swampyankee
Chief Master Sergeant
- 4,030
- Jun 25, 2013
Well, the world population is several times greater than it was then. Plus, of course, the Web is a great vector for the stupidity virus.
The jet age ?
- Thread starter PWR4360-59B
- Start date
Ad: This forum contains affiliate links to products on Amazon and eBay. More information in Terms and rules
Well, the world population is several times greater than it was then. Plus, of course, the Web is a great vector for the stupidity virus.
FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
Just catching up to this....
Airframes
Benevolens Magister
So, if we believe the total b*ll*cks spouted by these people, then it must follow that the many well-known photos showing contrails over the south of England and London in the summer of 1940, don't really show contrails, but a secret weapon, deployed by the Luftwaffe, under orders from Hitler, which deployed chemicals intended to harm the population.
Exceedingly cunning, especially as the then enemy was apparently able to cause RAF fighters to spread the same 'chem trails'..........
Exceedingly cunning, especially as the then enemy was apparently able to cause RAF fighters to spread the same 'chem trails'..........
vikingBerserker
Lieutenant General
I watched the video starting at 9:09 and have a few comments.
The main source of his data is an Air Force book published in 1951 and Wikipedia. I will admit when somebody quotes Wikipedia to me as backup to an argument their creditability significantly drops as give me 5 minutes and I will have it support my view. The 1951 book I think over all is accurate for it's time, but it is almost 70 years later and the methods of measuring and testing have significantly improved - they need to find a modern source.
One thing I did note (or perhaps overlooked because I started at 9:09) is it did not mention the impact of nuclear weapons testing on the ION levels, this could significantly boast the amount of IONs in the atmosphere.
Most if not all of the major producers of jet engines are for profit and as such there are reasons why certain metals are used in their production. I don't argue the impact of the metals used as the video states, but I think they are taking a theory and trying to force facts to fit it. IMHO the impact on the "D" Zone is a by-product of using the materials in the engines and not the intent.
People are social animals and are not good at keeping secrets. If the video was true, then the ten of thousands of people that build and design engines who would know about it would have to keep it a secret and I just do not see that being possible. This is the same fallacy I have in believing about Chem-Trails.
The main source of his data is an Air Force book published in 1951 and Wikipedia. I will admit when somebody quotes Wikipedia to me as backup to an argument their creditability significantly drops as give me 5 minutes and I will have it support my view. The 1951 book I think over all is accurate for it's time, but it is almost 70 years later and the methods of measuring and testing have significantly improved - they need to find a modern source.
One thing I did note (or perhaps overlooked because I started at 9:09) is it did not mention the impact of nuclear weapons testing on the ION levels, this could significantly boast the amount of IONs in the atmosphere.
Most if not all of the major producers of jet engines are for profit and as such there are reasons why certain metals are used in their production. I don't argue the impact of the metals used as the video states, but I think they are taking a theory and trying to force facts to fit it. IMHO the impact on the "D" Zone is a by-product of using the materials in the engines and not the intent.
People are social animals and are not good at keeping secrets. If the video was true, then the ten of thousands of people that build and design engines who would know about it would have to keep it a secret and I just do not see that being possible. This is the same fallacy I have in believing about Chem-Trails.
special ed
2nd Lieutenant
- 5,717
- May 13, 2018
After reading thru this thread, no one has mentioned that ozone is 0 3. I used to point out to those years ago who wanted to do away with spray cans that 0 3 is unstable and is always trying to find monoxide, 0 to become 0 2, i.e. stable oxygen. Ozone is created by lightning and certain types of pine trees. It is what you smell after a thunderstorm or in a pine forest. I mentioned this to a kid in college at our job back then and after he told his professor he was told "That's right but I have to teach the curriculum".
vikingBerserker
Lieutenant General
True, but I believe at least in the US since the 70's the propellants that destroyed ozone are no longer allowed to be used.
special ed
2nd Lieutenant
- 5,717
- May 13, 2018
True, but it was unnecessary as volcanos put out more florcholorcarbons than all of the freon ever made.
MIflyer
1st Lieutenant
Back in the 70's a University group looked into what could be done to prevent cholorflorocarbons from depleting the ozone layer.
The answer they came up with was the opposite of what the video says - to inject metals into the upper atmosphere which would react with the cholorflorocarbons and prevent the destruction of the ozone.
Then they did some more calculations and found that meteors entering the atmosphere put something like 10,000 times as much metals in the atmosphere than would be required.
As for other reference sources, VB has a real point there. Look at this and you'll see there are later reference sources that are still pre-jet airliner:
https://archive.org/search.php?query=The Upper Atmosphere
By the way a neighbor of mine had his air conditioning system worked on and discovered that the cost of Freon 22 has increased incredibly. Production of Freon 22 was reduced and then stopped entirely in 2015; the price has increased accordingly. Service companies now charge $75 and up per pound of Freon 22.
