# SAAF Foggia, Italy 1944



## soalebm (Feb 23, 2008)

I'm currently trying to figure out as much as possible about the air bases around Foggia, Italy during WWII. I'm in contact with the 2nd, 301st, 463rd, and 99th bomb group websites but I want to know more about the South African AF in 1944 and the German units that operated ther before the allies atacked in 1943. If anyone has any info about the SAAF units or any information about allied or axis planes, men, etc flying from Foggia around august-november 1944 let me know. 
the smallest bit helps!
thanks,
Brandon


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## Henk (Feb 23, 2008)

Try the war museum website here in South Africa. 

Try contacting them with your question and they will hopefully get back to you.

South African Air Force Museum

WELCOME TO THE SOUTH AFRICAN NATIONAL MUSEUM OF MILITARY HISTORY

Hope it will help, I will try and have a look in my WW2 books to see if I can find something.


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## Wildcat (Feb 23, 2008)

G'day Brandon, from an Aussie point of view 451 (spitfires) and 458 (Wellington) sqdn's RAAF were based at Foggia during that time frame.


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## soalebm (Feb 27, 2008)

Thanks a lot gentleman I will try the SAAF museum and I I have not begun researching the RAAF yet but you provided me with a good place to start!
cheers,
Brandon


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## pwesleynd93 (Jul 6, 2008)

My dad was a pilot with the 463rd and he's alive and well in Rochester, NY. I'm home for a visit and we were talking about Foggia just last night because it came up in a book I'm reading. Tell me what you want to know and I'll ask him.


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## Micdrow (Jul 7, 2008)

Try this web site The South African Air Force


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## jhor9 (Aug 5, 2008)

soalebm said:


> I'm currently trying to figure out as much as possible about the air bases around Foggia, Italy during WWII. I'm in contact with the 2nd, 301st, 463rd, and 99th bomb group websites but I want to know more about the South African AF in 1944 and the German units that operated ther before the allies atacked in 1943. If anyone has any info about the SAAF units or any information about allied or axis planes, men, etc flying from Foggia around august-november 1944 let me know.
> the smallest bit helps!
> thanks,
> Brandon



I was in the 99th at Foggia #2-Tortorella, moving up from Tunis during Dec43 I completed my tour of 50 missions/sorties in mid Feb44. I don't know how else I can help
Jules Horowitz
pilot 348th Sqdn


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## Njaco (Aug 5, 2008)

Try this site. has a lot of great stuff about that time peroid and area.

Home Page


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## caroline_b (Jan 3, 2009)

Hi there

My Dad was in SAAF 12 Squadron flying Lockheed-Martin B26 Marauders (bombers) - in Italy for most of 1944. I'm not sure what sort of info you want but have his logbooks. A lot of the flying was done from temporary airfields - pressed steel plate runways which were put down by the engineers then picked up and moved when the front moved.

I think 39 Squadron was also in Italy at the time, and I think the wing ended up under the command of Major Jack Robb (who was OC 39 Squadron if I've got this right, was shot down in a Marauder - survived).

The SAAF definitely had Spitfire squadrons in Italy as well but I don't know much about which ones - probably 43 Squadron.

There's a Marauder bomber site at http://www.b26.com which has quite a lot of info.

Hope that helps,

Caroline

Burning Blue


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## mhuxt (Jan 4, 2009)

IIRC 60 SAAF flew Mosquitos on recce sorties from Foggia, though I'm going completely from memory here...


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## hilli (Jan 20, 2009)

Hi

My father was an Observer (navigator/bomb aimer) on Martin Baltimores in 15 Squadron SAAF during 1944 at foggia.


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## flakhappy (Jan 22, 2009)

I was a radio operator in a B-17 crew in the 97th BG based at Amendola duringthe last half of 1944, near Foggia. The 2nd BG and a sqdn. of the RAF's 5 Group was also based at Amendola.


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## seesul (Jan 22, 2009)

Welcome onboard flakhappy!
A friend of mine mentioned in my signature was shot down over my country on Aug. 29, 1944. Visited me here in 2005 and 2007. He was a member of 2ndBG, 20th Sqdn.
Could you tell us more about your tour?
Attached few pics of Amendola air base from today (Google Earth).


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## flakhappy (Jan 22, 2009)

greetings, Seesul. Thanks for the images. I and my wife visited the present Italian base at Amendola in 1990. Much more civilized, but even so, much the same as in 44. As you probably know, we were heavily engaged in attacking Hitlelr's oil, first at Ploesti, and then the synthetic plants in Silesia, which became a passion for us because they were so important to choke off. My crew lost two men KIA, one POW (Bucharest) and I was with another crew, made up of "bastards" from other crews, that crash-landed in then Yugoslavia. We walked out, with the help of a band of Tito's followers who were paid in food and ammo. for every crew they helped. Lovely time. We had a good bomb group, (the first in the 8th AF, back in Aug., 42). Bombed two targets in Czechoslovakia, as I recall: the Skoda Works at Pilsen and a huge railroad marshalling yard.


