# Hitler: Worst Veteran of WWI?



## Soundbreaker Welch? (Apr 1, 2008)

Ok, this is a dumb thread, not meant to offend anyone.


----------



## Konigstiger205 (Apr 1, 2008)

Well I don't think he was, at least not in WW1, what he did later was another thing.Sure most people wish he would have died then but from what I know he served pretty well during WW1.Twice decorated and promoted.But if this thread refers on his life after WW1 than he was the worst veteran.


----------



## Soundbreaker Welch? (Apr 1, 2008)

Yeah, I'm not trying to diss the whatever bravery he showed in WWI, It's just his life after the wars I'm commenting on, his "veteran" years.

Nor am I trying to diss all German Veterans. Rommel was a brave and intelligent soldier already in WWI, taking mountains and towns, everyone admires the gallant Red Baron, and even Goring didn't do too bad, though somehow he lost some of his Aviation savyness when running the Luftwaffe in WWII.


----------



## A4K (Apr 1, 2008)

Not making him out to be a 'good guy' in any way, but I can sort of understand some of his ideals. 
He fought for his country as a common soldier in the first world war, and was even gassed (hence his personal vindiction not to use gases during WW II). His country lost the war, and he watched his country get torn apart by the Allies, with unbelievable tax rates as repayment for war costs, and chopping chunks off Germany, Austria and Hungary (the Hungarians lost a third of their country, including their coastal access and all natural resources. They were left with miles of flat pastureland, and Italy stole alot of the Tirol region of Austria at this time too). The currencies of Germany and Hungary collapsed, and the Austrian currency severly decreased in value as a result of the taxes, with a box of matches going for something like 600,000 Hungarian Pengő (a hitherto valuable currency), and people were starving everywhere.
I've often heard the opinion that the Allies practically forced the Axis countries into another war situation, as there was no way they could ever have repayed the 'debts' or improve their living standards. 
I reckon if Hitler hadn't come along, someone else would have.

(I am not in any way endorsing his actions against the surrounding countries, of course, but I can appreciate though that he saw no other option.)


----------



## Konigstiger205 (Apr 1, 2008)

Soundbreaker Welch? said:


> Yeah, I'm not trying to diss the whatever bravery he showed in WWI, It's just his life after the wars I'm commenting on, his "veteran" years.
> 
> Nor am I trying to diss all German Veterans. Rommel was a brave and intelligent soldier already in WWI, taking mountains and towns, everyone admires the gallant Red Baron, and even Goring didn't do too bad, though somehow he lost some of his Aviation savyness when running the Luftwaffe in WWII.



Well then I took the vote too early then, but A4K has a good point.


----------



## Soundbreaker Welch? (Apr 1, 2008)

Yeah, a sobering thought.


----------



## Thorlifter (Apr 1, 2008)

I believe he was a decent soldier in WWI. I believe he was so distraught that the war ended while he was in the hospital that he suffered "mental" blindness because he wanted to get back to the front.

Regardless of ideology, he was a loyal soldier.


----------



## JimmywiT (Apr 1, 2008)

A4K said:


> He fought for his country as a common soldier in the first world war, and was even gassed (hence his personal vindiction not to use gases during WW II).



The germans did use gas against the soviets holed up in caves under the Adzhimushkai quarries in the Crimea in WW2, but this was without the knowledge of Hitler. There is also unconfirmed (and probably false) reports of gas bieng used at Brest-Litovsk in 1941 and against British paratroopers on D +1.





A4K said:


> (the Hungarians lost a third of their country, including their coastal access and all natural resources.


Hungary historically has no claim to any coastal region. It has at points in the past had control over coastal regions of Croatia, but 3ethnic Magyars (Hungarians) live on the central Hungarian plain and the Transylvanian plateau, although they were largely removed by the Romanians 1945-1989. During world war one Hungary was a part of the Austrian Empire (although it enjoyed "duel monarchy" status) and thus technically had no territory at all in 1918.



A4K said:


> I've often heard the opinion that the Allies practically forced the Axis countries into another war situation, as there was no way they could ever have repayed the 'debts' or improve their living standards.
> I reckon if Hitler hadn't come along, someone else would have.



