Why American aces had lower scores than anybody else

[buffnut453]

Would ever Canada dare to follow a different route on major issues than USA?

Well, in WW2 Canada DID follow a different route than America despite the latter being dominant on the North American continent.

Without America the rest of the allied powers, against Germany and Japan, the best scenario would be a draw

Disagree. In all likelihood, Russia would still have defeated Nazi Germany. The difference would be that most of Europe would likely have fallen under Communist rule.


I'm going to ignore your comments about the UK because, frankly, you're talking nonsense.

 

[dedalos]

I now get what D dedalos was saying, that American economic strength enabled the Allies to pull through, and in that sense, yes, it was our crucial contribution. I misread his point in a manner of sorts. T-34s were often built with imported American steel, planes were fueled often by American avgas of all grades, etc. This is true.

But I think the Germans lost the war once they were turned back at Moscow.

Moscow was just a battle. A communication center ,nothing more. Napoleon did capture Moscow. So what?
Germany lost the war when lost the ability to recreate her armies. And that ability was lost,mainly, because of the American daylight bomber offensive , a campaign that would be impossible for any other country to produce and support.

 

[pbehn]

Yes I agree
, America would have a different war to win, but eventually,still,would win, even if it would need atomic weapons.
Without America the rest of the allied powers, against Germany and Japan, the best scenario would be a draw
I am aware of the geography of the American continent. However on major international affairs, the entire continent follows the policy of the dominant country without question. This is a fact at least since the American president Monroe. Would ever Canada dare to follow a different route on major issues than USA? Would have suffered the fate of the Confederate States of America.
On UK case England is also the dominant part of the union. It was never a union of equality. I would say ,that actually it was a polite way to pass the de facto occupation of Scotland,Ireland and Wels without further revolutions and independence wars. Look at the Brexit case. Scotland wanted to remain in EU. England wanted the Brexit. Guess what happened. So ,in reality , it was , and still is England not UK.

Well if you would say, who would use facts to argue? BTW the Irish Republic was neutral during WW2, Northern Ireland, being part of the UK was involved. Also there are two American continents one called North America and the other called South America. There is actually no such place as "America". Leave present day politics out of discussions using your logic Biden is only president of 27 states.

 

[PAT303]

Merlin was the best aero engine of the war , and it was an English design, so what? They had to ask America to help with their production!

And America needed British technology in return, technology such as gun sights, ammunition, sonar, radar, superchargers, jet engines the list goes on, Britain had the know how, America had the ability to produce it.

 

[Thumpalumpacus]

Moscow was just a battle. A communication center ,nothing more. Napoleon did capture Moscow. So what?

Because it committed Germany to a war of attrition it could not win while having the UK fighting it in the West -- that's what.

Also, Moscow was not just "a" communications center, it was the communications hub.

 

[PAT303]

100% correct, the Russians did to the Germans exactly what they did to Napoleon, retreat retreat and retreat some more drawing them deeper and deeper into the abyss, then attack when there is no chance of escape.

 

[SaparotRob]

.. using your logic Biden is only president of 27 states...

Twenty six states.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missourah."
Abraham Simpson

 

[Greg Boeser]

Twenty six states.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missourah."
Abraham Simpson

I've been there. I don't blame you.

 

[SaparotRob]

Liking the avatar!

 

[Greg Boeser]

Liking the avatar!

It's the overhead shot of my Belgian Gladiator.

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

and P-39s ...

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

I've been there. I don't blame you.

Hey, it ain't that bad here.

 

[Greg Boeser]

Hey, it ain't that bad here.

I was at Ft. Leonard Wood.

 

[GregP]

Dear me, in terms of this discussion "America" and "England" dont figure at all. North America is a continent, the Americas are two continents. North America contains Canada the USA and Mexico. England ceased to be a sovereign state in 1707 with the Act of Union. This is not semantics or pedantry, talking of "England" is not only ignorant it is insulting to all those who werent English but who fought for the commonwealth military. Without USA involvement the war in Europe would have continued, it may have come to a stalemate or there may have been a "winner" if that is possible with so many millions dead. The USA, as has been said already was a major contributor to the war they were in. If the UK was unable or unwilling to fight in 1940 and Russia capitulated in 1941 the USA has a much different war to win.