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## seesul (Jan 22, 2009)

Marshaling yards where? Pardubice? Ostrava? When has your tour began and ended up? Good to have you here!!!


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## flakhappy (Jan 23, 2009)

To Seesul: I've checked my records, and find that my missions include frag 
bombing the Pardubice airdrome Aug. 25, attacking the Brux (Most) refineries on Oct. 16 and the Pilsen target on Oct. 23, all in 1944. Of course we flew over Czechoslovakia territory on many missions to the Oder valley. They were long, cold and dangerous rides.


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## flakhappy (Jan 23, 2009)

Seesul: Don't know if you got my last msg. My crew was at Amendola from mid-July, 44, to early Jan., 45. Among other missions are those to Pardubice (airdrome), Brux (Most)(refineries) and Pilsen (Skoda). Flew over your country many times to German targets, including Oder valley synthetic refineries.


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## seesul (Jan 25, 2009)

thank you flakhappy. you were over pardubice on aug. 25 and 4 days later the whole 20th sqdn of the 2nd bg was erased from the sky over my town.
'thanks' to this loss my friendship with with 'jersey joe' could begin...
don´t you have any pics of amendola to post?


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## pzulba (Apr 28, 2009)

Hi

My Dad was an Air Gunner in the Royal Air Force (Volunteer Reserve), in Mar '44 he completed training in the UK and as he put it missed being posted to the 'Killing Fields' of Lincolnshire in the UK (RAF Bomber Command) 

Instead he was posted to Lydda in Palestine (now Lod in Israel) to 1675 Heavy Conversion Unit for traing on Liberator BVI's (B-24J's) and then to 34 Squadron SAAF

Then moved with 34 to Foggia Main(?) to link up with 31 Squadron SAAF which formed 2 Wing SAAF as part of RAF 205 Group who in turn, unusually for an RAF unit were part of US Fifteenth Air Force

Operating principally at night 31 34 SAAF were involved in varied ops:

Mining the Danube; Ploesti district; Warsaw Airlift (losses on 31 Sqd reached 75%), supplies to Partisans - Yugolsav Italian - heavy losses on 13 October, 5 from 31 1 from 34; Munich, various Austrian marshalling yards, daylight interdiction of German retreat through Albania also to Greece against ELAS communist guerillas

My dad switched to 31 Sqd following their heavy losses to Warsaw, his last op was to Graz in Mar '45;

If required I could post a 'reading list' covering some of the above

PZULBA - Out of Africa (Retired)


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## v2 (Apr 28, 2009)

Hi Pzulba,

I'm interesting in all about 31 and 34 SAAF Squadrons. Especially I'm looking for infos about their missions to Poland. A few mounths ago I found a Liberator's KH-152 "F" crash site in south Poland. This happened at October 16/17, 1944. I have a contact with families of Pilot and Air Gunner... maybe your Dad flew with them..

regards from Poland.


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## tomo pauk (Apr 29, 2009)

Hi, fakhappy,

I'm interested if SAAF attacked anything in the ex-Yugoslavia.


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## pzulba (Apr 30, 2009)

Tomo

From my Dad's log

4 Oct '44 Supplies to Yugoslav Partisans 12 containers from 800feet 

11 Oct '44 Supplies to Yugoslav Partisans 12 containers from 2500feet

21 Oct '44 Bombing Maribora Marshalling Yards Yugoslavia 5500 feet, 10 x 1000lb bombs, 10/10 cloud medium flak

4 Nov '44 Supplies to Yugoslav Partisans - Kladusa 12 containers from 400feet

6 Nov '44 Yugoslavia Podgorica bombing Troops 11 x 1000lb at 12000feet

8 Nov '44 Yugoslavia Sjenica bombing Roads MT 10 x 1000lb at 6500feet

18 Nov '44 Yugoslavia Sarajevo Marshalling Yards bombing 10 x 1000lb at 17000feet Flak

23 Nov '44 Yugoslavia Rogatica bombing Troops 12 x 500lb at 12000feet

25 Nov '44 Supplies to Yugoslav Partisans 12 containers from 7000feet

6 Dec '44 Supplies to Yugoslav Partisans

18 Dec '44 Yugoslavia Bombing Ground STRAFING MT on roads 12 x 500lbs

19 Dec '44 Sarajevo Marshalling Yards 12 x 500lbs 8500feet slight flak

25 Dec '44 Supplies to Yugoslav Partisans 12 containers from 800feet

2 Feb '45 Supplies to North Yugoslav Partisans FLOTSAM AREA 12 containers from 1400feet

3 Feb '45 Supplies to North Yugoslav Partisans FLOTSAM AREA 12 containers from 500feet

Above Night Ops in RED  DAYLIGHT Ops in BLUE

Ops 4 11 Oct - 34 SAAF - All others 31 SAAF primarily with Capt then Maj Carter

Trust the above is of use

PZULBA - Out of Africa Retired


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## pzulba (Jun 7, 2009)

v2 said:


> Hi Pzulba,
> 
> I'm interesting in all about 31 and 34 SAAF Squadrons. Especially I'm looking for infos about their missions to Poland. A few mounths ago I found a Liberator's KH-152 "F" crash site in south Poland. This happened at October 16/17, 1944. I have a contact with families of Pilot and Air Gunner... maybe your Dad flew with them..
> 
> regards from Poland.



