modified by omitting the drum and modifying the water jacket.
Boba Fett's gun is a modified Webly & Scott 37mm grenade/flare launcher.
The Rebellion's A295 rifle is a modified MG44.

There's a great deal more, of course.

It's actually quite a bit of fun to look over the prop weapons and seeing if what surplus bits were used.


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