Saying "English" may be insulting to people today, but it surely wasn't during the war. Lot's of people, including the actual English, called themselves English. Australians were called Australians, South Africans were called South Africans, Indians were called Indians. That comes from talking with people who live in England and Australia. Perhaps, as here in the U.S.A., there are differing opinions in the British Isles. I'd likely say "British" today myself but, during actual the war, saying English wasn't considered wrong. If they were South African and wanted you to know it, they'd tell you. I think we should be able to make allowances for changes in language over 75 years without calling people "ignorant" or getting insulted. They used to say "groovy" in the 1960s and don't today, but I'd not be insulted if I heard it.

My cylindrical slide rule doesn't say "Made in Britain" on it, it says "Made in England," clearly stamped in the steel. As a family, we have visitors this week from Ireland. We call them Irish and they have yet to correct us. Perhaps they will before they depart next week. We'll see.

I am one of the U.S. people who doesn't like the term "Americans" applied to me because, as you said above , there are people in many countries who can be called Americans. I think they adopted Americans because it is a bit awkward to called say "US-ans" and "US citizens" sounds sort of forced. So, they picked something easy to say. I made peace with the term but don't really use it much myself.

 

[slaterat]

I think it was in the "Grand Alliance" , that Churchill said something like before the US was in the war he didn't know if the Allies would win, but after the US was in he knew the Allies would win.

 

[GrauGeist]

They used the the term "American" in reference to the Colonists fighting the British. King George said it, the French said it, the Founding Fathers said it.

The U.S. is one of two nations with a continent in it's name, the others Australia. The Australian continent also includes PNG, Tasmania and several other islands. But people from the mainland call themselves "Australians" and no one seems to have a problem with it just as people from the United States of Mexico are usually referred to as "Mexicans" and it's not uncommon to refer to someone from France, Belgium, Germany, etc. as "European".

I usually refer to myself as a "Californian", but since there are 58 counties in the state, I may have to stop doing that...

 

[Greg Boeser]

It's a post-modern conceit to pretend that the term "american" refers to anything other than something of, or pertaining to, the United States of America.
People were calling Bavarians, Saxons, Franks, etc., Germans long before Germany existed as a country.
But don't call an Austrian "German". They don't like being reminded.

 

[GregP]

Don't call an Okinawan Japanese, either.

 

[pbehn]

It's a post-modern conceit to pretend that the term "american" refers to anything other than something of, or pertaining to, the United States of America.
People were calling Bavarians, Saxons, Franks, etc., Germans long before Germany existed as a country.
But don't call an Austrian "German". They don't like being reminded.

The name German and Germany was given by the Romans Germani = our brothers . Germans dont call themselves German, the French dont call them German and neither do the Italians. Germans call themselves Deutsch. French is Allemagne/ Allemond (the people who live beyond the Mano river). While Italians say Germania for the country and Todeschi (Theod discuss) for the people. Comically "Wales" is Saxon for outsider or foreigner. What people say and use colloquially is OK as far as it goes but it is frequently wrong. The assertion that Canada always follows the USA and that England is the same as the UK and Commonwealth leads to people believing nonsense. Without Canada, Northern Ireland and Scotland being in the war from 1939 there would have been no battle of the Atlantic

 

[Thumpalumpacus]

I think it was in the "Grand Alliance" , that Churchill said something like before the US was in the war he didn't know if the Allies would win, but after the US was in he knew the Allies would win.

"Now at this very moment I knew that the United States was in the war, up to the neck and in to the death. So we had won after all! ... How long the war would last or in what fashion it would end no man could tell, nor did I at this moment care ... We should not be wiped out. Our history would not come to an end ... Hitler's fate was sealed. Mussolini's fate was sealed. As for the Japanese, they would be ground to a powder. All the rest was merely the proper application of overwhelming force."

... and from his memoirs ...

"Being saturated and satiated with emotion and sensation, I went to bed and slept the sleep of the saved and thankful."