1:32 scale Lancaster Mk.1 Hachette Partworks

Gerry, I've seen the fitting for the flare pistol in a number of WW2 photos, and film/video footage, although it appeared to be slightly further outboard on the spar cap. (I seem to recall snagging on it in the BBMF Lanc, although only the base of the 'holster' was fitted at that time, 30 years ago.)
However, none of these have shown the pistol in position, and some (just like the BBMF example) have been the circular/tubular base only, whilst others suggested a complete lack of the fitting. It's rather like the fitting of the armour plate at the rest bench - some pics (mainly early versions) show it, others don't. And like the paint colours up front - some all grey-green (early), some grey-green with black main cockpit, and some a combination of all colours.
A flare pistol would normally be standard equipment, used for emergency signalling, special communications, and firing the identification 'colours of the day', even though the three signalling lamps were fitted beneath the rear fuselage, but its storage position might be down to production batch, modification, unit practice, or personal preference.
It's possible/probable, that W/Op stored the pistol under the hinged flap of his desk, or perhaps clipped to the fuselage wall, rather than risk it flying around the compartment under violent manouvering, should it become detached from the spar mount. Either way, inclusion of one will not go amiss.
Going back to the flare chute exit, I've been trying to find an underside pic, which I know is in at least one of the many Lanc books I have, which shows the feint outline of the exit hatch, but apparently without the 'windbreak'.
Four books done - only eight more to go !!

Apologies Gerry - I misread your last question re the flare pistol, and thought you meant the stowage position on the main spar cap.
I hadn't looked that closely at the roof of the W/Op's station in those Lancs I've been in, which did not have a pistol in place, so can't comment on the variations (if any) in the pistol's firing location or type.
However, having studied the photo you mentioned, it looks like this socket mount could be similar to those fitted to aircraft such as the Mustang, and post-war, multi-engine RAF aircraft. This was a socket-mount, with an internal, spring-loaded cap, or cover, opening inwards, into which the barrel of the pistol was slid, and held in place by the spring-loaded cap, rather like outdoor electrical connection sockets.
The outside of the 'tube' holding the barrel would therefore probably be open to the air, but 'chamfered' against the ingress of airflow, again like the exterior of the 'hole' on the port side of the Mustang cockpit, or possibly hinged outward, to be opened by the pistol muzzle when fitted.
I've checked the interior shots (35mm slides) I took thirty years ago, but unfortunately the socket isn't visible and, dragging back into my memory, I can only recall the internal cover over the socket. But, just looking at a topside pic I took of the Duxford Lanc, what might be the flare pistol port exterior 'hatch' is just visible, behind the astro-dome, and in the right location, although it can't be seen clearly.
I'm hoping to get to Duxford again sometime in late July or early August (I'll miss 'Legends', unfortunately), so I'll make a point of getting up on the balcony to have a look, and also do a 'walk around', as far as access will allow, as there are a few detail shots I want for my model too.

OK guys, here's what I found out tonight at the Nanton museum. I asked the engineer, Greg, about the pneumatic tanks in the starboard wheel well and he proceeded to give me a rundown of practically the entire pneumatic system from the engine compressors to the charge tanks, filters, traps, check valves, etc. Long story short, the tanks that are seen from the wheel wells are on the starboard side only. Here's a pic from the manual:



The line you see running to the fuselage charges another slightly larger tank mounted on the roof of the nose, just behind the turret. I believe that tank is isolated from the rest of the system with a check valve and runs the brakes. The 3 tanks that you have in your kit are for the engine functions such as supercharger control and radiator shutters.

Here are pics of the wheel wells (apologies for the quality - shaky cell phone operator). Port well showing no tanks:



...and the starboard one showing your tanks.



The Nanton Lanc has the flare pistol holder mounted on the spar cover as you have modeled it:



Immediately above, and just forward of the bulkhead frame, is the flare socket, as Terry described it. Note that the cap for the socket is removed and hangs from a chain. The chord that you see coming through the opening is actually an electrical extension chord that the museum uses to power up lights and outlets inside the fuselage for restoration work. Again, apologies for the shaky quality.



The same opening as seen from the outside through the astrodome:



Now, I completely missed checking out the photo flare chute and will need to look into this on my next visit this coming Saturday. I must admit that I'm a little unclear as to what you are looking for here so if you can give me a bit more of a hint I'll have a better chance of getting what you need.

And that's what makes this such a Great community.

