The Best Bomber of WWII: #4

helmitsmit · Nov 26, 2007

I actually see the mosquito as the best bomber. Purely on a strategic view but still. It was the most efficient in terms of human life (only two crew), minimal time over enemy territory, hardest to shoot down, beautiful (oops that isn't strategic!), manoeuvrable, long range matched with very high cursing speed (higher cursing speed then a P51!), very cheap and easy to build, parts can be built in random places over the country so production less likely to be effected by enemy bombing, Hitler hated it (oops not strategic either!) and versatile.

DerAdlerIstGelandet · Nov 26, 2007

helmitsmit said:
I think the Lancaster was the best heavy of the war (accept for maybe the B29 but that was very late on in the war). I mean it could carry 14,000lb to Berlin! And some very heavy special presents! 22,000lb Glam slam! With the B24 second. I don't rate the fortress at all! I read in "Mosquito stories" that the Fortress in order to get to Berlin could only carry 4,000lb at a speed of 200mph! Yet the pregnant mossie light bomber could carry a 4,000lb cookie to berlin at 300mph! and complete the trip in half the time! It also didn't waste millions of .50 rounds or five crew members (as it carry two crew compared with seven)

Yet the B-24 had about the same crew as the B-17. Carried a bomb load comparable to the B-17 and as you say wasted millions of .50 rounds.

The B-17 was more dependable than the B-24 and overall a better bomber than the B-24.

I dont understand how you can rate the B-24 but not the B-17....

helmitsmit · Nov 26, 2007

because the liberator was useful in other less common bomber roles like mining and actually had much better range which was useful in the pacific war.

Screaming Eagle · Nov 27, 2007

but you can't beat the ruggedness of a B-17

DerAdlerIstGelandet · Nov 27, 2007

helmitsmit said:
because the liberator was useful in other less common bomber roles like mining and actually had much better range which was useful in the pacific war.

The B-17 was as well. Infact the B-17 was probably used in more roles than the Liberator and flew better and was more rugged and dependable.

syscom3 · Nov 27, 2007

DerAdlerIstGelandet said:
The B-17 was as well. Infact the B-17 was probably used in more roles than the Liberator and flew better and was more rugged and dependable.

The B24 was more versatile than the B17, due to its larger bomb bays and larger fuel load.

ToughOmbre · Nov 27, 2007

DerAdlerIstGelandet said:
The B-17 was as well. Infact the B-17 was probably used in more roles than the Liberator and flew better and was more rugged and dependable.

Also, although I can't speak from first hand experience, I've heard from more than a few that the B-17 was a lot easier to fly than the B-24, or for that matter any of the heavies of WW II. And yes, the ruggedness and dependability of the Fort is legendary.

Battle-Damaged B-17 Flying Fortresses

TO

syscom3 · Nov 27, 2007

Yes, the B17 was quite rugged. But...... the purpose of a bomber is to drop as many bombs on target as possible. And the B17 had the lowest payload and range of the four principle heavy bombers of the war.

There was also the issue of it flying so high. Good for survivability.... but.... bad for bomb accuracy.

DerAdlerIstGelandet · Nov 28, 2007

syscom3 said:
The B24 was more versatile than the B17, due to its larger bomb bays and larger fuel load.

I was not talking about bomb sizes and what not. I am talking about varients and versatility. The B-17 was more versatile overall.

AL Schlageter · Nov 28, 2007

What were the uses the B-17 and B-24 were put to?

FLYBOYJ · Nov 28, 2007

AL Schlageter said:
What were the uses the B-17 and B-24 were put to?

Recon, ASW, SAR, transport, training, and later for the B-17, target drones.

Just a few off the top of my head....

DerAdlerIstGelandet · Nov 28, 2007

AL Schlageter said:
What were the uses the B-17 and B-24 were put to?