Apologies for delayed response

From my Dad's log book, he flew with Lithgow as follows:

28 June 1944 - Aleppo to Cairo 3h 30m

6 July 1944 - Cairo to Castle Benito to Foggia 12h 40m

This would have been when 34 SAAF repositioned from Syria (where they had been on 'flag waving ops' to encourage the Turks) to Foggia 

PZULBA - Out of Africa (Retired)


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## seesul (Jun 10, 2009)

seesul said:


> thank you flakhappy. you were over pardubice on aug. 25 and 4 days later the whole 20th sqdn of the 2nd bg was erased from the sky over my town.
> 'thanks' to this loss my friendship with with 'jersey joe' could begin...
> don´t you have any pics of amendola to post?



Flakhappy- have you heard about this whole squadron loss back then? This squadron flew from Amendola as well...


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## flakhappy (Jun 21, 2009)

Seesul; Sorry for the delay. I knew that the 2nd BG had some big losses at about that time. My group, the 97th lost 7 planes at once on Sept. 13, 44, over Blechhammer in Silesia. I was in another sqdn. and saw only a lot of smoke and bits of airplane passing my windows. It was either a direct hit on a bomb bay or one plane dropped its bombs on another. I don't think it was ever resolved. A 2nd BG pilot brought a severely damaged pla ne back to base on Sept. 21, 44, after it was hit over Debreczen, Hungary. He flew the plane home and landed it using only wing controls and the throttles. A flak burst had blown a hole through the plane's waist, killing the radioman and both waist gunners. The plane was held together by a four-foot strip at the top and about a six-foot strip at the bottom. The tail wheel collapsed on landing and the waist buckled,causing the plane to skid to a stop riding on the ball turret. I was on the field and helped release the ball gunner from his turret. He had ridden home unable to move the turret or to communicate with the rest of the crew. He was pretty wild-eyed when he crawled out.


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## flakhappy (Jun 21, 2009)

Seesul: I see that I didn't answer your post entirely. I had seen present-day air photos of Amendola and am impressed that the entire layout of the Italian base is almost as it was in 1944, except for the palm trees, modern amenities, etc. Our bivouac area was pretty dismal 65 years ago. Six-man tents, etc.


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## lingo (Jun 21, 2009)

Two squadrons (at least) of RAF Wellingtons were based at Foggia during 1944/5. The book 'Out of the Italian Night' by Maurice Lihou has a great deal of information about the location.


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## flakhappy (Jun 21, 2009)

One of the RAF Wellingtons crashed into my squadron's bivouac area at Amendola, hitting several tents and killing several ground crewmen. It was in June, 1944, just before I joined the 97th Group.


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## seesul (Jun 21, 2009)

flakhappy said:


> Seesul; Sorry for the delay. I knew that the 2nd BG had some big losses at about that time. My group, the 97th lost 7 planes at once on Sept. 13, 44, over Blechhammer in Silesia. I was in another sqdn. and saw only a lot of smoke and bits of airplane passing my windows. It was either a direct hit on a bomb bay or one plane dropped its bombs on another. I don't think it was ever resolved. A 2nd BG pilot brought a severely damaged pla ne back to base on Sept. 21, 44, after it was hit over Debreczen, Hungary. He flew the plane home and landed it using only wing controls and the throttles. A flak burst had blown a hole through the plane's waist, killing the radioman and both waist gunners. The plane was held together by a four-foot strip at the top and about a six-foot strip at the bottom. The tail wheel collapsed on landing and the waist buckled,causing the plane to skid to a stop riding on the ball turret. I was on the field and helped release the ball gunner from his turret. He had ridden home unable to move the turret or to communicate with the rest of the crew. He was pretty wild-eyed when he crawled out.