Yeah it is often said that the seeds of future conflict were sown at Versailles in 1919. Although the world recession of the 30s also had a big part to play in voters deciding to support extremists. Votes in germany for the Nazis and Communists increased greatly from 1929. But the shame of defeat was a major part of the German pysche in the inter war period.


----------



## Hunter368 (Apr 1, 2008)

By all accounts Hitler was a very good soldier during WW1, he did his duty.


----------



## syscom3 (Apr 1, 2008)

Read this thread I started last year.

http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/world-war-i/pt1-fateful-encounter-private-henry-tandey-5983.html


----------



## Célérité (Apr 1, 2008)

Hitler: Worst Veteran of WWI????

If you read your history books, it's an obvious fact.



> Hitler was a very good soldier during WW1, he did his duty



no doubt, so what!!! Fact is here, he was the greatest mentally ill person of the twentieth century.


----------



## pbfoot (Apr 1, 2008)

An honourable mention might go to Field Marshall Petain who went from hero in WW1 to leader of a puppet gov't in Vichy


----------



## Hunter368 (Apr 1, 2008)

Célérité said:


> Hitler: Worst Veteran of WWI????
> 
> If you read your history books, it's an obvious fact.
> 
> ...



If you actually live in France I can understand your reasoning, but I would say Stalin was much more insane or evil then Hitler.

If you actually read history books without bias you would say Hitler was a good soldier in WW1.


----------



## timshatz (Apr 1, 2008)

Deciding between Hitler and Stalin, that's a tough one. Technically, Stalin didn't fight in WW1 so he might get a hall pass on that one. 

On the other hand, Hitler had the advantage (if it was in fact an advantage) of physical bravery. He was not a coward when it came to a battlefield. By most accounts, Stalin was. Stalin never got closer to the fighting than several miles when the fighting was outside of Moscow and he went to see it (car got stuck in the mud). Claimed he was at the front thereafter. Afraid of plots, afraid of flying (only flew once), the guy was a phsycological piece of work. 

Both were paranoid, but Stalin's was probably to the greater degree. Both were both probably psychotic as well.


----------



## DerAdlerIstGelandet (Apr 1, 2008)

Célérité said:


> Hitler: Worst Veteran of WWI????
> 
> If you read your history books, it's an obvious fact.
> 
> ...



You are correct that he was a crazy mad man but I dont think that his WW1 and pre WW1 days can be counted against him. At that point in time he had not done anything wrong.


----------



## Hunter368 (Apr 1, 2008)

Agreed


----------



## Célérité (Apr 1, 2008)

> An honourable mention might go to Field Marshall Petain who went from hero in WW1 to leader of a puppet gov't in Vichy


Absolutely, Pétain was an hero during the first world war, he had save the france. But lost all honour with the Vichy government. The french collaboration it's not a secret and the Vichy's police (la milice) participated actively to deport of Jew.
It's not a coincidence if Pétain finished his life in prison. He died in prison.
We can't compare him with Hitler.He wasn't an antisemite.



> If you actually read history books without bias you would say Hitler was a good soldier in WW1.


I don't call into question the military capacity of Hitler. I just said among the survivor of the WW1, it was the worst in comparison of consequence of his ideas on the World.


----------



## Hunter368 (Apr 1, 2008)

Célérité said:


> I don't call into question the military capacity of Hitler. I just said among the survivor of the WW1, it was the worst in comparison of consequence of his ideas on the World.



Vague thread title but all it asked was "Hitler the worse WW1 vet?"

I would say he was a good Vet for Germany by all standards in 1918. It was not until later did he go nuts/evil.

Just comparing person to person (regardless if they served or not), I still say Stalin was worse then Hitler.


----------



## pbfoot (Apr 1, 2008)

Stalin shoundn't be mentioned as for what i know he was not a veteran


----------



## Hunter368 (Apr 1, 2008)

Is is not being mentioned in this poll. He is being talked about totally differently from what this thread is about. As I have said already. Just so happens he is being mentioned, as a side subject, in this thread. No one has referred to him as a Vet of any war.


