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I thought the only real problem with the 262 was engine life, this isnt a problem of aircraft design or even the engine design just a shortage of very exotic metals. Some pilots were much better than others at prolonging engine life (I read somewhere on this forum). Hardly a surprise, it was the first jet to go into combat service so everyone was learning.
I am sure the first meteor pilots had the same experience learning rapidly from hard lessons what the do's and don'ts are certainly the F80 had its problems but went on to be produced in large numbers
The 262s were put together by slave labour. If they had a chance of sabotaging them without getting caught, they did:How did the general drop off in quality control that afflicted German industry from late 44 affect the 262. Was the 262 treated as a special case and kept pre 44 standards. I have read that late Bf109s could have wildly varying performance between aircraft from the same batch.
I'll call 100% BS on that statement as well as the article. Robert Dorr was a long time aviation author and had many books published under Osprey (par for the course). Although he had a long and distinguished career in the US military, as a diplomat and as a writer, I don't think he was a rated pilot and doesn't provide any reference to back up that statement.
This is from Zeno's site, "Summary of debriefing German pilot Hans Fey on operational performance & late
war deployment of the Me 262 jet fighter."
From the document:
"Fay says that this aircraft is easier to fly than the latest types of Fw 190 or Me 109- In fact, he feels any Me 109 pilot is qualified to fly the Me 262 after one hour's instruction."
http://www.zenoswarbirdvideos.com/Images/Me262/ME262PILOTDEBRIEF.pdf
"After Brown took off, he thought the airplane was easy—a pleasure, even—to fly: The controls were responsive, there were no vibrations and compared to a piston-engine fighter it whispered."
Lt. Roy Brown ATI USAAF, 1944
Watson's Whizzers - Saving the Me-262 | HistoryNet
And a quote from another Brown;
"After his flight, Eric had the highest praise for the 262, the world's first operational jet fighter, calling it, "the most formidable combat aircraft to evolve in World War II."
Jörg "Czyp" Czypionka on Eric Brown's evaluation of the Me 262.
Jorg Czypionka
Eric Brown's own words (starts at 4:00)
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zhVp0dvwr68
There were some flight test reports that were critical of the Me 262, while not perfect by any means, I think some of these reports were agenda driven IMO. Form your own opinions but consider your sources, especially those who actually FLEW the aircraft!
This has little to do with aerodynamic performance and everything to do with weapons systems! The Me-262 had 4X 30 MM Mk-108s and could not hit a maneuvering target with them. That is why prop fighters shot down many more jet fighters than vice verse. The 4X 20s in the GM had a flat trajectory and it was easy to get hits with them.Assume that the GM's pilot was somewhat less experienced but more knowledgeable about the enemy aircraft than the 262 pilot (an allied jet fighter arriving with no warning would've be a shocker). Both of them meet each other at the same altitude shortly after the 262's dive on a B-17 Flying Fortress during an allied bombing run, who would win?
You can't be serious with this statement...This has little to do with aerodynamic performance and everything to do with weapons systems! The Me-262 had 4X 30 MM Mk-108s and could not hit a maneuvering target with them. That is why prop fighters shot down many more jet fighters than vice verse. The 4X 20s in the GM had a flat trajectory and it was easy to get hits with them.
The 262 can run, but not win and the GM can win, but not catch the 262!
So, it all boils down to the geometry of the intercept. In a head on pass, the 262 looses almost every time! Also to P-38s and P-39s! But as the Angle off goes past the 3-9 line, the 262 pilots has to step on his **** to loose. Chasing any target, the 262 has such huge problems getting any hit at all that it is all a matter of luck and if he chooses to fight the dog, the other guy will get a shot in sooner or later.
So it's any other plane before the 262.
The 262s were put together by slave labour. If they had a chance of sabotaging them without getting caught, they did:
"...As early as March 1944 slave labor was considered for production of the Me-262 but it wasn't until AFTER the July 20, 1944 bomb plot on the Fuhrer's life that the Me-262 eventually fell under control of the SS and their underground super assembly plant plans; still, a large percentage of the late 1944-1945 Me-262s were produced by slave labor. .."
For information, from :
The Me 262 Stormbird: From the Pilots Who Flew, Fought, and Survived It
By Colin D. Heaton
This has little to do with aerodynamic performance and everything to do with weapons systems! The Me-262 had 4X 30 MM Mk-108s and could not hit a maneuvering target with them. That is why prop fighters shot down many more jet fighters than vice verse. The 4X 20s in the GM had a flat trajectory and it was easy to get hits with them.
The 262 can run, but not win and the GM can win, but not catch the 262!
So, it all boils down to the geometry of the intercept. In a head on pass, the 262 looses almost every time! Also to P-38s and P-39s! But as the Angle off goes past the 3-9 line, the 262 pilots has to step on his **** to loose. Chasing any target, the 262 has such huge problems getting any hit at all that it is all a matter of luck and if he chooses to fight the dog, the other guy will get a shot in sooner or later.
So it's any other plane before the 262.
The big advantage flying the L29 when compared to early jets were speed brakes. .
with it's inferior Mk108 cannon?
Meeehh the Mk108 vastly over rated I got shot by one once and it didnt even hurt I just pressed reset ordered another 16inch pizza and carried on with the game.
I would appreciate your views on the tactics the allies had to use to try and shoot down the 262. Where they had to try and get them on landing and take off because they were almost invulnerable to interception when up to speed. This entailed flying down huge aa traps because the Germans had very effective aa guns. According to your belief all the allies had to do was wait for the Germans to come to them, indulge in a bit or aerobatics because the Germans couldn't hit them and eventually shoot the 262's when it was time for tea.This has little to do with aerodynamic performance and everything to do with weapons systems! The Me-262 had 4X 30 MM Mk-108s and could not hit a maneuvering target with them. That is why prop fighters shot down many more jet fighters than vice verse. The 4X 20s in the GM had a flat trajectory and it was easy to get hits with them.
The 262 can run, but not win and the GM can win, but not catch the 262!
So, it all boils down to the geometry of the intercept. In a head on pass, the 262 looses almost every time! Also to P-38s and P-39s! But as the Angle off goes past the 3-9 line, the 262 pilots has to step on his **** to loose. Chasing any target, the 262 has such huge problems getting any hit at all that it is all a matter of luck and if he chooses to fight the dog, the other guy will get a shot in sooner or later.
So it's any other plane before the 262.