Welcome back Flakhappy!
Guess you mean Sweat Pea Story... http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/aviation/b-17s-took-beating-11209.html
Btw, did I tell you we will have a 65th anniversary commemoration of the 20th Sqdn loss over my town this year?
A friend of mine, mentioned in my signature, is going to visit us again. He was among 49 survivors of the 9 crews that went down that day...
Some pics from his last visit are here http://forum.armyairforces.com/tm.aspx?m=127054&high=rudice
And also relatives of one airmen who was KIA are going to visit us as well. His name is Russell Meyrick, bombardier... more here http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/aviation/b-17s-took-beating-11209-2.html


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## flakhappy (Jun 21, 2009)

sorry, Seesul. I first posted this response in the wrong thread. That's a fine story that fills in some of the blanks for me about the 2nd BG plane. I know it is injaccurate only in on respect: the ball gunner didn't get out of the turret until after it landed. I and a couple other guys opened the turret and pulled him out onto the tround. In the picture you can see the ball door lying open on the ground. I have a picture of that plane taken from the other side. By the way, the plane at the top in the group of pictures is the famous "All American" from the 97th BG, 414th Sqdn. struck by an attacking Me109 over a Tunisian target.


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## seesul (Jun 22, 2009)

flakhappy said:


> I know it is injaccurate only in on respect: the ball gunner didn't get out of the turret until after it landed. I and a couple other guys opened the turret and pulled him out onto the tround. In the picture you can see the ball door lying open on the ground. I have a picture of that plane taken from the other side.



That is vey interesting! Would you like to tell your story to 2nd BG historian? If so I´d send you his e-mail via PM...


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## flakhappy (Jun 23, 2009)

seesul said:


> That is vey interesting! Would you like to tell your story to 2nd BG historian? If so I´d send you his e-mail via PM...



Sure, Seesul. Fire away. If I can add a touch to the record, that's fine.


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## seesul (Jun 23, 2009)

Thank you for your interest!
I just sent you a PM.


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## mr2bob (Jun 30, 2009)

flakhappy said:


> greetings, Seesul. Thanks for the images. I and my wife visited the present Italian base at Amendola in 1990. Much more civilized, but even so, much the same as in 44. As you probably know, we were heavily engaged in attacking Hitlelr's oil, first at Ploesti, and then the synthetic plants in Silesia, which became a passion for us because they were so important to choke off. My crew lost two men KIA, one POW (Bucharest) and I was with another crew, made up of "bastards" from other crews, that crash-landed in then Yugoslavia. We walked out, with the help of a band of Tito's followers who were paid in food and ammo. for every crew they helped. Lovely time. We had a good bomb group, (the first in the 8th AF, back in Aug., 42). Bombed two targets in Czechoslovakia, as I recall: the Skoda Works at Pilsen and a huge railroad marshalling yard.


Hello Flakhappy, I read some of your posts on the clean blue web site and you mentioned you flew B17's out of the Foggia airbase during the last half of 1944. What caught my eye was you were shot down over Yugoslavia and picked up by the Partisans. My Dad was also stationed in Foggia during the last half of 1944 and 1945. He also was shot down over Yugoslavia and picked up by Tito's people. His name was Bob Carey and was a tail gunner on a B17G with the 97th BG, 342 SQ. I believe his plane was called the Bitter Bitch. I didn't see where you said what Bomb Squadron you flew with. I just want to thank you for your service and how pleased I am reading your posts.


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## catscrds (Jul 20, 2009)

Hi, I am trying to get information on my Uncle Frederick Beach who was stationed at Foggia, Italy. He was killed in action while flying his 13th mission in 1944. The story I heard from my mom was that another group was supposed to fly but something happend and they needed volunteers to go on this mission. They were hit by flak. The pilot, Mc Cabe, and co pilot got out and thought they saw parachutes from the others. My uncle is buried in a group grave at Jefferson Barracks. I would love to get any info you might have on the base there and anything else. I am still trying to get the group he belonged to. I only know that he was a part of the 603 Bombardment Squadron. they flew B-17's. He was a part of the Europe, African, Middle East Campaign and American Campaign. Thanks so much for any help! Cathi


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## seesul (Jul 20, 2009)

Hi, are you sure about the 603th BS? It was a part of 398th BG but this group was stationed in England.
And youruncle is not included in the list of KIA of 398th BG. 398th Killed in Combat Missions


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## seesul (Jul 20, 2009)

Check this Combat Crew Gallery Page 8
9th pic from top...there´s Lt Fred O. Beach in this crew...is it not him?


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## soalebm (Apr 1, 2010)

I would like to know about the layout of the airfield and any memories of life on the base. If you would like to email me i can send you some questions. I have been working on this research project for almost three years and still have very little about Amendola. My email is [email protected].
Thanks,
Brandon






jhor9 said:


> I was in the 99th at Foggia #2-Tortorella, moving up from Tunis during Dec43 I completed my tour of 50 missions/sorties in mid Feb44. I don't know how else I can help
> Jules Horowitz
> pilot 348th Sqdn


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## seesul (Apr 1, 2010)

soalebm said:


> I would like to know about the layout of the airfield and any memories of life on the base. If you would like to email me i can send you some questions. I have been working on this research project for almost three years and still have very little about Amendola. My email is [email protected].
> Thanks,
> Brandon



Brandon, check this http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/stories/one-more-book-about-15th-usaaf-last-roll-call-23651.html
It´s a book written by a tail gunner who served in 97th BG stationed in Foggia. I got this book and you can find some good info there. In their websate you´ll find an e-mail of this tail gunner´s daughter Wandy. She would get you in touch with her dad.
And one more book http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/av...about-loss-20th-sqdn-aug-29-1944-a-19602.html
I´m sure this book will help you a lot!