B-17

Bomber
Trainer (TB-17)
Bomber Escort (YB-40 26 built; unsuccessfull and never put into full production)
Transport (C-108 and CB-17)
VIP Transport (VB-17)
Recon (RB-17)
Photo Recon (F-9 Flying Fortress)
AWACS (PB-1 and PB-1W utilized the AN/APS-20 radar and used to develop Airborne Early Warning equipment)
Search and Rescue (SB-17G and PB-1G equipped with an airborne lifeboat and ASV radar)
Target Drone (QB-17)

B-24

Bomber
Bomber Escort (XB-41 only 1 built)
Trainer (AT-24 or TB-24 or RB-24L)
Transport (C-87)
Fuel Tanker (C-109)
Photo Recon (F-7 or PB4Y-1P)

ToughOmbre · Nov 28, 2007

The B-17 and B-24 were also used in "Operation Aphrodite" as remotely controlled "bombs". This use was short-lived as it was very dangerous. I believe Joe Kennedy Jr. (brother of JFK) was killed on a mission, I think in a B-24.

TO

drgondog · Nov 28, 2007

DerAdlerIstGelandet said:
B-17

Bomber
Trainer (TB-17)
Bomber Escort (YB-40 26 built; unsuccessfull and never put into full production)
Transport (C-108 and CB-17)
VIP Transport (VB-17)
Recon (RB-17)
Photo Recon (F-9 Flying Fortress)
AWACS (PB-1 and PB-1W utilized the AN/APS-20 radar and used to develop Airborne Early Warning equipment)
Search and Rescue (SB-17G and PB-1G equipped with an airborne lifeboat and ASV radar)
Target Drone (QB-17)

plus Target Drone Control (Mother Ship) - one of my father's best friends was killed accidentally at Eglin in 1952(?) when an F86D under the hood acquired and shot down the control B-17 instead of Drone

B-24

Bomber
Bomber Escort (XB-41 only 1 built)
Trainer (AT-24 or TB-24 or RB-24L)
Transport (C-87)
Fuel Tanker (C-109)
Photo Recon (F-7 or PB4Y-1P)

B-24 also used as OSS/agent Night insertion ship all over ETO

syscom3 · Nov 28, 2007

I dont think B17's were used extensively in the dedicated ASW aspect of the war. They did perform it on occasion, but only when no other aircraft were available

FLYBOYJ · Nov 28, 2007

syscom3 said:
I dont think B17's were used extensively in the dedicated ASW aspect of the war. They did perform it on occasion, but only when no other aircraft were available

Don't forget the RAF...

DerAdlerIstGelandet · Nov 28, 2007

Bill said:
plus Target Drone Control (Mother Ship) - one of my father's best friends was killed accidentally at Eglin in 1952(?) when an F86D under the hood acquired and shot down the control B-17 instead of Drone

Sorry to hear that Bill.

drgondog said:
B-24 also used as OSS/agent Night insertion ship all over ETO

Yeah but that is pretty much transport I think.

drgondog · Dec 4, 2007

DerAdlerIstGelandet said:
Sorry to hear that Bill.

Yeah but that is pretty much transport I think.

Chris - if you lived at Eglin or Edwards in the 50's someone you knew or liked died every month in an accident.

The Carpetbagggers otherwise known as the 36th and 406th of the 801st BG flew from March 1944 until April 26, 1945. They flew B24D, B-24H, B-24J, C-47, Mossie XVI and A-26B's. They were detached to 15th AF in Jan 1945 and 'did it all'. Dropped guerillas, agents, supplies, petroleum re-supply, radio relay (night - to coordinate R/T traffic from agents), Weather Scout and finally Training... but yes - definitely Transport..

Fairly unique operations throughout Europe. RAF also had this type unit but not sure what the designation was.

Wildcat · Dec 4, 2007

The RAAF in the Pacific had two B-24 special duties flights, 200 and 201. 200 Flight was used for dropping agents and Z force soldiers behind enemy lines and also resupplied them etc. 201 flight was an electronic warfare and surveillance unit, however I don't believe they flew any operations before the war ended.

16KJV11 · Dec 6, 2007

FLYBOYJ said:
Don't forget the RAF...

Or the Luftwaffe.

The Best Bomber of WWII: #4

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