Greatest WWII Military Commanders: Updated

[Danielmellbin]

Churchill had very poor strategic sense, he often ignored good advice from the Generals.

In fact {IIRC} Metaxas was quite old, it was only after he passed away that the UK convinced the Greeks to allow their troops in. And I disagree, the arrival of the Brits made Hitler send a much larger force, he didn't want to allow them to get set up on the continent.

Brooke had the smartest approach to this question, the Brits simply were not ready or properly equipped for this operation, and it was foolish to "let up" on a beaten enemy {the Italians in N.Africa} to switch to a different front. This would only allow the beaten Italians time to rebuild, and would probably result in both operations failing. {Which is exactly what happened}

Agreed - it was a foolish undertaking. And IMO a curoius echo of Gallipoli (luckily not with the same amount of wasted life). And yes Churchill was no strategic genius - and in many ways very old fashioned. But the same stubborness and foolhardy decisions that led to Greece, Gallipoli, Singapore etc.. - also led to the defiance of Hitler after Dunkirk, during the blitz and laid the ground for the alliance that would ultimately destroy the Japanese and Germans.

 

[Freebird]

Agreed - it was a foolish undertaking. And IMO a curoius echo of Gallipoli (luckily not with the same amount of wasted life). And yes Churchill was no strategic genius - and in many ways very old fashioned. But the same stubborness and foolhardy decisions that led to Greece, Gallipoli, Singapore etc.. - also led to the defiance of Hitler after Dunkirk, during the blitz and laid the ground for the alliance that would ultimately destroy the Japanese and Germans.

Thats why I rate him as about the best Prime Minister, but among the worst Ministers of Defence. {He was both from 1940 - 1945} In fact Gallipoli did have an effect in WWII. The public was willing to forgive one major "blunder" - but likely another would end him as PM. Brooke writes in his diary that Churchill would sometimes latch onto these wild ideas, {"Jupiter" and "Imperator" among others} but if the Chiefs of Staff were united in opposition he wouldn't dare to overrule them. Hitler on the other hand could ignore or fire his Generals at any time - and with disasterous results.

 

[JugBR]

translated parts of book "zhukov", writen by otto preston chaney jr.

december 1940 - january 41:

the russian high commamd, makes an important meeting in moscow followed by "war games", developed over maps. the meeting was attended by stalin and all the responsibles for the defence of ussr including the military district of kiev, driven by zhukov.

many topics was discussed, like the modernization of russian war devices, the lack of training by the high level officers - consequence of stalin´s persecutions - and also the modern ofensive operations, presented by zhukov.

later, after presentations was started the great exercise over maps, and the theme was an german invasion over ussr.

zhukov played the german army - the blues - , pavlov commands the reds, the defender army.

after the exercise, stalin openly criticised the way as pavlov commanded the reds, he ask if someone has something to say. zhukov complain that the fortified zones along the russian frontier was too close to the borderline, in case of war, they wouldnt be able to resist much time.

voroshilov, president of peoples defence comission and very close of stalin, severely interrupted zhukov, to say the zones was builted acording to the plans aproved by the main military council.

feeling that argue would be useless, zhukov sit and stay silent.

then, general meretskov, chief of staff, show his briefing about the situation, his briefing was inconsistent and with lack of many infos. asked about the past exercise, he couldnt make a good analisys wich made stalin very angry.

after the meeting, stalin invite zhukov for his office and says:
- the "politiburo" decided fire meretskov and mominates you as chief of staff.

 

[Amsel]

The most dangerous man in Europe.

 

[parsifal]

okay, I give up...who is it and why is he the most dangerous man in europe?

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

The man in the picture is Otto Skorzeny.

He was an Obersturmbannführer (Lieutenant Colonel) in the Waffen SS.
Otto Skorzeny - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[parsifal]

Well, in the sense of the larger unit commanders, I dont think Skorzeny could reasonably be included, any more than the great british commando leaders, like Stirling or Bagnold could be included.

For the record, however, I do think that Skorzeny was one of the most effective commandoes of his time, and certainly deserves a great ddeal of respect

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Well, in the sense of the larger unit commanders, I dont think Skorzeny could reasonably be included, any more than the great british commando leaders, like Stirling or Bagnold could be included.

I don't know, I did not throw him in the pot.

 

[Freebird]

Well, in the sense of the larger unit commanders, I dont think Skorzeny could reasonably be included, any more than the great british commando leaders, like Stirling or Bagnold could be included.

For the record, however, I do think that Skorzeny was one of the most effective commandoes of his time, and certainly deserves a great ddeal of respect

Yes, you are right about that.

 

[Burmese Bandit]

OOOps....