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## Stefaan (Apr 10, 2010)

Hi Caroline.
I am in SA and doing research on the SAAF as well.
Can you please email me at [email protected].

As for Foggia.
Mainly used by 205 BG which had 31 and 34 SAAF Sqdn, operating B-24's.
3 Wing had Marauders, and 12 sqdn used ther Marauder with 24 sqdn.The other sqdn, 21, used Baltimores at first, and the the Marauders.
Their were quite a few Bases in the area beibg used, not just one.
Stefaan


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## Stefaan (Apr 10, 2010)

Hi Hilli.
We just finished a book on 15 SAAF, The Aegean Pirates.
Please contact me at
[email protected]
Thx
Stefaan


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## al49 (Apr 10, 2010)

soalebm said:


> I'm currently trying to figure out as much as possible about the air bases around Foggia, Italy during WWII. I'm in contact with the 2nd, 301st, 463rd, and 99th bomb group websites but I want to know more about the South African AF in 1944 and the German units that operated ther before the allies atacked in 1943. If anyone has any info about the SAAF units or any information about allied or axis planes, men, etc flying from Foggia around august-november 1944 let me know.
> the smallest bit helps!
> thanks,
> Brandon



Hi Brandon,
I just was this thread for the firs time today and I will try to give my contribution, on "the other side", based on info I can get from books in my hands or from other sources.
But, first of all, there is a link that gives many details on airports in the Foggia area used by the Allies.
Wapedia - Wiki: Foggia Airfield Complex
So far I only found that in September 1942 in the Foggia area airports were based the following Regia Aeronautica units:
104° Gruppo Bombardamento (bombers) with SM-79 Sparviero
87° Gruppo Bombardamento (bombers) with SM-79 Sparviero and
90° Gruppo Aerosiluranti (torpedo bombers) again with SM-79 Sparviero
I will add more info as soon as I can.
Cheers
Alberto


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## mhuxt (Apr 10, 2010)

Stefaan said:


> Hi Hilli.
> We just finished a book on 15 SAAF, The Aegean Pirates.
> Please contact me at
> [email protected]
> ...



Hi Stefaa,

Congratulations on getting the book done. I know you've described the challenges of doing so in the past, but do you think there will ever be anything published on 60 SAAF? It seems strange that a unit which played such a leading role in its theatre should be so undocumented.

Cheers,

Mark


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## Stefaan (Apr 11, 2010)

Hi.
I have started to collect all the data I can get at our archives, as well as interviewing the last surviving vets(less than 10) of 60 sqdn.
I am just going to finish a book on all the axis a.c the SAAF came across, with a friend of mine, so looking for photos of any wrecks found in all your families photoalbums, as well as any photos of the Mossies. They are as rare as budgie teeth.
There are also only a few photos of the SAAF 31 and 34 Liberators, so any scans will be most welcome.
Our problem in South Africa is that all our photographs from WWII were sent to the British HQ's as we flew under thme, apart from 60 sqdn that was under an American Unit.
15 sqdn photos were sent to 454 RAAF photographic unit early '44 onwards.
That is probably why there are so few books on the SAAF.
We have to pay the overseas archives for any SAAF photos, and the Rand is a tenth of the Pound.
Only photos I can get hold of are those in the family albums.
As for 60 sqdn, they were mostly based at San Severo.
To the chaps who kindly sent us the logbook entries, is it possible that you can send the codes and or serial no's next to those entreis, so that we can link codes to serials??
The the chap looking for the raids into Poland. 31 and 34 sqdn raids are dealt with in detail in the book 'The Men Who Went To Warsaw' by Simon Isemonger.
Do you know that book?? It is still available.
Be good
Stefaan


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## mhuxt (Apr 12, 2010)

Thanks Stefaan.


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## Dreamseer (Dec 15, 2011)

Hello Brandon , my uncle Desmond Vincent Watson , Seargent Pilot , RAAF , arrived at Foggia Italy on 2nd October 1944 and died in a mission to drop supplies to Italian Partisans the evening of 12th October 1944 , he was 20yrs old , the plane he was piloting crashed near the hill town of Rora , Piedmonte , Italy , my uncle is buried in the Milan War Cemetary , regards Colleen .


soalebm said:


> I'm currently trying to figure out as much as possible about the air bases around Foggia, Italy during WWII. I'm in contact with the 2nd, 301st, 463rd, and 99th bomb group websites but I want to know more about the South African AF in 1944 and the German units that operated ther before the allies atacked in 1943. If anyone has any info about the SAAF units or any information about allied or axis planes, men, etc flying from Foggia around august-november 1944 let me know.
> the smallest bit helps!
> thanks,
> Brandon


