- Thread starter
- #21
Well, if they used a mounted weapon (event though it was this caliber) it could be cosidered starfing (referring to the definition taken from Wikipedia)...
Regards, Filip
Best strafing aircraft in WWII???
- Thread starter filnorm
- Start date
Well, if they used a mounted weapon (event though it was this caliber) it could be cosidered starfing (referring to the definition taken from Wikipedia)...
Regards, Filip
I dont disagree.. but i think rate of fire weighs heavily...
lobing a couple rounds is not enveloping a targrt in a rain of led
Glider
Major
Beaufighter 4 x 20mm each 10 rps + 6 x 303 each 20 rps = 160 rps
B25 14 x 0.5 each 13rps = 182 rps
Throw in the explosive content of the 20mm and there is nothing in it.
Has anyone realised how dumb this debate is. Does anyone fancy their chances in front of either of these aircraft?
B25 14 x 0.5 each 13rps = 182 rps
Throw in the explosive content of the 20mm and there is nothing in it.
Has anyone realised how dumb this debate is. Does anyone fancy their chances in front of either of these aircraft?
Beaufighter is freakin awesome!... lots of rounds on target! In the strafing role..
i'd rather have 4 x 20 mm than one 75
That's for sure. With a 75 mm you only have 1 shot a go
The Basket
Senior Master Sergeant
- 3,712
- Jun 27, 2007
I remember one Hurricane pilot saying he fired his 303s against a German tank in the battle of france. The tank commander closed his hatch and tank carried on its way.
You only get an ooooh with Typhoon. And with this Hawker fighter, the rounds didn't bounce.
You only get an ooooh with Typhoon. And with this Hawker fighter, the rounds didn't bounce.
- Thread starter
- #27
drgondog
Major
This is an interesting debate because it begs the question, most devastating or most effective.
The Pappy Gunn modified B-25s had a crucial impact on the Battle of Bismark Sea when the Japanese tried to move reinforcements to New Gunea and then made major contributions from that time forward in missions from sinking troop transports and freighters with water line stikes from 10-14 .50's plus skip bombing with 250 to 500 ponders - or laying parafrags.
But wouyld it have survived in ETO? As Erich mentioned the 355th had the best total of German a/c destroyed on the ground and pioneered strafing of German airfields - but lost 92+ to German flak - twice as many as lost battling German fighters.. Itwas strafing at 350-400mph in shallow dives, quick strikes - one group to shoot up flak batteries - the rest to hammer the a/c.
B-25s, Beaufighters, etc would not do well in these missions.. Tempest, P-47s and Mustangs did this well and Mustangs did the most on German airfields and deep transportation strikes but more vulnerable..
If I was making a living strafing, deep in heavily defended areas, it would be in a Jug - the key is range here coupled with heavy firepower and relative survivability against both flak and fighters.
The A-26 takes top honors of the twin engine attack bombers, I believe
The Pappy Gunn modified B-25s had a crucial impact on the Battle of Bismark Sea when the Japanese tried to move reinforcements to New Gunea and then made major contributions from that time forward in missions from sinking troop transports and freighters with water line stikes from 10-14 .50's plus skip bombing with 250 to 500 ponders - or laying parafrags.
But wouyld it have survived in ETO? As Erich mentioned the 355th had the best total of German a/c destroyed on the ground and pioneered strafing of German airfields - but lost 92+ to German flak - twice as many as lost battling German fighters.. Itwas strafing at 350-400mph in shallow dives, quick strikes - one group to shoot up flak batteries - the rest to hammer the a/c.
B-25s, Beaufighters, etc would not do well in these missions.. Tempest, P-47s and Mustangs did this well and Mustangs did the most on German airfields and deep transportation strikes but more vulnerable..
If I was making a living strafing, deep in heavily defended areas, it would be in a Jug - the key is range here coupled with heavy firepower and relative survivability against both flak and fighters.
The A-26 takes top honors of the twin engine attack bombers, I believe
Glider
Major
As ever a good point. The anti shipping wings of the RAF operated with some success against German naval forces off the coast of Europe and they were equipped with Beaufighters and Mossies. Normally the Rocket armed Beaus went for the AA escorts and the torpedo armed Beaus for the merchant vessels.
Obviously they were not equipped with B25's so no comparison can be made.
Its interesting to speculate how well the larger and/or slower B25's, B26 and Bostons would have been in a similar role. The German fighters were a significant risk being close to the coast and normally escorted the convoys. They would I suggest have been a larger risk than in the Far East due to the distances involved.
Obviously they were not equipped with B25's so no comparison can be made.
Its interesting to speculate how well the larger and/or slower B25's, B26 and Bostons would have been in a similar role. The German fighters were a significant risk being close to the coast and normally escorted the convoys. They would I suggest have been a larger risk than in the Far East due to the distances involved.