I didn't read the poll carefully and thought it meant Military leaders instead of Military commanders and so I voted for George Marshall!!!!

 

[steelDUST]

Gen. Douglas MacArthur is, for me, the greatest WW2 general.
With fewer casualties of troops in comparison to eisenhower, montgomery, patton, and even rommel, with even fewer war materials used, MacArthur is definitely the best WW2 general.

 

[HerrKaleut]

Unless I missed it on a page somewhere, why has nobody mentioned Karl Doenitz?

 

[Cromwell]

I know it has been chewed over many times, but how an efficient commander like Montgomery allowed such a stupendous coke-up as Market Garden puzzles me endlessly.

Even the radio sets had the wrong crystals and when intelligence officers tried to point out the presence of Panzers in the region, they shrugged it off as scare-mongering etc.

Un-real

I therefore say that all military commanders are only as good as their last victory.

 

[Freebird]

I know it has been chewed over many times, but how an efficient commander like Montgomery allowed such a stupendous coke-up as Market Garden puzzles me endlessly.
.

Monty has been harshly critisized for the plan, but overall it was not a bad plan, and even with all the "****-ups" very nearly succeeded, as they almost captured the Arnhem bridge.

It was a big gamble, which {they supposed} if it succeeded would prevent a long nasty slog similar to the Italian campaign.

If it failed, it would cost about 10,000 paratroops, which could be replaced. They decided it was worth the gamble.


To be fair, things like the wrong crystals or the poor para DZ's are not Monty's responsibility, alot of leaders dropped the ball on this one

 

[Cromwell]

Yes, it does seem that Monty was not well-advised or supported in retrospect. It was almost as if they (his supporting cast) were becoming *complacent* or perhaps jaded and war-weary ?

Still, it must rate as one of the greatest reversals Post D-Day BAR 'The Bulge' of course !

- and Monty must take at least some responsibility for the failure, after all it was his show, and he was in a position to select his subordinates to some degree.

BUT most battle plans go to pot within about 5 minutes of the action starting, especially where airborne forces are involved.

They never seem to land in the right place !!


Crom

Monty has been harshly critisized for the plan, but overall it was not a bad plan, and even with all the "****-ups" very nearly succeeded, as they almost captured the Arnhem bridge.

It was a big gamble, which {they supposed} if it succeeded would prevent a long nasty slog similar to the Italian campaign.

If it failed, it would cost about 10,000 paratroops, which could be replaced. They decided it was worth the gamble.

To be fair, things like the wrong crystals or the poor para DZ's are not Monty's responsibility, a lot of leaders dropped the ball on this one

 

[Amsel]

I had to vote for Hugh Dowding. Without him who knows what might have happened if the Battle of Britain was lost.

 

[pbfoot]

I think the forerunners of Dowding should get more acclaim then him. It was guys like Freeman and Ellington that got the Spits and Hurricanes and radar , they had foresight to make sure the Merlins were 100 octane capable in 37 and also were the people that got the Mosquito on line , Dowding had all the weapons he needed thanks to Freeman and Ellington and Newell

 

[Cromwell]

It is a sad fact, almost a platitude or by-word, that credit is rarely distributed fairly or to the right person

My father, bless his soul, made several unique discoveries or innovations during the war - but could never talk about them for decades due to the official secrets act. Neither could he make money out his discoveries either, for the same reason(s)


There must be 100s of stories of lost or mis-placed credit, in combat or further back in the supporting ranks.

What can you do ?

I think the forerunners of Dowding should get more acclaim then him. It was guys like Freeman and Ellington that got the Spits and Hurricanes and radar , they had foresight to make sure the Merlins were 100 octane capable in 37 and also were the people that got the Mosquito on line , Dowding had all the weapons he needed thanks to Freeman and Ellington and Newell

 

[Amsel]

I think the forerunners of Dowding should get more acclaim then him. It was guys like Freeman and Ellington that got the Spits and Hurricanes and radar , they had foresight to make sure the Merlins were 100 octane capable in 37 and also were the people that got the Mosquito on line , Dowding had all the weapons he needed thanks to Freeman and Ellington and Newell

While that is all true and great, Dowding is the one who organized the fierce resistance in the air, facing several challenges from his own goverment as well as the pesky huns. If Dowding wasn't so resolute then Churchill might have used up all the Spitfires in the Battle of France, etc etc.

 

[Freebird]

While that is all true and great, Dowding is the one who organized the fierce resistance in the air, facing several challenges from his own goverment as well as the pesky huns. If Dowding wasn't so resolute then Churchill might have used up all the Spitfires in the Battle of France, etc etc.

Spot on!

Churchill was ready to thow everything into the defence of France, and the cupboard would be bare for the BoB