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## Dreamseer (Dec 15, 2011)

Hello Brandon , its nearly impossible to leave a message on this site , its extremely frustrating , Colleen


soalebm said:


> Thanks a lot gentleman I will try the SAAF museum and I I have not begun researching the RAAF yet but you provided me with a good place to start!
> cheers,
> Brandon


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## Dreamseer (Dec 15, 2011)

Brandon , my uncle Des was flying Liberator KH154 on the evening he died . He had been in England flying Lancasters , so how he came to be in Italy is still a mystery to me . I read the Liberators were called flying coffins because of the location of the fuel tanks and the only exit door being near the tail of the plane . Uncle Des was in 31 Squadron . He was very handsome with laughing eyes and dimples , i have always felt his loss .


Dreamseer said:


> Hello Brandon , my uncle Desmond Vincent Watson , Seargent Pilot , RAAF , arrived at Foggia Italy on 2nd October 1944 and died in a mission to drop supplies to Italian Partisans the evening of 12th October 1944 , he was 20yrs old , the plane he was piloting crashed near the hill town of Rora , Piedmonte , Italy , my uncle is buried in the Milan War Cemetary , regards Colleen .


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## Alte Hase (Dec 15, 2011)

If you are trying to get info on SAAF history, try contacting a gent called Karel Zaayman who runs The Aviation Shop in Johannesburg, he is a wealth of information.If you Google 'The Aviation Shop ' or "TAS Hobbies", you'll get his contact email.

Hope that helps!


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## Dreamseer (Dec 17, 2011)

Thankyou kindly Alte Hase , i will , i came across an Italian site which had the complete account of the mission the night of 12th October 1944 , it even had the sounds of a plane , maps of the terrain etc and i foolishly didn't save the sit address .A number of aircraft crashed that night , i think 48 young men died in total.I never met my uncle only saw him in the photograph's and my mothers saying he was a lovely young man , i found out he played Rugby and he was a a lifsaver in the North Bondi Surf Lifesaving Club along with my father and another uncle.


Alte Hase said:


> If you are trying to get info on SAAF history, try contacting a gent called Karel Zaayman who runs The Aviation Shop in Johannesburg, he is a wealth of information.If you Google 'The Aviation Shop ' or "TAS Hobbies", you'll get his contact email.
> 
> Hope that helps!


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## Dreamseer (Dec 17, 2011)

I want to mention the other young men on my uncles crew , one of whom was 19 years old .When i type these things i start to cry .If i could stretch out my arms to that plane in the cold and the rain of that dark night i would try to save them , try to stop the crash , try to stop the fire.


Alte Hase said:


> If you are trying to get info on SAAF history, try contacting a gent called Karel Zaayman who runs The Aviation Shop in Johannesburg, he is a wealth of information.If you Google 'The Aviation Shop ' or "TAS Hobbies", you'll get his contact email.
> 
> Hope that helps!

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## Alte Hase (Dec 18, 2011)

Sadly, the story you recount was played out so many times over Europe during the war...it's tragic that so many capable, talented, full of life young men from all sides lost their lives in this way. What we can do to honour these brave men is to respect their memory, recount and research their stories for future generations, and above all, remember them and the huge sacrifices they made.


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## Njaco (Dec 18, 2011)

Dreamseer said:


> Hello Brandon , its nearly impossible to leave a message on this site , its extremely frustrating , Colleen



If you go to his profile (click on his name) and you can leave a message there.

Sadly soalebm/Brandon hasn't been here for 2 years.


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## Dreamseer (Dec 19, 2011)

Alte Hase , its true , all the men on all sides , the remembering and honouring will hopefully continue reminding all people everywhere of the cost of war .Thankyou , Colleen


Alte Hase said:


> Sadly, the story you recount was played out so many times over Europe during the war...it's tragic that so many capable, talented, full of life young men from all sides lost their lives in this way. What we can do to honour these brave men is to respect their memory, recount and research their stories for future generations, and above all, remember them and the huge sacrifices they made.


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## Dreamseer (Dec 19, 2011)

Njaco , thankyou kindly for your help , Colleen


Njaco said:


> If you go to his profile (click on his name) and you can leave a message there.
> 
> Sadly soalebm/Brandon hasn't been here for 2 years.


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## Sonik87 (Dec 29, 2011)

Hi there, I just read through your post and noticing that you are talking about Foggia, I remember that my grandfather used to tell me that his uncle emigrated to the U.S. at the beginning of the XX century and that during WWII a son of this uncle came to Foggia, apparently as a U.S. air-force pilot, and visited the relatives in the small town we come from (Rionero in Vulture) which is just an hour from Foggia. The family name is Richter, or as it was later misspelt in Italian bureaucracy Ricter.
Do you think it would be somehow possible to go back to these relatives in the U.S.? I live in Italy, and my family is still living in this town in the south: Rionero in Vulture.

