FW-190
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Yes they could have sent p-40's and maybe a couple of p-51a's
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But nothing really changed that much between the Marine fighters at Midway and early Guadalcanal.Joe
- draws The Book -
On May 29 1942, the 1st combat deployment to Alaska is made, 25 of P-39Es go there, winterized* with drop tanks. Half a year before, the P-38Ds are present with 69 examples in combat units. From April 15th, 1942, preparations are being made with 100 P-38Fs to be ferried across Atlantic.
On June 11th, 1942, the all-P38 1st fighter group is ordered to go to West coast, but later ordered for Maine.
* quite in contrast with serious issues in ETO in high altitude
Already answered in this very thread:
So yes, there were P-38s that were combat capable in May 1942.
But nothing really changed that much between the Marine fighters at Midway and early Guadalcanal. The units at Guadalcanal, especially the early ones, weren't that much better prepared. The famous fighter leader at G'canal, Marion Carl, was present in the Midway fight (flying F4F-3 and credited with a Zero) but otherwise most Marine units at G'canal saw their first combat there. And Marine F4F tactics at G'canal were improvised as they went, and in many cases don't fit the standard thumbnail sketch of tactics evolution v the Zero (for example later in the campaign the Marines sometimes sought to dogfight Zeroes, while the IJN units sought to 'hit and run'). The tactical situations at G'canal were often different, OTOH that of VMF-221 at Midway was not that terribly unfavorable, outnumbered, but they were above the Japanese force when the combat began.
You can't conclude much from one combat anyway, but I think it's worth noting that VMF-221 thought the F4F-3 was a much superior a/c to the F2A-3, even if some of the written accounts saying so may have been influenced by hindsight But it's not a just a conclusion outside observers reached. Also, though it's subdividing an already very small sample, the F4F's record v Zero in this combat was not so far below its general level of parity in kill ratio: 4 Zeroes were credited to the Marines, the two most credible to each F2A and F4F, and one Zero was downed by the USMC fighters (another certainly by AA) and another Zero pilot died of wounds though managed to land his a/c, v 2 F4F's downed.
Anyway, in not much later months Marine fighter units had a pretty good record v Zeroes, in a period of limited action by Army fighters; but Army P-39's in New Guinea in the few months between Midway and the start of the G'canal campaign had a much tougher go v Zeroes, similarly couldn't add much at Gudalcanal due to lack of altitude capability (partly due to special factor wrt O2 equipment which didn't pertain in NG). Again these were often missions against escorted higher flying twin engine enemy bombers at G'canal and Port Moresby (in many cases though not all cases in either place), rather than the single incident v a carrier strike at Midway. But in general US Army fighters didn't do as well as USN and USMC ones v Zeroes in 1942.
Joe
Everyone seems to concentrate on P39's and P40's.
Yes, IMHO, the USMC should have requested several squadrons worth of CCF built Hawker Hurricanes, the only North American built fighter that could hope to cope with the Zero.
Historically, the Hurricane didn't do well at all against the Zero. If P38's were operational at that time, that would have been THE airplane for intercepting a bombing raid.
Yes, IMHO, the USMC should have requested several squadrons worth of CCF built Hawker Hurricanes, the only North American built fighter that could hope to cope with the Zero.
Historically, the Hurricane didn't do well at all against the Zero. If P38's were operational at that time, that would have been THE airplane for intercepting a bombing raid.
That choice (Hurricane) might have been a bit (see below) better than the F2A F4F combination assuming they were flown by pilots familiar with the huricane. However it would have totally eliminated the option to conduct an escorted strike which is too desirable an option to neglect even if Simard did so.
Of the 124 aircraft based at midway, there was not one liquid cooled engine, let alone a Merlin engine. You'd have to ship in some mechanics with those Hurricanes.
Of course as short as the battle was for Midway itself, that wouldn't matter. But they wouldn't have known that beforehand.
Of the 124 aircraft based at midway, there was not one liquid cooled engine, let alone a Merlin engine. You'd have to ship in some mechanics with those Hurricanes.
Of course as short as the battle was for Midway itself, that wouldn't matter. But they wouldn't have known that beforehand.
50-58 gallon drop tanks on the F4F extended its combat range by about 50 miles at most out to 225 miles or from about 800 miles to about 900 for total range. How does that compare to the Hurricane's combat range with similar sized drops ot whatever size it actually used?The Hurricane had been using drop tanks from early/mid 1941.
About June 5th, the auxilliary carrier Long Island (AVG-1 or CVE-1) was cruising off the west coast providing cover to Batdiv 4 consisting 7 old pre-1930 battleships and as many destroyers under Adm. William Pye. Acting as a shield for the west coast (?) or as much to keep him out of trouble while Midway was fought according to Lundstrom. The Long Island's airwing at that time but in August carried 12 non-folding wing SBD and 19 folding wing F4F-4 aircraft to Guadacanal. It could probably carry about 15-20 P-40 or P-39 aircraft for a flyoff to Midway in a pinch or maybe 3 P-38s. Flight deck dimensions were about 400+ ft by about 60 ft I believe.
They used the Wasp IIRC to fly a good number (47) of Spits off for Malta in spring 42I don't think you could pack the upper deck that full of Army aircraft, they can't be catapult launched, AFAIK. You'd need to leave part of that upper deck clear for the first few aircraft to fly off.
Some of the Army B-17 and B-26 mechanics, might have experience with Allisons, but in that time period none would have even seen a Merlin, let alone have any experience with one.Same for P38/P39/P40.