Id have to go with the rugged P-47.
Single engined wise it would be between the P-47/Typhoon and in multi-engined it would be between the B-25 and the Beaufighter for me.
Wildcat
Major
Agreed with Gnomey. Also give mention to the P-40, which on all accounts was a stable gun platform, and gave stirling service in North Africa and the PTO.
Desert Fox
Senior Airman
I would say the P-47. The eight .50 calibre machine guns would do a lot of damage, on both infantry and vehicles.
trackend
Chief Master Sergeant
I've posted this before but no harm in another attachment obviously the sound track is a load of dubbed nonsense
Wildcat
Major
Talking about Beaufighters, here are some great shots of Japanese airmen caught with their pants down by an Aussie Beau in New Guinea. 
plus a Beau test firing its cannons.
source - Australian War Memorial: One of the world's great museums
plus a Beau test firing its cannons.source - Australian War Memorial: One of the world's great museums
Attachments
I am not saying that the Hs 129 was the best aircraft (even though I think with better engines it could have been the best ground attack aircraft) but with its combination of great armour and very good armament it could be be a pretty devistating straffer as well.
Hs 129B-1/R2:
Two 7.92mm MG 17 Machine Guns in nose.
Two 20mm MG 151/20 cannon in nose.
One 30mm Mk 101 cannon mounted under fuselage.
Hs 129B-1/R3:
Two 7.92mm MG 17 Machine Guns in nose.
Two 20mm MG 151/20 cannon in nose.
Four 7.92mm MG 17 Machine Guns in ventral box.
Hs 129B-2 Series:
Two 13mm MG 131 Machine Guns in nose.
Two 20mm MG 151/20 cannon in nose.
Various weapons were fitted inclusding 37mm BK 3.7 and 75mm BK 7.5. An interesting weapon was a battery of six 75mm smoothbore recoiless rifles that fired downawrds and to the rear. This system was fired by an automatic magnetic trigger that fired when the aircraft flew over metal objects. This system was reported to be quite successful.
WRG - Luftwaffe Resource Group - Henschel Hs 129
Hs 129B-1/R2:
Two 7.92mm MG 17 Machine Guns in nose.
Two 20mm MG 151/20 cannon in nose.
One 30mm Mk 101 cannon mounted under fuselage.
Hs 129B-1/R3:
Two 7.92mm MG 17 Machine Guns in nose.
Two 20mm MG 151/20 cannon in nose.
Four 7.92mm MG 17 Machine Guns in ventral box.
Hs 129B-2 Series:
Two 13mm MG 131 Machine Guns in nose.
Two 20mm MG 151/20 cannon in nose.
Various weapons were fitted inclusding 37mm BK 3.7 and 75mm BK 7.5. An interesting weapon was a battery of six 75mm smoothbore recoiless rifles that fired downawrds and to the rear. This system was fired by an automatic magnetic trigger that fired when the aircraft flew over metal objects. This system was reported to be quite successful.
WRG - Luftwaffe Resource Group - Henschel Hs 129
model299
Airman 1st Class
The main drawback with any aircraft that uses liquid for cooling purposes is, of course, the radiator. One decent hole in it and an airman's whole day goes to hell in a hand basket. This gives air cooled planes a decided advantage.
The B-25 with the 75mm cannon sure seems impressive, but the gun needed one full-time crew member just to load and reload the thing. They tried putting a 105mm cannon on I think, but the test shot just about tore the nose off the plane. And the Spectre thought it was the first...
I think there was either an early model Typhoon or Tempest with 10 .303 caliber guns before they converted to the Hispano 20mm. Not quite as useful against vehicles perhaps, but against troops it couldn't be anything less than horrendously effective. How many rounds/second does that work out to?
The Tigercat, had it seen service in the war, would have been a strong candidate. Four 20mm cannons and four .50 caliber guns on a good stable platform with two air-cooled R-2800s.
But the top contestant would have the be the B-25. There's just no way to argue against that much oomph under one man's control.
I think there was either an early model Typhoon or Tempest with 10 .303 caliber guns before they converted to the Hispano 20mm. Not quite as useful against vehicles perhaps, but against troops it couldn't be anything less than horrendously effective. How many rounds/second does that work out to?
The Tigercat, had it seen service in the war, would have been a strong candidate. Four 20mm cannons and four .50 caliber guns on a good stable platform with two air-cooled R-2800s.
But the top contestant would have the be the B-25. There's just no way to argue against that much oomph under one man's control.
renrich
Chief Master Sergeant
The Douglas A26 with the solid nose had 6-50 cal mgs plus 2 each in the dorsal and ventral turrets and with it's performance was a formidable strafer.