----------



## A4K (Apr 2, 2008)

Re Hungary, etc, good points Jimmy.
The Hungarians were the lesser party (but the larger country) of the Austro-Hungarian empire, but try telling them that! I lived for 3 1/2 years in Austria, and have for the last 6 years lived in Hungary. It's a VERY touchy subject on both sides, full of national pride, arrogance and ignorance. The main point is the Austrians were besieged by the Turks, with-held and eventually defeated them, driving them not only out of Austria, but Hungary aswell. The problem was they didn't leave, and annexed hungary as part of Austria. The Hungarians revolted a number of times, and it was decided to recognize the Hungarian Monarchy (creating the dual-Monarchy) to stabilize the Empire. 

Croatia was officially a part of Hungary,so from that point of view they did have coastal access. Likewise Slovenia was a part of Austria, aswell as the large port of Trieste, "acquired" by Italy at the end of WW I. hard to believe now the Austrians once had a large Navy!

The Hungarians in the cut-off regions are still despised to this day, although Hungary is the first destination for many people (especially Romanians) seeking a better life (almost a joke considering our wage scale - the minimum weekly wage in Ireland is more than my monthly pay-packet, and as a professional solderer I earn a fairly good wage in comparison to many people)

This is by the by, anyway. I was trying to make the point of conditions in central Europe at the time.


----------



## Kruska (May 7, 2008)

Winston Churchill, 

he hated Germany or Germans since the Boer War, refused to take Hitler’s hand and share the spoils with him, thus creating the downfall of Germany and Stalin’s expansion into half of Europe.

One could see it this way, right??? 

Regards
Kruska


----------



## DerAdlerIstGelandet (May 8, 2008)

No offense I dont think very many people will agree with you. I too would rather have seen the fall of Germany than Europe ruled by Hitler.


----------



## parsifal (May 8, 2008)

Leader of the Hungarian state during the war was Admiral horthy, an officer in a non-existent navy


----------



## parsifal (May 8, 2008)

Churchill was merely following the time honoured British Foreign Policy principal of supporting the second most powerful continental power. If any one power was allowed to dominate, there was a risk to britains domination of Europe. Of course, the brits had by wwii been outflanked by two countries, the US and Japan. British lion was starting to lose its teeth by that stage


----------



## A4K (May 8, 2008)

'Non existant Navy'??


----------



## Kruska (May 8, 2008)

DerAdlerIstGelandet said:


> No offense I dont think very many people will agree with you. I too would rather have seen the fall of Germany than Europe ruled by Hitler.



Hello D.A.I.G.

Well I do sincerely hope that no one agrees on my forwarded statement, after all this is a forum for discussions right? Not just for expressing ones true opinion. 

Regards
Kruska


----------



## parsifal (May 8, 2008)

wwii as far as i know there was no Royal Hungarian Navy


----------



## A4K (May 8, 2008)

There wasn't a seperate Hungarian Navy - the Navy was Austro-Hungarian and was known as the K.u.K Kriegsmarine.

Austro-Hungarian Navy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


----------



## parsifal (May 8, 2008)

I know that he was a memeber of a navy in wwi for a country that in wwii no longer existed. Geez!!!! 

was there a navy for Hungary in wwii???apart from a few row boats on the Danube, I think its safe to say no


----------



## A4K (May 8, 2008)

Austria and Hungary were not only seperated but broken up the Allies after WW I, all port access being lost to them in the process, hence no Navy for either of them after that time, with the exception as you say of a number of patrol boats on the Danube and Tisza rivers (These days under control of the army, in both countries )


----------



## Patoruzu (Jun 13, 2008)

This was an excellent discussion, and as italian heritage I can understand all the points about the creation of "Hitler" then my grandma came to Argentina in 1937 and she was still at his death 1984 a fervorous defender of the facsist ITALY and of the DUCE - and remember that Italy was one of the victors of WWI.
The years after the WWI wasn´t the best, much more for the "loosers".

And if I´m not wrong G Britain and France make the conditions for the surrender proposed by USA (I guess - Wodrow Wilson) totally dif´rent, submerging Germany, Austria, the balcans, in such a kaos.

So many people are guilty of the born of the "Hitlers" - It is easy to say just they (the germans) were guilty.

So it was good to hear those things here around


----------