Thank you for your help.
Kind regards
Anthony


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## Dreamseer (Dec 29, 2011)

Hello Anthony , i don't quite understand your question , however it is possible to research for relatives in a number of ways , if that is what you mean , for free in a general sense ie: phone books and writing letters or Births , Deaths and Marriage records in the particular country.I am not an expert , so i stumble along using my own common sense . I was able to trace one branch of my family for free through Church records held and collected by a well known "religious" organisation back to 1650's .T search and be able to print actual documents i think paying a Genealogy site may be the go . If i can help you please ask , kind regards Colleen .


Sonik87 said:


> Hi there, I just read through your post and noticing that you are talking about Foggia, I remember that my grandfather used to tell me that his uncle emigrated to the U.S. at the beginning of the XX century and that during WWII a son of this uncle came to Foggia, apparently as a U.S. air-force pilot, and visited the relatives in the small town we come from (Rionero in Vulture) which is just an hour from Foggia. The family name is Richter, or as it was later misspelt in Italian bureaucracy Ricter.
> Do you think it would be somehow possible to go back to these relatives in the U.S.? I live in Italy, and my family is still living in this town in the south: Rionero in Vulture.
> 
> Thank you for your help.
> ...


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## Dreamseer (Dec 29, 2011)

Anthony , i'm sure you know that Richter is a name of German origin . Reaching out to our family however far away seems to be a shared human need . For myself the need to search for my uncle Des was spontaneous but strong , i had only seen photo's of him . Colleen .


Dreamseer said:


> Hello Anthony , i don't quite understand your question , however it is possible to research for relatives in a number of ways , if that is what you mean , for free in a general sense ie: phone books and writing letters or Births , Deaths and Marriage records in the particular country.I am not an expert , so i stumble along using my own common sense . I was able to trace one branch of my family for free through Church records held and collected by a well known "religious" organisation back to 1650's .T search and be able to print actual documents i think paying a Genealogy site may be the go . If i can help you please ask , kind regards Colleen .


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## Charmaine Olinsky Howard (Dec 31, 2011)

My father, Jacob (Jack) Olinsky was with the S.A..A.F. 31 Heavy Bomber Squadron as an air mechanic. He kept a sort of diary...not too detailed and not daily. If anyone is interested in his notes, contact me. He was stationed in Foggia.


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## Dreamseer (Jan 7, 2012)

Hello Charmaine , my uncle Des arrived in Celone , Foggia on 2nd October 1944 and died in an aircrash of KH154 , SAAF , near R'ora in the Po Valley on the 12th October 1944 , thankyou for offering help , kind regards Colleen.


Charmaine Olinsky Howard said:


> My father, Jacob (Jack) Olinsky was with the S.A..A.F. 31 Heavy Bomber Squadron as an air mechanic. He kept a sort of diary...not too detailed and not daily. If anyone is interested in his notes, contact me. He was stationed in Foggia.


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## Sonik87 (Jan 8, 2012)

Well I just wanted to find out some information about my roots. Both the origin of my surname, which as you said is surely of German origin, and somehow contact these distant relatives. Unfortunately the only piece of information I have is this pilot (or I believe it was a pilot) during WWII. Anyway I have started looking at some records and search on websites, like the Ellis Island one. But till now, no luck in finding some names or informations which could match with what I know of the story.
If you think you could have some interesting information please let me know. Thank you very much.


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## Dreamseer (Jan 12, 2012)

Anthony , i just typed in a lengthy message to you and the flurry thing didn't go through ! . However i hope you are well .You are in Italy i'm in Australia so we are both at a disadvantage . Begin at the beginning , with your birth , going back through each generation (yes i know i'm stating the obvious) ask family members , jog their memories .Its fascinating where this surname Richter came from , a romantic traveller ? sailor ? and in the South of Italy , the north would make morre sense , wishing you well , kind regards Colleen .


Sonik87 said:


> Well I just wanted to find out some information about my roots. Both the origin of my surname, which as you said is surely of German origin, and somehow contact these distant relatives. Unfortunately the only piece of information I have is this pilot (or I believe it was a pilot) during WWII. Anyway I have started looking at some records and search on websites, like the Ellis Island one. But till now, no luck in finding some names or informations which could match with what I know of the story.
> If you think you could have some interesting information please let me know. Thank you very much.


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## v2 (Jan 13, 2012)

all interested the 31/34 sqn history I invite here: Log In | Facebook


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## Dreamseer (Jan 13, 2012)

Thankyou V2 , i had sworn off Facebook for obvious reasons .(chiefly Identity Fraud)


v2 said:


> all interested the 31/34 sqn history I invite here: Log In | Facebook


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## v2 (Jan 14, 2012)

Dreamseer said:


> Thankyou V2 , i had sworn off Facebook for obvious reasons .(chiefly Identity Fraud)



I understand, but this is a group of people and families of 31/34 SQN. There is a lot of photos and documents about squadrons.