Crimea_River said:

OK guys, here's what I found out tonight at the Nanton museum. I asked the engineer, Greg, about the pneumatic tanks in the starboard wheel well and he proceeded to give me a rundown of practically the entire pneumatic system from the engine compressors to the charge tanks, filters, traps, check valves, etc. Long story short, the tanks that are seen from the wheel wells are on the starboard side only. Here's a pic from the manual:

View attachment 295914

The line you see running to the fuselage charges another slightly larger tank mounted on the roof of the nose, just behind the turret. I believe that tank is isolated from the rest of the system with a check valve and runs the brakes. The 3 tanks that you have in your kit are for the engine functions such as supercharger control and radiator shutters.

Here are pics of the wheel wells (apologies for the quality - shaky cell phone operator). Port well showing no tanks:

View attachment 295916

...and the starboard one showing your tanks.

View attachment 295917

The Nanton Lanc has the flare pistol holder mounted on the spar cover as you have modeled it:

View attachment 295912

Immediately above, and just forward of the bulkhead frame, is the flare socket, as Terry described it. Note that the cap for the socket is removed and hangs from a chain. The chord that you see coming through the opening is actually an electrical extension chord that the museum uses to power up lights and outlets inside the fuselage for restoration work. Again, apologies for the shaky quality.

View attachment 295915

The same opening as seen from the outside through the astrodome:

View attachment 295913

Now, I completely missed checking out the photo flare chute and will need to look into this on my next visit this coming Saturday. I must admit that I'm a little unclear as to what you are looking for here so if you can give me a bit more of a hint I'll have a better chance of getting what you need.

Click to expand...

Bl**dy well done there Andy !

Thanks Terry. The pistol holder looks a bit worse for wear but at least it's there. It looks like it's been bent a few times. As for the photo flash unit, I'll try to get some more info this Saturday but there is an event going on and they'll be running the engines so cockpit access may be a challenge with line-ups of people.

Great stuff Andy!

Terry and Andy, Thank you both. That's absolutely priceless reference information and the stuff you just can't find on the Internet. I will install the roof exit, although it will be very difficult to spot in the interior. And thank you both for your offer of future references, when you have the opportunity.

Andy, thanks also for the info on the bottles. Without that I would probably built some sprue bottles for the port side.

I can only second Herman1rg's sentiment: this is indeed what makes this such a great community.

Gerry

You're very welcome Gerry. Funny that when I was talking to Greg, he said that he's been contacted by Hatchette about reference pics for their Facebook page. I've gone over there but can't find anything. Are you using any reference links that sound like it might be this?

That wonderful community!!; seconding comments, it is for me a fortune to belong to this great group of friends. Experienced and knowledgeable !!
No workbench colleague where there is much to learn from so many contributions and suggestions.

Felicidades otra vez Gerry

Saludos
SANCER

Awesome info!

Good stuff!

Thanks Andy, Luis Carlos, David and Wayne.

Crimea_River said:

You're very welcome Gerry. Funny that when I was talking to Greg, he said that he's been contacted by Hatchette about reference pics for their Facebook page. I've gone over there but can't find anything. Are you using any reference links that sound like it might be this?

Click to expand...

Andy, I've never known of a Hatchette thread for the Lancaster build. However, I've never signed up to Facebook, so therefore don't tend to look at Facebook pages. There were two main references I used to refer to at the start of the build; one was a thread of the Lanc build on the Diecast Aviation site <The Diecast Aviation Web Site and Forum - Powered by vBulletin> by a chap called 'The Old 'Un'. I found this build very helpful, as he discovered most of the problems the hard way and was well advanced before I commenced. Unfortunately, he passed away before completing the build - R.I.P. Recently, I have been unable to access the thread or even the site so maybe that thread has been taken down.

The second reference was a link from that site to a Flickr photostream album of the Lanc build by Lee Douglas Brown. Despite there not being a commentary, It does show the build in various stages and what can be achieved. As far as I can see, Lee built it 'out of the box' and any enhancements were in a very elaborate diorama he placed it in, when completed. That album is still viewable on Flickr.

These are the sum total of the sites I'm currently aware of but I would certainly be interested to hear if there are any others out there.