The answer they came up with was the opposite of what the video says - to inject metals into the upper atmosphere which would react with the cholorflorocarbons and prevent the destruction of the ozone.
Then they did some more calculations and found that meteors entering the atmosphere put something like 10,000 times as much metals in the atmosphere than would be required.
As for other reference sources, VB has a real point there. Look at this and you'll see there are later reference sources that are still pre-jet airliner:
https://archive.org/search.php?query=The Upper Atmosphere
By the way a neighbor of mine had his air conditioning system worked on and discovered that the cost of Freon 22 has increased incredibly. Production of Freon 22 was reduced and then stopped entirely in 2015; the price has increased accordingly. Service companies now charge $75 and up per pound of Freon 22.
Not sure how that would work - ozone is an extremely active oxidiser, brominated halogenes interrupt the oxidation process so wouldn't react with the metals.
- Thread starter
- #50
PWR4360-59B
Senior Airman
- 379
- May 27, 2008
I also remember the good old days of piston engine contrails, and jets as well. Those photos don't show what became of those after say an hour or more. The photos show fresh contrails. Yes they would in those days disappear. The trails that happen here when they do it, come from a specific direction and become persistent cirroform type clouds at the wrong height. And during this last summer when they didn't want moisture here there were no trails nor planes from those directions. A passenger plane nor any other plane can't come from the direction at the altitude they are at while dumping, from normal flight, as they would be out of fuel. So it has to be a deliberate maneuver doing what they are doing. And the total lack of that air traffic for at least 3 months proves the point. When the high pressure area is established, they don't fly the path. Its called observation that most people don't think of or care about. I find it funny how for some reason there is always a poo poo crowd, that doesn't even want to try to study something that may alter their reality a bit. Luckily we have had great inventors that were not like that. Yes they were called all sorts of names and crapped on, just makes me think of how some act on here.
special ed
2nd Lieutenant
- 5,717
- May 13, 2018
He will have to convert to R-134a. Conversion and refill will most likely be cheaper than fill with R-22. An interesting thing about Byrd's 1939 trip to Antarctica included research into why the ozone layer dipped to the south pole. There was apparently a void of ozone at the pole. The south pole also has the longest known continuously erupting volcano. When Mount Pinitubo erupted in the Phillapines the aircraft doing air sampling brought results that just this one eruption of a medium size put out more choloflorocarbons than all the freon made since 1920 when it was invented.
special ed
2nd Lieutenant
- 5,717
- May 13, 2018
Ozone is actually present from the surface of the earth thru the stratosphere but the concentration is called the ozone 'layer'.
Can you explain this further. I don't know of a place in the US that is unattainable due to the reasons you state...
"A passenger plane nor any other plane can't come from the direction at the altitude they are at while dumping, from normal flight, as they would be out of fuel."
As for the rest of your post, wow...
"A passenger plane nor any other plane can't come from the direction at the altitude they are at while dumping, from normal flight, as they would be out of fuel."
As for the rest of your post, wow...
That's because there are a number of us on this forum who have first-hand knowledge that this is bullsh!t.
Last edited:
Shortround6
Major General
He just hit my ignore list.
My favorite picture provided as evidence by "Chemtrail Conspiracy Nuts" is this one.
Then when you explain to them that these are ballast tanks filled with water during flight testing of new aircraft to simulate different weight and passenger characteristics, they call you a liar. "Liar! I saw it on the internet!"
Then you show them your credentials and experience, and they accuse you of being part of the deep conspiracy, or simply not knowing what you are doing...
It never gets old...
Then when you explain to them that these are ballast tanks filled with water during flight testing of new aircraft to simulate different weight and passenger characteristics, they call you a liar. "Liar! I saw it on the internet!"
Then you show them your credentials and experience, and they accuse you of being part of the deep conspiracy, or simply not knowing what you are doing...
It never gets old...
Last edited:
Yeah, posting things like that is asking for some lashing on an aviation forum. That is because many of the people here have worked or still work in Aviation and you're indirectly accusing them of spraying chemicals or at least covering it up. With these kind of theories, you must remember that it is not so simple to keep a secret, especially not one like this idea that would be executed in the open. Also you should be able to detect the chemicals on the ground if the have to have any impact. I never heard that this as the case. Most researchers don't work for the goverment, you know... Another thing to remember is that with that vast area to cover and at that altitude, you need an awful lot of chemicals to have any significant effect at all on the ground. That means there must be a lot of money involved. This you cannot hide for 60+ years. Therefore it's highly unlikely that your theory is true.
People believe what they want to believe and with the Internet booming, conspiracy theories are thriving.
Last edited:
Exactly Marcel, there are only hundreds of thousands of people around tge world covering up this conspiracy.
At my Masonic Lodge during monthly meetings, we come up with more creative ways to keep it secret.