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## Dreamseer (Jan 14, 2012)

Thankyou V2.......................i appreciate your help , Colleen


v2 said:


> I understand, but this is a group of people and families of 31/34 SQN. There is a lot of photos and documents about squadrons.


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## v2 (Jan 14, 2012)

Dreamseer said:


> Thankyou V2.......................i appreciate your help , Colleen


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## soalebm (Nov 29, 2012)

]I want to say thank you for all of your help with my research. I am proud to announce that since I first joined this site in 2008 I finally finished my research on the 15th Air Force and published my first book From Foggia To Freedom. 

Chapters Include detailed information about:

The Fight for Foggia and Operation Avalanche

The history of the B-17 flying fortress, from "Project 299" to the B-17G.

Training to fly heavy bombers, including veteran interviews and first-hand accounts from veterans who flew from airfields accross the U.S. like Chico, California, Hobbs AFB in Hobbs, New Mexico, and Gulfport, Mississippi.

Airfields Around Foggia, including detailed information and interviews with veterans who flew from the airfields at Tortorella, Lucera, Amendola, Celone, and Foggia Main.

Combat Missions, first-hand accounts detailing the duties of a B-17 crew, flying in combat, being shot down, and evading capture.

How the U.S. Army Air Corps, RAF, and AAF supplied the Yugoslav and Polish partisan forces behind German lines.

Interviews with POWs who were located at Stalag Luft III and Stalag Luft IV, and stories about the "Black March" the men of Stalag Luft IV were forced to make during the winter of 1945.

Repatriation, Camp Lucky Strike, and the journey home to the United States.

If anyone is interested in ordering a copy please contact me.

Thanks again,
Brandon Soale


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## bobbysocks (Nov 30, 2012)

congrats on your first book....


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## v2 (Dec 3, 2012)

Great!


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## Davida (May 25, 2014)

I was toldthat my Uncle David Weinstein was a gunner in a plan named the Bitter Bitch. His plan was shot down over Italy in 1945 and he did not survive. I am looking for anyone who may have known him


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## aircrewremembered (May 25, 2014)

soalebm said:


> I'm currently trying to figure out as much as possible about the air bases around Foggia, Italy during WWII. I'm in contact with the 2nd, 301st, 463rd, and 99th bomb group websites but I want to know more about the South African AF in 1944 and the German units that operated ther before the allies atacked in 1943. If anyone has any info about the SAAF units or any information about allied or axis planes, men, etc flying from Foggia around august-november 1944 let me know.
> the smallest bit helps!
> thanks,
> Brandon



We've got a vivid personal account of life in the 57th Fighter Group USAAF in Foggia at aircrewremembered.com/GeraldSchwartzArchive which we transcribed from our friend Gerald's original notes. This opus is over 100 chapters in length, and we're up to Chapter 60 right now, with all Gerald's images yet to be added. We should have the job completed within a month. It's a great read from a gifted writer.


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## bobbysocks (May 25, 2014)

i have read some of it..its pretty good. there are several things i had heard of before but a lot of new info and insight.....thanks for taking the time to transcribe and post it.


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## rogerwilko (May 25, 2014)

flakhappy said:


> I was a radio operator in a B-17 crew in the 97th BG based at Amendola duringthe last half of 1944, near Foggia. The 2nd BG and a sqdn. of the RAF's 5 Group was also based at Amendola.


So that makes you about 90 years old? And using a computer?


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## Bhuber (May 22, 2015)

Hi,
I waas wondering if your dad knew a Nigel Cooney. He was an air gunner for the SAAF 34th sqn. He was shot down whilst on a bombing mission Pardubice Oil Refinery 22 July 1944. I am looking for any information relating to him, especially photos. He was my grandfathers cousin and unfortunately nothing of his was kept (he had no siblings and never married so I suppose there was no one to pass things on to).





pzulba said:


> Hi
> 
> My Dad was an Air Gunner in the Royal Air Force (Volunteer Reserve), in Mar '44 he completed training in the UK and as he put it missed being posted to the 'Killing Fields' of Lincolnshire in the UK (RAF Bomber Command)
> 
> ...


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## Bhuber (Oct 13, 2015)

Bhuber said:


> Hi,
> I waas wondering if your dad knew a Nigel Cooney. He was an air gunner for the SAAF 34th sqn. He was shot down whilst on a bombing mission Pardubice Oil Refinery 22 July 1944. I am looking for any information relating to him, especially photos. He was my grandfathers cousin and unfortunately nothing of his was kept (he had no siblings and never married so I suppose there was no one to pass things on to).



A reading list would be most welcome, although they tend to focus on the 31st squadron or the 34th only after July 1944.


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