Gerry

Gerry, I've been looking into that external flare pistol hatch thing, since it's something I hadn't considered until you mentioned it.
After viewing lots of period photos, I've seen variations of the same thing, when the external part has been visible that is.
It's mostly been shown as a flush, round aperture on British-built Lancs, without the 'tube' protruding, as seen on Canadian manufactured airframes. This has been seen with what appears to be a circular hatch cover, again flush fitting, with what appears to be a hinge on the rear edge, and also as an open, circular 'hole', as well as the latter with what I presume is a red-doped canvas patch, seen in both circular and rectangular form.
I'm continuing to search my books and files (as strength allows) for this, and the flare-chute exit on the lower, rear fuselage, as they're both items I want to incorporate in my 1/48th scale model, so if I find anything showing a clear presentation of the areas, I'll post them here.
I'll also make a point of getting as many detail shots as possible of the Duxford Lanc when I visit, bearing in mind it is a late model, and has had modifications to some areas. I'll be showing my youngest daughter around DX (she's just turned 22), and I'm sure she won't mind me taking the time to 'tour' the outside of the Lanc, as, since she saw the BBMF one over London, and then again at 'Legends' last year, as well as the two Lancs together it's possibly her favourite aircraft !
EDIT:- Forgot to mention; the internal socket-mount for the flare pistol seen in the pics Andy posted, is very similar to that fitted to the P-51 Mustang, which makes sense, since Canadian-built Lancs used American instrumentation, radios, electrical equipment, etc, different to the 'British' Lancs.
From what I remember, the 'British' socket, although similar in appearance overall, did not have the 'screw-on' cover with chain, but the hinged, spring-loaded 'cap' as previously described. Of course, even in 1/32nd scale, this would be difficult to see, if the whole fitting itself can even be seen, once the model is 'closed up', so even a basic representation would suffice.

After another visit to the Nanton Lanc yesterday and a discussion with Greg, I have little more to offer on the photo flare chute opening. In fact, on our Lancaster, the skin in this area has been removed for repair so there is nothing of substance I can post in regard to details. However, the chute itself is in storage for restoration and some marginal pics are below. I could not lift the chute into a better position as lifting this unit is a 2 man job due to the fact that it has steel armour plating on it!

Here is where the chute mounts to the floor. The opening has been plated over on our Lanc. In the foreground, you can see that the floor walkway is under repair.



The chute itself:

Terry and Andy,

Thank you both for the additional information, and Andy, for the photos of the dismantled flare chute. I'm currently working on correcting/adapting the undercarriage. More of that in a few days time.

Gerry

As promised, I'm going to update you here on my attempts to correct the undercarriage. You may remember that I had initially partially tackled this on pps 25, 26 and 27, if you want to check back. This initiated a debate about the oleos looking totally wrong, which I reluctantly had to agree with. I said I'd look at it again, at some point but put it on the long finger. Following the build sequence, the starboard u/c now needed to be completed.

Since parking the undercarriages (no pun intended), I have been blowing hot and cold as to whether the risk of adapting them was worth it. My worry was that if I botched it, I couldn't just go and buy an aftermarket replacement set, as they're just not available. Another concern was that they're built from cast metal and I have no experience working with metal. However, I had managed to source a spare oleo frame and thought I could experiment on that. Just as well!

I finally decided to have a go and see how it went. Taking my courage in both hands and a Dremel in my other one, I decided to give it a go. I cut the frame where I thought and, using brass tube and rod, tried this first attempt.



It was just as well that I had the spare frame to experiment on. Unfortunately, the holes in the frame are off centre where the cut was made so the brass tube and supporting rod inside is slightly off centre but I might have got away with that. Worse, though, was the fact that the oleos were now too long and wouldn't fit the wheel bay by quite a bit.

Back to the drawing board. I carefully measured everything again and found I could only increase the original length by approx 1cm. if I wanted them to work as designed.



The photo above is to remind you how they originally looked and the adaptions I eventually thought might work. Rather than cut the legs, the support bars and brackets need to be cut and ground and repositioned to the height of the solid line. Then one cm. of tube could be added to the bottom for extra length. So, deciding to be brave and careful, I sanded/stripped the oleo frames back down to the bare metal.



Then the brace bars were removed and replaced with longer rods. New collars were made from cut chrome tape, salvaged brackets added and brass tube gave the extra length. I should confess that I didn't have the courage to grind the old collars as I was afraid I would gouge the legs. If I had access to a lathe I might have tried.



The resized oleos were repainted and lightly weathered and brake lines and placards were added. These are back and front views of the painted oleos.



The oleos were then anchored in the wheel bays and attached to the support bars behind.



The final part of the assembly was to drop the springs into the oleo support frames and grease and insert the oleo legs. The tiny bolts slot through the support legs and into the grooves on the oleos to prevent them falling out of the support frame, but allowing for some up/down movement.



Here the wheels and the flexible brake lines are attached to the hubs. Next three shots demonstrate how the full articulated metal undercarriage extends and retracts like the real thing. I just realised, when doing this that in the actual aircraft, the black inner hub must remain static, otherwise the brake lines would be ripped out.







Finally, I decided to test the new proportions of the oleos against a reference photo with the help of a little computer manipulation.



The photo on the left is the BBMF Lancaster. That on the right, the new oleo matched to the width of the actual oleo and montaged on to the original photo.
I hope you'll agree that while it's not perfect, it's an honest attempt to correct the deficiency in the supplied parts and now looks closer to the real thing. I now believe it was worth the extra time and effort.

Back to stringing and skinning now and hopefully progressing my other build a bit more.

Gerry

Outstanding work Gerry!