Aviation myths that will not die

[davparlr]

Ground speed, as measured between two points on the ground, can be very accurate. It is the way world speed records were measured. It can also be very inaccurate, all the way down to WAG territory.
World speed records require cameras and clocks that are synchronized at both the start and finish lines and flights to be made both ways within a short period of time to average the wind conditions.
Flights from airport A to airport B certainly introduce a host of variables. Synchronized clocks at each airport? Pilots wrist watch?
When was the time started? Did the plane loose altitude over the course of the flight? like drop several thousand feet over 50 miles? Tail winds were what speed at what altitude?
However even test flights are not 100% accurate until/unless correction factors are figured into the instrument readings.
Sometimes extra instruments were fitted to aircraft including things like recording barometers and temperature recorders (they recorded on paper drums)

So the proper corrections could be made to the instrument readings, like the normal altimeter and air speed indicator.
Often a new/different pitot tube was fitted to test aircraft in order to minimize errors due to pitot tube location or shape until a general correction could be worked out for production examples. Also the correction factor for the pitot tube/airspeed indicator varied a bit with the speed of the aircraft and in some cases gave higher readings than true instead of lower.

Both the P-38 and F4U were designed with the intention of being 400mph aircraft. Both wound up being 400mph aircraft, just not in their original form or using their original engines. Since due to crashes of prototypes and delays in programs they over lapped considerably the only real value in which was first would be to settle a bar bet.

Precisely!

 

[parsifal]

So were lots of other units, that doesn't wash with me.

Keitel clearly signed orders dealing with allied airmen in general, I see no evidence that any particular unit was singled out. The idea that one was is a typical extrapolation or interpretation of known facts to suit another end, absolutely typical roots for this kind of myth to grow on. A little dash of truth makes it all the more plausible.
Unless someone shows some specific evidence then the proposition that Keitel signed an order to the effect that "Aviators Normandie (Niemen) shall be executed on capture" is busted!

Cheers

Steve

Of the 42 pilots shot down and captured alive by the germans from this group 38 were shot or otherwise disappeared.

hard to produce the hard evidence you are asking, but I believe that statistic and it certainly looks like the normandie gp (it wasn't awarded the honourary title "niemen' until 1944) was singled out for special treatment. The gp had caught the eye of the germans since its above average performance in the battle of france. When as a group it defected enmasse in December 1941 it enraged the Nazis. when it showed up in the East in 1943, and began shooting down large numbers of LW a/c , and generally acting as "pin up boys" for both the VVS and the FFL forces, it was a short extrapolation for the Nazis to extend their already illegal positions like the commissar orders and the commando orders to include these guys.


its not explainable why they would treat these guys differently to others, but the statistics just say that they did. Like a lot of things, the Nazis often acted without rationality or consistency.

 

[GrauGeist]

its not explainable why they would treat these guys differently to others, but the statistics just say that they did. Like a lot of things, the Nazis often acted without rationality or consistency.

Like I mentioned earlier, Groupe de Chasse 3 was a thorn in the Luftwaffe's side.

And as we know, there was no love lost between Germany and the Soviet Union.

 

[parsifal]

I should say this as a word of caution. In the book "French Eagles, Soviet Heroes", the numbers of pilots that were taken prisoner to the number I quoted above (which comes from a different source). The book says that only 8 were taken prisoner, but conversely all of those 8 were killed whilst in captivity.

I'd have to say the information does appear a little unreliable, but both sources that I know of are in unison as to proportions of pilots captured and then killed....all of them, or nearly all of them. .

 

[Graeme]

I believe the origins of the Dornier Do-17, as reproduced here, is a complete myth that has been replicated in books/magazines for many decades...

The truth...

 

[Graeme]

So where did the Fork Tailed Devil name come from then?

Not on this list...but there are some interesting others...

 

[tomo pauk]

"Bf 109G was a slow fighter"

 

[Milosh]

CF-100 was also called the Clunk, iirc

 

[Shortround6]

Many aircraft had nicknames, some affectionate, some not.
Nicknames that were supposed to be made-up by enemy troops/forces showing how terrified they were of the aircraft in question should be looked at with a fair amount of suspicion.

 

[michaelmaltby]

clunk ..... from landing gear retraction

 

[pbehn]

M

Many aircraft had nicknames, some affectionate, some not.
Nicknames that were supposed to be made-up by enemy troops/forces showing how terrified they were of the aircraft in question should be looked at with a fair amount of suspicion.

I think many RAF BoB pilots referred to 109s as "snappers"

 

[Airframes]

"Snappers" was a generic R/T code for enemy fighters, just as was Bandits, and later, Bogeys.

 

[stona]

Yep, the RAF does seem to have known and used the name Jaguar for the Bf 110.

 

[GrauGeist]

The nickname discussion got me to finally post a master list I had been working on several years ago...

Certainly not complete, but has a huge number of names on the list.

Take a look and see which ones I may have left out!

Aircraft Nickname Master List

 

[bobbysocks]

I remember my father referring to the me163 as a squirt

 

[michaelmaltby]

The CF-121 Redhawk ..... Canada's Migs. Now this was a well-built myth

The Breaking Point - Canadian MiGs test American friendship - 2011 APRIL FOOL'S HOAX > Vintage Wings of Canada

 

[stona]

Re: the "Goering ordered the fighters to closely escort the bombers" myth. Hans-Jürgen Stumpff, who commanded Luftflotte 5 which launched the disastrous (for the Luftwaffe) raids from Norway during the Battle of Britain, described Goering as a man
"with a tremendous strength; he was full of bright ideas. After each meeting with him you felt strongly inspired and filled with energy".
Despite surviving the war, having served with considerable distinction, he obviously didn't get the Galland et alter post war script, in which all the many failings of the Luftwaffe were blamed on Goering, hence exculpating the men who were actually responsible, Galland, who we shouldn't forget commanded Germany's fighter force later in the war, among them.
Cheers
Steve

 

[fastmongrel]

Re: the "Goering ordered the fighters to closely escort the bombers" myth. Hans-Jürgen Stumpff, who commanded Luftflotte 5 which launched the disastrous (for the Luftwaffe) raids from Norway during the Battle of Britain, described Goering as a man
"with a tremendous strength; he was full of bright ideas. After each meeting with him you felt strongly inspired and filled with energy".
Despite surviving the war, having served with considerable distinction, he obviously didn't get the Galland et alter post war script, in which all the many failings of the Luftwaffe were blamed on Goering, hence exculpating the men who were actually responsible, Galland, who we shouldn't forget commanded Germany's fighter force later in the war, among them.
Cheers
Steve

I have read several books about Galland and I have come away from them with the feeling that Galland and the truth were sometimes not in the same room, sometimes not even in the same country. Goering was a bit of a Bullsh**er and a junkie but he was obviously not the complete buffoon some war survivors like to paint him. Without his work I doubt the LW would have been the battle winning machine it was.

 

[stona]

Without his work I doubt the LW would have been the battle winning machine it was.

Agree 100%

Cheers

Steve

 

[Airframes]

In a filmed interview with Galland, I think in the 1980s, he is very obviously uncomfortable when answering the question regarding the shooting of aircrew under parachutes, stating that he never knew of this, and certainly not in his own unit.
Also, during the filming of the BoB movie, he is recorded as stating that Luftwaffe officers never gave the Nazi salute - there are photos of him, and other officers of JG26 giving this salute to Hitler, as he departed after a visit